Author Topic: Growing rare durian varieties from seed  (Read 7736 times)

Kona fruit farm

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Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« on: August 23, 2016, 04:18:12 AM »
After returning home from Thailand I planted over 150 seeds of many unique and super tasty varieties of durian.  Nokkachip. Puang manee. Gangyao. Hawk talon. Nam sod. Tub Tim.  Etc etc.  I then got even more seeds from my friend Lindsay of red prawn. Black Thorn. Musang King.  D24.  And tekka. 

Now I KNOW that ideally grafting is the way to go for durian.  But in Hawaii no one has scion wood available for most of these species.  Puang manee yes.  Red prawn yes.  But most of the others I don't think so.   

Does anyone have experience growing durian from seed??!!   My theory is this... Sure if I plant a ganyao seed it might not grow up into a tree that delivers the same delicious fruit of the ganyao I ate in Thailand.   BUT... it's not like I plant the ganyao and it would be like a monthong.   It would hopefully at least be similar to its mother ganyao tree.  Right?  Or no? 

I'm 30 years old.   I have some time and patience to see this experiment through.  Haha.  Even if it's a 15 year experiment that delivers crap fruit from my seedling puang manee and ganyao and musang King trees.  Or is literally a complete waste of my time and I should just use all these seedlings as rootstocks for grafting???  Who knows the answer?  Sorry this post got a little long winded. 
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

fruitlovers

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2016, 06:10:32 AM »
Did you see my recent photo post? All the durians in that shot are from a seedling tree, and they are delicious. I started them from good quality grafted types like you. I have also many grafted trees, but so far the seedling trees are much more productive. Because a cultivar does well in Thailand says nothing about how it will perform in Hawaii. That being said, if you can lay your hands on grafted trees plant some of them as well.
Oscar

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2016, 12:36:04 PM »
I would plant all you have room for. If you have extra seeds multigraft rootstocks. As budwood becomes available either topwork or multigraft on existing trees. Watch that taproot if you are not direct sowing. There was a year in the life of a durian grower that tropicalfruithunter (Jay) posted that showed them cutting the taproot in the nursery. I think air pruning would be better though. I only have a tiny seedling tree right now so my first hand experience is limited but I am eating Monthong as I type this and I am bringing the seeds back from California to plant some more just for fun or maybe I will try to fruit my trees before the large ones in the Whitman pavillion at Fairchild. :P

Did you learn any tips or tricks from the growers out in Thailand on your trip? I saw the pictures of your group.  It looks amazing. I would love to get out there next year.
-Josh

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2016, 12:51:24 PM »
None of these are my images. I just obsess over things and save pictures from my internet searches.




This one is amazing. Keep it pruned back and keep the light on the lower canopy so it doesn't keep climbing up the tree.


They have high density Tatura trellis plantings in Australia from what I have read but I can't find any pictures of mature groves. I need some more land. :)
-Josh

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2016, 02:27:33 PM »
Where I live many durian seedlings were distributed to local farmers more than 25 years ago. Of the trees that were grown out it took on average 10 years to come into production. Of those I would estimate that 75% produce good quality fruit. We have one that I have selected, giving it the name of my farm. So, I would encourage you to grow the seedlings out, it's an important task that will add quality selections that may be more suited to your locale than some Asian selection.
I started this project when I was in my thirties and I have selections of other fruits as well that are sought out on the local market.
Peter

Kona fruit farm

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2016, 03:51:54 PM »
Wow.  Peter that's awesome to hear.  Also same from you oscar.  I will definitely grow 2-3 of each variety out and see how the fruit turns out.  Probably gonna dedicate an entire acre or two to just durian orchard.  I wonder how close I can get away with on the spacing?
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

Kona fruit farm

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2016, 04:01:44 PM »
I was thinking 20' between rows and 20' between trees.   If this is the case I could fit about 100 trees in an acre.   If I did 25' spacing and 25' between rows I can fit about 75.   According to Google. :)
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2016, 06:01:26 PM »
I was thinking 20' between rows and 20' between trees.   If this is the case I could fit about 100 trees in an acre.   If I did 25' spacing and 25' between rows I can fit about 75.   According to Google. :)
I'd go with at least 25' apart. I have mine 30' apart.
Oscar

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2016, 10:49:28 PM »
Maybe plant them in rows that run north to south quite close but leave more space between those rows so they at least get good sun on two sides.
Peter

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2016, 11:23:14 PM »
I hear ya Peter.  So like tree spacing of 20' running north to south.  Then space the rows 25' apart to allow more sunlight.  I like it.  Or something like that.  Oscar I would like to see your orchard sometime and your trees. 
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

FrankDrebinOfFruits

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2016, 02:13:16 AM »
Did you learn any tips or tricks from the growers out in Thailand on your trip? I saw the pictures of your group.  It looks amazing. I would love to get out there next year.

