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Messages - Vlk

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1
I use Espoma Hollytone on my Jabos
So a fertilizer for acid loving plants, that's a great idea - I will try that out! I've heard jaboticabas love acidity. We don't have Espoma here, but I found some other alternatives, fertilizers and acidifiers (if that's the correct term) for azaleas, rhodos, blueberries etc. Thanks for the tip!

2
So it seems the seedling survived the repotting and pruning and is now pushing a fresh new bud from the only tiny branch that it has. I am still set on reviving it and overcome the stunt phase since it is such a resilient fighter. It deserves that. :) Do you have any recommended types of fertilizers for jaboticabas, probiotics or anything that might help with that? I perhaps wouldn't use it right off the bat (there is a bit of fertilizer in the soil mix for couple of weeks) after repotting it so recently, but in a few weeks from now perhaps, I would like to give it a boost.

By the way Julian, I did exactly what you describe. The root system seems pretty well developed and somewhat healthy (it's very complex for such a small seedling, but the individual roots are very very thin). I guess the next step now is to figure out how to boost the growth of what is above the ground.

I will create a better mix of soil for it next time, but that would be after it bounces back and grows some more... For now, I wouldn't disturb it after the recent repotting.

3
Thank you for all your answers! Much appreciated. :) I don't want to give up on it just yet... I would of course prefer to acquire larger, already established plant ideally, but it is somewhat rare in our country and mostly only small freshly sprouted seedlings are available.

4
Ah, so you think it might be not enough acidity issue? I am using a mix of peat, sometimes I used to mix it with coffee grinds as well. And I am using only rainwater for watering... I suppose that digging some soil in a pine forest might make for an even more acidic substrate. I can definitely give it a shot if you think it might help. Though not sure if it would be optimal now though, since I repotted it at the end of December.

5
Hi there! Is there a bulletproof way to boost growth of jaboticabas, particularly Escarlate jaboticaba? I have a small seedling for almost 3 years now and it literally made no progress. It's tiny as if it sprouted a month ago (it's about 2-3 cm tall). It grows small yellowish leaves and shoots that later on tends to wilt and fall off... And the cycle has just been repeating over those 3 years, with absolutely no significant growth. I repotted it recently (the only green shoot wilted and dried out again), cut off some of the dead parts and I see that the trunk is still healthy and green. I really want to help it to get over this stunted phase... I've heard a lot of great things about Escarlate jaboticaba, how quickly and easily it grows, how fast it fruits... But I just keep failing at making it healthy. Any tips to overcome this would be greatly appreciated!

7
Hi there, I've got a young avocado Ettinger tree that seems to be pushing flower buds out. The thing is, I don't see flower buds on the rest of the trees just yet (they might grow some, but they barely started to create fresh buds after winter, so it is inconclusive just yet). Is there a way to fertilize at least some of the flowers to get some fruit or there is no way to do that, unless I have a flowering A variety synchronized with it?

8
Got my plants from Vlk a while ago at this point, sorry for the delay with updating-

Vlk was amazing, from holding the plants for multiple weeks until I could get over to the country, shipping extra plants with extra care, and keeping it cool through shipping difficulties-

The plants arrived in fabulous shape and have been planted out and (most) are thriving

Great to hear that! :) Thank you very much for your feedback. :)

9
Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / Durio kinabaluensis seeds wanted
« on: December 01, 2021, 12:08:14 PM »
Hi there, would anyone be able to obtain some seeds this season? :)

10
Thanks again for the plants, Vlk. Received some healthy looking plants a few days ago. Fast shipping and everything was packed really well.

Thank you for your feedback! :) I am glad everything went well!

11
Thank you for your responses, I appreciate it! I am curious what kind of fruit will each of the seedlings produce. :)

12
If the 2 seedlings remain distinct in form, one may be zygotic. The fact that there are 2 embryos from one seed almost guarantees one is a nucellar clone of the parent. On very rare occasions there are twin zygotic embryos, but only very rarely.
So do you think the one with the thorns is the zygotic one? I never grew Hamlin orange, so I have no idea how it looks like.

13
Hi there, I've got two seedlings that come from a single seed of Hamlin orange variety. I've read somewhere that very often, one of the seedlings out of a polyembryonic seed is true to seed, so in this case, a Hamlin orange, and the other is a hybrid - mix of the plant from which the pollen came and mix of the Hamlin variety. I see that one of the seedlings has a slightly different growth - it is more gnarly/twisted, it grew a second branch very soon after germinating and it has thorns. The other one grows straight up and it is much taller and looks very "orderly" compared to the other one. :D It also doesn't have thorns. So I take it that the thornless seedling is true Hamlin whereas the other one will be a hybrid?

Also how long would you say it takes for the Hamlin to start bearing fruit from seed without being grafted? What is your experience?

