Author Topic: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread  (Read 15040 times)

simon_grow

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #175 on: April 27, 2022, 11:05:10 PM »
Late to the party for a change but did go ahead and order the Monterey Nematode Control yesterday.  Thank you, Simon.

While waiting for it to arrive, I thought I would revisit the whole male/female/seedling issue.    I am less than two miles from the ocean so except for a couple of bizarre heat waves, it has remained pretty cool here.  Only my Biqi (one female and one putative male) have leafed out and one of my An Ha females.  Everything else looks comatose.   I have to say that both  my male and female Biqi look like nice succesful grafts.  I have others, notably my An Ha male and my Late female where the grafts are absolute disasters with no signs up life above them.  But these look a lot better.  Fang, am I reading these wrong?  They are from top to bottom, female Biqi and then its graft;  male Biqi and its graft.









Looks like you have some trees that may make it. Try to gradually increase the amount of light it gets.

Simon

Tustinfruitnerd

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #176 on: April 28, 2022, 11:26:52 AM »
Satya, my BC did the exact same thing.  It was the first to leaf out and was looking quite good and afterwards wilted.  It looks dead from what I can tell.  The others that leafed out are doing well.
Same here...It had the best roots also. Maybe it has to do with something else as my other trees are looking fine (at least for now).

My BC did the same thing. It was the first to leaf out, then slowly wilted away. I'm waiting if it actually comes back. Another BC that also leafed out is not completely dead but it's struggling. Anyone can think of what can be the problem?

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #177 on: April 28, 2022, 11:35:50 AM »
Satya, my BC did the exact same thing.  It was the first to leaf out and was looking quite good and afterwards wilted.  It looks dead from what I can tell.  The others that leafed out are doing well.
Same here...It had the best roots also. Maybe it has to do with something else as my other trees are looking fine (at least for now).

My BC did the same thing. It was the first to leaf out, then slowly wilted away. I'm waiting if it actually comes back. Another BC that also leafed out is not completely dead but it's struggling. Anyone can think of what can be the problem?
I was thinking overwatering, but I'm not sure about that. I scratched the bark and it is dead. I'm going to throw it out now. Probably just chuck it in the trash to prevent contamination.

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #178 on: April 28, 2022, 12:21:02 PM »
Tustinfruitnerd,

I had similar issue, I removed all the dead leaves, trimmed the leaves that were partially shriveled and covered with clear plastic to increase humidity, which helped it to revive.  Even the branches covered with buddy tape did better with the plastic.  Important to check at least a couple times a day so no mold grows, the mold on dried branches and leaves grow really fast on the Yangmei.  The plants I have that are growing uncovered were slowly transitioned to decreased humidity, I cut tiny holes in the plastic, then gradually enlarged the holes. 

Janet

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #179 on: April 28, 2022, 02:43:12 PM »
Quote
Looks like you have some trees that may make it. Try to gradually increase the amount of light it gets.

Simon

Thank you for the advice.  Gradually increasing the light isn't too much of a problem since different parts of the greenhouse get more shade than others.  Where I get nervous,  given that  the Santa Anas keep popping up. is trying to figure out how much dryness these little guys can take,  I still have a humidifier running at something around 65% and spray the not-yet-leafed out plants daily but I know at some point the Biqis (and Mrs. An Ha)  will have to move out into the real world.  My one survivor (1 of2) from Ken's buy I did try the gradual hardening off thing and it promptly lost all its leaves and looked dead.  I stuck it in the ground anyway surrounded by some Myrica Cerifera I got from Carlos' Plants and it started growing tiny leaves from below the ground.  Of course, with last week's blast of wind even those tiny leaves have started browning at the edges.    I can toss a little shade cloth over it but there's not much I can do about the dryness. 

K-Rimes

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #180 on: April 28, 2022, 04:34:55 PM »
My BC finally leafed out a bit, looked promising, blap, dead. I don't hold out hope for it coming back. The Biqi Male and Female did ok and I found some 5g californica I'll scoop next week to graft on.

spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #181 on: April 28, 2022, 04:49:34 PM »
Quote
Looks like you have some trees that may make it. Try to gradually increase the amount of light it gets.

Simon

Thank you for the advice.  Gradually increasing the light isn't too much of a problem since different parts of the greenhouse get more shade than others.  Where I get nervous,  given that  the Santa Anas keep popping up. is trying to figure out how much dryness these little guys can take,  I still have a humidifier running at something around 65% and spray the not-yet-leafed out plants daily but I know at some point the Biqis (and Mrs. An Ha)  will have to move out into the real world.  My one survivor (1 of2) from Ken's buy I did try the gradual hardening off thing and it promptly lost all its leaves and looked dead.  I stuck it in the ground anyway surrounded by some Myrica Cerifera I got from Carlos' Plants and it started growing tiny leaves from below the ground.  Of course, with last week's blast of wind even those tiny leaves have started browning at the edges.    I can toss a little shade cloth over it but there's not much I can do about the dryness.

