Author Topic: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit  (Read 32452 times)

lycheeluva

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the ever magnanimous Harry of House fame, gave me a tour of his paradise today. Alas, not even a hint of lychee bloom on his many trees. I am deeply concerned for the florida lychee harvest this year. I digress. At the end of the tour we feasted on 2 large Cherimoyas that I purchased from Chrimoya.com. They were excellent, if annoyingly seedy.  Of course, murahilin complained that the fruit had too much flavor. We also tried some of Harry's black sapote. When a fruit looks like someone has just taken a dump into a passion fruit shell, you assume it would have to taste outstanding for it to still be cultivated. Not so. A more tasteless fruit surely cannot exist- the only flavor i could detect at all was a very slight taste of mango bloom. I have never tasted mango blooms but the sapote tasted like how mango blooms smell (and they dont smell good). We also had some very good carembola- cultivars, belll and possum's arse or something like that, some sapodilla- meh, and some pretty good pommelo

Thanks Harry for your omnipotent hospitality and I hope I am forgiven for dissing your black sapotes
« Last Edit: January 23, 2012, 08:02:08 AM by lycheeluva »

Tropicalgrower89

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2012, 11:53:42 PM »


IMO mango blooms smell like corn bread. I remember that smell from my old haden blooms.
 There's a carambola cultivar called Possum's A$$?   j/k  :D
Alexi

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2012, 11:54:22 PM »
Lycheeluva - well, all fruits can't be lychees  :P ;D

While it is give the title of "chocolate pudding fruit", without using my imagination, I don't see it....however, I do believe it does have a nice, subtle taste with a hint of the persimmon its a relative of.  I also find it extremely variable from tree to tree.  I have had some that have a bit of "stringiness" to them and I have had some from a tree that were absolutely creamy.  It does tend to taste better if you mix a little whip cream with it where it tales on a sweeter mousse type character.

As to the other fruits, I love saps, pommelo has to be really good to be good...so, murahilin, does the cherimoya rank with the Mahachanok in your book   :( >:( ;)

Rob
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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2012, 12:18:44 AM »
Lycheeluva, the most bland fruit i think must be cocoplum, or hicaco, (Chrsobalanus icaco). Although even with that one some are better than others. I agree with Rob and there are some good chocolate sapotes, they vary from tree to tree.  I guess most people call them black sapotes (Diospyros digyna). But i have to tell you that after eating cherimoya is not a good time to be trying to taste any other fruit, as cherimoyas are so super sweet. Have you ever tried to taste a fruit after eating Haagen Dasz ice cream? Maybe you get my point? Some chocolate sapotes are really good out of hand, but most are better after being prepared. You can make a to kill for chocolate mousse just by adding some cream, cacao powder, some sweetener, and a tad of lemon juice to chocolate sapotes.
Oscar
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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2012, 07:06:28 AM »
Gerry has a unique way of describing fruit taste...entertaining to say the least.  I don't think anything tops his experience with soursop!  Definitely my fav. :D

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2012, 07:26:10 AM »
Fruitlovers, I'm going to try your ingredients next time I get some black sapotes. I've always had them chilled and then served with cool whip (like BS Bullie suggested)...a way I found to be pretty good. But I agree, the fruit's appearances sure are uninviting!
They're like the Varmint-Cong...

lycheeluva

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2012, 07:56:34 AM »
Oscar, actually, we ate the sapotes before the cherimoya. there was not even the most remote hint of chocolate- maybe this particular variety was especially bland.

Fruitguy

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2012, 08:35:12 AM »
Generally speaking, they are probably in the Top Ten category of bland fruit, but as others have pointed out, some are better than others.  Pitaya (aka dragonfruit) has some fairly bland tasting cultivars as well, though now that there has been some breeding work done, that is not necessarily true anymore.  In defense of the black sapote, they do add color to baked goods such as bread, cookies, cheesecake, etc, as well as ice cream.  Yum!

Here is an article from yesterday's Miami Herald.  The last pic shows some preparations of the fruit.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/01/22/2599857/chocolate-fruit-for-south-florida.html

Morton also has some preparation suggestions, and interestingly (who knew?) it is has twice the vitamin C content of an orange.

