Amending the soil with sand after planting ?

[Plantinyum]

When i was preparing the soil in the gh i did add sand for drainage and poriosity, i think i added less than what i need.
I understand that spreading it on top of the soil wont work, so i had the idea of making holes in the soil with a sharp obcect ,then filling those holes with sand . The soil really isnt bad , but i have some places that hold a bit of an excess moisture so would like to help with the drainage everywhere if possible.
Is this a good idea ?

[Aiptasia904]

Spread a tarp on the ground and then dig out your topsoil and put it on the tarp. Just dig around the plants trying not to disturb them too much but in a nice wide, deep bowl shape and put the dirt on the tarp. Mix your amendments on the tarp and then shovel it back into place. Walk around it to tamp it in good and then water well. You can sub vermiculite or perlite for sand. If you have sandy soil it might not be necessary. But, if it has a lot of clay in it yeah you want to increase the drainage.

[Mark in Texas]

When i was preparing the soil in the gh i did add sand for drainage and poriosity, i think i added less than what i need.
I understand that spreading it on top of the soil wont work, so i had the idea of making holes in the soil with a sharp obcect ,then filling those holes with sand . The soil really isnt bad , but i have some places that hold a bit of an excess moisture so would like to help with the drainage everywhere if possible.
Is this a good idea ?

Do you have clay?

Never amend clay soil or you just killed your tree with a non draining pot. 

I use nothing but bottomless RootBuilder pots in my greenhouse.  Only way to go. https://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=7511.0

[Plantinyum]

Spread a tarp on the ground and then dig out your topsoil and put it on the tarp. Just dig around the plants trying not to disturb them too much but in a nice wide, deep bowl shape and put the dirt on the tarp. Mix your amendments on the tarp and then shovel it back into place. Walk around it to tamp it in good and then water well. You can sub vermiculite or perlite for sand. If you have sandy soil it might not be necessary. But, if it has a lot of clay in it yeah you want to increase the drainage.

This is possible, i dont think the plants are too rooted arround yet so i should be able to do that, i am worried of tdoing this thought , since were closing up on winter and i dont want to stress them too much. I'm also thinking about perlite as a substitute for the sand, ive used perlite with good results.


Mark in Texas - yes the soil is kinda clayey, when i was preparing the area i removed alot of it and replaced it with forest top soil/ the humus layer right below the leaf litter, which as a result made it better. The soil really is not that bad ,it could be better tho. The other day i watered the heck out of my passion fruit thats in the gh becouse i overfertilized it, i used around 20 leters or more of water to an awready moist soil, the next day the soil was the same, moist but not wet.
Ive noticed that there are spots that stay too wet and ones that need wattering more often, which may be due to an established vs a non yet established plant, dunno...

[Mark in Texas]

Good luck bud.   I went thru 200 gals. of rainwater today.  Texas is finally getting some rain.  My area is still in an Exceptional Drought category after about 3.7". .

[1rainman]

Perlite actually stays pretty wet. It's main advantage is light weight which loosens up soil. Sand works better. Sprinkling a small amount of sand in the dirt seems to help but anything more than that, sand lacks nutrients and is too dry with pure sand. Just let the dirt dry in between watering.

[1rainman]

Perlite actually stays pretty wet. It's main advantage is light weight which loosens up soil. Sand works better if the goal is to dry up the soil.  Sprinkling a small amount of sand in the dirt seems to help but anything more than that, sand lacks nutrients and is too dry with pure sand. Just let the dirt dry in between watering.

[Galatians522]

I have not dealt much with clay soil here in Florida. However, most gardening books recommend amending clay with organic matter instead of sand. Even though organic matter holds moisture, it also improves drainage as well. Apparently it takes a huge volume of sand to change the character of clay soil significantly. With organic matter, the worms will distribute it for you through out the soil as they do so they create little drains of a sort. The biggest advantage is that you can put it on top of the soil and they will "dig it in" naturally. Native worms work better for this than "composting" worms because the composters stay mostly in the top few inches of soil. The trouble with most organic matter is that it breaks down over time and disappears. Charcoal is cheap and easy to make and powder. It will not break down in the next 10,000 years. Apparently, worms digest it to help clean their guts out and can work it into the top 3' of soil. Suposedly, the combination of powdered char and worms accounts for some of the highly fertile dark soils in Brazil.

