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Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Interesting kumquat and other hybrids in Argentina
« on: February 15, 2023, 01:39:33 AM »
How do you determine anthocyanin content?
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: What is everyone doing with their lychee trees?
« on: January 21, 2023, 12:18:06 PM »
Somebody mentioned growin them in the panhandle and I agree but hardy enough varieties need to be found. I have a few seedlings lychees that made it this last hard freeze low of 19F and almost 2 consecutive days frozen, although I can't conclusively say it wasn't some 'microclimate' areas of the yard that helped them though. However there were a lot of others right beside the ones that lived, that died.
For example..
For example..
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Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Can asian, non-astrigent persimmons be grafted on American persimmon?
« on: January 04, 2023, 10:41:39 PM »
The persimmons in Florida are small and astringent, when ripe they taste like weird cinnamon pumpkin.
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Rubber tire mulch as a zinc fertilizer under tropical fruit trees?
« on: January 02, 2023, 11:41:23 AM »
One example, zinc phosphide a mole killer, toxic to mammals including humans. Yet we and plants need zinc and phosphorous in other forms. I never ever put rubber mulch or that dyed crap around edibles.
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Generally frost free
« on: January 02, 2023, 01:44:23 AM »
Kohala longans only hardy to 24-25F in my experience. However I have some seedlings that survived 19-20F. But they are near oaks and a stream so I will have to grow them out a few years to get a better feel for their individual hardiness. Not sure about the other commercial longans.. but I think kohala is supposed to be one of the hardiest anyway. So maybe go to an Asian market and start planting a bunch of kohala seeds from the fruit, same with lychees.
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Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / Re: Anyone got myrica cerifera plants?
« on: January 02, 2023, 01:20:15 AM »
I can get you some suckers. Just need some help verifying what I dig up is actual wax myrtle and not the other native look-alike.
Does wax myrtle exclusively have those little waxy black balls?
Does wax myrtle exclusively have those little waxy black balls?
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Rubber tire mulch as a zinc fertilizer under tropical fruit trees?
« on: January 02, 2023, 01:04:20 AM »
What form of zinc? There are forms of 'good' minerals that can be toxic. And what about other chemicals and compounds it would release?
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Che tree (cudrania tricuspidata)
« on: January 02, 2023, 01:00:26 AM »
You can buy cuttings and root them like mulberries. In perlite or something good like that. If I knew this before I bought a grafted one I would've just bought a bunch of cuttings!
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: How cold did it get in your FL yard and what if any damage are you seeing
« on: January 02, 2023, 12:57:03 AM »
You should float the candles in a jar of water just in case, if possible. I like the idea though!
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: How cold did it get in your FL yard and what if any damage are you seeing
« on: January 02, 2023, 12:55:30 AM »You've definitely got a point there- mangos are extra deceiving after bad freezes, they might look alive but end up being stumped. But actually almost everything is predictable in its 'decievability' after a bad freeze. Lychees for example look terrible immediately after the freeze, I just know what is up with most things now. Feeling, scratching and then smelling the stems gives a good indication almost always. Annonas you can rub the frost damaged skin and it will be wrinkly and loose. Ill scratch my way down a trunk to see at what point the cambium is still alive. If it's hard to tell then smell it- fresh living cambium has its own scent while frost scalded cambium has almost a sweet and fermenting smell often kind of like fermenting grape juice and the cambium looks discolored (mango cambium can sort of look ok and then really not be a lot of times but if theres a slight fermenting smell its dead wood).
850FL, did you provide *any* protection to anything? Hopefully your survivors come out okay--I know after last year's freezes, some things that looked initially okay eventually didn't.
I don't really do a whole lot to protect. I did wrap some guava and lychee trunks up in bamboo sheaths and then threw some leaves over them. It didn't do a whole lot. I think I saved an ice cream mango by leaning it onto a coffee ground mulch pile and then stacking up a foot of leaf debris over it. Its end branches that were less covered are gone but i think the main limbs and trunk are ok. The pile was still steaming hot when i kicked it up during the last day of freezes. Just like 5 bags of grounds were in that pile. Honestly I didnt think most citrus was going to burn the way it did. Lol. I still can't belive even somebody right on the coast had their grapefruit and Satsuma saplings completely defoliated! Kind of an awful sight but they'll probably be ok.
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: How cold did it get in your FL yard and what if any damage are you seeing
« on: December 31, 2022, 01:01:25 AM »
The first night freeze was a low of 24 here, the second night's low of 19-20F with wind chill (felt like '8 degrees'), third day's high was only 37 and froze again to a low of 27 at night.