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/black_sapote.html

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2012, 08:57:58 AM »
the ever magnanimous Harry of House fame, gave me a tour of his paradise today. Alas, not even a hint of lychee bloom on his many trees. I am deeply concerned for the florida lychee harvest this year. I digress. At the end of the tour we feasted on 2 large Cherimoyas that I purchased from Chrimoya.com. They were excellent, if annoyingly seedy.  Of course, murahilin complained that the fruit had too much flavor. We also tried some of Harry's black sapote. When a fruit looks like someone has just taken a dump into a passion fruit shell, you assume it would have to taste outstanding for it to still be cultivated. Not so. A more tasteless fruit surely cannot exist- the only flavor i could detect at all was a very slight taste of mango bloom. I have never tasted mango blooms but the sapote tasted like how mango blooms smell (and they dont smell good). We also had some very good carembola- cultivars, belll and possum's arse or something like that, some sapodilla- meh, and some pretty good pommelo

Thanks Harry for your omnipotent hospitality and I hope I am forgiven for dissing your black sapotes

Noel Ramos has a nice tasting one, and so does Toppy of Merritt Island FL...Ive had a nasty one like you are saying! No taste!, these ones have a sweet floral taste, not like the (stale natural ice beer smell) smell of mango flowers.  LOL

Keep on trying them!  Don't give up, not all fruits taste the same of the same species...

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adiel

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2012, 11:50:30 AM »
This is how I make it a little more tasteful:

Black Sapote Milkshake.  Ingredients:

- 1 black sapote fruit
- 1 cup of milk
- 2-3 spoons of condensed milk
- sugar
- ice

Blend everything together to create a milkshake.  Looks like chocolate milkshake.  Tastes very good.  :)

Adiel
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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2012, 11:55:42 AM »
I think the problem comes from the common name- "Chocolate Pudding fruit", so people expect it to taste like chocolate.
When whipped up with some milk, it does look like chocolate pudding, but it doesn't taste like it.  Unmet expectations.
Out of hand, I think it is blah, but prepared, it can taste pretty good.

murahilin

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2012, 01:02:26 PM »
I stand by my comment that the cherimoya's had too much flavor. The texture was nice and I did like the flavor, there was just too much of it. Not something I can eat much of. The black sapote was not bad. Was just kinda bland. I think Gerry may have been picking up the smell of the mango blossoms around him and that is why he thought the black sapote tasted like mango blossoms (maybe it was the scent from the pickering mango blossom I accidentally broke off. Sorry about that Harry). The pommelo was the best tasting fruit we had.

Here are some pics from the fruit tasting at Harry's.





« Last Edit: January 23, 2012, 01:08:27 PM by murahilin »

bsbullie

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2012, 01:54:43 PM »
From those pics, I can see the "fiber" I was referring to that are seen in some blacl sapote.  I have had a bunch from Har's tree (for those who know him) and they are nothing like that.  They are extremely creamy and pudding-like and much more consistently darker in color.  There is no way you could cut them with a knife and get that clean of a cut.
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lycheeluva

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2012, 03:37:21 PM »
The pommelo was the best tasting fruit we had.


harry! what are we to do with sheehan for such a ridiculous comment- can we ban him from a forum he founded and started?
sheehan seriously needs tongue taste bud augmentation surgery

bsbullie

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2012, 03:59:13 PM »
The pommelo was the best tasting fruit we had.


harry! what are we to do with murahilin for such a ridiculous comment- can we ban him from a forum he founded and started?
murahilin seriously needs tongue taste bud augmentation surgery

+1  :( :(
- Rob

Felipe

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2012, 05:10:39 PM »
I have never tasted a black zapote that had anything to do with chocolate! But I like them. Sure there is variation in fruit quality. I have one grafted tree (cultivar?) that produces small but tasty fruit. The taste reminds me a lot of dates :-)





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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2012, 06:04:35 PM »
I'm not very positive about eating Black Sapote, the few times I have tried it reminded me of eating rotted fruit.

