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Messages - Francis_Eric

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601
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Florida Persimmon 30 chromosomes
« on: October 07, 2019, 06:34:00 AM »
From what I understand if a 90 persimmon gets pollinated by a Kentucky 60
seedless fruit comes about so no offspring

Wouldn't KY 60 with a Keywest 30 be sterile and no offspring too.

Do you mean double the chromes on a Key west to 60

but if it is 60, and 60 a fertile offspring would be the result .

I am actually wondering what if a 30, and a 90 chromosones one breed what would happen
sterile or not

I understand somewhat , was really good at math in school but not so much now
wish someone could explain some of the examples that normally look like they wouldn't work, but do.

I will have some examples when I get home

By the way the bar right by the hotel is named Keywest bar, and grill maybe subconcious why I asked

https://www2.palomar.edu/users/warmstrong/ww0503.htm#triploid

Oops wrong link Modifying days later
https://www2.palomar.edu/users/warmstrong/hybrids1.htm

602
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Lemon Quince (tastes like Lemonade)
« on: October 07, 2019, 06:19:35 AM »
Looked at Okios picture maybe it is Japanese quince you speak of (or pseudocydonia )
it is a tiny bush (mortun Arboretums tree's are 15 feet or so with huge  size fruit )
(the founder of morton salt company started that place)

I may have seeds available if anyone is interested

I may have pollen  next year (I will ship in diatonomous earth)
I do not want to introduce any pests in any parts of the world


603
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Lemon Quince (tastes like Lemonade)
« on: October 07, 2019, 06:06:22 AM »
Good Observation, but As I remember they said it was Quince, and I think it was a larger tree smaller fruit,

I know the Nursery name it's at my home so maybe on Wednesday or Thursday I will know.

They are passionate about seed growing, and letting the tree's adapt (okio's It sounds like)
\
Oh I guess that was it.

https://oikostreecrops.com/

https://oikostreecrops.com/products/?route=product%2Fsearch&search=quince

By the way Want to try to grow those japanese quince you mention (maybe make hybrids , or use as rootstock 
When I was a little younger (early 20's) I saw one a block away 2 feet or less tall
actually had a thorn in the fruit (not sure if it was stuck in it or grew out of it)

I didn't prepare it right Now I like quinces because they dry easy,  and store better then apples
makes great tea along with those tiny (marble sized) crab apples no on cares about.

604
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Thai Dwarf Mulberries
« on: October 07, 2019, 02:46:26 AM »
Could the dwarfimng be from a osage orange rootstock not certain myself they seem more bushy?
I've always Just put a tarp Under them Threw a rope over them with a weight attached , and shook them onto it.
otherwise being a kid and picking them was fun, but didn't think of that then.

No need to have a dwarf unless it's a space issue

otherwise makes good wine, and drying (and freeze drying) them unripe is very good.

605
CLick On the  picture of the seeds
https://sheffields.com/seeds-for-sale/Passiflora/incarnata///////3077/Purple-Passionflower,-Maypop,-Wild-Passion-Flower,-Wild-Apricot,-Wild-Passion-Vine,-True-Passionflower/Purple-Passionflower,-Maypop,-Wild-Passion-Flower,-Wild-Apricot,-Wild-Passion-Vine,-True-Passionflower






Edible Uses: Fruit - raw or cooked in jellies, jams etc. A sweet flavour, it is best when used as a jelly.High in niacin. Fairly large, the fruit is up to 5cm in diameter though it contains relatively little ediblepulp and a lot of seeds. Leaves - raw or cooked. Said to be delicious as a cooked vegetable or wheneaten in salads. Flowers - cooked as a vegetable or made into syrup.

Medicinal Uses: Maypops is a valuable sedative and tranquillising herb with a long history of use in NorthAmerica. It is frequently used in the treatment of insomnia, epilepsy, hysteria etc. The leaves and stemsare antispasmodic, astringent, diaphoretic, hypnotic, narcotic, sedative, vasodilator and are also used inthe treatment of women's complaints. The plant is harvested after some of the berries have matured andis then dried for later use. It is used in the treatment of insomnia, nervous tension, irritability, neuralgia,irritable bowel syndrome, pre-menstrual tension and vaginal discharges. An extract of the plant depressesthe motor nerves of the spinal cord[213], it is also slightly sedative, slightly reduces blood pressure andincreases respiratory rate. The plant contains alkaloids and flavonoids that are an effective non-addictivesedative that does not cause drowsiness. The plant is not recommended for use during pregnancy. Apoultice of the roots is applied to boils, cuts, earaches, inflammation etc]. The dried plant is exportedfrom America to Europe for medicinal usage. A homeopathic remedy is made from the plant. The GermanCommission E Monographs, a therapeutic guide to herbal medicine, approve Passiflora incarnata for nervousness& insomnia .

