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Author Topic: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions  (Read 3412 times)

plantlover13

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Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« on: July 07, 2013, 12:21:35 PM »
Hi all. I have a bunch of tropical seeds i want to start, and i want to use gibberellin to help start them. I want to get it from amazon, but what product should i get? Any tips? also, What concentration should i use?

And a couple other questions. Is it better to, in general, try to get seeds to sprout using the baggie method and then transfer to soil or to just start in soil? What conditions are preferred, and what mix should i use?

Thanks for any help!

fruitlovers

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2013, 10:05:17 PM »
First question, why do you want to use gibberelic acid to start seeds? Very few seeds really need it or benefit from it, and most might actually be injured by it. What seeds are you trying to start?
Oscar

Tropicdude

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2013, 10:48:02 PM »
Most tropical fruit tree seed I have found it more important to have fresh viable seeds. 

Gibberellin I read helps "some" seeds to germinate.   there are a lot of things I have read over the years that help germinate seeds,  soaking , hot dip, peroxide, etc. but what works great for one species may be bad for another. 

I was thinking of doing an experiment with water infused with Moringa to soak seeds.  as this seems to have natural growth hormones. but have not done this because of time and space ruining out at my place.  to be scientific, I would have controls, and was going to use seaweed, and other items, to see if there was a difference between all these.
William
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Mike T

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2013, 11:17:08 PM »
It works well for some defiant Annona seeds like ilama and species like red bayberry but it would not be many species really.I would not go outside the 500ppm to 1500ppm window.It is hard to mix accurately because you only need a little at a time and the solution loses potency if kept.

PltdWorld

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2013, 11:18:00 PM »
I bought on ebay from dr_ned.  The GA3 showed up quickly, was well-packed and came with instructions.  However, I didn't notice any difference in germination rates (speed or percentage) in the seeds I was working with despite trying various solution strengths, soaking periods, etc // I did control groups to try to eliminate luck in either direction and read way too many articles on the subject.  I went back to my damp paper towel in a re-sealable baggy filled with CO2 (hold breath for 45 secs, exhale into bag, close and seal) - which continues to work great for me and has the added benefit of seeing exactly what is happening with the seeds and when.

For me, Gibberellic Acid was an inexpensive experiment, so I don't feel too badly about it.

Here is a link to the seller I bought from on ebay:

Gibberellic Acid, 90% GA3 - Granular - 10g - Technical Grade
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gibberellic-Acid-90-GA3-Granular-10g-Technical-Grade-/281126658974?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item417474639e


Soren

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2013, 04:23:09 AM »
I am using it for several Annona spp. and Myrica rubra. I use a concentration of 500-900ppm depending on the size of the seed for 24 hours and use peroxide as well in the mix (1%). Have had fairly good results.
I got this regarding GA3 from the internet;

GA3 Powder 90% is soluble in 70% common rubbing alcohol. Before it can be used is must be turned into a liquid. The amount of Gibberellic acid that needs to be used is very small. Drop the correct amount of powder in a small bottle, then add a few drops of rubbing alcohol. The only reason to use alcohol is to dilute the Gibberellic acid powder. Use just enough alcohol to wet the gibberellic acid powder. If after a couple of minutes you can still see some powder add a few more drops of alcohol. Then just add water to get he right concentration. It is often being said that alcohol will damage plants. Yes, but not in the very low concentration needed to dissolve Gibberellic acid. 90% GA3 powder will not dissolve in water. Once mixed it loses viability within a week, even if refrigerated.

You don't need much of the solution to soak your seeds, just enough for the seeds to fully swell. Most seeds can be soaked in the small poly-bags. Tiny seeds should be folded up in a filter paper for ease of handling when soaking. Larger seeds can be soaked in a pill bottle or small jar.

To know the concentration, replace X and Y, (X mg / Yml) x 1000 = Z ppm
To know the amount of solution to make to get a certain ppm, replace X and Z, (X mg / Z ppm) x 1000 = Y ml
To know the quantity of powder to use, replace Z and Y, (Z ppm x Y ml) / 1000 = X mg

For exemple: 100mg of GA3 in 200ml of water gives you 200ml at 500 ppm (part per million). 100mg of GA3 in 400ml of water gives you 400ml at 250 ppm. 1g of GA3 at 90% concentration will be supplied as a powder in a small ziplock bag, sufficient quantity to make a 2 liters of solution at 500 ppm. You should have enough for a couple of years.

Use strong solution, 500 ppm, on very hard to germinate seeds; and a 250 ppm on seeds that are just hard or slow to start. Seeds enclosed in a hard coat may be submit to a higher concentration, 750-1000 ppm. You can scarify the seeds at first. Soak seeds for 24 hours and at most three days for the ones enclosed in a hard coat. Keep the seeds at room temperature with occasional careful shaking. The seeds may then be sown. Don't use it on easy to start seeds unless you dilute it greatly, like 25-100 ppm, and soak them only for 2-3 hours. Normal, easy-to-sprout seeds will become very elongated and stretched out, then die if GA3 is used on them. Concentrations of about 2 ppm can cause tubers to sprout earlier.

