The Tropical Fruit Forum
Citrus => Cold Hardy Citrus => Topic started by: Zitrusgaertner on March 25, 2018, 02:32:07 PM
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Is there anybody out there who owns the Citrandarin PoncirusXNin-Kat-Mandarin? I keep it outdoors in ground and it is hardy at least down to -15°C
It has not bloomed yet.
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Pics please!
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Okay, I try to find some pics. The leaves are the size of the ones of finger lime. Narrow (1cm) mostly monofoliate and max 4cm long. I am not quite sure if it war really PTXNin-Kat or maybe PTXSunki. For a long time I thought it was Sunki, but then I found an old note that said: Nin-Kat. I gave a scion to Ilya named "PTXSunki" but I am in doubt now.
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Yes, I got it from you under the name PTxSunki😊
Grafted on poncirus, it is very resistant, not so on its own roots. It is now 2m tall,hope will flower soon. The leaves of the spring growth are narrow and fall in the autumn, while those of the second,summer flush are wider and keep green during the winter. Both are mostly monofoliate.
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I will ask Bernhard when we meet again in May. He sent me seeds and I grafted the seedling on PT 10 years ago I suppose. This winter it has lost all leaves at -14°C but the wood is totally undamaged. Unprotected "Prag" aswell. And C. ichangensis IVIA lost 50% of its leaves and maybe some tips. It seems to be harder than Citrumelo 5* which lost every single leave. Ichangquat has a crack in its bark near ground and does not look very happy. I will have to high-craft it on PT. In your post, Ilya, the fruits of Ichangquat lookes very nice -do they taste as nice?
Best Regards
Robert
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In June 2017 received a branch of PTxSunki with fruit. Much overripe fruit, but bitter butter Poncirus was not. The leaves are long and narrow like willow. The handle imparted to citrumelo - here is the growth today
(http://f23.ifotki.info/org/f60082b4996459c7cc9a4b0fbc02550fbcbf14304742218.jpg) (http://i-fotki.info/)
(http://f23.ifotki.info/org/80ca754b91f4fe2681936d7138d370ffbcbf14304742218.jpg) (http://i-fotki.info/)
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Thank you Samodelkin, your picture resembels very much my plant. Narrow, serrated leaves and thorny twigs. But there is also a differenve: Mine does not have trifoliate leaves at all. Somtimes bifoliate but no more trifoliate. No poncirin sounds very good. Bitter is not a problem if it tastes good.
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Robert,
Actually 5* flowers even after loosing all leaves. This winter we had only two nights of minus 9 but with violent winds up to 80 km/hour, also periods with snow and abrupt changes of temperature. No damage on Ichangquat, but 5* lost leaves on North Eastern side of a tree.
Fruits of Ichangquat are rather special, but I like them, they are not particularly soar, grapefruit like bitterness and if eaten fully ripe with a skin, the taste resembles fejoa with some pine note.
Alexander (Samodelkin), leaves on your PTxSunki look exactly like on my plant
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Okay, we stick with PTXSunki ;)
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The USDA has developed several root stocks using Nin Kat crosses
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Interesting: "Swingle and Reece (1967) additionally noted that: "Citrandarins are much like citranges except that the mandarin orange parent greatly reduces the amount of bitter oil found in droplets inside the pulp-vesicles. In citranges this oil usually makes the fruit too bitter to eat." Thus Citrandarins should be preferred to Citranges?
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Very cool finding this thread. Unfortunately I can't see your pictures.
I have successfully rooted a cutting from a bud below the graft on US 1284 rootstock (Nin-kat x poncirus) which a Xie Shan Satsuma is grafted to. I also grafted a piece to a poncirus seedling so I have two plants now. Will test the grafted one outside in zone 7a and keep the rooted cutting inside.
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This year I had first flowers on a 9 years old tree grafted with budwood from Robert. Only one flower was fully developed and unfortunately the first fruit was fallen.
(https://d.radikal.ru/d24/2108/2c/7026977b9f5f.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
(https://b.radikal.ru/b14/2108/6f/f2cea61f54b4t.jpg) (https://b.radikal.ru/b14/2108/6f/f2cea61f54b4.jpg)
(https://b.radikal.ru/b03/2108/ba/30fd0779ecdf.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
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Ilya11, Good things come to those who wait. However, you always do a great job with your trees.
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Thank you Millet.
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Ilya, it looks like a nameless plant I`ve got from Bernhard. I sent you budwood of it some years ago. It should be one of the BV types.
Is it still alive? Could you check both if they are the same variety?
Thank you!