14
Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / WTB Eugenia pyriformis
« on: August 18, 2021, 08:58:55 AM »
Looking to buy seeds (or plants if it would be in the EU)! Thank you in advance for any offers!

15
Any chance either of you could PM me your source of those durian seeds, graveolens etc? Im looking for some way to get suluk (zibenthius x graveolens) seeds?
Hi there, all the wild durian seeds I ever got were from Maryoto and afriadoni. Maryoto is still actively selling here and I am not sure about afriadoni, he might not be active anymore. One batch of seeds of the Durio kinabaluensis I got from a friend of Lindsay from Year of the Durian. But she doesn't seem to sell seeds anymore.

16
Yes I only can imagine how frustrated he must have felt.
I also understand his decision.

I think that there maybe isn't enough experience made in growing durian out of it's natural environment to tell that it's impossible to make it bloom. Without artificial lighting, constant temperature and humidity it's nearly impossible to grow most of the tropical plants in many parts of Europe. I know that there are many producing cocoa plants for example in greenhouses. So why not Durian if the right conditions where found under greenhouse conditions?
I think in order of exploration and gaining new information it's okay to dream and experiment with that dreams.

To get back to durian, the biggest tree I saw was a Durio zibethinus in the botanical garden of Berlin. It was nearly 3 m (9,8 ft) tall the last time I was there. They also had a giant bread fruit tree that already reached the top of the roof with little fruits on it. So maybe there are more bigger specimens of Durian throughout Europe than one might think. The next time I get there, I will ask if they might know of a durian tree that flowered in other botanical gardens or private collectors they know of. They have a huge greenhouse for tropical fruit plants, I think they are well connected.

I also read that wild jungle durian make the best rootstocks for grafting, since they are well adapted to poor and soggy soil, deseases and stuff. But I guess that counts only for the parts these wild jungle durio are from?

I plan on documenting my growing experience, if they don't make it even through the first winter I save up the money for scions. If they are alive but struggle I have to think about it again. But if they thrive, I will definitely try to get some scions and share all the experiences I made in its own thread.

I also get why you don't want to try growing durian again, all your points are right. Normally I don't grow ultra tropicals, I focus more on dragon fruit, annona, plinia, Eugenia and other smaller shrubs. But I was lucky to try a really good fresh durian a few weeks ago and I fell so in love that I thought that's such nice fruit that I must honor it by growing it as a plant, even if it's just ornamental and not flowering. So I guess I'm becoming that guy that travels just for fresh durian from now on.

I definitely will let you know if my plants survived winter and found a person willing to sell me scions.

And if someone reading this and is willing to support my plan with some D99 or other self compatible durian varieties next year, please feel free to get in contact with me.  :D

Yeah, it must've been pretty devastating for him. He spent several decades building his collection...

You are right, there isn't much knowledge about that out there and that definitely shouldn't stand in the way of trying it out and see what's possible. :) You have all my support! And it's great to have a dream!

Wow, that's a pretty nice specimen! That's what I thought - there are so many botanical gardens out there with huge greenhouses, advanced technology, and tropical sections, so why wouldn't it be possible? What I think is that they might avoid this species due to the fact that the falling fruit might be dangerous and because of its controversial smell? :D In any case, that might be a perfect place to acquire scion. Because I am not sure if sending scions overseas is a viable solution - I imagine the scion would need to be very fresh in order to be successfully grafted onto a rootstock.

Definitely try to acquire some of the jungle durian (kutejensis and graveolens are fairly easy to get) and graft the zibethinus onto them. And maybe compare these with zibethinus grafted onto a zibethinus.

Haha, reading on your experience reminded me of myself back in 2013 when I tasted my first durian! I totally fell in love and I was absolutely blown away by the taste. I immediately sowed the seeds back then and that's how my passion for growing (and collecting durians) started. I also dreamed of traveling to Southeast Asia and try all the different varieties (as the only you can get here is mostly Mon Thong and that should be one of the least interesting ones!) and also jungle durians. That actually happened in 2018, but sadly enough, I was there during the time when durian wasn't in season. So I haven't tasted any local durian... But I still really want to. I think the jungle ones must be so unique in terms of taste!

Definitely keep me updated please, I am really interested in the topic of durians in Europe. :)

17
Hello, thanks for replying!

That's some bad news, sorry to hear that. But good to hear that you're keeping up with your hobby and started to grow again.

Yes I know durian are not easy ones, it's more of an experiment for me to see what is possible in my climate, with and without greenhouse conditions. Also grafted plants don't grow as vigorous and tall as non grafted ones. Makes it easier for me to keep it under control in the longterm. If I manage to keep them alive and let's say it will flower someday, it would be a shame if it's self incompatible.
So far, the tap roots are digging deep into the soil, there are no signs of leafs yet. If they make it through winter, I will try to get some scions and graft them next year at the end of spring.
But til then I'm trying to find a source for scions. If it's all working as planned, I may will have a grafted plant to spare next year if you're interested.
The D. kinabaluensis seems promising, but seeds aren't that easy to obtain either, right?

