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Topics - Peep

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Cold Hardy Citrus / Community Tristeza Virus test results
« on: March 27, 2024, 08:25:56 AM »
Myself and some other people have bought ImmunoStrip test kits for the Citrus Tristeza Virus. I thought it would be good to collect test results in a spreadsheet, so people are warned about certain cultivars and nurseries

So far it's mostly plants from Adavo that I have tested, because they are not to be trusted regarding phytosanitary. I will buy another 25 piece kit to complete testing all my other plants, but I could only afford one kit right now.

Keep in mind that even if certain cultivars from a risky nursery like Adavo are tested negative in this list, it's still possible for these cultivars to get infected from the other cultivars in their  collection which are infected.

False positives don't really happen, but false negatives can happen if the virus is very dormant in the plant.

Besides my own results I try to keep this document updated with results from other people. So please also let me know if you have done tests, so I can add the results.

Where to get test kits? ->
You can order from them through email. Price is €166 (without tax) for a 25 piece kit and €28 shipping (EU)

Also a question, does anyone know if I can re-use potting soil mix from infected plants that I remove?
If I remove most of the roots, then the possible remaining small roots will die and as far as I know a virus like this doesn't last long without a host? But it's hard to find information on this.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Citrus daoxianensis (Daoxian wild mandarin)
« on: February 11, 2024, 07:57:16 AM »
I like citrus fruits that have a rough or corrugated skin. I noticed this daoxianensis mandarin has very rough skin, but I can't find much about it online.

Does anyone have this cultivar?

This might be it, but the fruit in the picture has a very smooth skin so I'm quite unsure if it's the same cultivar

This is where I found it:

Botanical Monographs. Jardín Botánico de la Universitat de València
Volume 2: Citrus

It's hard to see in this low resolution, but I have the print version, which is higher quality, and there you can see that each fruit on the tree is quite rough and bumpy.


I'm quickly getting salt crystal / crust build up on the soil of my potted citrus plants. Part of this could be caused by the fertilizer (, and I might have fertilized a little bit too much, but I suspect that the main problem is my tap water.

I don't have rainwater to water them with. Recently I bought PH strips and I believe the water was around 8 PH. I now add a little bit of vinegar to the tap water to adjust the PH to something suitable for citrus, but if I'm not mistaken, this doesn't really help against the soluble salts issue?

Is there any other way to treat my water and improve it? I have too many plants to be able to just buy demineralized water.

I read that it helps to sometimes flush the soil by watering a large amount, which I did, but I don't believe it will solve it well enough. Any ideas and tips are appreciated.

Here are some pictures of the soil:

[EDIT] Solved ->The conclusion is copper deficiency:


I have this Keraji with weird lumps / bulges on the branches. This plant had the same issue last year on one new branch (I think), the last one of the season, which I cut off.

However it's present again this year. It could be gall wasp, but to me it doesn't completely fit the pictures, but maybe I'm wrong. If it was insects I would have expected that it would have been removed last year when I cut the branch off. Or that I would have found the same problem on other plants. But only this one, out of over 50 citrus plants, has shown this problem, two years in a row...

The lumps are partly filled with what looks like resin.

First two pics are from last year

cut open:

Anyone here that can tell me what causes these lumps? Fixable, or do I need to burn it and find a new Keraji?
The color of the leaf stems is also maybe a bit weird because it's not uniform.

Hello all,

As we all know, citrus flowers smell amazing, so I was hoping to capture that aroma. Orange blossom water is a thing, but for now I will not be able to harvest large amounts. My plants are small, some are too small to carry fruit, so I will remove flowers sporadically. Storing them to collect enough over time to make 'blossom water' doesn't seem like a practical thing, so I was thinking alcohol instead.

Could I just have a bottle of grain alcohol and chuck more flowers in it whenever I pick some of the plants? Should I strain and remove old flowers in between sometimes, or just let everything collect for half a year and strain it afterwards?

I'm also looking into if I should dry the flowers or not before putting them in the alcohol.

Anyone else that has been doing things with the citrus flowers? I'm curious about different things to do with them.

Kind regards,

Still looking for a few cultivars to complete my collection, please let me know if you can send me a scion from any of these :)

- Clemyuz-22
- Satsuma Corsica SRA 145
- Bloomsweet / kinkoji
- Nansho Daidai (taiwanica)
- Taichang Lemon (taiwanica x ichang)
- Yuzu N30 Hybrid
- Yuzukichi
- Yuzu Nishiki Tada / Tanaka Mukaku Yuzu
- Ventura Lemandarin

Here you can see my spreadsheet with my collection progress:

I can try to trade you scions of cultivars that I have, but my plants are mostly very young so it's not always possible. Hopefully next year and after I will have most of these cultivars available to ship scions to people within Europe.

