Author Topic: Double planting (specifically garcinias)  (Read 803 times)

0hip

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Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« on: March 09, 2023, 03:23:51 AM »
I just wanted to get everyone opinions on double plantings on fruit trees. In this case I’m thinking garcinias but I do have doubles of a fair number of other species too.

 Because garcinias grow so slowly and I’m limited on space, and then having the whole male-female-hermaphrodite-??? Problem I’m wanting to double plant a few garcinias but I wanted to ask other people experiences with them and also get an idea of the best spacing.

 I was thinking on pretty close maybe 30-50cm apart so that eventually the branches intermingle and just become one. Of course branches which are rubbing or causing too much trouble can just be removed in the future. Is this too close or too far?

The garcinias I want to try this with are:
Luc garcini
Achacha
Mangosteen
Lemon drop mangosteen
Possibly more (russels/macrophylla) depending on advice and what’s available

I’ve double planted a few other species before but they are a bit further apart (~1m) and am going to with a few more too. I guess the theory is that if they grow up at the same time one won’t outcompete the other too much? And it will help with pollination and serve as a backup for a bad seedling. Also even though they may grow slower, you have two chances at a good plant instead of waiting 8+ years for a dud
« Last Edit: March 09, 2023, 03:31:03 AM by 0hip »

brian

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2023, 10:12:47 AM »
I was under the impression that most garcinias are self-fruitful, is that not the case?

I do companion planting for trees that fruit at small size because ultimately their canopy size is reduced by half.  For trees that must be big to fruit I think companion planting would delay flowering significantly for both trees.

roblack

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2023, 10:29:10 AM »
Have a pair of Luc's growing within 2 - 3 feet of each other, and they seem quite happy together. Have other garcinias almost that close, all seem fine. I would rather have diversity with small to medium yields vs. optimal harvest from just a few trees. Also, I think it does help with fruit production, having multiple trees. Many garcinias are self-fertile, but often when mature. Younger trees like to party.

elouicious

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2023, 10:41:21 AM »
Many garcinias are self-fertile, but often when mature. Younger trees like to party.

 ;D ;D ;D

tru

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2023, 10:42:11 AM »
I have 2 imbes planted in the same 5 gallon pot, they seem to have not noticed so far as they push really often!

I've heard that for dioecious garcinias, the female leaves are usually pointy and male leaves are usually rounded at the tips; can anyone confirm this pattern?
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cbss_daviefl

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2023, 11:34:09 AM »
No, some garcinias are mostly dioicous with exceptions that are self-fertile. Male trees seem more likely to produce female flowers and fruit based on my limited observations. It really sucks when you raise a seedling for 7+ years only to find that you only have half of the equation. I have 5+ female flowering lucs. I waited 3 years hoping they would mature into fruiting and they even produce flowers that appear male. At 10+ years, they still do not set fruit naturally. I grafted some males 2 years ago. I waiting for them to mature and flower, which will probably take a couple more years for heavy flowering. I had a few male flowers this year and was able to hand pollinate and set some fruit. Mangosteen and achachairu produce clones so those you do not need to worry about and there are probably others.  G. intermedia and brasiliensis are two that seem to be self-fertile. Charechuela might also fit this class. Large leaf madruno seems to be a mixed bag and my flowering tree does not set fruit. 

I have an achachairu planted which is actually 2 individuals maybe under 15 cm apart and both are growing well, just under 2 meters.  I do not have any long-term experience. They are intertwined and seem ok with close proximity and do not seem to be growing apart as closely planted jakfruit seem to do.
Brandon

brian

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2023, 12:09:55 PM »
Is there a list of primarily dioecious garcinias?  I'm aware of prainiana (cherapu), livingstonei (imbe) and it sounds like Lucs.  Also Russels Sweet

Any idea on hombrionia (seashore)? 

Epicatt2

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2023, 12:32:13 PM »
I had long had the impression that it was sensible (space being available) to double plant.

I bought a large pitangatuba about three years ago from one of our longtime TFF members and although it has flowered several times it has never set any fruit.  It is certainly large enough to do so.  Not sure why it has so far never set fruit, but that has encouraged mt to start buying multiples of fruit tree seedlings for the compatibility and hopefully better fruit set.

Now I have five or six more small pitangatuba seedlings that have just begun trying to bloom and so they've just been moved up to 3 gal. pots.  This seems to have encouraged them to quickly flush some new growth and to bloom some more so I'm hoping that the bees will find them and my large original one and there will be some fruit set on it, finally.

The only thing I'm not so sure about is the widest maximum planting distance between the same types of fruit trees that allows for maximum cross-polination.  (I have mostly Garcinias and Eugenias that I am dealing with.) 

Any suggestions, please?

Paul M.
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cbss_daviefl

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2023, 12:42:53 PM »
I have a few seashores in pots but they are small from neglect and don't have any in the ground. I am not a fan. G. xanthochymus is similarly sour with large fruit and good flesh ratio and more to my liking, still not worthy of a spot in my yard.  I have a PM from a forum member stating they have a female seashore and they were looking for male seashore scions. 
 
Is there a list of primarily dioecious garcinias?  I'm aware of prainiana (cherapu), livingstonei (imbe) and it sounds like Lucs.  Also Russels Sweet

Any idea on hombrionia (seashore)?
Brandon

dwfl

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2023, 12:58:09 PM »
Is there a list of primarily dioecious garcinias?  I'm aware of prainiana (cherapu), livingstonei (imbe) and it sounds like Lucs.  Also Russels Sweet

Any idea on hombrionia (seashore)?

G. hombroniana usually needs male and female, although I have seen a female set small fruit without developed seed.

0hip

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2023, 07:58:11 PM »
Thanks for letting me know your experiences it seems that it is worthwhile to do. Hopefully picking some more plants up today and I’ll get two and there’s a few in the ground that I’m going to plant a companion for.

 Just on the brasiliensis/intermedia - they are both lemon drop mangosteen from what I understand but one is the superior form? I’ve heard it so many ways I don’t know what’s true about those two.

achetadomestica

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2023, 09:39:25 PM »
I have 6 seedling imbes growing now and planned to plant 3 in a space?
I figured about a foot apart in a triangle. They are only a little over a foot tall now

Epicatt2

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Re: Double planting (specifically garcinias)
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2023, 01:41:40 PM »
I have 6 seedling imbes growing now and planned to plant 3 in a space?
I figured about a foot apart in a triangle. They are only a little over a foot tall now

Great idea, AD.  I've been trying to decide how to plant the several imbes that I have and your plan ought to work well with me, too, since I am limiited to the size of a typical city lot (minus the footprint of my smallish house).

How far apart are you plannng to set your two 'clumps' of three imbes?

Cheers!

Paul M.
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