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There was a narrow leaf plant among these BVs, but unfortunately it was dead after a rather mild winter.
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Discovered this week two small fruits, probably from the late secondary flowering
(https://c.radikal.ru/c15/2109/b0/52055d9e163b.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
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The fruit reached maturity by now.
(https://b.radikal.ru/b22/2112/ec/ce126ea2f2e2.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
(https://b.radikal.ru/b37/2112/85/c105244ecd1f.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
Good fruity smell without poncirus note, juicy, acid, bitter like calamondin, a little bit of internal oils sticking to the dents.
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The fruit reached maturity by now.
(https://b.radikal.ru/b22/2112/ec/ce126ea2f2e2.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
(https://b.radikal.ru/b37/2112/85/c105244ecd1f.jpg) (https://radikal.ru)
Good fruity smell without poncirus note, juicy, acid, bitter like calamondin, a little bit of internal oils sticking to the dents.
Thank you, Ilya. Looks very nice! Mine did not flower yet but is a very nice tree with dense round crown (high grafted on poncirus) Maybe this year!
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Is Nin Kat itself particularly hardy? I saw a plant in Eisenhut's garden in July.
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Is Nin Kat itself particularly hardy? I saw a plant in Eisenhut's garden in July.
I am not sure, but I think I mixed up Ninkat and Sunki. I think this is PTxSunki -US812 from seed.
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This spring my PTxSunki has become crazy with flowers
(https://i.postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm/20230502-132459.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm)
(https://i.postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5/20230515-173245.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5)
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Ninkat x Poncirus US 1284 died to ground level for me. Coldest was 1F./-17.2C It has one sprout from the base now.
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This spring my PTxSunki has become crazy with flowers
(https://i.postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm/20230502-132459.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm)
(https://i.postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5/20230515-173245.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5)
I remain slightly confused. This is US-812?
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Probably, I got the immature budwood from Zitrusgaertner labeled as PTxSunki in 2012.
First flower and one fruit in 2021
(https://i.postimg.cc/hJ04SDTn/20211213-150339.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hJ04SDTn)
No protection and it has never been damaged.
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This spring my PTxSunki has become crazy with flowers
(https://i.postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm/20230502-132459.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/VrfdqKGm)
(https://i.postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5/20230515-173245.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJZgxmZ5)
Mine, the mother plant, blooms for the first time at last. But there are hundereds of flowers. Quite tiny yet because of the very low temperatures but I am glad. How was this fruit? Awful?
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Zitrusgaertner
Have you ever been to Zinzinnati, Ohio
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It is interesting to observe that while US-812 is seed-stable (true to type), later re-crosses between poncirus and citrus sunki are quite variable. This has been exploited to study which genes poncirus uses and which genes citrus has/has not that confer resistance to various pathogens.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-77840-2
https://bmcgenomics.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1471-2164-12-39
Essentially, poncirus is really resistant to CLA/HLB (greening) and phytophthora and citrus sunki is really susceptible to them. So they are frequently hybridized in genetic research to learn which genes are up- and down-regulated in the hybrids that exhibit different levels of resistance or susceptibility. US-812 didn't arise from this source -- it came about due to CTV resistance -- but it remains to be seen if other poncirus/sunki crosses will later be released.
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Zitrusgaertner
Have you ever been to Zinzinnati, Ohio
No, never been there. Never been to the US either.Why?
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Zitrusgaertner
Have you ever been to Zinzinnati, Ohio
No, never been there. Never been to the US either.Why?
Our professional base ball tea, The Cincinnati reds, referred to them as being in Zinzinnati. Our city is of German heritage and misspelling it with Z's is supposed to give it a German twist. With your name of Zitrus.... I though you may be from Cincinnati.
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No, never been there. Never been to the US either.Why?
[/quote]
Our professional base ball tea, The Cincinnati reds, referred to them as being in Zinzinnati. Our city is of German heritage and misspelling it with Z's is supposed to give it a German twist. With your name of Zitrus.... I though you may be from Cincinnati.
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In June I will visit the US and Canada for the first time in my life.
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US1284 sprouting from the base
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZCv56NSJ/20230528-155228.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ZCv56NSJ)
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No, never been there. Never been to the US either.Why?
Our professional base ball tea, The Cincinnati reds, referred to them as being in Zinzinnati. Our city is of German heritage and misspelling it with Z's is supposed to give it a German twist. With your name of Zitrus.... I though you may be from Cincinnati.
[/quote]
In June I will visit the US and Canada for the first time in my life.
[/quote]
You are brave to visit a third world country like the USA.