Author Topic: Not enough Durian Discussion  (Read 17543 times)

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #250 on: March 30, 2022, 11:32:25 PM »
The pandanus I am thinking of, utilus I believe, has smooth leaf edges and an edible fruit.
I’m not really into sending seeds but I could send some plukentia.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #251 on: April 05, 2022, 10:01:08 PM »
Thanks for the pandanus tips, will see if I can find some, it's from madagaskar so probobly won't be wild on the beach like the other pandanus sp.

I found a man in a local rare fruit magazine growing Plukentia so I can most likely get seeds locally Peter, thanks for wanting to help out, won't forget it :D

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #252 on: April 10, 2022, 07:50:05 AM »
Probably my last durian of the season here. Was lucky enough to buy this one last week. Quite different from other durians that I have had in that each segment only one large, flat seed. Any ideas on the variety/genetics?




ben mango

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #253 on: April 10, 2022, 08:08:17 AM »
Spent $50 on a 4lb musang king yesterday. Very bitter and strong tasting. Worth it





Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #254 on: April 10, 2022, 08:19:00 AM »
Durian season just started for us on the southern Caribbean coast of Costa Rica. Actually, at the same time the durians are falling there are lots of flowers on the same trees.  So we should have another harvest in July or so.
On my own farm I don’t have that many durians at the moment so I have been buying some durians from another farm to eat more and different durians as well as get lots of seeds for rootstock.  I’d like to get about 200 planted right now.
The going price for random durians that are pretty good is $6 kg.
I tried to load some photos but the program didn’t like them!!?!
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #255 on: April 12, 2022, 12:47:54 AM »
Hey Peter or Oskar or anyone who has multiple durian trees can you please help me out.  I want to plant a good few number of durian which will be upwind of my house the closest trees would be approx 25m or 80ft from house.  My wife is not at all impressed as she cant stand the smell of durian and she is currently standing in the way of my plans.

Can you guys confirm how far downwind can you smell durian when they are on the trees near ripeness out in open air?  Is she likely be able to smell them when we are sitting on the patio 80ft downwind from the trees?

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #256 on: April 12, 2022, 06:07:56 PM »
I don’t think there is any smell until they fall on the ground.  At that point the smell could reach 80’ down wind.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #257 on: April 12, 2022, 07:17:07 PM »
I don’t think there is any smell until they fall on the ground.  At that point the smell could reach 80’ down wind.
Peter

Thanks peter i will put an argument forward based on your recommendation.

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #258 on: April 15, 2022, 12:19:07 AM »
On the bottom of our property, we can sometimes smell durian from our neighbors orchard. The smell is not very strong and they have large number of trees. I guess another thing to factor in is the direction of the prevailing winds.

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #259 on: April 16, 2022, 05:48:08 PM »
ive noticed there are 3 scents that come from the tree. there seems to be a pre flowering scent that smells like farts, it seems to come from the leaves? there is the flower scent that smells somewhat like rubber. and then there is the fruit scent once it drops. a woman i work for has a huge druian tree at least 100 feet tall by 100 feet wide. its right on the other side of her driveway, but it is about 30 feet below the driveway with a large rock wall/barrier. you cannot really smell the duirans until you head down the path to the tree. but from down there the scent would go 80 feet easily. maybe have some sort of vegetated berm or barricade from the house so the sent wont waft that hard? our closest trees will probably be that same distance. but were not concerned about the scent. you could also plant a bunch of gardenias or something around the house to mask the scent. we want to do that along the roadside to prevent fruit theft. not sure how well that will work though
« Last Edit: April 16, 2022, 05:50:05 PM by spencerw »

cassowary

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #260 on: April 17, 2022, 07:30:34 PM »
Yeah definetly flowers smell strong, but not a intense as the fruits, it's a lovely robust smell. Reminds me a little bit of A*Men by thierry mugler.
You have to put your nose to a amlost ripe fruit on the tree in order to smell it really.

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #261 on: July 14, 2022, 07:43:19 AM »
How are people's durians going in FNQ? Probably got down to 8-9C here this morning, 4.7C in Innisfail (annual record by the way). All my durians are looking great but looks like another very cold night on the way.