Is that on Lindsay's site? I was on the verge of going, chickened out. Would love to see a travel log.  I am going to be in Malaysia in January, I am hoping to find some of those off season durians.  Now... I went to Lindsays site and still haven't finished writing this post 20mins later. I get lost easily in the adventure.

Update: Found it! http://www.yearofthedurian.com/2016/06/recap-2016-bao-sheng-durian-festival.html

Kona Fruit Farm
Have you talked to Ken Love in Capt Cook. He is working on bringing in named grafted durians (there is a USDA quarantine process, inspections, etc). I think we will get an update at the next HTFG conference.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2016, 02:27:14 AM by FrankDrebinOfFruits »

Kona fruit farm

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2016, 03:12:19 AM »
Yeah I was just at kens house a few days ago.  I know on his last trip back he got 1000's of trees confiscated.    Heart breaker there.   But yeah I'm looking forward to the next Conf and contributing to new diversity in Hawaii.  That's a big part of the reason I did this.   Somebody has to grow out a bunch of trees and hopefully find some new good species..   I might be able to have a new strain that people wanna graft off of.   
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

Mike T

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2016, 06:28:15 AM »
There plenty of seedling durians here from most of the best varieties. At least one key grower prefers seedlings and planted many since the 70s.The fruit of the offspring resembles the parents and I have noticed some that are very similar to the mother tree. Some appear to be a shade better, many are of similar quality and some are worse. I think productivity outstrips grafted trees in many cases by year 15 or earlier and the seedling usually have a longer life.

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2016, 12:41:47 PM »
Did you learn any tips or tricks from the growers out in Thailand on your trip? I saw the pictures of your group.  It looks amazing. I would love to get out there next year.

Is that on Lindsay's site? I was on the verge of going, chickened out. Would love to see a travel log.  I am going to be in Malaysia in January, I am hoping to find some of those off season durians.  Now... I went to Lindsays site and still haven't finished writing this post 20mins later. I get lost easily in the adventure.

Update: Found it! http://www.yearofthedurian.com/2016/06/recap-2016-bao-sheng-durian-festival.html

Kona Fruit Farm
Have you talked to Ken Love in Capt Cook. He is working on bringing in named grafted durians (there is a USDA quarantine process, inspections, etc). I think we will get an update at the next HTFG conference.

I think it was on her site and also some pics on her Instagram. I can spot Jeff (Kona Fruit Farm) from watching his Periscopes.
-Josh

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2016, 01:06:28 PM »
Yeah I was just at kens house a few days ago.  I know on his last trip back he got 1000's of trees confiscated.    Heart breaker there.   But yeah I'm looking forward to the next Conf and contributing to new diversity in Hawaii.  That's a big part of the reason I did this.   Somebody has to grow out a bunch of trees and hopefully find some new good species..   I might be able to have a new strain that people wanna graft off of.   

Just being a source for scion wood would be a major step, even if it was a new set of varieties, it would be exciting.

mikemap

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2016, 04:18:10 PM »
There are ganyao clones on the island, so you can get those scions too. I heard they haven't done well for some people but I do know one guy who has an old, productive ganyao seedling in low elevation lower Puna. I believe he smuggled the seed from Thailand himself in the early 80s. The fruits from his tree are highly rated.

I agree with your plan to plant a few of each seed. 10 years goes by fast!
Mike Parker: kefir fanatic, ethnomusicology hobbyist

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2016, 05:30:14 PM »
There are ganyao clones on the island, so you can get those scions too. I heard they haven't done well for some people but I do know one guy who has an old, productive ganyao seedling in low elevation lower Puna. I believe he smuggled the seed from Thailand himself in the early 80s. The fruits from his tree are highly rated.