Once your plant has roots that have well filled in a 1gal pot, it should be strong enough to go out into the yard.  Use 70% aluminet shade on it for the first several months, the switch to regular 30% shade until after November.  If you want a piece of 70% aluminum send me a message, I have some extra pieces.  You can make a circle with welded wire fencing material and drape the 70% aluminet around that entirely to protect the tree and break it in once it exists the greenhouse. 

You also want to gradually drop the humidity in the GH for a few weeks prior to its graduation from the GH. 
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #182 on: April 28, 2022, 07:40:10 PM »
Ok so I just threw out the black crystal...I was expecting the roots to look bad, and they all did, but there was a few white roots. Maybe it was trying to grow back? Although I scraped a little higher and the cambium of the roots was old and not alive. Same for the bark scratch test. I assume the tree died from top to bottom, instead of bottom to top as I expected. I don't think overwatering was the victim this time.

K-Rimes

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #183 on: April 28, 2022, 07:59:40 PM »
Ok so I just threw out the black crystal...I was expecting the roots to look bad, and they all did, but there was a few white roots. Maybe it was trying to grow back? Although I scraped a little higher and the cambium of the roots was old and not alive. Same for the bark scratch test. I assume the tree died from top to bottom, instead of bottom to top as I expected. I don't think overwatering was the victim this time.

Same as mine. Mine leafed out pretty nice, had some dry leaves up top... Then lower... Then a day later gone.

simon_grow

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #184 on: April 28, 2022, 09:41:24 PM »
When you guys start seeing leaves and branches starting to grow, are you slowly decreasing the humidity?

When the trees come in bare root from China, they need a lot of humidity because there is little to no feeder roots and the trees are in shock from the bare rooting process.

Once you see buds, you still need high humidity because the bud push may be from stored energy in the wood but the feeder roots may not have grown out yet.

If the buds continue to push leaves and the leaves are expanding rapidly, there is a good chance the feeder roots are starting to grow out. If you see leaf expansion and stem/branch elongation, there is a very high probability the roots have grown out.

At this point, you want to slowly decrease the humidity so that there is some vapor pressure deficit. The less humid air will pull water through the plant from the roots and out through the stomata in the leaves. This helps with root elongation.

If the humidity is too high, transpiration will be inhibited and root elongation may be delayed or stop altogether.

Another issue that may arise and cause trees that have pushed to die later on is the presence of fungus  gnats. Fungal gnats thrive in soil that is overwatered and their larvae eat new roots. Allowing your soil to dry up a bit before re watering will decrease the amount of fungus gnats.

Simon

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #185 on: April 29, 2022, 01:17:44 PM »
I kept humidity super high when they were not buddytaped. Nothing was happening much. When I taped them up with buddy, they all started sprouting buds nearly immediately. The two Biqi I have (much larger plants compared to BC) both leafed out nicely and it would appear both are now growing branches so I would say rooting is well on its way.

When I buddytaped, I stopped the supplemental humidifying altogether.

The first BC died before I could buddy it. The second BC died after sprouting small leaves about 1/4" long, all dried up over the course of 2 days.

There are no fungus gnats. I have them in an air filtered grow tent and learned my lesson to not over water from the last time. Soil was dang near dry the whole time or as close as I could get to "barely damp".

slopat

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #186 on: April 29, 2022, 01:27:56 PM »
Similar situation with my 2 BCs   one wrapped and the other with plastic bag covering. Same leaf out and dry up.

Have another one neglected, pot placed in a 5 gallon HD bucket to catch drainage after the RKN notice,  only watered when it rained that is starting to leaf out.



spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #187 on: April 29, 2022, 03:04:31 PM »
I kept humidity super high when they were not buddytaped. Nothing was happening much. When I taped them up with buddy, they all started sprouting buds nearly immediately. The two Biqi I have (much larger plants compared to BC) both leafed out nicely and it would appear both are now growing branches so I would say rooting is well on its way.

When I buddytaped, I stopped the supplemental humidifying altogether.

The first BC died before I could buddy it. The second BC died after sprouting small leaves about 1/4" long, all dried up over the course of 2 days.

There are no fungus gnats. I have them in an air filtered grow tent and learned my lesson to not over water from the last time. Soil was dang near dry the whole time or as close as I could get to "barely damp".

What kind of dirt are you using? 

My .02$, if the mix has enough perlite and or coco etc which will hold air, the dirt can stay wet and not get anerobic.  Then you dont have to worry about over watering etc.   Im terrible with potted plants so to make it a no brainer, I always add a lot of perlite when doing something like reviving a delicate plant or rooting cuttings etc.  Makes it almost impossible to over wet the medium.
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #188 on: April 29, 2022, 03:10:42 PM »
So guys and girls, where can I get a male tree?  Its required to get fruit off the grafted tree correct?  I probably need to go ahead and source and plant one.
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #189 on: April 29, 2022, 03:34:06 PM »
So guys and girls, where can I get a male tree?  Its required to get fruit off the grafted tree correct?  I probably need to go ahead and source and plant one.