Citrus General Discussion / Yet another soil thread
« on: February 19, 2023, 10:13:14 AM »
I try to do my own research but after using lava split/grit last time and this apparently being not the ideal choice for citrus, I wanted to make sure to make a good mix this time. Especially because I'll be repotting 50 or so plants.

What I have around at the moment is:
- Coarse perlite 2 - 6 mm 
- COMPO Bio Potting soil - Extra light (pic: bottom right)
- Pine bark mulch 10 - 25mm (pic: bottom left)
- Coco husk mulch - compressed blocks - (pic: top left)
- 100% Coco potting soil - compressed blocks - (pic: top right)

Pot sizes: 20 - 30 cm
Climate: Belgium
Winter: outdoors (wet)
Summer: hot rooftop
Rootstock: mostly Poncirus, few C4475

For the coco products I hear about a problem with salt. Some say it's fine, some say to rinse it with water, some say to rinse it with certain products... Is it worth the effort or better to use something else...

I'm only in my second year growing citrus so I hope I can get some advice from people with a little more experience :)

Cold Hardy Citrus / Ichanglemonquat?
« on: January 14, 2023, 07:39:08 AM »

Yesterday I was grafting Ichangquat and Ichang Lemon, then I was thinking: There is Ichangquat and there is Lemonquat (sunquat), so what about an Ichang-Lemon-quat?

Ichangquat is very hardy, but is a bit behind in fruit quality. Lemonquat has higher fruit quality, but lacks hardiness. So Ichanglemonquat could be interesting?

Anyone ever heard of it existing? Or if it doesn't, is there a reason nobody has made it yet? Is it difficult?

Best regards,

Not available anymore

Hello everyone,

At the end of next week I will receive some scions. Up to now I've only grafted in spring with freshly cut scions, so this is different now. I think of a few options:

1. Store the scionwood until spring at 9°C in a fridge (I'm afraid they will lose their viability).

2. Graft and place the plants in a unheated room around 14°C, with ambient light but no direct sunlight.

3. Graft and place them in a room around 20°C, can be positioned either for ambient light or for direct sunlight.

4. Or maybe other suggestions?

Any advice for what is best?
The poncirus rootstock is currently placed outdoors. If it is recommend to put the grafts in a 20°C room then I can already bring the rootstock inside as preparation.

I will receive three scions for each variety so it is also possible to try two things. This is what I'm expecting:

3 x Ichangquat
3 x Ichang Lemon CRC 1215
3 x Eremorange
3 x Citradia "Eisenhut 139"

Best regards,

Cold Hardy Citrus / Nansho Daidai and other Taiwanica cultivars
« on: December 14, 2022, 10:44:13 AM »
I could use some help regarding Taiwanica cultivars.

I bought the Taiwanica from Adavo, expecting the Nansho Daidai, which is known for it's narrow leaves, and this matches their picture and description (although they use pictures from other people / internet)

The leaves on the plant I received are quite round, with wide petioles (see my picture below). So I emailed about it and I got an answer:

Translated from Czech:

You're right. The Nanshô-daidai variety has narrow leaves:

We do not offer this variety. We offer only the original species. He doesn't have narrow leaves:

So it seems their own description on the website is not correct for the cultivar that they sell.

Does anyone know the name of this 'original species' cultivar?

On the web pages he gives I don't really find a name. Translated from the Taiwanese page it says "The difference from the original mother is that the petiole wing of this species is linear and the fruit is 7-9cm." So the plant from Adavo would be the 'original mother' mentioned here.

I also have the Taiwanica from Lenzi, of which I also don't know a cultivar name. But it seems different from the one that I have from Adavo. And Lenzi's Taiwanica leaves also don't seem narrow enough to be the Nansho Daidai.

Plant from Adavo:

Plant from Lenzi:

Newer leaves seem to get larger:

Best regards,

Is anyone able tell me what these lumps on this young branch are? Could this be from gall wasp? I'm a bit concerned. Few weeks ago there was also resin coming out of different spots on this branch, the big bits I removed some weeks ago, but you can still see it a bit.

I bought both the "C. Unshiu x C. Junos" and "Poncirus x C. Unshiu" from Adavo. I was wondering if people here have experience with these.

The description of the "Poncirus x C. Unshiu" is fairly positive:

  • "Probably a Czech variety, the branches are flat and twisted similar to the Flying Dragon with small single, double or triple leaves of irregular shapes with smooth edges, small flowers and large twisted thorns. Frost resistance is between -15 and -20°C. It grows significantly. A partially deciduous variety, the younger plants practically do not fall at all, the older ones can be said to be almost as deciduous as Poncirus, although the plant always keeps a leaf here and there through the winter. The fruits are smaller, mandarin-shaped, sweet without the influence of poncirus in taste, but rather of a lower mandarin quality, the length of our growing season also seems sufficient in the lowlands, although obviously at the cost of smaller and less ripe fruits. It grafts poorly."

