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Author Topic: persimmon collectors?  (Read 1936 times)

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #25 on: December 14, 2020, 10:59:24 AM »
I will be definitely baying a none astringent one since I like to eat persimmons when not in mush stage, havent stopped my eyes on a variety yet, i'm also very interested in the ones with chocolate tones in the flavor ....

Nyuu

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #26 on: December 14, 2020, 12:07:59 PM »
I'm definitely not an expert when it comes to persimmons, but Fuyu tastes good and is the best variety of the maybe 4 varieties which I've tasted.
Every single Hachiya that I've ever tasted I could almost not eat, they were too astringent. I've purchased Hachiya an endless number of times from different markets, each time hoping this time might different, but it never is.
And this is coming from someone who is a fan of quince fruit and sometimes likes eating raw plantain bananas, so it's definitely not like I am the type of individual who would be unable to like something astringent.
Hachiya is very tasty variety I prefer over the fuyu  persimmon . It sounds like you never let him ripen enough they need to become super soft and a little translucent skin . Saijo is another good one. I have a couple other varieties but I haven't been able to try them yet like lchi-kikei-jirro , suruga and velvet Apple technically is a persimmon

Nyuu

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #27 on: December 14, 2020, 12:10:56 PM »
The Velvet Apple doesn't taste like any traditional persimmons though that one in itself I did try and it's very unique

slopat

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #28 on: December 14, 2020, 02:24:37 PM »
I am down to the last dozen fuyu picked back in mid November. These were the lighter orange that I put in refrigeration right away.  So much better when crunchy.  After starting in October,  3 or 4 a day, I'm done for the season.  Hachiya's are still being pulped and frozen as they ripen. Persimmon chocolate chip cookies for the holidays and throughout the year :)  the hand rubbed/dried hachiyas are good too. Btw: #Liziqi released a YouTube video about persimmons this past week!

Have to say that I am not a fan of Persimmon smoothies the way I've been making them. Maybe its time to try Saijo or something other than fuyu or hachiya.


nexxogen

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #29 on: December 15, 2020, 05:25:53 PM »
I will be definitely baying a none astringent one since I like to eat persimmons when not in mush stage, havent stopped my eyes on a variety yet, i'm also very interested in the ones with chocolate tones in the flavor ....

With astringent ones, you can put them in a plastic container together with a shot glass half full of vodka and close the lid. Every 2 to 3 days check if the alcohol level in the glass has subsided (by smelling it), and replace it with a new swig of vodka. After about 8 to 10 days, the astringency will be gone and you'll be able to eat the astringent persimmons like they were non-astringent.

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #30 on: December 15, 2020, 05:38:05 PM »
I will be definitely baying a none astringent one since I like to eat persimmons when not in mush stage, havent stopped my eyes on a variety yet, i'm also very interested in the ones with chocolate tones in the flavor ....

With astringent ones, you can put them in a plastic container together with a shot glass half full of vodka and close the lid. Every 2 to 3 days check if the alcohol level in the glass has subsided (by smelling it), and replace it with a new swig of vodka. After about 8 to 10 days, the astringency will be gone and you'll be able to eat the astringent persimmons like they were non-astringent.
[/quote.
Lol thanks for the idea, I wonder how this method came up 😀

RollingInTheWeeds

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2020, 05:39:48 PM »
Every single Hachiya that I've ever tasted I could almost not eat, they were too astringent. I've purchased Hachiya an endless number of times from different markets, each time hoping this time might different, but it never is.

Here's my experience with Hachiyas: They are inedible until they are so ripe they look translucent.  At that stage, the skin is paper thin and peels off by hand easily, leaving the gelatinous flesh behind.  In order for a Hachiya to ripen to that degree, I begin with fruit that have absolutely no damage to them (holes, bruises, etc).  I let them sit on the counter for however long it takes for them to turn translucent and the color to deepen to a very deep orange.  If a fruit is damaged, the damaged area will begin molding before the rest of the fruit ripens.