Do you have any suckers coming from the rootstock? You may already have a male tree...I have one sucker coming from my rootstock Iím praying is male. Thereís a woman up north who can sex the trees for people through leaf samples.




Nate

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #190 on: April 29, 2022, 04:05:41 PM »
Your Biqi should be self-fertile.

I like the advice on extra perlite and coco to protect soil from becoming anaerobic. Notorious over-waterer here. Spraying stuff relaxes me, and can't stand the idea of a thirsty plant.

spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #191 on: April 29, 2022, 04:06:14 PM »
No suckers
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #192 on: April 29, 2022, 05:00:17 PM »
Brad,

I ordered a biqi male that's budding out and also have some seedlings.  Plan on sending them to Marta for the DNA test to sex them in the fall.  If any of them are male, I'll share scions with you.

Janet

ronke47

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #193 on: April 29, 2022, 05:39:50 PM »
Thanks, Brad, for the advice on transitioning my Yang Mei to the real world.  Since I have four plants that look like they have a chance of making that journey (2 Biqi females, one Biqi male and one An Ha female) I will probably be needing more of that Aluminet shade cloth than you can spare but I really appreciate your offer. If my male Biqi survives, you are welcome to some scion wood from it.    At the moment, it is the only one pushing actually branchy things (yeah, I know there must be a real word for that but this is the 3rd time Iíve tried to post this before someone else posts and erases everything Iíve written so Iím going fast)
At the moment I have some cheapo Amazon 70% shade cloth tossed over half of my greenhouse with another 30% cloth on the west wall where the sun can get incredibly intense in the afternoon.  I cut a square out of the 30% and tossed it over my rootstock that pushed some tiny leaves out in the front yard, but now I realize I probably should be using a square of the 70% until November.  Anyhow, thanks so much for giving me a roadmap, and hope.

And Simon, thanks so much for the advice on tapering off on the humidifier.  I have been agonizing over how much I should be catering to my moribund trees at the expense of the ones that have managed to leaf out.  So I finally went out today and determined that four of my trees are dead as little doornails, two from the January buy and two from the March buy.  I wrapped everything else up in Buddy tape and will start tapering.  Strangely my Late Growing from the January buy is one of those that still shows green when I snip a bit off the top and yet it has not swollen a single bud.  Likewise my other female An Ha from the March buy seems alive but asleep.  It is in sterile potting mix whereas my An Ha in peat-based mix was the first to leaf out. On the other hand, my leafed-out Biqis from this buy are in sterile mix and the comatose Late Growing is in peat mix,  so I canít draw any big conclusions.
BTW, while I was moving my leafed-out  pots farther from the humidifer, I discovered that my March female Biqi was growing leaves from its rootstock.  I dithered for a while about keeping them alive for future grafts, but then decided not to risk the graft that was already working, and knocked off the volunteers.  For the peace of mind of those still worried about whether they actually have males vs failed grafts, I will say that the leaves on the rootstock were quite different from those on my male Biqi,  and less different but still not identical to the ones on the female.  See what you think.









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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #194 on: April 29, 2022, 05:43:07 PM »
Actually I got that backwards. The male Biqi leaves are slightly sawtooth but nowhere near as much as those on the rootstock. The female leaves are  pretty smooth-edged.

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #195 on: April 29, 2022, 06:26:41 PM »
No suckers

Hit up Shane, he has a flowering Male tree
Nate

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #196 on: April 29, 2022, 06:39:55 PM »
No suckers

My male DK is growing, if it continuous growing, I can share with you some scions next year.

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #197 on: April 29, 2022, 09:15:31 PM »
I have a male tree that was confirmed by Marta.  It's a pretty decent size. I could spare some scions and hope I'll be able to graft some up here in coming years.
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simon_grow

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #198 on: April 30, 2022, 12:16:57 AM »
So guys and girls, where can I get a male tree?  Its required to get fruit off the grafted tree correct?  I probably need to go ahead and source and plant one.

Brad, I got you. Iíll either graft a male on your tree or bring you a male tree. In my opinion, having a whole male tree is a waste of space. It is more efficient to have a grafted female tree with a high graft of a male branch.

Simon

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Re: Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread
« Reply #199 on: April 30, 2022, 12:52:11 AM »
Actually I got that backwards. The male Biqi leaves are slightly sawtooth but nowhere near as much as those on the rootstock. The female leaves are  pretty smooth-edged.

The leaves with the sawtooth edges are commonly seen on seedling trees but Iíve also seen them from younger growth from grafts from mature wood.

Simon

 

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