Future

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #262 on: July 14, 2022, 05:21:54 PM »
Hey Peter or Oskar or anyone who has multiple durian trees can you please help me out.  I want to plant a good few number of durian which will be upwind of my house the closest trees would be approx 25m or 80ft from house.  My wife is not at all impressed as she cant stand the smell of durian and she is currently standing in the way of my plans.

Can you guys confirm how far downwind can you smell durian when they are on the trees near ripeness out in open air?  Is she likely be able to smell them when we are sitting on the patio 80ft downwind from the trees?

Trade her in. (I’m kidding)

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #263 on: July 14, 2022, 06:40:39 PM »
Future yes she has tried durian once or twice im hoping one day she comes around too it but it isnt something that is instantly attractive for most people like mangosteen.

Yes we had some record breaking temperatures at my place at least as long as i can remember, 8.9C yesterday morning and a bone chilling 8.4C this morning for a new record. I will be watching the durian closely over the next few weeks to see if they start to defoliate .  From everything i have seen some will start to defoliate at temps below 11C, however the tough varieties like red prawn should show no leaf loss even down to just below 5C.

cassowary

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #264 on: July 17, 2022, 03:40:51 AM »
Haven't gone bellow 15C here and they are still flushing, no worries :D
Were down futher south two weeks ago and it was like a lot colder down there, tully etc. idk what it is that make's it so, but cairns is also quite a lot colder then here, maybe the rainforest buffers the cold winds idk...
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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #265 on: July 17, 2022, 04:23:11 AM »
Cassowary it’s certainly the rainforest and your proximity to the coast keeping it warmer.
I’m not far south of you yet I’m in a valley surrounded by cane fields and it gets down to temps similar to Tully etc here. One of my seedling durian has dropped a bunch of leaves from this cold snap and another seedling looks like it will as well. They did not have shade covers on them. My grafted trees with shade covers seem to be holding up well so far. I think the shade cage might have held the temperature in a bit better or something. Certainly 8.4c is too cold for them.

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #266 on: July 17, 2022, 06:39:00 AM »
Interesting. All my durians are still looking good. I have had a seedling in the ground almost a year which has no protection, no signs that it will drop any leaves. Had a chempedak die after the wet period ended a couple weeks ago but I believe that they do that sometimes.

Future

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #267 on: July 17, 2022, 05:47:57 PM »
Some interesting notes from my recent trip to Penang. Some, definitely not all, serious durian farmers claim to remove flowers for the first 20 years after they begin. 6-8 years to flower means 26-28 to fruit. I imagine this is for grafted varieties only as you’d probably want to evaluate a seedlings potential. Nonetheless, their reasoning is trees don’t produce quality level needed for sale until that time and they don’t want wasted energy on fruiting.

That’s commitment.

Second thing was slopes vs. flat land. Most say Durian does better on slopes. I’m not so sure. It might be the Durian in Penang were planted to stop landslides and everyone is used to that. The oldest trees I saw, one 200 year old and the other a stunning 300 year old were on flat land.  Anecdotal but nonetheless....


Third thing, the most common cause of death I heard  for and established tree: lightning.

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #268 on: July 17, 2022, 07:31:37 PM »
Imagine paying to have a crew knock all the flowers off for 20 years and then… the tree gets hit by lightning!
I can imagine those durian farmers in Bulik Palau having a good laugh about that.
Probably the first durians planted on Penang we’re planted on the flat land where it was easiest. There’s plenty to see there though there’s more rice than durian on the flat for sure.
There’s lots of reasons for planting durian on a slope.
They tolerate it well.
There may be less risk of root fungi which is a problem with durian.
The fallen fruits can be collected at a fence line below the trees, out of the impact zone!
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #269 on: July 17, 2022, 10:07:31 PM »
Fruit nerd your property is on a bit of a hill cold air generally settles on the lowest places in cold clear nights like we had my place is low. I dare say it would not have got down to 8.4C where your durian are. I know In Mossman It only got down to 10.5. My area had the lowest temps in our shire. Innisfail district however saw lower temps again.