Description of the "C. Unshiu x C. Junos" is a little less positive about taste and there is also no information about cold resistance:

  • "The new hybrid, not described in detail, has a looser structure and has thorny twigs. Stems up to 2.5 cm long. The leaves are deep green, 5-15 cm long, with less prominent veining and a bluntly bifurcated tip. The lower part of the leaf is a stipule up to 4 cm long and 2 cm wide. In younger leaves, the stipules are less noticeable. Rather straight, visible as a petiole, which is, however, short 5 mm. It has white five-pointed flowers. The pear-shaped fruit, lemon-yellow in color, 5-7 cm long and 3-4 cm wide, has a rough, rough skin. The peel is firm, hard, 1 cm wide. There are 9 segments inside, medium seeds (about 10) and very little juice. The color of the pulp is white-yellow-brown. The taste is bitter, astringent and almost inedible."

I'm not very familiar with this kinds of crosses, would it be expected that these are F1 crosses? Or could they be F2 or possibly further in generation? I bought these two because I might eventually want to use them for breeding. But would it also be useful to grow seeds from these to make selections from?

Here is a picture of my "C. Unshiu x C. Junos" that I received:

I'll update with a better picture and also one of the "Poncirus x C. Unshiu"

Best regards,

Citrus Buy, Sell, & Trade / [EU] Wanted: Kumquat Nameiwa scion
« on: September 20, 2022, 08:37:34 AM »
Hi there,

I'm Are you, or do you know someone, that could help me add the kumquat Nameiwa to my cold-resistant collection?

I'm looking for a scion, maybe two for improved chances. They don't have to be  very large or thick, I can graft a variety of diameters. I'm located in Belgium.

Best regards,

Cold Hardy Citrus / The eremo- hybrids, which ones are worth it?
« on: August 21, 2022, 08:46:25 AM »
Last time I was asking about satsuma's, now the eremo's.

From what I have gathered there is:

1. Eremorange (-14°C)
2. Eremolemon Coachella (-12°C)
3. Eremomandarin (-?°C)
4. Citrangeremo (-15°C)
5. Citrus glauca x shekwasha (-?°C)

- Eremorange is the most popular, so I expect it to be good and it has good cold resistance, so I will add this to my collection

- Eremolemon is also reasonably popular, not as cold hardy, but because lemons overal aren't very cold hardy, I still think it is interesting to have (I have this one already).

- Citrangeremo, some information about it on the internet, but I did not find much about fruit quality or how it compares to Eremorange. It could be a little more cold hardy due to the poncirus genetics, but I'm wondering if it's worth it if Eremorange has better taste.

- Eremomandarin I haven't found much about it...

- Citrus glauca x shekwasha, I think this is also considered an eremomandarin. Not much information, especially about fruit quality. Adavo has it.

Any people here that have some experience with these? I could just get all of them for my collection, but I will already have so many varieties that I would rather preemptively remove some, instead of waiting until I can test and taste them all.

Here's a picture of my Eremolemon Coachella on poncirus. I have another one from Lenzi on carrizo, which I took a scion from and grafted on poncirus

Cold Hardy Citrus / Best and most hardy satsuma varieties?
« on: July 04, 2022, 09:47:47 AM »
I'm curious what the current opinion is, or your personal opinion, on the best cold hardy satsuma?

I have my eye on these varieties:

Satsuma Corsica SRA 145 (-15°C)
Satsuma Collot (-14°C)
Satsuma Hashimoto (-14°C)
Satsuma Iseki (-13°C)
Satsuma Maxima (-??°C)
Satsuma Miyagawa (-12°C)
Satsuma Okitsu / Owari (-12°C)

These temperature numbers are pretty arbitrary, but the number isn't very important to me, it's more about which variety is more cold hardy than the other.

SRA 145 seems very hardy, although I doubt a little if it's really that much more hardy than Hashimoto and Collot. Some people are very positive about the fruit, others a bit less.

Collot is supposedly a bit less cold hardy and less tasty than SRA 145, but ripens earlier.

Hashimoto has some positives, like being quite hardy, early fruit, good taste, but I've read it's a slow growing tree, not as vigorous as the other satsuma's.

Iseki is one I don't know much about. It's the most known hardy satsuma coming from Russia. Olivier Biggio mentions it in his book, and Adavo has it. Adavo writes that it's high quality, but Miyagawa became popular because it's more productive.

Maxima is a fairly unknown variety, sold by two French nurseries that have it from the same source in Italy. Bigger than average fruit, and possibly better than average cold hardiness. So I would put it above Okitsu/Owari regarding hardiness

Monjardinextraordinaire: Maxima' is a new Sicilian selection. It has been tested in our nursery in Loire et Cher (41) for 2 years. It is superior to Unshui in terms of fruit size, shelf life and cold hardiness. / From email: Our Italian salesman brought this variety to us after selecting it from his crops. The selection is still young. We are updating the variety as we receive feedback from the field.