No mangos, carambola, pineapples, tropical guavas, and no atemoyas or sugar apples survived above ground. Most will probably recover from stumps or roots though.
Almost all the citrus out of 40 varieties or so are going to defoliate. Most citrus branches themselves are okay, except key lime and ponderosa, which burnt down probably to trunks. Cetennial variegated and nagami kumquats got scorched quite a bit themselves, which surprised me, as well as satsumas, a red lime, hamlins and some sour oranges (out of several varieties) that definitely got unexpected leaf scalding. Swingler rootstocks that still had green leaves even damaged their leaves. One minneola defoliated, two are fine. Minneola fruit even made it through well. Clementines did some of the best. I was thinking the murcott tangerine would suffer but it was not damaged at all, same with tango tangerine and 'mandarin F'. Giant green finger lime looks like extensive damage. I can make a more comprehensive list..
I was also surprised a cattley guava defoliated entirely. Passion vines burst violently. Hap ik, mauritius, sweetheart, Brewster lychees down to main trunks (they are all under 4 ft though). Out of a few hundred lychee seedlings there are a handful that either got nipped just a little bit or were completely untouched. Some of these were pretty exposed too. A big pot with a few of them that survived was frozen solid for those 3 days! A couple longan seedlings were good, out of hundreds. One Hass seedling was unfazed, while about 50 others burnt down to the ground, even 8 footers with 2ft of bark. Joey and Mexicola did good, I think their rootstocks Lula even did alright (one has a sucker and it wasn't damaged). Doni and Russell burned down. I've got a few jaboticaba sabaras and they had light/medium leaf damage, not defoliated though. No stick burn on them either. For dragonfruit, red and yellow both turning to mush, however a tray of a few seedlings had some survivors that did well, while the others around them got mushed. Peruvian apple cactuses really took a hit but I think their tougher bases did survive. Quite a few small and mid-sized century plants with succulent growth got mushed, which really surprised me. I didn't think that could even happen here.
One papaya seedling actually made it with some leaf damage, surrounded by 3 small century plants that didn't make it!
Not exactly sure what to make of everything.. it was a hard enough freeze though! Disappointed in some varieties but excited about the real survivors and now I know what to focus more effort on.
If interested I can take more pictures.
The dark green dragonfruit seedlings are actually dead. Notice some light green survivors right on top of them
No mangos, carambola, pineapples, tropical guavas, and no atemoyas or sugar apples survived above ground. Most will probably recover from stumps or roots though.
Almost all the citrus out of 40 varieties or so are going to defoliate. Most citrus branches themselves are okay, except key lime and ponderosa, which burnt down probably to trunks. Cetennial variegated and nagami kumquats got scorched quite a bit themselves, which surprised me, as well as satsumas, a red lime, hamlins and some sour oranges (out of several varieties) that definitely got unexpected leaf scalding. Swingler rootstocks that still had green leaves even damaged their leaves. One minneola defoliated, two are fine. Minneola fruit even made it through well. Clementines did some of the best. I was thinking the murcott tangerine would suffer but it was not damaged at all, same with tango tangerine and 'mandarin F'. Giant green finger lime looks like extensive damage. I can make a more comprehensive list..
I was also surprised a cattley guava defoliated entirely. Passion vines burst violently. Hap ik, mauritius, sweetheart, Brewster lychees down to main trunks (they are all under 4 ft though). Out of a few hundred lychee seedlings there are a handful that either got nipped just a little bit or were completely untouched. Some of these were pretty exposed too. A big pot with a few of them that survived was frozen solid for those 3 days! A couple longan seedlings were good, out of hundreds. One Hass seedling was unfazed, while about 50 others burnt down to the ground, even 8 footers with 2ft of bark. Joey and Mexicola did good, I think their rootstocks Lula even did alright (one has a sucker and it wasn't damaged). Doni and Russell burned down. I've got a few jaboticaba sabaras and they had light/medium leaf damage, not defoliated though. No stick burn on them either. For dragonfruit, red and yellow both turning to mush, however a tray of a few seedlings had some survivors that did well, while the others around them got mushed. Peruvian apple cactuses really took a hit but I think their tougher bases did survive. Quite a few small and mid-sized century plants with succulent growth got mushed, which really surprised me. I didn't think that could even happen here.
One papaya seedling actually made it with some leaf damage, surrounded by 3 small century plants that didn't make it!
Not exactly sure what to make of everything.. it was a hard enough freeze though! Disappointed in some varieties but excited about the real survivors and now I know what to focus more effort on.
If interested I can take more pictures.