Eating a ripe Hachiya is kind of like eating jello; I can slurp it.  That texture puts some people off.  A matter of personal taste.  A truly ripe Hachiya is usually intensely sweet -- (also a matter of personal taste -- some would say it's too sweet).

There are also ways of forcing persimmons to ripen.  I'm aware of 4 different methods, and using these methods you might not end up with gelatinous fruit:
  • I've been told that you can store the fruit in a plastic bag full of CO2 for a day or so and that will ripen it.
  • Another method is exposure to ethanol (drinking alcohol).  You can put a couple of tablespoons of cheap vodka in a small dish within a plastic bag.  Place the fruit in the same bag (*not* in direct contact with the liquid), seal it up and let it sit.  I'm not sure how long that method takes; I tried it once, but didn't really like the results.  It was so long ago I can't remember what I didn't like about it.
  • Freezing.  Pop them in the freezer for a few days.  Freezing apparently breaks tannins down.
  • And then there's Hoshigaki (dried).  Search the Internet for "Hoshigaki" and you'll find instructions on how.  I've done this twice and liked the results after drying for about 2 weeks.  I didn't like them as much when they were fully dried (which happens at about 3 weeks).

I plan to try the CO2 method next year, when I can get some Hachiyas again.
Ha ha! @nexxogen and @Plantinyum were typing while I was.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2020, 05:46:55 PM by RollingInTheWeeds »

slopat

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #32 on: December 15, 2020, 09:01:44 PM »
One for the chickens and one ready to eat.

The vodka idea sounds like a good experiment for next year. Putting a the hachiya, in trays, single layer stem down, in the cooler garage has worked out well for me ~ just be sure no ants, flies,  or rodents, etc, get near them.



Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #33 on: December 16, 2020, 03:58:22 AM »
I just ordered one tsuru noko / chocolate persimmon , the reviels are for a big, spicy sweet fruit, non astringent ,the taste is said to be reminiscent of chocolate and cinnamon desert .
 hardy for 6-7 zone
Anyone has experience with this variety ?

Nyuu

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2020, 07:36:44 PM »
Coffee Cake , chocolate persimmon supposed to have a more complex flavor . It's two I want to add to my collection . I like to try find Texas Persimmon /Diospyros texana that is another one is supposed to have a great different flavor profile on the wishlist . And just in case of someone once a very sweet  non-astringent variety suruga persimmon supposed to be the one .

nexxogen

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2020, 01:36:00 AM »
@RollingInTheWeeds

The "votka" method is what I recently tested. Info that I found online said to keep persimmons together with alcohol for 72 hours. Unfortunately, this didn't remove the astringency completely for me. It went down noticeably, but it was still there. So I let them sit more until all of the astringency went away, which took about 8 days I think. But I did replace the alcohol 2 times in the process because I noticed that it didn't smell like alcohol after a while so I assumed it had evaporated.

The persimmons will stay firm after this method, so this is by no means a way to quickly ripen them, just to remove the tannins.

I've had really bad experience with freezing. It will turn the persimmons wrinkly and mushy without ripening them properly and some astringency will still be there. I've heard in a youtube video recently that you're supposed to freeze them twice but I don't feel like trying that out. I actually like the jelly-like texture of ripe persimmons, but these frozen ones were somehow gritty and not much like properly ripened ones.

So for me, the vodka method is the method currently. You can still let the persimmons ripen completely even after you treat them with this method, but it will just give you the option to eat them hard as well, if you feel like it.

Bush2Beach

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #36 on: December 28, 2020, 01:32:00 PM »
I have eaten a fair amount of Chocolate and Coffee Cake Persimmons the last 2 years.
They are knock your socks of amazing.
Coffee cake tastes a bit like a good non gritty Sapodilla , maybe a hair less sweet.
Chocolate is melts in your mouth delicious perfection! What I imagined Black Sapote to taste like until I actually tried some.
I may be able to hook up some scion pretty soon.