[Plantinyum]

Mark in Texas , here we are were also having a severe drought along with some unusually high temps this summer, thank god i have a well which does not go dry even with my daily waterings, in a good wattering day i would use arround 300  litters of water.
I also collect rain water when i can, now i have 5 barrels of 100+ leters of rain water collected , right now we are in a rainy period and some places even had flods coused by severe storms.

 

1rainman , the staff at the hydroponic store also reccomended perlite for clay soil. Right now i am having a slight problem with the wattering, becouse of the mulch and  mainly the compost i added, the soil on top seems to stay moist for longer , thus forcing me to dig deeper near the root ball to check what the moisture level is. I do think that some of the plants may benefit from a little less water from time to time, i havent watered them for 4 days now, we are having a nice cloud cover theese days and i'm using this accurance to hopefully dry out the soil a bit . I just awlays feel that i either am not giving them enough water or i am overwatering them... mulch is kinda tricky since it retains the moisture and it may play a nasty joke to someone like me that is used to wattering daily....



Galatians52  interesting thing u say about the worm tipes and their behaviour, its true that when i dig in the soil the compost worm are in the compost and near the organic matter, the regular ones i find deeper.  I also have a thread about adding worm in the gh soil, the reviels were kinda mixed. The two worm tipes may work in a team, the compost ones help brake down the coarse organic matter, the garden ones then take the finer stuff deeper into the soil layer...
Interesting tip about the charcoal, ive also read that people charge charcoal with soluble fertilizers and then add it to the soil, at which point it start releasing the fertilizer slowly. I can leave some bigger pieces which can act as a fert batterie. Ive read many times about charcoal but never got to try it . I suppose i could also use the BBQ  one in the bags ?

[1rainman]

Perlite will under certain conditions help dry soil, mainly on hot days when you don't want it. This is because more air is the soil. I was told that perlite increases drainage by everyone. I rooted grape cuttings in pure 100% perlite so they don't get wet and rot. I watered thinking it would not hold water. Much to my surprise the perlite was wet and soggy and remained like that for a long time which can rot roots or cuttings. It held water about the same as regular potting soil on a cool day though will go bone dry in hot weather.

But adding perlite to soil will make them grow faster due to more air in the dirt, lighter soil. My experiences seem to go against what everyone tells me. But potting soil with perlite on a hot day will get bone dry in one day. In which case I add a small amount of clay to retain moisture and sand is good too for drainage that isn't as soggy as perlite.

That seems to be the best soil. Mostly compost with a small amount of everything. A little clay, little sand, little perlite. On dry days the clay provides moisture. On wet days sand keeps it from being too wet. though perlite is a lot more dry than clay or something.

[Plantinyum]

Thanks for all the ideas to all of u, at this point i wonder if i should do anything to the soil really, i changed my mind regarding sand and would now use perlite as i awready have some sand in there. However, i wonder if i wont end up damaging the roots of the plants, or end up creating a drier top layer that needs more water, but having the same moisture retentive soil below ,which may become excesively moist due to the regular wattering of the drier upper layer. I kinda regret i didnt add everithing needed to the soil from the start. I'll just have to constantly be carefull with the wattering there, at least until the plants get strongly rooted into the soil.
I'll keep on adding organic matter from time to time, also compost and will try the thing with the charcoal as its interesting for me what will happen.

[Galatians522]

Plantinyum, I do not use the charcoal briquettes. Some people say the binder can be harmful to plants. I don't know, though. We have used "chunk charcoal" after pulverising it some, but the char is most effective when it is as fine as possible. I feel like the cheapest and best way is to smother a blazing pile of sticks with the hose or by covering a metal bucket or grill. This makes finer chunks that can be smashed up easier. The pea sized chunks that result make a great substitute for perlite in potting mixes even without crushing. Similarly sized charcoal chunks are used lot in orchid mixes that require good drainage and are expensive to buy but are easy to make with yard waste. We couldn't get perlit during the pandemic and ended up using small chunks of char that we put through a sifter instead. It worked out great.