The Tropical Fruit Forum
Citrus => Cold Hardy Citrus => Topic started by: tedburn on April 09, 2021, 04:59:33 PM
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In summer 2020 I planted a lot of assumed frosthardy citrus varieties in my garden in ground. Due to the plants have been not so big I hoped to get a mild winter, but counted with the worst. And the winter got worse, we got 4 days and nights enduring frost down to 3,2 F ( - 16 C) and during the days frost with 100% full sunlight.
Heavy test for my citrus. Then from 20.2. it got warmer, but always change a few days warm, followed by colder days with night frost. So I show you the result after the severe winter. Hope it can help you to get more information of cold hardiness of citrus varieties 😋.
Regards Frank
(https://i.ibb.co/wsr9yx2/citrus-frost-hardiness-experience-winter-2020-to-2021-compressed.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vYv71KM)
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Excellent photos, some surprises. You had a colder Winter than I did.
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thanks kumin, yes it was an ugly winter in our region
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Nice comparisons. To increase the survival rate the graft union must be completely healed 2-3 years and the tree with a trunk diameter of 1 cm, then planted outside in soil.
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Thanks Lebmung, for adding your experience, yes I think this are very true points. In my case, I know that my plants all have been risky ( young and small) but regarding the last warmer winters and using winter protection I decided the risk to be not so high. So hope for a good recovery this summer 😅.
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Like you I risked my small hybrids outside. My lowest in zone 7a this winter was 12f/-11c. My Yuzu defoliated at the very end of winter but it's pushing out new leaves now. My citrumelo had some leaves curl and dry up and then drop but kept at least half of them and is otherwise fine. My tai-tri didn't lose but 1 or two leaves.
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Hello vnomonee, that sounds good for a new restart, congratulation. But it is very difficult to tell early after the freeze how severe the damage is.
My Ichangquat 245 looked pretty good in March and now there are still some more twig damages, perhaps also our bad spring this year with always changing warm weather with night freezes stresses the already harmed plants additionally.
So I'm really curious when the citrus start to grow again and finally to see what is then still damaged. At some small buds are already to be seen.
Think to give an update in a few weeks.
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I’ve lost almost all poncirus hybrids when temps reached 5 degrees F and below over several years. Also lost 10 ft tall dunstan and swingle citrumelos when temps never got above freezing, hovering at or just below 32 degrees F for a week. I lost hybrids when they just started putting out new growth in March, when we got a low of 14 degrees, and these were protected in a high tunnel with water barrels next to each tree. The only hybrids that have survived at my place outdoors without being covered and heated by space heaters for the past decade are Dunstan citrumelo, citradia, and Thomasville citrangequat, and they have died to ground and came back from roots several times. I’ve lost several Dunstan and citradia trees too, but these are the only three specimens that I have left. I’ve lost the following over the years: Dunstan, swingle, citradia, rusk, Changsha, mortan, Nansho dai dai, ichangensis, Ichang lemon, carizo, yuzu. I’ve even lost some potted flying dragon one-year seedlings when zero degrees F all night two nights in a row. The small cracks at base of the tree trunk in spring means the tree is going to die; I had a citradia leaf out in spring despite a crack in base of trunk bark and it died suddenly soon after.
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I’ve lost almost all poncirus hybrids when temps reached 5 degrees F and below over several years. Also lost 10 ft tall dunstan and swingle citrumelos when temps never got above freezing, hovering at or just below 32 degrees F for a week. I lost hybrids when they just started putting out new growth in March, when we got a low of 14 degrees, and these were protected in a high tunnel with water barrels next to each tree.
From what I have observed, the amount of cold tolerance can go down if the citrus is covered in such a way that creates a greenhouse effect. The very warm daytime temperatures inside the covering then brings the citrus out of dormancy and can make even cold hardy citrus vulnerable to modest cold temperatures.
So I think it is important to describe the conditions of the covering, if that may have been creating a greenhouse effect.
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I’ve lost almost all poncirus hybrids when temps reached 5 degrees F and below over several years. Also lost 10 ft tall dunstan and swingle citrumelos when temps never got above freezing, hovering at or just below 32 degrees F for a week. I lost hybrids when they just started putting out new growth in March, when we got a low of 14 degrees, and these were protected in a high tunnel with water barrels next to each tree. The only hybrids that have survived at my place outdoors without being covered and heated by space heaters for the past decade are Dunstan citrumelo, citradia, and Thomasville citrangequat, and they have died to ground and came back from roots several times. I’ve lost several Dunstan and citradia trees too, but these are the only three specimens that I have left. I’ve lost the following over the years: Dunstan, swingle, citradia, rusk, Changsha, mortan, Nansho dai dai, ichangensis, Ichang lemon, carizo, yuzu. I’ve even lost some potted flying dragon one-year seedlings when zero degrees F all night two nights in a row. The small cracks at base of the tree trunk in spring means the tree is going to die; I had a citradia leaf out in spring despite a crack in base of trunk bark and it died suddenly soon after.
Thanks for your much experiences, very interesting. What I also could observe:
That Thomasville is very cold tolerant, up to now no damage, not even a leave.
That the damages still get more severe the months after the longer deep freeze. Thats really difficult, because I think final result will only be seen in June or July. So I already have lost a Dunstan and my 5* Citrumelo is in pretty bad shape.
