very old trifoliate, maybe poncirus

[jbirdfunk]

I'm not that familiar with cold hardy citrus since I live in San Diego, CA but I am from Indiana and on a recent trip back home I ran across this very mature citrus tree and it blew me away. It is is Indianapolis and is loaded with fruit in an unprotected area in the city. 6b zone. From my guess I think it looks similar to flying dragon rootstock I've seen with contorted branches and long recurved thorns. The ping ping / golf ball fruit does have a slight velvet feel to it.

Looking at google street view I can see it looks like it might be about 15 years old. I'm surprised how big it is seeing as the thing must stop growing for 4-5 months.

What do you guys think this is?

[kumin]

It appears to be Flying Dragon. I doubt it has any other Citrus admixture.

[BP]

Anyone have a guess on how old it is? The ones I have grow surprisingly slow

[jim VH]

How tall is it? My 18 year old Flying Dragon is about 10 feet tall. They grow faster as they get older too.

[jbirdfunk]

I collected a few fruit and cut one open so far. It was slightly bigger than ping ping ball and had 48 good size seeds. I'll grow some into rootstock and if anyone is interested in the rest of the seeds LMK.

I did a google street view history on it and while I thought it looked "very old" by the trunk I think I was mistaken, or the top died and regrew from the stump possibly.. probably was planted sometime around 2009. I can see it was about 4 feet high in 2011.

If anyone in Indy wants the location PM me.

[jbirdfunk]

This thing has survived Zone 6b, for 15-16 years in the ground. That is a tough plant.. Indy can get really cold for a long time, which is one reason I moved.

[SoCal2warm]

I want to quickly point out that I believe Poncirus grows slower in the PNW climate (due to the growing season that has a shorter span of heat).
For this reason, BP's and jim VH's observations may not be the most relevant to the situation in Indiana, which despite the much more bitter cold, nevertheless has a longer growing season for citrus. I think it likely that Poncirus may grow much faster in Indiana, if it can survive the winters.

My personal observations in the PNW is that Flying Dragon and most Poncirus hybrids are extremely slow growing (even slower than other non-Poncirus hardy citrus varieties).

[jbirdfunk]

That’s a good point. Indiana summer is like tropical weather. The seasonal fruiting bananas that people over winner in their garages looked amazing. 

[BP]

I want to quickly point out that I believe Poncirus grows slower in the PNW climate (due to the growing season that has a shorter span of heat).
For this reason, BP's and jim VH's observations may not be the most relevant to the situation in Indiana, which despite the much more bitter cold, nevertheless has a longer growing season for citrus. I think it likely that Poncirus may grow much faster in Indiana, if it can survive the winters.

My personal observations in the PNW is that Flying Dragon and most Poncirus hybrids are extremely slow growing (even slower than other non-Poncirus hardy citrus varieties).

Yea its tough out here, I think this explains it somewhat but I am always learning more, we just dont have the juice up here that other places have

[a_Vivaldi]

I want to quickly point out that I believe Poncirus grows slower in the PNW climate (due to the growing season that has a shorter span of heat).
For this reason, BP's and jim VH's observations may not be the most relevant to the situation in Indiana, which despite the much more bitter cold, nevertheless has a longer growing season for citrus. I think it likely that Poncirus may grow much faster in Indiana, if it can survive the winters.

My personal observations in the PNW is that Flying Dragon and most Poncirus hybrids are extremely slow growing (even slower than other non-Poncirus hardy citrus varieties).

Yea its tough out here, I think this explains it somewhat but I am always learning more, we just dont have the juice up here that other places have

The solar map doesn't fully capture just how stark the difference in heat and moisture is.




The entire South gets as much heat as the infamously hot Central Valley, all the while getting more rain than almost anywhere in the country outside of the PNW.

[BP]

I want to quickly point out that I believe Poncirus grows slower in the PNW climate (due to the growing season that has a shorter span of heat).
For this reason, BP's and jim VH's observations may not be the most relevant to the situation in Indiana, which despite the much more bitter cold, nevertheless has a longer growing season for citrus. I think it likely that Poncirus may grow much faster in Indiana, if it can survive the winters.

My personal observations in the PNW is that Flying Dragon and most Poncirus hybrids are extremely slow growing (even slower than other non-Poncirus hardy citrus varieties).

Yea its tough out here, I think this explains it somewhat but I am always learning more, we just dont have the juice up here that other places have

The solar map doesn't fully capture just how stark the difference in heat and moisture is.




The entire South gets as much heat as the infamously hot Central Valley, all the while getting more rain than almost anywhere in the country outside of the PNW.

It took me a bit to fully understand the first one.. wow

[bussone]

How tall is it? My 18 year old Flying Dragon is about 10 feet tall. They grow faster as they get older too.

To a point. Flying Dragon is pretty runty even when full-grown, and even species poncirus is shortish.

Longwood Gardens has some poncirus specimens that they date to the early 1980s, so they are about 40-45 years old now. They are probably 12-15 ft tall.

Truck diameter might tell you more, but my tree in SE Pennsylvania has siblings in SW Michigan, and its trunk diameter is 2x those. Indy is both colder and warmer than SW Michigan (Lake Michigan moderates extremes in both directions), so it will probably grow a little faster in the higher summer temps of Indianapolis than it would in Michigan, but a bit less quickly than around Philly, because Philly has both warmer summers and winters.