The Tropical Fruit Forum

🐸My goal is to help Florida and humankind🐸
https://youtu.be/m81un5CKUk4?si=lqPaCYk4h36mF-OO

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3202163/

Below the video link there is the first study he lists and thus I assume most important to him but maybe not as I went to read the Discussion section of the reported study of many variables of weight/cholesterol/age/concentration of PFPA and Concentrations of PFOS levels; way too many variables for my liking. But regardless did you read what they wrote in Discussion as I'm not sure you did...

There is a significant Negative association between serum PFOS and a reported diagnosis of osteoarthritis.
That means less arthritis association than expected with highest serum PFOS individuals.

PFOA was reported to have a significant Positive association between PFOA and osteoarthritis.
The positive association of PFOA with osteoarthritis also appeared evident only at serum concentration above the mean of the US general population, suggesting a possible threshold effect for the association.

Soooo, they did find a positive association for osteoarthritis for 1 of the 2 (if serum concentrations were elevated above the mean of the US general population)....

Let's see what else they said clearly has a postive association for osteoarthritis::: 1. Female gender 2. Obesity, 3. Advancing age 4. lower educational level 5. poverty 6.Chronic comorbid conditions....7. Serum Cholesterol 8. Serum Uric Acid levels 9. etc. etc. etc. with many many things that have a positive correlation to osteoarthritis.....

Sooo, how is it that only 1 of the many many many positive associations to osteoarthritis is in your video is the one positive association that you tell us you are trying to get your friend and everyone else to believe is why he has osteoarthritis?

Yes, I see he does not agree with you for the reason he has osteoarthritis and perhaps many of the Eight other listed positive factors he feels is much more likely to be the cause of his osteoarthritis....

I do not recommend taking PFOS to increase serum levels of PFOS as they report a negative association between high serum PFOS and osteoarthritis.... I would suggest weight loss, lower your serum uric acid levels, get more educated, avoid poverty, avoid other chronic comorbid conditions by staying healthy exercising as much as your physician allows and see them regularly. These suggestions would probably be more meaningful to the world & your friend than your suggestion.

Nice pictures in video.... But tell me your opinion once instead of every 5 minutes in video repeating your harping on plastics and forever chemicals as the material cited does not agree with your opinion at least not the first listed....

I also like seeing you attempting more of a natural farming and seeing the native weeds growing with the editable plants.. I'm curious as to how fast they will grow vs. conventional practices and videos are a very nice comparison experience.

I do a lot a recycling plants/wood/etc. and also have an area that is close to but not as thick with natural plants as you.... So I will be looking for more of your farming efforts/ideas.

Ladies and gentlemen, we are at peak Mexican Kent season. I picked up a dozen Kents at Aldi last week and they were absolute perfection.  Deep orange flesh, smooth as butter, and sweet like Sunny D. Relatively undersized as Kents go, but packed a flavor punch in a small package. 
Now I know that store bought mangos have a poor reputation, but these Kents were better than most of the FL grown mangos I had shipped to me this year.  At $.59 each, it was a steal. Get ‘‘em before they’re gone.

By your experiences, you seem to be describing what I see in most of my mango varieties during their fruiting season. The first mangos to ripen/fall off and on the ground of almost any variety, does so for a reason and.... it usually is not good. I expect first fruits of a variety to usually be less sweet and less tasty than middle to end of season variety fruits, and this is for all varieties I have and I have about 50 varieties.

 

I'm eating my next to last Kent now and it is far far better than my first kents a month ago. It is very sweet, with a hint of the tropical fruit punch type taste.

Quote from: Bush2Beach on August 27, 2023, 01:14:47 PM

This theory holds true for all fruits and vegetables!
Most people are unaware our imported fruits are not only picked green from foreign but boiled to ensure sub par taste and dissuade further ripening.

Another thing is I don't know if it's a western or American thing but we don't seem to like paying for expensive or quality fruits and vegetables.  Most people i know either grew up with fruits or immigrants that would pay premiumn prices. 

Lies have become the norm since the 1960's with Nixon on. Thus there is no reason for people to believe our produce is better than imported early picked. The public is lied to daily and the consumer just looks at the price and the size of the fruit and "hopes" it will be good tasting.

I see no solution to the problem.

Farmers markets, home sales, and places like tropical acres & truly tropical are our best bet for changing the public perception. But even then, many go back to the supermarket to take the gamble for "perhaps" getting a cheap good tasting mango etc.

The OS I have on Atalufo rootstock is indeed very vigorous and very dense. Going on it's 4th year grafted in and I still can't get it to hold fruit, it just wants to grow. I girdled a few branches that caused it to flower, but it shed the fruit and went right back to vegging when they were pea-sized.

over 30 yrs ago bought my property/house and it had a pig pen area that nothing wanted to grow in and still not sure why.
About 4 years ago planted a OS in that spot and it proceeded to send out blooms and fruit for 2 years in a row although only 3 ft tall. I've been throwing fertilizer on it and I got a little growth this year after picking off all but 1 fruit and fell off very early this year.

I took scions and grafted seedling trees this year and they are growing fine in other locations on the property.