Indeed, it was hard and must've been hundred times harder for my friend, who lost thousands of plants and incredibly rare species, many of which were already fruiting. He had one of the largest of collections. He told me this year he will never get back to it, which I understand.

From durio species, I had oxleyanus, graveolens, kutejensis, dulcis, kinabaluensis and zibethinus. As far as I remember, the one that grew best was oxleyanus, at least in the beginning. I was trying to get other species as well, especially testudinarum, but that seemed nearly impossible. :) D. kinabaluensis is fairly rare and quite hard to get, but definitely not impossible. I bought it on two separate occasions from two different sources, always with a success.

I've never heard of a flowering durian in the European region, but maybe such a plant is somewhere out there? And with the climate changes and temperatures rising, who knows what will be possible in the upcoming years? I've contacted several botanical gardens if they happen to have a mature plant that is already flowering, but I never found one.

I was thinking that if one would want to successfully grow a durian tree and make it fruit, you would need a huge, top-of-the-line greenhouse and pump millions into the project to maintain the optimal conditions throughout the year. Heating, artificial light, keeping humidity levels, and maintaining optimal quality of the soil (ideally they would need to be in the ground). But sadly, no one with spare millions has that kind of ambition I guess. :D

The reason I gave up on durians is exactly the above... I realized that I want to grow plants that I can later harvest fruit from and with durian, it just seems more like a dream. Not that I want to discourage you of course. It's a great challenge that can be exciting and motivational, pushing the boundaries of what's possible. That was my motivation all those years back - that, plus my love for the fruit, which is just out of this world.

In any case, my experience is that the seeds are sprouting perfectly, they grow quite fast and strong in the first couple of months and then they usually started to slow down and also somewhat deteriorate. Though I've seen a beautiful durian tree seedling from France I believe, which was growing in an apartment close to a heating pipe (which is usually bad for plants as it dries out the air) and it was looking incredible. I think it was about 2 years old.

The durians that my friend had were growing in a tropical greenhouse and they were growing much better, but still not as well as Artocarpus for instance. They were quite slow in their growth and the leaves didn't look entirely healthy. I think it's really a lottery when it comes to growing these as they are extremely sensitive.

But I think wild durians might be an interesting experiment. Either the above mentioned D. oxleyanus or D. kinabaluensis. You could also use one of these as a rootstock to graft zibethinus varietes on it. Might be worth the shot as well. I know we wanted to try graft durian onto Cullenia excelsa, which is related to durians and might be more vigorous and resistant. I don't know if that would work though.

I would definitely be interested in a grafted plant, thank you for the offer! I always wanted to acquire one back then but it seemed impossible... All the leads that I had (to grafted plants and scions) always led to a dead-end, unfortunately. But it's definitely not impossible!

18
Hello,
I know it's been a while since the last post, but how is your durian tree? I'm trying to do the same as you. I have a few Durio zibethinus seeds sprouting, which I want to graft on some D99 Scions or other self compatible varieties of durian. Did you find over the years a source for durian scions or grafted plants? Also what is your experience in growing durian in moderate european climate?
Hi there! First of all, I was so surprised to see this thread revived. :D I totally forgot I started it all those years back. I actually had to stop growing a year or two after I started collecting plants and I gave all of my collection of plants to my friend. Unfortunately, the last winter was extreme (I had -27,5 C here) and during those extremes, as luck would have it, my friend's tropical greenhouse got shattered wall because his dogs were fighting overnight and somehow manage to broke the glass. That resulted in the loss of his entire collection, including all of my plants and all the durians that I ever had. I was quite shocked to learn this as just this year, I decided to get back into growing plants, only to find out that I lost everything...

So to your question, I don't have any durian plants at the moment. I was thinking about acquiring some, but I decided not to collect durians again (I started collection Eugenias instead :) ) as they are way too sensitive to our climate, and making them to produce fruit, even in a greenhouse, seems impossible. I would like to try and grow the mountain durian Durio kinabaluensis though, which I think might have a great potential to grow in our climate since it is used to much higher altitudes and lower temperatures throughout the year. I had it all those years back but lost it last winter with the rest. So maybe at some point, I will be able to acquire it again. :) I haven't found any source of scions or budwood eventhough I tried back then.

How are your plants doing?