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #37 on: December 28, 2020, 03:09:08 PM »
I have eaten a fair amount of Chocolate and Coffee Cake Persimmons the last 2 years.
They are knock your socks of amazing.
Coffee cake tastes a bit like a good non gritty Sapodilla , maybe a hair less sweet.
Chocolate is melts in your mouth delicious perfection! What I imagined Black Sapote to taste like until I actually tried some.
I may be able to hook up some scion pretty soon.
that sounds amazing !!!  The lone chocolate plant I bought was bare root(all of the feeder roots were dead) hope it survives and sprouts in spring. Either way i'm years away from tasting a homegrown chocolate one....

Bush2Beach

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #38 on: December 28, 2020, 04:32:40 PM »
Graft onto mature persimmon then right?

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #39 on: December 29, 2020, 01:18:30 AM »
Graft onto mature persimmon then right?
I will need to let the plant grow some branches first, it a straight stick right now ,which i'm sure will die off to just above the graft. I may doo this too if I see enough living tissue in the spring ...the past ones that I planted bare root years ago did just that , died off to just above the graft the very first spring , and they had alot more healthy roots than this one. I hate buying bare root plants

spaugh

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #40 on: December 31, 2020, 04:25:58 PM »
I picked up a bare root chocolate and coffee cake today.  55$ each !  Expensive.  But I do get a 20% discount there and they told me they cost more than peches for instance that were 35$ because they are harder to grow and graft.  These are dave wilson trees from walter andersens nursery.
Brad Spaugh

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #41 on: December 31, 2020, 04:50:09 PM »
I picked up a bare root chocolate and coffee cake today.  55$ each !  Expensive.  But I do get a 20% discount there and they told me they cost more than peches for instance that were 35$ because they are harder to grow and graft.  These are dave wilson trees from walter andersens nursery.
thats very pricey , around here typical bare root plants cost around $ 5 , sometimes cheaper. I would any time go with a potted plant rather a bare root ,but when there are non im forced to by them.
I really think the biggest mistake nurseries make is to bare root the plants from the field and store them in sand or whatever . It would be way healthier for the plants if they were digged up from the field at the moment of the order...at least I would do this but I guess its way too much work for them that way ...

spaugh

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #42 on: December 31, 2020, 05:50:52 PM »
th bare root plants are great quality here .  They are dug up and sent to nurseries in 1-2 days.  Theres a video on youtube of dave wilsons operation.  Their trees are premium quality.

Im going to cut these tree back if anyone wants the scion wood send me a messafe.   
« Last Edit: December 31, 2020, 06:17:11 PM by spaugh »
Brad Spaugh

Plantinyum

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #43 on: December 31, 2020, 06:06:06 PM »
th bare root plants are great quality here.  They are dug up and sent to nurseries in 1-2 days.  Theres a video on youtube of dave wilsons operation.  Their trees are premium quality.

Im going to cut these tree back if anyone wants the scion wood send me a messafe.
here I am left with the impression that they just want to make money, they uproot them and god knows how they store them or how fresh are they, bare might be ok here if u go to the nursery and pick a specimen with healthy roots . Now awful plants are not always the case thought , if its not a nursery u are familiar with, its a gamble....

spaugh

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #44 on: December 31, 2020, 06:19:32 PM »
I rather grow bare root trees than trees that have been stuck in a small pot.  The root system is bigger and thry havent been sitting at the nursery being overwatered all year.  What they do here is pot up the bare rrot trees they cant sell then they sit and go bad over time at the nursery.
Brad Spaugh

spaugh

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #45 on: December 31, 2020, 07:07:33 PM »
Heres their video of how they process the trees
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNt5FHw8kaY&feature=youtu.be
Brad Spaugh

Oolie

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Re: persimmon collectors?
« Reply #46 on: January 02, 2021, 12:05:27 AM »
Chocolate really impressed me in previous years. This year the Maru finally hit its stride, producing multiple large crops.

The pollinated ones easily surpassed Chocolate in flavor, but they had to be eaten on the softer side. I dried most of the unpollinated marus, and even though they were slightly astringent (even in dried and peeled form) they had good flavor.

 

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