So, yours grows with no fruit and mine fruits with almost no growth due to something in the soil at that spot.... So, if you like to experiment add too much of almost any mineral or change the ph to less desirable levels and see if you can get growth stoped without killing the tree and I bet it will bloom and set fruit next year... Just IMO.

2nd/3rd/ etc. mangos this year still eating::: Carrie is typical for me in Aug. but this is the first year to get Glen on a few trees. I just finished a delicious Glen Just like in the spring. But I only have a few maybe 6 more after picking 4 on the trees (on more than 1 tree this partial bloom harvest late).

Trickling out slowly in Aug: Maalika, Orange essence, LZ, Sweet Tart. Valencia Pride, Cac, Super Julie, Tebow aka Young, Edgar, M4,Cotton Candy, Nam Doc Mai just saw 1 more on the tree.

Not yet half harvested: Kent, Venus, Rapoza.

Waiting their Day to Arrive: Various Keitt (They get sweeter and sweeter as the Day goes by) Awaiting sweetness to increase to top expected levels before selling. Only sold a few large Keitt after sampling a sweet tree's harvest but will not sell Little Keitt yet as IMO too soon at this location.

I see this search so often, especially by the "experts" looking for ways to decrease expense of trimming hundreds of trees after fruit harvest. The current way is by trimming part of the canopy after harvest. I will propose other ways for them to ponder:::

1. The relationship between canopy and root system. Instead of canopy reduction, focus your attention on root system reduction as there is a parallel relationship between the two.
One of the factors to consider is decreasing root size without causing root disease and some options will work better than others IMO but have not tried them, just imagined the outcomes.
A. Cutting roots with machinery like a ditch witch around the canopy; however this might be just as time consuming/expensive as just cutting part of the canopy.
B. Adding substances to the soil to stress the tree and decrease tree growth (this will probably increase the odds of fruit set and bloom the following year IMO).
     1. Borates/boric acid: already known to be needed in small amounts by the tree. However larger amounts should decrease root growth/canopy growth. It is just a matter of determining the dosage without killing the tree. It should be quicker/less expensive than canopy cutting reduction.
     2. Copper/various formulations: already known to be needed in small amounts by the tree. However larger amounts should decrease root growth/canopy growth.  Unknown dosage to stress the tree without killing the tree.
     3. Magnesium/chlorine: already known to be needed in small amounts by the tree. However larger amounts should decrease root growth/canopy growth. Unknown dosage to stress the tree without killing the tree.
     4. Calcium and all the other minerals: most minerals are known to be needed in small amounts by the tree. However larger amounts  of most should be able to decrease root growth/canopy growth.
     5. Soil Ph adjustments: once again root growth can be slowed by lowering/raising PH soil levels to unfavorable levels to decrease root and canopy growth.

Make the soil environment favorable to the tree when small and growing. Then change the soil environment to less favorable to growth once the tree is bearing fruit to your satisfaction and maturity size.

It is my belief that if you desire to save money/ time on tree trimming, these options should be explored more.

Quote from: palmcity on July 30, 2023, 07:54:14 AM

Quote from: Satya on July 29, 2023, 10:43:32 PM

Quote from: fruitnut1944 on July 29, 2023, 08:19:13 PM

Summer pruning does dwarf a tree, some. I summer prune my trees about 6-8 times.

I'm planting 1000 trees in my new farm, and won't have time to excessively prune anything. a solution to managing both small backyard trees and large farms. you won't need to prune 6-8 times,

Some of my mango trees are over 30 years old. I have never pruned more than once a year and I often skip a year. I do not see the big deal in just taking off 1/3 to 1/2 of the canopy after harvest. IMO makes no sense to prune 6-8 times a year unless you are sculpturing the tree like at disney making it look like perhaps micky mouse.

IMO a big tree cut low should produce as much fruit as a runt dwarf tree that is probably more susceptible to not surviving those 30 years as a producing tree anyways.

I guess I just never understood this topic or the need for producing a slow growing runt tree that might die with disease before it ever produces fruit.

But then again, I have no problem handling a chainsaw...

following this logic, all grafted trees should be susceptible and die. What makes a tree grafted to itself more disease susceptible? it won't be a runt, it'll just be a leaderless grafted tree. If anything, trimming will give more chances for parasites to attack the tree than one graft, especially in wet climates. Plus, takes so much time when you have many trees. Grove maintenance takes lots of time if you do it without chemicals, and to add trimming to that would mean more days working haha.
Maybe in Florida and especially your property soil doesn't make them grow super tall and wide because of the special pH, sandy nature, whatever; my FL property is entirely coral and trees also don't grow as tall, and in my Costa Rica property mango trees are super compact probably because of high winds, but that's not always the case, especially in the real tropics with ultra fertile soils, as Nef described above.
Thanks for sharing your experience though.

"following this logic, all grafted trees should be susceptible and die." = FALSE

Satya, You have just failed your Reading Comprehension Test......

All = 100 percent = Total amount

This statement "that is probably more susceptible" implies lack of 100 percent probability.... It was illogical by you to say otherwise....

