WTB Triumph Persimmon

[victory66]

So I have called virtually everyone who has ever offered this cultivar in the past, but either their grafts failed or the rootstock (Black Sapote) got a fungus this year so they died. Julian at Lara, Jack and the Beanstalk, Richard Lyons, and Birkes says maybe next year. Does anyone even grow this cultivar in Florida??? sigh.

[victory66]

Tried Pepe's Plants as well.

[victory66]

If anyone has scions of Triumph I would be very interested as well...been goose chasing this since 2020 lol!

[skhan]

I got suruga from just fruits and exotics
I have a South Florida tree, you are welcome to scions in spring

[victory66]

Has Surge fruited for you? Maybe when available I'll grab one. Second person that mentioned Surge.

[victory66]

damn spellchecker SURUGA

[kapps]

I was down at Xain’s World a couple weeks ago and asked about the south Florida / tropical persimmon. They said that one guy was grafting thousands of them for years. Then he just stopped and disappeared.  Now, everyone seems to want one and nobody is producing them in decent numbers.

I’m far enough north that I may give Fuyu and Hachiya a try. I recall one of the vendors at the Vero beach plant sale saying that there is a large Fuyu grove near Melbourne.

[victory66]

Yeah apparently whoever that was had some skills, because an array of other nurseries have had great difficulty grafting this variety of fruit! A couple nurseries have used Black Sapote for rootstock, but the rootstock almost always takes over thus losing the desired scion graft in time. I would pay good money for the 'Triumph' or even the 'South Florida - Tropical' (aka 'Hudson') varieties, but oh well. maybe this is one goose I can't catch!

[skhan]

If anyone has rootstock I'd happily graft some next year

[victory66]

As I was told earlier today the time to graft is in early spring when buds want to push, kinda like annonas I guess? Ordered a tree, and I have the previous tree's root suckers (maybe 7 of them?).

[Galatians522]

I have a friend with a very productive persimmon tree grafted to the native American Persimmon rootstock. I need to ask what variety it is. Its astringent but makes delicious and seedless fruit. That combo has proven to make a long lived tree for Florida (with the possible exception of non-astringent cultivars from what I have read). I don't think Black Sapote is anywhere near as closely related. I am guessing that part of the trouble is that south Florida nurseries have trouble sourcing American Persimmon seeds but have black sapote applenty. They are quite common here, though.

[victory66]

If you find out any further info it would be appreciated thanks. Perhaps the nurseries have been using seed sourced from the northern part of American Persimmon's range, rather than from Florida strains. There is a source in Gainesville of Florida strain of this species that seems to be ideal for rootstock. Also as I understand it the South Florida and Triumph are either seedless or nearly so, thus the difficulty sourcing suitable seed for growing rootstock.

[RS]

You could maybe try asking Paul at Fruitful Trees (paul@rawlife.com, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lXGvK5FP_0) he loves Triumph persimmon and visits nurseries all over S Florida.

That's surprising to hear black sapote used as rootstock. Fairchild Botanical Gardens says,

"In the case of persimmons for South Florida the only rootstock that is appropriate is our own native wild persimmon. The native persimmon rootstock will allow for the ‘Triumph’ to thrive in our soils and climates. Before purchasing your tree you should first confirm that it is indeed grafted on a native persimmon rootstock."
https://fairchildgarden.org/visit/petite-attractive-and-delicious-the-persimmon-in-south-florida/