I agree with your plan to plant a few of each seed. 10 years goes by fast!
One grower here told me he removed all his Gan Yao trees because the fruits were junk. I really liked the Gan Yao i tasted in Thailand. There it fetches very good price. Haven't tasted any of the ones grown here. Climate and soils can affect fruit quality
Oscar

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2016, 04:40:14 AM »
Honestly to take it one step further I plan on growing some of these seedlings on my 3 acres here in Kona (upslope) and growing the rest on another property just north of Hilo.   Even that is gonna be a fun experiment to see how 2 seedling trees from the same species will grow on different sides of the island.  And how long they take to fruit respectively. 

Interesting to hear about people's experiences growing ganyao here on big island.  I've got about 10 seedling trees of ganyao about 1 ft tall now.  Will be growing 2-3 in Kona and 4-5 in Hilo side.   Hopefully someone good comes from One of the trees.   This will be repeated across about 12-15 species.  Including puang manee. Red prawn.  Black Thorn.  Musang kind.  Nokkachip.  Etc etc.   
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

Future

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #18 on: August 11, 2018, 06:08:44 PM »
I have the best seeds from Durian I ate the summer, planted in West Africa.  We'll see on a decade or so how they taste...

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2018, 12:37:23 AM »
I have the best seeds from Durian I ate the summer, planted in West Africa.  We'll see on a decade or so how they taste...

Isn't that's where your mango project is with 8 months long dry season? That would be quite challenging for durian.
There are cacao growing areas in West Africa,  those should be great for durian.

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2018, 12:49:52 AM »
You in the far north or south of Konya side or planning to heavily irrigate? Seems Iona is too try for durian. For seedling durian 30ft or more should be considered. Just plant mid term crops in between like papayas, bananas, grafted white sapote or jackfruit etc and remove them in ten years for the durian to take up the area.

Imo the #1 mistake is planting too close, too close to buildings, and other plants. 10 meters is what we plant durians at and 20 meters between rows.

Future

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2018, 12:46:44 PM »
I have the best seeds from Durian I ate the summer, planted in West Africa.  We'll see on a decade or so how they taste...

Isn't that's where your mango project is with 8 months long dry season? That would be quite challenging for durian.
There are cacao growing areas in West Africa,  those should be great for durian.

Same location. Dry season is about 4-5 months. Cacao is grown here.

Sam

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2018, 03:32:07 PM »
I wanted to grow just one durian tree as I'm a bit challenged for space. Is it true that more than one tree is required for good fruit set?

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #23 on: August 13, 2018, 03:30:55 AM »
I have the best seeds from Durian I ate the summer, planted in West Africa.  We'll see on a decade or so how they taste...

Isn't that's where your mango project is with 8 months long dry season? That would be quite challenging for durian.
There are cacao growing areas in West Africa,  those should be great for durian.
You will have to irrigate during dry season. Durian is very susceptible to drought. Even a short period of drought can kill a mature tree.

Same location. Dry season is about 4-5 months. Cacao is grown here.
Oscar

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #24 on: August 13, 2018, 02:01:40 PM »
I have the best seeds from Durian I ate the summer, planted in West Africa.  We'll see on a decade or so how they taste...

Isn't that's where your mango project is with 8 months long dry season? That would be quite challenging for durian.
There are cacao growing areas in West Africa,  those should be great for durian.
You will have to irrigate during dry season. Durian is very susceptible to drought. Even a short period of drought can kill a mature tree.

Same location. Dry season is about 4-5 months. Cacao is grown here.

Got it. Thanks. Good we have water supply.

Kona fruit farm

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2018, 02:45:14 AM »
hey friends... so i did plant a few of my durian.  spaced at 30 feet... and yes kona has about a 3 month dry spell where i'm at.  i have all the trees in shade cages and on drip irrigation... so we'll see!
With 3 acres of prime real estate for growing tropicals... why not create my own garden of eden?? Work in progress

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2018, 11:30:28 AM »

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Re: Growing rare durian varieties from seed
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2023, 12:46:15 AM »
This post was started almost 7 years ago, a few on this topic dont post here anymore. Would be great to see some updates on how this all went and where the trees are at now? Im sure some valuable information could be obtained from both hawaii and west africa.