Unfortunately, regular customers often never experience end of variety mango tasting and leave depressed that the mangos were not as good as described. And they are often right.

Why? IMO mangos are seldom if ever as good at the beginning of that mango variety ripening season as at the end of the varieties season.

My wife says when a mango tastes like these taste, they are Honey Mangos... And that is how these end of variety season Maha Chanoks are tasting today. Super sweet, luscious, slick, slimy, dripping almost a honey lime hint. Just look at the pictures and you can see the richer yellow/lime colored flesh as we bite into it.

They were no where near as good a month ago. I did not like them as the flesh was mediocre sweetness and a mild yellow hint of color even when tree ripened to outer skin being a full yellow color. That was about a month ago and with only a few left, my wife, I, and a few others are feasting on these delicious mangos end of season.

Reason for posting::: If you do not grow your own mangos, you will be lucky to ever experience the best tasting mangos from any mango variety unless you go weekly to the grove, person's stand, etc. and ask questions like how sweet is this variety in it's normal mango ripening phase? Of course they may say "They have no idea" and unfortunately that is often the case unless they love to sample their harvest often.

And.... lol... Your odds of buying a grocery store processed mango at that varieties peak flavor? lol  IMO less than .1 percent...

M4 are mature and ready to be picked in Martin County.

One weights 1.6lb and other 1.66lb
One on left was picked Tues. and 3 days later has softened and I'm guessing will taste primarily sweet pineapple. I will put it in refrigerator for tomorrow and hope to also get a little coconut taste but expect it to take about 5 days in refrigerator (just a guess from prior years).

One on right was picked Wednesday and is a little firmer but showing very slight softness so about a day behind other.

These mangos can often hang on the tree for quite some time so no hurry to harvest the crop as they (as do most varieties) get sweeter and sweeter as the days go by...

I do not remember when my Fruit Punch started tasting a strong fruit punch flavor. But, I do remember on my Carrie trees from a 3 gallon planting expect the first 2 years to be off flavored & not strong tasting.

Canopy growth corresponds to root growth and a good supporting root growth stretching out is needed to pull in all required nutrients in normal soil to produce a sweet strong taste. Also more tree wood holds nitrogen etc. needed and thicker is better. Finally the sunlight for photosynthesis is better with an enlarged canopy...

Do not expect your thin small tree trunks with small root systems and limited canopy to have a strong tasting Fruit Punch.

Lacking sweetness is very common in recently planted 3 gallon tree fruits the first 2 years or more if stunted growth. That was the primary reason my Carries tasted bad the first 2 years.

Even in large trees still growing early in the spring, they might not produce enough sugars to make the fruit taste right for the 1st week of that varieties harvest. It's much easier to just say the rain/lack of sunshine/ etc. weakened the taste rather than tasting each variety for sweetness at the beginning of harvest. Just IMO...

Was Fruit Punch Overrated?
My taste buds say nope, it is a great fruit punch flavor to me.
However, in my yard I get very few fruit reaching maturity. Why? 1. The fruit are large and do not adhere well to the tree during winds. 2. The fruit gets fungus infections more than my average tree (I do not spray frequently).

For those reasons, I have not planted more trees. Instead I went to smaller fruit with a little of the similar flavors like Kent and I recently tasted Mark Anthony a smaller fruit with some of the similar flavors. I still prefer the taste of Fruit Punch over either of the above choices. 0-15 is not an option for me as in my yard it gets fungus worse than even Fruit Punch and bears less often than Fruit Punch for me in my yard with zero fruit this year and last year.


 

Rosen Reports::: 
Just showed the portable keypad door lock for travelers to prevent maids etc. from entering your room even with the key...
Very simple to place in between door and wood latch area then wrap a chain over inside handle to keep the door closed...
Under $15 on amazon and apparently recommended by airline personnel when traveling. They also suggest checking out your room for people with your luggage keeping door open so you can escape (I guess the airline personnel are targeted due to their looks etc.) and lead with an object around corners like a coat hanger so the bad guys will grab it instead of you as you turn the corner and you drop it as you run out of the room...

https://www.amazon.com/Portable-Security-Additional-Traveling-Apartment/dp/B08L7DNXT9/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=1GGU4VS4H8D8B&keywords=portable+key+lock&qid=1688813415&sprefix=portable+key+lock%2Caps%2C1146&sr=8-1-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&psc=1

 

• Pickering seems much more eager to set fruit compared to carrie

I have 10 Carrie trees and 10 for 10 all set not just fruit, but a good quantity of fruit this year.
Pickering (only 1 fruited) has been much less likely at my location to set fruit but also was much more prone to various spots on the fruit and tree than my Carrie that bear fruit if even all the stems looking black and total leaf preventing sun from hitting where the fruit is located.
For me, Carrie trees are excellant bearing trees and Pickering (only 1 bearing, 2 other recently grafted) much worse odds of getting fruit at harvest time.

Here's a Super Julie that tastes similar to Carrie but a little sweeter with sometimes like a apricot hint.
Turns ripe fast also, like a Carrie from 1 day to the next except more obvious with the purple to red change of color.