Author Topic: When it's time ......  (Read 985 times)

nanewnanew

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When it's time ......
« on: February 10, 2022, 05:22:22 PM »
So let me preface this with saying that I have limited yard space.

I have two trees that I am thinking about pulling due to lack of growth or production.

The first is a Fuerte Avocado tree. I planted it last summer from 2 gallons and while there has been some growth and new leaves, the trunk is still kind of spindly and the leaves just look uninspired (I didn't plant it in compost).

The second is a grapefruit tree. This one is tougher. I planted it 3 years ago from 15 gallons. It had a few fruit that year that I let grow (I know, probably a mistake), the second year it produced 8 delicious fruit, and last year it skunked, not even a single flower, although a lot of leaf growth. I'm thinking about pulling it if it doesn't flower this year. Still kind of pissed about last year.

So, would you pull these two?

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2022, 05:25:00 PM »
I wouldn't pull the grapefruit if it's established, it sounds like you just need to fertilize. You can top work it if you don't like the grapefruit / fruit quality. I did a project last year where I top worked an established pomelo which was inedible and now have 10 types of citrus on it.

The Avo, hard to say. Again, you could top work it if you don't like the quality. Sometimes it takes a few years for a tree to get established and build out a strong root system.

It sounds like you just need a better fert regimen.

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2022, 06:14:27 PM »
Okay thx, that sounds right. My soil is kind of lacking. I do fertilize (with Organic Fruit Tree fertilizer), do I need to apply more or less? The strong leaf growth on the Grapefruit but no flowers make me think less than what I was doing, and not sure what to think of avo situation w regards to fert.

I tried topworking the Grapefruit last summer with scions from CCPP and failed with all 3 scions (tangerines, I think). I figured citrus on citrus should be fine and thought my cleft grafts looked good, but no luck.

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2022, 06:35:56 PM »
Throw a bag of chicken manure on each and some citrus avo slow release fertilizer and see how they grow this year. I bet a lot.

Grafting citrus isn't too hard, but you need to do it when weather is hot. I didn't get 100% takes either, but they worked. I recommend also using plant tie or similar to really cinch the graft shut along with the buddy tape up and down the scion and covering the wound.

spaugh

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2022, 06:52:38 PM »
The fuerte is too young to really say how it will do.  Really needs 5+ years to decide.  But fuerte is known to be unreliable in producing.  Mine produces some years then others it goes for  2 years at a time 0 fruit.  Its big and healthy and if it strikes out this year Im going to top work it. 

Personally I think hass is a better avocado tree to plant.  Instead of ripping it out maybe just top work the tree.  Not sure if thats what you planned since you were asking about hass scions recently. 

Brad Spaugh

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2022, 07:06:15 PM »
The fuerte is too young to really say how it will do.  Really needs 5+ years to decide.  But fuerte is known to be unreliable in producing.  Mine produces some years then others it goes for  2 years at a time 0 fruit.  Its big and healthy and if it strikes out this year Im going to top work it. 

Personally I think hass is a better avocado tree to plant.  Instead of ripping it out maybe just top work the tree.  Not sure if thats what you planned since you were asking about hass scions recently.

I planted some seeds last year and they are chunky so I wanted to graft hass onto those.

I chose the Fuerte for two reasons: time of year it produces and flavor. I'm willing to gamble with production since hopefully I'll have small producing more reliable trees in other areas. And as you mentioned, if it does strengthen I can always graft onto it later (which I'm better at than with citrus, for whatever reason).

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2022, 07:08:07 PM »
Throw a bag of chicken manure on each and some citrus avo slow release fertilizer and see how they grow this year. I bet a lot.

Grafting citrus isn't too hard, but you need to do it when weather is hot. I didn't get 100% takes either, but they worked. I recommend also using plant tie or similar to really cinch the graft shut along with the buddy tape up and down the scion and covering the wound.

Okay I've got the slow release, I'll go look for some chicken manure. Is that particularly good for all citrus for flowering (high phosphorous)?

Growth doesn't seem to be the problem with that one, it's the flowering thats the problem.

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2022, 08:09:02 PM »
Throw a bag of chicken manure on each and some citrus avo slow release fertilizer and see how they grow this year. I bet a lot.

Grafting citrus isn't too hard, but you need to do it when weather is hot. I didn't get 100% takes either, but they worked. I recommend also using plant tie or similar to really cinch the graft shut along with the buddy tape up and down the scion and covering the wound.

Okay I've got the slow release, I'll go look for some chicken manure. Is that particularly good for all citrus for flowering (high phosphorous)?

Growth doesn't seem to be the problem with that one, it's the flowering thats the problem.

I put a bag of chicken manure on basically everything early season. Chicken manure is pretty balanced 3-2-2 so it does everything you need it to and is a strong jumpstart to the year. My opinion is that it's not just the nutrients that are beneficial, it is the microbial life that is in the manure and digesting it. This gets into the soil and helps nutrients absorb into the roots. I like to throw the slow release on top of the chicken manure and it leeches in over time.