Achat-vente-palmiers: Italian selection of the famous Japanese mandarin tree satsuma offering in November seedless fruits bigger than the type. Grafted on poncirus for better hardiness: -10 to -12°C.

Miyagawa is one I come across a lot, many people have it or recommend it, but it's a bit unclear to me why. It's not the most cold hardy, mixed bag on taste, I guess it might be like Adavo says and it's because it's a vigorous and productive tree?

Owari / Okitsu seem to be equally cold hardy, but not (much) more cold hardy than the average satsuma. High quality fruit, some people prefer Owari, some Okitsu...

My personal pick right now, without tasting any fruit or experience growing them:
- SRA 145 for hardiness and also good to great fruit quality depending on who you ask.
- Hashimoto for hardiness and it's very early ripening, even though it's not vigorous, maybe I'm biased and also just curious about this one. I think it might even beat SRA 145 in hardiness.
- Iseki because curiosity, but maybe I could do some more research on it first.
- Maxima because curiosity.

Even though many people have it, I don't see much reason to add Miyagawa. Collot seems like a decent one, but I think I would wait to see if I experience trouble with frozen fruit on SRA 145. I own and Okitsu, not sure if I keep if for good fruit quality or sell it to have more room.

What do you guys think about satsuma varieties?

Cold Hardy Citrus / My citrus collection [EU - Antwerp]
« on: June 30, 2022, 09:15:17 AM »
Hello everyone,

In summer of 2021 I started my citrus collection with a few plants from Lenzi, and have kept learning and adding varieties during the year. I thought I'd just make a topic to put some information about my plants, my experiences and people are free to ask questions if they have any.

I'm located in the city of Antwerp and while the back of our house and garden are facing south, the hours of sun can be limited due to walls and buildings blocking the sun. So I keep my citrus plants on a flat rooftop, two stories high up and get a reasonable amount of sun there I think (it's not at the top of the house, I still get some shade from other buildings). Downside is that it can get a bit more wind up there. Other than that, the winter temperatures are not too harsh here in the city I think. According to the book from Olivier Biggio "Agrumes résistant au froid" I'm on the edge between zone 8A and 8B.

These are the varieties I have now:

- Yuzu
- Yuzu N°3
- Smooth Skin Hanayuzu
- Yuzumelo / Yuzu x Citrumelo
- Thomasville Citrangequat
- US119
- Furrowed Bitter Orange
- Taiwanica
- Sudachi
- Eremolemon Coachella
- Prague Chimera
- Shekwasha
- Keraji Mandarine
- Changsha Tangerine
- Okitsu Satsuma
- Maxima Satsuma
- Enzo Pomelo
- Citrangequat 4 Season
- Meyer Lemon

Some of them came from Lenzi and are on carrizo rootstock, so I am taking scions from them and grafting them onto poncirus. I had never made grafts before and from reading on the internet it seemed like I should not expect a high success rate, but it really wasn’t an issue. Most of them succeeded and if they failed it was often when the mother plant wasn’t doing very well at the time or if the scion was just a terrible piece.

Here you can find more information about my plants, the rootstocks, my grafts, and any information I collect:

I’m still looking to add a lot of varieties, this is what I still have on my list right now

These I have no good source for yet (Vessieres doesn't reply again):
- Kumquat Nameïwa
- Clemyuz22 (or Clemyuz33)
- Kishu(-mikan)
- Tachibana
- Eremomandarin
- Bloomsweet / kinkoji

Quissac has these two, but they are expensive, so still looking for alternatives or get scions:
- Yuzu Nishiki Tada
- Yuzukichi

These I think I can get from Adavo, but I'm still interested in scions (just less of a priority):
- Ichang lemon CRC 1215
- Trifeola
- Satsuma Hashimoto
- Satsuma Iseki
- Citrangeremo
- Eremorange
- Kabosu
- Ichangensis x Sinensis
- Citrus glauca x shekwasha

For these I know someone in France that is willing to send me scions:
- Satsuma Collot
- Satsuma Corsica SRA 145

And this one I should get from a local nursery in August, he says it's very cold hardy, when I go there I'll try to get more information about it, because online there is nothing to be found about it:
- Kumquat Rafael

I'm also interested in making crosses in the future, so Poncirus+ would also be nice to add to the collection.

If you see a variety on my list that is not worth getting, or if you think a variety should be added to my list, please let me know!

And if you can help me with scions, I’d be very happy to talk about that.

I'm also happy to share scions, but I don't know when I will have which variety available as my plants are rather young right now so I don't get many good scions from them.

Here is a picture of most of my plants together:

Feel free to request pictures of specific plants.

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