The dark green dragonfruit seedlings are actually dead. Notice some light green survivors right on top of them
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Generally frost free
« on: December 19, 2022, 02:34:57 PM »
If your jaboticabas are sabara they will probably be fine. They can take frosts and prefer some shade anyway. I planted one under a crape myrtle this year and it was doing fine until early fall and the sun changed angle, and cooked almost all the leaves!
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: What are the chances of theese seeds sprouting
« on: December 19, 2022, 02:30:03 PM »
I've dried out squamosa seeds for a couple months before and they sprouted.
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: "Breeding" cold hardy avocadoes from supermarket seeds?
« on: December 19, 2022, 01:09:29 AM »
Seed sprouted from store Hass probably won't survive above-ground lower than about 23F, in Florida 8b. In my experience most survive occasional brief hard freezes (18-23F) as stumps and sprout back when it warms up. The ground is warmer and frost insulated versus the air around when it freezes, as long as the bad freeze isn't too extended.. They often survive, but sprout back with less vigor. I had one seedling grow 7 foot it's first year and put on a few branches and a foot or so of bark, but the next winter got to 19F, and it didn't grow past a foot for 3 years until it finally died, which may have actually been from drought. After trying at least 200 seedlings or so thats the result. Although some will grow back 2-10 feet after a couple mild years, I expect them to eventually be stumped again and probably never produce. I keep them around for the idea to use as rootstock in the future. However, a grocery store seedling is not a tested clonal rootstock variety, so it 'could' be a gamble using them as rootstock in a given area in the first place..
The mexican types I haven't had cold issues with themselves, but since these grafted varieties available around here are grafted on less cold hardy rootstock, the graft union must be buried, which could 'potentially' cause future problems (I haven't run into major issues burying grafts so far, to my knowledge, although I have read not to do it). I think burying the graft with a good barrier of perlite around the immediate trunk/graft area would be best to discourage potential rot fungus and pests from attacking the underground graft. Then I would put a layer of clean sand on top, to hold heat down when it does freeze hard (since perlite can be pretty loose and might dissipate heat faster without a barrier). I would not bury the graft in contact with rich soil, out of caution. Also I tend to put some limestone at the very top of the sand close to the trunk and pour normal strength miracle grow solution right on the trunk base when fertilizing. It contains some copper and sulfur, which I believe is a bit of a fungus preventative whenever the trunk/graft gets briefly drenched, as well as obviously fertilizing, but I would not go overboard and fertilize too much and also not in the cold months.
You could also mound the less hardy base/graft with bags of mulch/leaves/pine straw during bad freezes and uncover it in the spring. A few cinder blocks stacked up circling the graft packed in with leaves, styrofoam or other insulating material might also work but i cant tell you to what degree. Or try a combination of these techniques. I leave out the prospect of using Christmas lights because its not really feasible if you wanted to plant a number of these.
We're fixing to get a 21F freeze in the next few days..I may put a few tricks together on some seedlings just to see what may work best.
The mexican types I haven't had cold issues with themselves, but since these grafted varieties available around here are grafted on less cold hardy rootstock, the graft union must be buried, which could 'potentially' cause future problems (I haven't run into major issues burying grafts so far, to my knowledge, although I have read not to do it). I think burying the graft with a good barrier of perlite around the immediate trunk/graft area would be best to discourage potential rot fungus and pests from attacking the underground graft. Then I would put a layer of clean sand on top, to hold heat down when it does freeze hard (since perlite can be pretty loose and might dissipate heat faster without a barrier). I would not bury the graft in contact with rich soil, out of caution. Also I tend to put some limestone at the very top of the sand close to the trunk and pour normal strength miracle grow solution right on the trunk base when fertilizing. It contains some copper and sulfur, which I believe is a bit of a fungus preventative whenever the trunk/graft gets briefly drenched, as well as obviously fertilizing, but I would not go overboard and fertilize too much and also not in the cold months.
You could also mound the less hardy base/graft with bags of mulch/leaves/pine straw during bad freezes and uncover it in the spring. A few cinder blocks stacked up circling the graft packed in with leaves, styrofoam or other insulating material might also work but i cant tell you to what degree. Or try a combination of these techniques. I leave out the prospect of using Christmas lights because its not really feasible if you wanted to plant a number of these.
We're fixing to get a 21F freeze in the next few days..I may put a few tricks together on some seedlings just to see what may work best.
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Help harvesting pawpaws!