Spaugh and others on here steered me away from using heavy P fertilizers and now I just go for a citrus avo slow release and forget about it. Sometimes I will use a handful of bone meal in flowering season, but that's the only P fert I use now.

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2022, 08:13:47 PM »
Alright thx, I'll give it a shot. The grapefruit has delicious fruit but doesn't seem to be bursting with flowers, like I'd expect.

SHV

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2022, 09:46:16 PM »
If you like grapefruit, donít give up on it.  Once they get established, they get big real fast and pump out more fruit than you can handle.  They are the most neglected trees in my orchard but reliably flower and hold fruit year round and in large quantities.  I grow Oro Blanco and donít even fertilize.  My neighbors have Ruby Red and neglect theirs even more. Same results, loads of fruit all year.

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2022, 03:24:47 PM »
See, that's what is confusing about fruit trees. The most productive fruit trees always seem to be the ones that are neglected. But to employ that strategy seems iffy.

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2022, 03:55:40 PM »
I think once a tree is established, not caring for it is just fine. It takes some care to either get it to size quickly, or to reverse course from it going backwards.

I would think fertilizing those citrus would do wonders for production, health of the tree, resistance to disease etc. My gf's family has a pretty good amount of fruit trees which they never fertilized and last year after applying 20lb of slow release the changes were shocking, far higher quality fruit and taste, more of it, and the trees cleared out all the leaf curl without fungicides or copper or anything.

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2022, 06:23:57 PM »
I think once a tree is established, not caring for it is just fine. It takes some care to either get it to size quickly, or to reverse course from it going backwards.

I would think fertilizing those citrus would do wonders for production, health of the tree, resistance to disease etc. My gf's family has a pretty good amount of fruit trees which they never fertilized and last year after applying 20lb of slow release the changes were shocking, far higher quality fruit and taste, more of it, and the trees cleared out all the leaf curl without fungicides or copper or anything.

Alright I'm convinced. Maybe I haven't been using the best fertilizer.  Can you recommend a good slow release fertilizer? A link would be best if possible.

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2022, 10:29:22 PM »
I don't do anything magic, I just use Vigoro citrus slow release from Home Depot, 40lb bag. I put it down around the width of the canopy of the tree. Probably put down anywhere from 1-2lb per tree, and re-apply every 3-4 weeks depending on how I water.

SaltwaterTx

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2022, 07:57:21 AM »
Rather than pull the Fuerte, have you considering too working? Can cut the tree down pretty far to remove spindle effect, then graft to the new shoots. Might be too late for this spring? I always like to graft another type of two on. Sure it might grow funny, nothing a little pruning canít fix. Always seems to help in fruit production though

ericalynne

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2022, 11:11:23 AM »
K-Rimes, are you using commercial chicken manure, or do you have a source for fresh/composted chicken manure.

If commercial, are the microbes still present after commercial processing?

K-Rimes

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2022, 06:27:48 PM »
K-Rimes, are you using commercial chicken manure, or do you have a source for fresh/composted chicken manure.

If commercial, are the microbes still present after commercial processing?

I use commercial, the Kellogg brand bags, $3 for 1 cu. ft. I'm sure they cook it to some degree for safety. All I can say is literally whatever I put it on IMMEDIATELY, I'm talking 1 week, starts flying growth wise. 

nanewnanew

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2022, 11:12:09 PM »
Rather than pull the Fuerte, have you considering too working? Can cut the tree down pretty far to remove spindle effect, then graft to the new shoots. Might be too late for this spring? I always like to graft another type of two on. Sure it might grow funny, nothing a little pruning canít fix. Always seems to help in fruit production though
Think I'd be more inclined to plant a pit and top work that later.  I've pulled seedlings to thin pits I've planted and am shocked at how long and sturdy the main root is. All the root systems of the potted plants that I've dig up pale in comparison to the system u get from a pit.

I actually wish I did this in this case. Should have started with a pit and grafted fuerte. I imagine that's what will probably end up happeni6with this 

ericalynne

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2022, 05:37:21 PM »
K-Rimes, are you using commercial chicken manure, or do you have a source for fresh/composted chicken manure.

If commercial, are the microbes still present after commercial processing?

I use commercial, the Kellogg brand bags, $3 for 1 cu. ft. I'm sure they cook it to some degree for safety. All I can say is literally whatever I put it on IMMEDIATELY, I'm talking 1 week, starts flying growth wise.

Sounds good. Iíll try it. Thank you.

palmcity

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Re: When it's time ......
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2022, 06:20:40 AM »
"Re: When it's time ......"

It is time::: HAPPY VALENTINES DAY

A Time to Plant............A Time to Reap.
A Time for War.............A Time for Peace.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WB6jhbtDUZE    Byrds Turn Turn Turn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22eS8acYlKE      Song from the Source
« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 06:44:14 AM by palmcity »

 

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