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2012, 06:36:26 PM »
So let me say that Tony, if you have experienced rotten taste when eating black sapote, then the fruit was probably rotten.  The fruit that we ate when Lycheeluva and Murahilin were over was a small fruit and despite apparent observations to the contrary, it was not fibrous.  The taste was not like mango bloom.  It has a mild sweetness and rich sort of vibe which is somewhat piudding like.  I have two trees.  This is from the larger of my trees and was an airlayer that I bought at one of the Broward Rare Fruit and Vegetable Council sales about 17 years ago.  I have no idea where the original plant was from which it was layered.  However, this fruit does have a representative quality in flavor and texture is better than some I have tried.  I also have a small tree of the Joyner Everbearing (a graft that I did myself from material I got at Gene Joyner's place).  I have to agree with Oscar that Black Sapote is worlds more flavorful than Coco Plum.  Although I have some Colombian friends that swear that there are sweet ones, I have never encountered any. They are grown in landscapes all over our area and I have literally tasted thousands of fruits, both dark and while skinned.  The best ones are like sucking on bland gelatinous cotton....if there were such a thing.  However, I keep tasting. One day I might be able to report a finding of something better.

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2012, 06:45:55 PM »
The black sapote at Harry's house was definitely not fibrous. Was actually very smooth and had a pleasant texture. I enjoyed it better than other black sapotes I've had.

SWRancher, you may like Harry's black sapote. It wasn't mushy or anything reminiscent of a rotting fruit.

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2012, 06:48:00 PM »
Come on folks, chocolate has to do with the color, not the taste! I think we need to taste fruits with our sensory organs rather than our brains. I think too often we taste them with our cerebral expectations, myself included. For example, I remember i was terribly dissapointed when i first tasted mangosteen and i did not think it was the best fruit in the world!  ???
That said, the black sapote does make an incredibly fabulous chocolate mousse. Try it and see. Just add cream, cocoa powder, a bit of honey, and a twist of lemon, and blend it all up.
Oscar
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murahilin

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2012, 06:56:12 PM »
Come on folks, chocolate has to do with the color, not the taste! I think we need to taste fruits with our sensory organs rather than our brains. I think too often we taste them with our cerebral expectations, myself included. For example, I remember i was terribly dissapointed when i first tasted mangosteen and i did not think it was the best fruit in the world!  ???
That said, the black sapote does make an incredibly fabulous chocolate mousse. Try it and see. Just add cream, cocoa powder, a bit of honey, and a twist of lemon, and blend it all up.
Oscar

Oscar,
That recipe sounds like it would taste awesome. Can you please give some more exact quantities or the quantities you recommend of each ingredient. I have no idea how much of each I should add.

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2012, 07:15:16 PM »
And FYI Gerry....its not Possum Arse carambola.  It's Possom Trot.  There is, or at least was, an old time nursery in Miami called Possum Trot Nursery.  This was a seedling selection of carambola that was made by the folks at that nursery.  Its a pretty good fruit and nicely sized and shaped.  Many people that have tasted it have said that it compared favorably with the best carambola fruit they have had.  Possum Arse.......lol...indeed.

Harry
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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2012, 08:25:11 PM »
I have sold as much as 25lbs of Black Sapote to one person. She is a raw foodist and loves the texture taste and color. You can make great smoothies, and cakes and pies. Although not my favorite fruit, I will eat them especially since they fruit in the winter when fresh local fruits are scarce. Hey anything is better than a nasty 6 month old apple from the supermarket!
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lycheeluva

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2012, 08:30:19 PM »
Harry, possum arse possum trot- is there a difference! ;D

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Re: is black sapote the most tasteless fruit in the history of fruit
« Reply #24 on: January 23, 2012, 08:34:55 PM »
This article about Black Sapote was in this Sunday's Miami Herald. Noris calls them Chocolate Persimmons!

