Fruits that grow true to seed - getting mixed info

[LostBoy_Dani]

Hello all! I am very new to the plant raising game in general, and when looking for info on what sorts of fruits grow true to seed, at times I'm finding mixed and conflicting info. For example for citrus, some websites state they do not grow true to seed, while some say they do. Same with stone fruits. Some info seems clear (info on apples, mango poly vs mono, etc.) but some I'm not finding a clear answer. Is some of the info out there just out of date? Is there a source folks recommend on up to date and reliable info?

Thanks!

[W.]

At least with citrus, it depends on what type of citrus you are trying to grow. For instance, pomelos are never true to type, and key limes are always true to type.

[pagnr]

Most fruit tree seeds are true to type, and most members would have propagated many from seed to get pretty close to what they wanted.
Wild species and non hybrid cultivars are pretty much in this zone.
Hybrids and improved cultivars will likely throw more variable seed offspring.
The wider the hybrid cross, the more likely to get more variable seed progeny.
F1 hybrid fruit will normally give variable F2 seedlings.
Not all hybrid varieties are actually true F1 ( AABB X aabb = AaBb hybrid )
Variety cultivars may give similar but variable seed progeny.
I had a nice white peach, maybe Okinawa, that volunteered quite a few seedlings. The fruit was pretty much identical to original, but the ripening time was different by weeks and months. One seedling is so late it can't ripen before winter.
Found seedlings of Apples on roadsides can be variable, but mostly pretty similar to the seed in the core that came out the car window.
There are also many myths about "not being true from seed".
In most cases you are going to get something pretty close to the fruit the seed it came out of, some might be real duds, but most variants will be edible.
Species and cultivated varieties might need more info beforehand, if you don't have time and space to wait for results.
Some varieties from some species have nucellar / polyembryonic seeds that are clones of the parent ie some Citrus and some Mangoes.
Where seedlings are used as grafting rootstocks, the level of seedling variation is low enough to allow fairly uniform similar rootstocks.

[drymifolia]

The problem is "true to type" or "true to seed" is vaguely defined so it will mean different things to different people.

Do you mean "genetically identical to the seed parent"? If so, then some percentage of citrus (it varies widely by cultivar) will be nucellar and therefore clones of the parent, and same for polyembryonic mangoes. But even those will also have some percentage of seedlings that are zygotic (i.e., not clones).

If you mean "very similar to the seed parent" (perhaps even visually identical without a DNA test), then many stable landraces of all types of trees will produce similar offspring to the parent unless you provide pollen from some different type of tree that is able to hybridize with it. Stone fruit, loquat, etc., fall in this category.

People use "true to seed" to mean both those things, but I think it should really only be used for the first one.

[1rainman]

I thought grape seedlings wouldn't be nearly as good as the parent because not true to seed or whatever and hybrid variation.

Yes there is enough variation to do selective breeding, but they are pretty similar to the parents about what you would expect but not clones of the parent. I guess it's the same with other cultivars. People make a big fuss that they aren't clones but they are similar enough.