« on: June 19, 2022, 04:06:25 PM »
There are a bunch of asimina parvifloras that I have been keeping an eye on. They are a smaller fruited pawpaw species. But I have no experience judging by skin color on when to harvest..? The fruit are just turning from green to very slightly off-green. Can I harvest in this stage and ripen the fruit? Will thy even ripen like this after being off the tree? I want to get them before the wild creatures do!
Also if anyone has experience with asimina incana as well. Thanks!
Also if anyone has experience with asimina incana as well. Thanks!
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Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 Citrus glauca
« on: June 19, 2022, 03:34:49 PM »
Do they have HLB resistance?
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Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: 20 ft tall wild blueberry (N. FL) - Vaccinium arboreum ("sparkleberry")
« on: June 19, 2022, 03:31:51 PM »
I think it would be more viable as a rootstock itself rather than being grafted onto something! I have not been able to root these from cuttings, either.. Not saying it's impossible, but comparatively blueberries are easy. Easiest option for these would be cutting out root suckers. What others in vaccinium are best graft compatible anyway?
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Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Plum varieties for Zone 9?
« on: May 24, 2022, 04:01:17 PM »
I'm in upper 9a FL. From what I have tried only Santa Rosa and methley survive here well. And Chickasaw, and seedlings, but.. I tried Bruce, yellow, excelsior, and possibly another type or two and they have died.
( excelsior and Bruce may have gotten too shaded. But I honestly don't think that's really what killed them). To be fair the yellows I tried last year may have had some type of gummosis or bacteria when I got them on clearance.. but for ones that I have tried healthy, insects and bacteria/fungus are what usually get them.
I'm trying a bruce again for the heck of it. Will plant it way away from any shade this time!
( excelsior and Bruce may have gotten too shaded. But I honestly don't think that's really what killed them). To be fair the yellows I tried last year may have had some type of gummosis or bacteria when I got them on clearance.. but for ones that I have tried healthy, insects and bacteria/fungus are what usually get them.
I'm trying a bruce again for the heck of it. Will plant it way away from any shade this time!
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Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Variegated sparkleberry
« on: May 23, 2022, 11:18:18 PM »
Waiting to see a persimmon or paw paw like this haha. Have you seen any like this? Ive been noticing a few other native species mostly weeds lately with that same yellow/green variegation. Could something be to this??
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Temperate Fruit Discussion / Variegated sparkleberry
« on: May 23, 2022, 10:36:13 AM »
First one I've seen variegated. They are kind of like gritty blueberries. They runner out so there is a 'clonal' grouping of these.
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Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Dr. Robert Dunstan
« on: May 17, 2022, 07:07:36 PM »
Anyone wonder why when Dunstan came across the last American Chestnut, why did he also not vegetatively propagate it, after he had hybridized it? I'm not saying in mass numbers but enough to go around a bit..
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Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: New sweet orange?
« on: May 17, 2022, 06:46:47 PM »
starting to think they are probably a trifoliate hybrid not SO..
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Cold Hardy Citrus / New sweet orange?
« on: May 17, 2022, 06:28:24 PM »
What is this variety? They are labeled "sweet orange".
They either have sour orange in them, by the thorns.. or maybe have trifoliate, since I did see a single bi-leaf on one of the trees.
Either way they must be a rootstock hybrid? None are grafted or labeled as grafted.. the black mark on the trunk was just where tape was (not a graft).
I hope they are not just a sour orange variety mislabeled!
They either have sour orange in them, by the thorns.. or maybe have trifoliate, since I did see a single bi-leaf on one of the trees.
Either way they must be a rootstock hybrid? None are grafted or labeled as grafted.. the black mark on the trunk was just where tape was (not a graft).
I hope they are not just a sour orange variety mislabeled!
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Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / (Wanted) Queen Palm Seeds (common in FL!)
« on: February 17, 2022, 02:49:20 PM »
Looking for a few pounds of queen palm (syagrus) seeds. They are producing now in Florida, and very common in south/central Fl. Preferably in the yellow fruit stage (not green or orange). If you live in Florida and don't know what one is look it up and I'm sure you can find seeds easy! syagrus romanzoffiana
Thanks
Thanks
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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Mexican avocado imports blocked?
« on: February 17, 2022, 02:36:32 PM »I agree and still plant all pits, they're just real finicky and susceptible here and need extra care. Is it like that in South Florida? Do you guys have laurel wilt bad?Sorry to hear that, but I still think everybody should give it a shot. Even though I've been buying Mexican avocados, they're usually crap and the criminal cartels...not good.Florida (and California) forum members, plant more avocado trees! Everybody should have their own trees.
Hardly been worth my effort. Boring bugs, fungus and freezes take out too many in Fl.
You can't rip one root on transplant.
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