Fairchild’s tropical garden column

Chocolate fruit for South Florida
By Noris Ledesma

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/01/22/2599857/chocolate-fruit-for-south-florida.html

Chocolate persimmon fruits have green skin and a shape that like a tomato. Noris Ledesma / Fairchild Tropical Botanic GardenFullsize Buy Photoprevious | nextImage 1 of 3Danna Velasco loves chocolate persimmon. Her mom says she has enjoyed it every season since she was a baby. Noris Ledesma / Fairchild Tropical Botanic GardenFullsize Buy Photoprevious | nextImage 2 of 3Chocolate persimmon can be used in a variety of sweet treats. Noris Ledesma / Fairchild Tropical Botanic GardenFullsize Buy Photoprevious | nextImage 3 of 3
For people who have chocolate cravings, here’s a surprising source of satisfaction: the chocoate persimmon — sweet and creamy with subtle notes of chocolate flavor.

 The smooth-textured chocolate persimmon ( Diospyros dignya) originates in the dry forests of central Mexico. This is a different fruit than cacao, which is what chocolate comes from. Growing cacao in South Florida can be a challenge but the chocolate persimmon is an easy tree to grow in your backyard.
 The chocolate persimmon is also called black sapote due to the unusual black color of the flesh. The chocolate persimmon has a green skin and the shape resembles a tomato. People have the idea that fruit comes in bright colors, like red, orange, yellow and green, but persimmons can even be brown. Just remember that there are other colors and flavors in the flora kingdom!

 The chocolate persimmon can be a favorite fruit for kids because of its sweet flavor. The ripe fruit has a rich cocoa colored flesh with the creamy texture of chocolate pudding (without the fat).  It is delicious when eaten as a dessert with cream and a touch of rum or vanilla. The fruit is a natural dessert by itself when eaten fresh, but it can also be used as a chocolate substitute in recipes and milkshakes, or simply mixed with yogurt and lemon juice for a refreshing treat. Another way to enjoy the chocolate persimmon is by cutting it in half and covering it with passion fruit. In Mexico, the pulp is mashed with orange juice or brandy and served with cream. It is also delicious mixed with wine, cinnamon and sugar.

This legendary fruit has been cultivated since the days of the Mayans in Yucatan, Mexico, where it originated. It was introduced to South Florida in the early 1900s by the Bureau of Plant Industry of the U.S. Department of Agriculture. Numerous seedlings have been grown in Miami-Dade County since then, and a few selections have been propagated and are available some local nurseries. Because there are both male and female trees when grown from seed, it is preferable to use grafted trees, which can bear fruit within three years. Most of the chocolate persimmons in South Florida ripen from October through March, a time when we have few tropical fruits to enjoy.

Chocolate persimmon is a handsome tree with shiny, dark green leaves useful as an ornamental specimen for your backyard. The tree grows well in a variety of soils as long as it is well drained. It is especially well adapted to the rocky soils of South Florida. Young trees can be injured by low temperatures below freezing (32° F).
Mature chocolate persimmon trees do not need frequent watering. Mulching is a great practice; as it helps to retain soil moisture, reduces weed problems and improves the soil. Mulch with a two to six inch layer of bark, wood chips, or similar material and keep mulch eight to twelve inches from the trunk.

 The chocolate persimmon tree is not demanding in its fertilizer requirements. After planting, when new growth begins, apply a half to full handful of 8-3-9, or similar fruit tree fertilizer mix. The fertilizer should be sprinkled lightly below the drip line of the canopy three times per year. Take care not to apply the fertilizer to the trunk.
 Chocolate persimmon is grown on a small commercial scale in Florida. Knowing when to pick the fruit can be tricky because of the green color of the skin that lightly changes when mature. The fruits are picked when full size but unripe (olive-green color), and allowed to ripen about 10 days at room temperature. The fruit is soft when fully ripe. The fruit can be used fresh or frozen, and ripe fruit will store for three or four days under refrigeration. For longer pulp storage (six months), seeds and skin should be removed and the pulp frozen. Chocolate persimmon fruit is rich in Vitamin A and Vitamin C, and has a relatively high amount of potassium.

 This tropical fruit is a distinctive element of South Florida cuisine, due to the mild fruit, and its brilliant gel texture. It develops a caramel flavor when cooked, making it a great base and desirable filling for pies.
 If you have the room to plant a fruit tree that produces a delicious treat and adds to your South Florida backyard, chocolate persimmon is the perfect option.

 Noris Ledesma is curator of Tropical Fruit at Fairchild Tropical Botanic Garden.
FloridaGreenMan