Citrus > Cold Hardy Citrus
Nansho Daidai and other Taiwanica cultivars
Peep:
--- Quote from: pagnr on March 08, 2023, 03:29:04 PM ---ls there any reason to think that the Taiwanica from Adavo and Lenzi are really Taiwanica, and not just something they grew from seed and marketed ?
They have a multitude of interesting Citrus on their websites, but some clearly don't match original descriptions from elsewhere.
I grew Taiwanica from seed, seedlings seemed highly identical with narrow leaves etc.
One occasionally fruits, but the fruit is closer to a mandarin than the original Taiwanica fruit.
The seed came from a collection, and the next door plant was a mandarin.
--- End quote ---
No I don't think there is anything like proof, but I believe the name Taiwanica does not say more than for example "bitter orange", it's not the name of a cultivar. And from what I've read so far, Taiwanica can be considered the bitter oranges from Taiwan.
EDIT: There are also many pictures that don't match the typical look of the Nansho Daidai version that is common in the USA, which has the very narrow leaves and large thorns. On this Taiwanese web page you can see that the picture does not match this, and instead looks more like the version of Taiwanica that is sold by Lenzi: https://taieol.tw/pages/44601
pagnr:
The Nansho Dai Dai fruit I have tried are very sour, much more so than Rough Seville Sour Orange. Possibly Gou Tou comes close, but not quite.
As for the foliage there are other "Willow Leaf" Sour Oranges and also Sweet Oranges with long narrow foliage.
Willow leaf variants could be possible ?
The type in Australia probably came from UC Riverside collection.
Citrus miaray, from the Phillipines is pretty close to Citrus Taiwanica.
https://citrusvariety.ucr.edu/crc3574
Not sure if the original question is any more clear now, possibly info about the fruit flavours of the variant types, and in Taiwan would help.
The Taiwanica type here is a very attractive tree, with its narrow foliage and the way the fruit hangs in it around the outside.
Peep:
--- Quote from: pagnr on March 09, 2023, 03:04:09 PM ---The Nansho Dai Dai fruit I have tried are very sour, much more so than Rough Seville Sour Orange. Possibly Gou Tou comes close, but not quite.
As for the foliage there are other "Willow Leaf" Sour Oranges and also Sweet Oranges with long narrow foliage.
Willow leaf variants could be possible ?
The type in Australia probably came from UC Riverside collection.
Citrus miaray, from the Phillipines is pretty close to Citrus Taiwanica.
https://citrusvariety.ucr.edu/crc3574
Not sure if the original question is any more clear now, possibly info about the fruit flavours of the variant types, and in Taiwan would help.
The Taiwanica type here is a very attractive tree, with its narrow foliage and the way the fruit hangs in it around the outside.
--- End quote ---
I've gotten into contact with Olivier Biggio (writer of the French book 'Agrumes résistant au froid'), and Pietro Lenzi (where I have bought a Taiwanica) so I'm going back and forth with them now to get some more clarity. I'll update here when I'm able to coherently put the information and puzzle pieces together.
SoCal2warm:
--- Quote from: pagnr on March 03, 2023, 10:33:50 PM ---One of the historic Japanese Citrus varieties ( sorry can't think which ) is said to have been grown from a fruit found on the beach several hundred years ago.
--- End quote ---
That would be Natsu mikan (meaning "summer mandarin orange", though despite the name, closer to being grapefruit-like rather than mandarin orange). I have actually picked off the tree and tasted one (which I described in another thread). I do not believe this variety has any ancestry from unusual citrus species though.
--- Quote from: bussone on March 02, 2023, 12:12:49 PM ---Something I had overlooked in a different thread.
--- End quote ---
This may not be completely correct, but from what I understand C. ryukuensis is kind of like a purer ancestor of C. tachibana.
In any case, they are probably very closely related.
Peep:
CORRECTION: I should probably update this, because the first "Taiwanica" that I had received from Lenzi was wrongly labeled. This summer it started to grow fruits that had a pointy end, while Taiwanica should have round fruit. I received a replacement plant from Lenzi. It's still very small, but I want to update this topic with photos of the leaves. I see that I can't edit my original post in this thread, so I will try breaking the link to the pictures of the wrong plant, so I don't spread wrong information.
Besides receiving the correct Taiwanica from Lenzi, I have also received Taiwanica budwood from Citrus BaLi. This would be the "Nansho Daidai" cultivar with long narrow leaves (at least the variant that is in Europe). It's clear that the correct Taiwanica from Lenzi is still something different, but that is not unexpected, as there are multiple Taiwanica cultivars.
So it will take some time for my different Taiwanicas to grow, after which I can update with more information on the cultivars.
- This is the correct (hopefully this time) Taiwanica from Lenzi:
- This is my graft of the Nansho Daidai Taiwanica with scion from Citrus BaLi, it has the beginning of a leaf, but it stopped growing, I expect the scion will start growing again next spring:
This is a picture I received from Citrus BaLi, the mother plant:
- The third cultivar I have is the one from Adavo, but this is apparently described as the "original mother of Nansho Daidai" and I'm not sure if it qualifies as a Taiwanica or not.
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