QUoted from Sheffeilds
Wiki description:
Passiflora incarnata , commonly known as Maypop , Purple passionflower , True passionflower , Wild apricot , and Wild passion vine , is a fast growing perennial vine with climbing or trailing stems. A member of the passionflower genus Passiflora , the Maypop has large, intricate flowers with prominent styles and stamens. One of the hardiest species of passionflower, it is a common wildflower in the southern United States . The Cherokee in the Tennessee area called it ocoee ; the Ocoee River and valley are named after this plant, which is the Tennessee State Wildflower .

606
Sheffields Seeds Claims they harvest there seeds from a Minnesota type (CLick On the  picture of the seeds)
I am not sure if that is Indoors or outdoors , but
I know passiflora Incarnata can grow in -20 I've seen it , but never did see it fruit around here (never looked though)
It was in the open on someones fence when I was a kid but haven't seen it around

(new owners probally killed it long ago way before any polor vortex since I haven't seen it for years)

607
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Lemon Quince (tastes like Lemonade)
« on: October 07, 2019, 12:59:21 AM »
Hi I found this Quince Inn Illinois At Mortun Arboretum (Lisle)
I never hear anything about it though

I may have seeds available

I DId look up After I started this post , and do not see it listed Anyone know where to find the true lemon quince

I swear this is it though tatsed just like lemonade
https://www.mortonarb.org/trees-plants/tree-plant-descriptions/common-flowering-quince

(note I have another web site that claims they have it In Michigan but they looked smaller
Will have to dig up the name of it , and email them.




608
try to contact them could work

CHARLESTON TEA PLANTATION, 6617 MAYBANK HIGHWAY, WADMALAW ISLAND, SC, 29487, UNITED STATES1-843-559-0383


6617 Maybank Highway
Wadmalaw Island, SC 29487

Telephone: 843-559-0383 Ext. 4206
Fax: 843-559-3791

Hours:
Monday – Saturday: 10AM – 4PM
Sunday: 12pm - 4pm

EVENTS, TOURS, & MEDIA:
Contact: Jane Knight, Business Manager
Telephone: 843-559-0383 Ext. 4207
E-Mail: jknight@rcbigelow.com

CONTACT US REGARDING YOUR ONLINE ORDER:
Telephone: 1-888-244-3569
E-Mail: ordtea@bigelowtea.com

609
Oh didn't see your recent posts read this a week ago (interesting)
They can survive In Gorgia ever heard of the (SC) charleston Tea Plantation
https://www.charlestonteaplantation.com/

Not what you asked But have you ever heard about Franklinia alatamaha (could survive even zone 5)
 Gordonia lasianthus (loblolly bay) or
 Stewartia malacodendron, the silky camellia

610
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Ripping of PawPaw fruits
« on: October 07, 2019, 12:10:27 AM »
https://www.virginiafruit.ento.vt.edu/PawPaw/PAW_000C.html

PIcture Of moth
https://www.butterfliesandmoths.org/species/Talponia-plummeriana

They didn't mention the black stuff that grows on the fruit , but I heard it doesn't harm them

IV. Pests: The pawpaw tree has few pests.


The pawpaw peduncle borer, Talponia plummeriana, may be the most severe pest (USNM image).  The larvae, which reach a length of 5 mm, feed in fleshy parts of the flower, causing flowers to drop.


Sorry for Hijacking your thread
didn't mean to just wanted to explain that boror

Speckled Talponia Moth
Cliff England with his fields of PAwpaw said it is rare for it so I wouldn't worry to much.
I wonder if a Moth is native to German that would do that (google didn't show anything)
 but did say Talponiabatesi (Оlethreutidae) was taken in a cherimoya } from Мехico.

I should look into it, and maybe start a thread of Pawpaw Annona pests.

611
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Ripping of PawPaw fruits
« on: October 07, 2019, 12:08:07 AM »
In America (not German) ever found a worm in a whole wild fruit

 peduncle borer, Talponia plummeriana,
Actually trying to find some wild ones now to graft onto mine in Southern IL Shawnee National forest>
(at hotel today though (never charged me for today SO I must rest)

Oh Persimmon too

Not sure if this is the best link But when I get home I should find better links about it.
Sure did scare me when I found one after pawpaw fest In athens ohio

Unfortunatly didn't refind the one with 4 seeds,
and the other that tasted like pineapple (90% seed)(so I just bought a GPS)
but a nice red persimmon I tagged with a sock. 