19
Added Eugenia florida seeds!

20
I did at one point, but I currently only have seedlings!
I see, good to know! I will keep an eye out in case they will be available again. :)

21
Hi there, do you also offer seeds of this one?

22
Added Randia formosa and Bunchosia argentea. :)

23
In any case, I will correct the tag and write Myrciaria there instead of Eugenia. :)

24
I became very interested in this plant when Trade Winds offered seeds a couple of years ago. I got a zero percent germination rate out of the seeds I ordered from them, however. I do not chalk that up to getting bad seeds from them; I think it had to do with my own inexperience. The poor germination rate does track with it being a cultivar or subspecies of Myrciaria floribunda, the Rumberry or Guavaberry. That species has a notoriously poor and slow germination rate. I got some fresh M. floribunda seeds from Tang Tonic at the end of 2020 which have, to this point, only a twenty percent germination rate. They had a zero percent germination rate until about four or five months after planting, so there is hope that more germination will occur. It also makes me believe that I probably gave up on my Belize Blackberry seeds far too quickly and that I would have had a few germinate if I had continued to care for them for at least a year after planting instead of giving up on them after two or three months.

Ertdude had some Belize Blackberry seedlings for sale in the winter of 2019. I really wanted them but was not willing to risk having them potentially killed by shipping them in the winter. They sold out before spring, so I still do not have this plant in my collection. But, Ertdude might have more info on this species.

Oh so it's not Eugenia but Myrciaria? Thank you for sharing the article, that's very interesting! I can see that they describe it there as Eugenia floribunda, which would correspond with the information found on Tradewinds website, though they mention they couldn't quite determine the species and that it is most likely related to E.floribunda, so maybe subspecies or as you mentioned a variety? Though looking at the pictures of both Myrciaria floribunda and Eugenia floribunda, the leaves seem to be of different shape, though the ripe fruit does seem to be deep purple/black.

Eugenia floribunda is a synonym of Myrciaria floribunda. I do not know why Trade Winds uses Eugenia instead of Myrciaria; Myrciaria floribunda (H.West ex Willd.) O.Berg has been the accepted botanical name for decades, with Julia Morton using it when writing about the species in Fruits of Warm Climates (https://hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/rumberry_ars.html).

The Wikipedia page states, "There is great genetic variability within the species, and Myrciaria floribunda can vary in form, structure and appearance, and that has given rise to a large number of botanical synonyms." A couple of scientific journal articles are cited for this claim: "Fruiting and quality attributes of cambui (Myrciaria floribunda (West ex Willd.) O. Berg in the Atlantic Forest of northeast Brazil" (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/340543017_Fruiting_and_quality_attributes_of_cambui_Myrciaria_floribunda_West_ex_Willd_O_Berg_in_the_Atlantic_Forest_of_northeast_Brazil) and "The Genetic Diversity of Myrciaria floribunda (Myrtaceae) in Atlantic Forest Fragments of Different Sizes" (https://www.jstor.org/stable/4499105).

Again, that lends credence to Belize Blackberry being a specific cultivar of M. floribunda.

Also, many Syzygium species used to be classified as Eugenias; you sometimes see them still referred to by their Eugenia synonyms. I am not a botanist, so I cannot tell you why these species are grouped in one genus instead of another. What I can say is that Myrtaceae is a large family, and its classification seems, to a layman like myself, to be a mess.

Oh I see! I saw the number of synonyms on the Wiki page and I was very surprised - never seen so many synonyms for one species! Well I am really curious when the plant will start producing, what kind of flowers and what fruits will it have. Just looking at it, I would never guess it's from Myrciaria or Eugenia family. To me it really most closely resembles Syzygium or Oleander.

25
I became very interested in this plant when Trade Winds offered seeds a couple of years ago. I got a zero percent germination rate out of the seeds I ordered from them, however. I do not chalk that up to getting bad seeds from them; I think it had to do with my own inexperience. The poor germination rate does track with it being a cultivar or subspecies of Myrciaria floribunda, the Rumberry or Guavaberry. That species has a notoriously poor and slow germination rate. I got some fresh M. floribunda seeds from Tang Tonic at the end of 2020 which have, to this point, only a twenty percent germination rate. They had a zero percent germination rate until about four or five months after planting, so there is hope that more germination will occur. It also makes me believe that I probably gave up on my Belize Blackberry seeds far too quickly and that I would have had a few germinate if I had continued to care for them for at least a year after planting instead of giving up on them after two or three months.

Ertdude had some Belize Blackberry seedlings for sale in the winter of 2019. I really wanted them but was not willing to risk having them potentially killed by shipping them in the winter. They sold out before spring, so I still do not have this plant in my collection. But, Ertdude might have more info on this species.

Oh so it's not Eugenia but Myrciaria? Thank you for sharing the article, that's very interesting! I can see that they describe it there as Eugenia floribunda, which would correspond with the information found on Tradewinds website, though they mention they couldn't quite determine the species and that it is most likely related to E.floribunda, so maybe subspecies or as you mentioned a variety? Though looking at the pictures of both Myrciaria floribunda and Eugenia floribunda, the leaves seem to be of different shape, though the ripe fruit does seem to be deep purple/black.

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