DurianLover

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #270 on: July 18, 2022, 12:43:01 AM »
Some interesting notes from my recent trip to Penang. Some, definitely not all, serious durian farmers claim to remove flowers for the first 20 years after they begin. 6-8 years to flower means 26-28 to fruit. I imagine this is for grafted varieties only as you’d probably want to evaluate a seedlings potential. Nonetheless, their reasoning is trees don’t produce quality level needed for sale until that time and they don’t want wasted energy on fruiting.

That’s commitment.

Second thing was slopes vs. flat land. Most say Durian does better on slopes. I’m not so sure. It might be the Durian in Penang were planted to stop landslides and everyone is used to that. The oldest trees I saw, one 200 year old and the other a stunning 300 year old were on flat land.  Anecdotal but nonetheless....


Third thing, the most common cause of death I heard  for and established tree: lightning.

Lightning is indeed big problem at my place. I lost 2 coconut trees and one very tall, old jackfruit tree to lightning since looking after property.

The oldest durian trees I have seen were in this botanical garden, almost on a flat land, not textbook flat. Planted in 19th century. Old seedling durian trees are majestic, absolutely beautiful sight. Grafted "Christmas trees" not so much.




fruit nerd

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #271 on: July 18, 2022, 06:41:53 AM »
Fruit nerd your property is on a bit of a hill cold air generally settles on the lowest places in cold clear nights like we had my place is low. I dare say it would not have got down to 8.4C where your durian are. I know In Mossman It only got down to 10.5. My area had the lowest temps in our shire. Innisfail district however saw lower temps again.

Certainly makes sense. I would like to get a weather station and start recording data. For what it's worth, my first seedling durian dropped a lot of leaves shortly after I planted it due to sun/heat/lack of protection. Took a long time to recover (grass hoppers didn't help) but it's looking very healthy now. I guess your trees will recover quickly with a bit of care.

Future

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #272 on: July 18, 2022, 11:47:29 AM »
Imagine paying to have a crew knock all the flowers off for 20 years and then… the tree gets hit by lightning!
I can imagine those durian farmers in Bulik Palau having a good laugh about that.
Probably the first durians planted on Penang we’re planted on the flat land where it was easiest. There’s plenty to see there though there’s more rice than durian on the flat for sure.
There’s lots of reasons for planting durian on a slope.
They tolerate it well.
There may be less risk of root fungi which is a problem with durian.
The fallen fruits can be collected at a fence line below the trees, out of the impact zone!
Peter

You’re right there. It’s seems it’s the really old tall trees getting hit. All the slopes I saw were “messy” - (no knock to the owners. Having managed less than an acre for years, it can get messy. 20 acres?  a much bigger management issue.). I would guess 30% of durian go missing. Nets over pathways is a good idea but also seems intensive to harvest from. Strings used to hold fallen durian off the ground was eye opening. I did not get to see workers climb these trees, never mind aging up a fruit at that height. It it seems like quite a feat! 

With such a long runway to take off durian trials take an exceptional strategic outlook but at least then literature indicates wild durian rootstock used on the flat areas, Durio zibethinus on the slopes b

Future

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #273 on: July 18, 2022, 11:48:33 AM »
Some interesting notes from my recent trip to Penang. Some, definitely not all, serious durian farmers claim to remove flowers for the first 20 years after they begin. 6-8 years to flower means 26-28 to fruit. I imagine this is for grafted varieties only as you’d probably want to evaluate a seedlings potential. Nonetheless, their reasoning is trees don’t produce quality level needed for sale until that time and they don’t want wasted energy on fruiting.

That’s commitment.

Second thing was slopes vs. flat land. Most say Durian does better on slopes. I’m not so sure. It might be the Durian in Penang were planted to stop landslides and everyone is used to that. The oldest trees I saw, one 200 year old and the other a stunning 300 year old were on flat land.  Anecdotal but nonetheless....


Third thing, the most common cause of death I heard  for and established tree: lightning.

Lightning is indeed big problem at my place. I lost 2 coconut trees and one very tall, old jackfruit tree to lightning since looking after property.

The oldest durian trees I have seen were in this botanical garden, almost on a flat land, not textbook flat. Planted in 19th century. Old seedling durian trees are majestic, absolutely beautiful sight. Grafted "Christmas trees" not so much.