612
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Florida Persimmon 30 chromosomes
« on: October 06, 2019, 11:52:52 PM »
Here is a link
https://www.intechopen.com/books/breeding-and-health-benefits-of-fruit-and-nut-crops/genetic-diversity-and-breeding-of-persimmon

In the genus Diospyros, there are species and varieties having diploid (2n = 2x = 30), tetraploid (2n = 4x = 60), hexaploid (2n = 6x = 90), nonaploid (2n = 9x =135) and dodecaploid (2n = 12x = 180) chromosome number. Therefore, it is thought that the basic chromosome number of the genus Diospyros is 15 [9, 12]. The chromosome numbers of some wild species of genus Diospyros (D. oleifera, D. glandulosa, D. confertiflora, D. discolorare, D. ehretioides, D. lycioides, D. mollis, D. rhodocalyx and D. sumatrana) are 2n = 30, except for 2n = 60 for D. rhombifolia and 2n = 90 for D. ebenum [13, 14, 15]. D. kaki L. is a hexaploid (2n = 6x = 90). However, octoploid (2n = 8x = 120) cultivars such as Hasshu and nonaploid (2n = 9x =135) cultivars such as ‘Hiratanenashi’ and ‘Tonewase’ have also been reported [14, 15, 16]. On the other hand, D. virginiana has two karyotypes with 2n = 60 and 90 [15, 17], while D. lotus is diploid (2n = 2x =30) [14].




I think it would be interesting to take a Florida Persimmon Breed it with a early type (kentucky 60 type),
 and see if your native types would be early since we get alot less sun.

613
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Florida Persimmon 30 chromosomes
« on: October 06, 2019, 11:49:51 PM »
Can someone that understands Genetics explain this to me
I've read the florida keys has a Persimmon with 30 chromosomes

I know if Our northern Persimmon (90) gets pollinated by a Kentucky one (60)
they are seedless (I know alittle about meosis, and that)

but what if a 30 chromosomes gets doubled would that go with a kentucky one.

All I read is the northern ones are better tasting ,  and the florida ones are not as good
(I read that alot about other things , and I usually disagree
Like American persimmons are no good when I love them)

614
Interesting I wonder If they just grew thousands , and found the ones that lived ,
or if they protected them for a some years so they could handle the cold.


I'm in -20 F USDA zone 5 b

Will have to watch next time I eat dinner
will look up some articals on it in a few days if your interested
(Im a caregiver so I can do that in my spare time I've seen your posts
right now as a matter of fact I'm trying to forge wild pawpaw for this week(asimina triloba not payapa)


so I can graft seleted wild types onto my tree's (or persimmon ) have fun forging.)

615
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Wild Persimmon Haul
« on: November 18, 2015, 12:01:55 PM »
oops this is the cultivar list
Oh I didn't know your know was triloba tracker (are you referring to Asimina triloba?) --
I plan on writing KYSU about seeds Since I missed my Buses to pawpaw fest for seeds..

http://www.persimmonpudding.com/cultivate/cultivars/cultivars.html

616
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Wild Persimmon Haul
« on: November 18, 2015, 11:58:10 AM »
My first Post I am actually interested in seeking out different fruits that may be good commercially
or just good cultivars Do you have any seeds to share?

I actually visited this site before, but after reading you post decided to join.

Mainly with me I have always been interested in breeding plants,
(I'm short for time right know, but could explain more about that later. I liked certain plants as a teenager.)

Speaking about different plants I had my First paw paw years ago, and ALWAYS busy with work (as a caregiver) had to relay on forums to get seeds
Since I no longer work everyday A few years ago went to Ohio to paw paw fest 
(it costs a lot $180 then, but this year I booked 2 buses for 35, but missed my bus though hahaha),
 and One Pawpaw I got had only 3 seeds (the size of a hass avocado  (actually someone threw the huge bag of ALL  the different seeds cold stratifying in the fridge out while I was out of state In Louisiana  Oh well. there will always be more time to try again, but I just hope I will find one like that agian)

Ahve you heard of The web site with culivars called persimmin pudding
http://www.persimmonpudding.com/recipes/puddings.html

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