Gibberellic acid can also influence the timing of flowering, flower gender, flower size and increase the number of flowers. If a plant is sufficiently developed, premature flowering may be induced by direct application of GA3 to young plants. Formation of male flowers is generally promoted by concentrations of 10 to 200 ppm, female flowers by concentrations of 200 to 300 ppm. You may have an increase in the number of flowers by direct application of GA3 to young plants, at 25 ppm.

When there is difficulty with fruit set because of incomplete pollination, GA3 may be effectively used to increase fruit set. The resulting fruit maybe partially or entirely seedless.

GA3 applied near the terminal bud of trees may increase the rate of growth by stimulating more or less constant growth during the season. Since GA3 regulates growth, applications of very low concentrations can have a profound effect while too much will have the opposite effect.

Although GA3 is not listed as a poison, the following precautions should be observed. Flush with water any GA3 that may get into the eye. Avoid skin contact if possible and wash away any contact with soap and water. Avoid ingestion of GA3.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2013, 04:24:41 AM by Soren »
Søren
Kampala, Uganda

plantlover13

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2013, 08:31:15 AM »
Thanks all. DOes anyone know the concentration of GA3 in seaweed extract?

Even if it doesn't help, i might as well try it in low quantities.

Mike T

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2013, 08:58:47 AM »
A friend who sprays it on bananas and other fruits gave me about 250g of powder so I can be wasteful. I know grape growers like to spray developing bunches.
I used 1000ppm for 24hrs on 11 ilama seeds and got 8 up and the 11 with not treatment had no germination. Etoliation was a problem but this corrected naturally after a few months.I tried the same with bayberries and got 1 up out of about 10 or more seeds.

plantlover13

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2013, 06:19:11 PM »
DOes anyone know the concentration of GA3 in seaweed extract?

Kay

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2013, 01:15:49 AM »
There is a fish GA3 product as well, i have bought it but not yet used it until my better stuff runs out.

i dont use it for most tropical fruit, in general i find it better for dry seeds and/or seeds that have really hard shells and/or dormant.  I think i would try it for some Annona too though, sometimes they can take long time.

For most i like a 500ppm 12-24hr soak.  I like to take out as soon as i see swell and switch to normal water or plant.  No real proof why, but i always thought it was only used to help start germination, after that GA3's job is done.

Tropicdude

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2013, 02:07:32 AM »
Was just looking at some research papers on GA3 and starting Jackfruit seeds.  seems less is more when used on jack seeds, 50ppm was gave better results than 100ppm, 150ppm etc.
William
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kh0110

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2013, 02:13:58 AM »
My experience is limited to sugar apple/cherimoya/atemoya. I've tested 3 methods with 10 seeds each time.
==> Sprout = tap root coming out. Not when you see the seedling pushing the soil.

  • The natural method: sowed in a small transparent cup for easy checking and placed in bright area with no direct sunlight
    --> Results: Took 4 weeks to get first sprout. Last sprout 7 days later.
  • GA3 at 500ppm and 1000ppm for 1,3,6 hours and then sowed in transparent cup and put in bright area with no direct sunlight
    --> Results: Beat the natural method by 1 week. All seeds sprouted the same day.
    --> Note: For the 6 hrs soak batch, seedlings are longer/taller and not straight once they are completely out of the soil.
  • The ziploc + moist sphagnum moss + bottom heat indoor
    --> Results: First sprout in 7 days!!! And last sprout 2 days after...
The results of the ziploc method were enough for me to stop wasting my time with GA3 in sprouting my sugar apple seeds.
Thera

fruitlovers

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2013, 06:24:24 AM »
Was just looking at some research papers on GA3 and starting Jackfruit seeds.  seems less is more when used on jack seeds, 50ppm was gave better results than 100ppm, 150ppm etc.

GA3 totally unnecessary for jackfruit seeds, which are already super easy to sprout.
Oscar

Kay

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2013, 08:07:57 AM »
i agree moist sphagnum moss method is one of the best.  i use this for most seeds with great success.  GA3 seems better suited for dormant seeds and seeds that are really hard to crack.

For any artocarpus i have tried i had very good success with sphagnum moss as well.  make sure moss isnt moldy and dirty though.

plantlover13

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2013, 08:48:54 AM »
most of the seeds i have are most likely very old.
I know for sure you don't need gibberellin for jackfruit. I have planted two seeds and both sprouted within 5 days. i am moe worried about some harder to sprout seeds.

onur

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #15 on: May 24, 2016, 05:16:04 PM »
How should GB3 powder be stored? in freezer? Thanks.

Onur

Pan Dulce

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #16 on: May 25, 2016, 08:13:13 AM »
In general, a dark place, but whatever the bottle says.

greenman62

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Re: Gibberellin Question and Seed Starting Questions
« Reply #17 on: May 25, 2016, 04:32:50 PM »
i did a test a few years ago
10 papaya seeds in   several baggies.

1 with just water
1 with humic acid
1 with fulvic acid
1 with worm castings.

the "just water" seedlings were the smallest
the worm castings were the largest, then fulvic acid, then humic.

the difference was pretty pronounced, when compared to the "just water"

and yeah, seeds should have everything needed to sprout the plant
and i am guessing that with larger fruit seeds, like mango there may be less of a difference.
at least at first, until it starts to pull some nutrients from the environment.

as for speed of them sprouting, the fulvic acid and the worm castings seemed to sprout a bit faster
but, that may have been due to chance.

 

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