There is at least one Durian tree in Penang with a lightning rod!

cassowary

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #274 on: July 22, 2022, 03:25:59 PM »
Interesting. All my durians are still looking good. I have had a seedling in the ground almost a year which has no protection, no signs that it will drop any leaves. Had a chempedak die after the wet period ended a couple weeks ago but I believe that they do that sometimes.

Yeah and that happen more frequently from some cempadak varieties I and one friend have noted, they just die no matter who cares for them or what is done (me and two others). There is one tree in Whyanbeel valley that is especially known for this.
That is probobly one of the reasons there is so little cempedak compared to jackfruit in AU. Idk if this is the case in other areas like Indonesia for example.

Regarding phytophra root rot and flat vs sloping land:
It is more likely root rot is the cause of death in a grafted tree then in a seedling tree (zygote) from my experience. I haven't seen any scientific evaluations on this but that is probobly becuase seedlings is not an option by default for comercial companies, so no funding goes there unfortunetly. If anyone can find or know of some evidence that would be great :D
I haven't seen any signs of root rot here in d. zib. even though most durians have 24/7 dripp irrigation on for most of the year, even in rainy season sometimes when it's really wet. And I haven't been able to get a native soil sample  from Borneo innoculated so similar microbiome to neighbours. But neighbours have problems with root rot and most of their plants (about 70%) are grafted. We only have one grafted as a novelty. In my opinion it is better to grow seedlings and focus resources on the ones that come out well eventually then to to have grafted tree's with expected economic life of aprox 30 years, that is what I can see here, after 20-30 years they decline rapidly, some just start showing signs of dying and then borers come in and finish it of, some damage the healthy tissue even and some eat the dead tissue from necrossis after the fungal infection.
I still haven't seen any borer damage on living durian seedling tissue.

Seedling tree's in the wild are more likely to die of trauma (other trees falling on them, lightning etc.). So i think it is the human cultivation that is causing the root rot issue. I would like to know if Durian have a DNA set that determines a time when it self dies or if they can live indefinetly without trauma.

Similar for grafted jackfruit, neigbours have a high presence of pinks disease (fungus) but I have never seen it here. And they spray with the bordeaux mix.

Durianloer:
"Old seedling durian trees are majestic, absolutely beautiful sight. Grafted "Christmas trees" not so much."
So true bro!

Peter:
"There’s lots of reasons for planting durian on a slope."
Yeah I agree, like if you have the right facing slope you could harvest lot's of sun in winter months.
And if you got a "pass" then you could create a moist microclimate. (Pass is kinda beween to peaks still sloping).
N and S face have different environments, it's clear here. And passes are the most lush and "Borneo" like here since it's so moist.

"There’s plenty to see there though there’s more rice than durian on the flat for sure."
Yeah and i think it is unfortunetly people value rice over durian so it get's the sencond fertile land.

fruit nerd:
If you don't provide some shade for young durian in Australia during mid summer you will not give the young durian the ability to photosynthesis at highest level, it will be reduced. there is lot's of info on this in a normal botany book. Even on overcast summer days there is enough light for optimal photosyn. according to the botany book i got. I can also see this in the field how their leavs drop angle to more vertical to reduce the amount of sun emitting on the leaf. And young durians don't have compact dense canopies yet so it won't hurt the lover branches and inside leafs with some shade. When mature it' a different story. And also consider that a leaf filters sun different from plastic shade cloth, eg. it let's through wavelenghts other then blue cause that is captured by the leaf if I am not wrong and red and green goes through mostly and will hit leafs bellow.

https://www.amazon.com/Botany-Introduction-James-D-Mauseth/dp/1284157350/ref=sr_1_11?keywords=botany&qid=1658517249&s=books&sr=1-11

I have thought about creating a trichome mimicking spray that will act as a sun lumens reductant. Many plants use trichomes to protect against the sun.
To use silica or calcium carbonate spray. Also wax could be used. I know there are some products available but haven't tried any of em and don't know what they are based on.
The coolest would be to actually create a trichome mimicking spray that enhances foliar nutrient assimilation.

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