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Socal2warm, my hybrid citrus die when not covered at all from either too many cumulative days below freezing or from extreme low temps. The ones that broke dormancy in the opened ventilated high tunnel broke dormancy in mid March which is when everything is starting to bloom here. My point was that I get late freezes here and if citrus of any kind other than trifoliata is starting to push new growth, it needs to be kept above freezing at that time or it may die. Today is April 22 and I had a low this morning of 28 degrees and below freezing for five hours. Have had temps in 60’s and 70’s since Early March with one other 29 degree low a few weeks ago. Even my unprotected poncirus has already bloomed. I have to keep my greenhouse frames up and heaters ready to go up until Mother’s Day here. My satsumas and grapefruit are in full bloom and my seedlings and grafted potted citrus are all safe inside my heated enclosures last night and tonight because I am not taking a chance on loosing my crop from last year, still fruit on trees ( grapefruit and Meiwa), or this years blooms, or loosing my trees. My protected citrus grafted on trifoliata and FD actually brake dormancy later than my unprotected trifoliata trees. I think I am doing it right for my roller coaster climate since I have harvested fruit for the past 6 or more years.
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here is the final update of the survivors (new green buds and no dry back anymore) and the candidates with still mortal risk (dry back goes on or rootstock got cracks) and the Dunstan which is already died.
Due to our very cold April ( coldest since many years) the plants start very slow growing.
The Thomasville had new shot and this was eaten by an unknown insect, so because the plant is still small I put it in a net for protection for a few weeks.
(https://i.ibb.co/VNjZWSZ/citrus-frost-hardiness-experience-winter-2020-to-2021final-compressed.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yRf1ny1)
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Now a final conclusion after the winter is possible.
From the 3 candidates with high mortal risk in the last report, the 5* and the HRS 899 finally died but I' m glad to report, that Ichangquat 245 survived. So from 10 frosthardy variants 7 could survive this for citrus very hard winter and spring.
Best regards Frank
(https://i.postimg.cc/sGZgyvzK/IMG-20210606-172720867.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/sGZgyvzK)
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Exceedingly helpful! As a 7b-er trying to grow citrus out here, i really appreciate the data!
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So I' m glad if my post is useful.
Regards Frank
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Don't know why the photo is so blurry- tried with Firefox and Chrome
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Hello Perlexed,
I checked with Android, try to tap on the blurry picture then you get asked if you want full resolution. If you tap on this, you should get full resolution and don' t have a blurry photo. Due to file datasize I was forced to compress.
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Don't know why the photo is so blurry- tried with Firefox and Chrome
It's tricky, but if you slowly and carefully start scrolling down to the middle of the picture, there should be a button in the middle of the picture you can click which says "Load full resolution".
When you click the button, the entire thing will stop being blurry.
The button will not be visible until you start going down to be able to see the midpoint in the very elongated image.
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Thanks y'all. I see it now
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Tedburn, maybe you could make another try with high grafted plants. Let's say 80 - 100cm poncirus stem under the scion. I was successful with this concept. And sun protection is very important.
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Thank you Zitrusgärtner, up to now I hadn' t the possibility to highcraft, but I agree that this is very helpful,
also the sun protection.
How is your HRS899 A did you have fruits last year ?
Regards Frank
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No, 899A lost its fruits after heavy blooming. This year there are no flowers at all. I have to recraft 899A and 899J. The plants are very old (more than 20 years) and roots are not good anymore. 899J did not bloom aswell.
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Thank you Zitrusgärtner, So it seems the HRS xxx varieties are a little bit like Divas. I lost mine this years but I think it was not only the cold but also a rootstockproblem.
Have now a new one in a different place - so lets see what the next winter brings ;).
Regards Frank
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Summer update of my survivors which suffered most.
Sanford with strongest recovery
(https://i.postimg.cc/wRHxPq28/IMG-20210801-175040.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/wRHxPq28)
Sanford Curafora
(https://i.postimg.cc/mPh9Vjh3/IMG-20210801-175143.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mPh9Vjh3)
Yuzu
(https://i.postimg.cc/RW8HYtnk/IMG-20210801-175334.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/RW8HYtnk)
Morton Citrange
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Looks really good. Do you have pictures of the yuzuquat and Thomasville citrangequat.
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Thomasville is a good story, Yuzuquat is an unlucky story.
(https://i.postimg.cc/7brXZ5Z1/IMG-20210607-122121.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7brXZ5Z1)
Ichangquat in begin of June, two sprouts I was happy ;D
then a few days later, a snail killed me both sprouts :-\, so I repotted the plant and now Im still hoping/waiting. I had new sprouts but from the rootstock, which I had to remove.
(https://i.postimg.cc/FYXhPgrd/IMG-20210801-195413.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/FYXhPgrd)
Ichangquat today
(https://i.postimg.cc/Pppcs9Kt/IMG-20210801-175209.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Pppcs9Kt)
Thomasville today, in good shape.
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would it make any sense to to grow in a 5+/- gallon pot till it is 3+ feet tall before planting in ground early spring.
(https://i.postimg.cc/RqCBhYfD/IMG-0411.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/RqCBhYfD)
6 weeks since planting in ground, a 4.5 year old seed grown Meiwa kumquat with a 0.5cubic meter canopy is starting to grow flower buds as well as foliage. It is unlikely that animals will do much damage.
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Yes, I regret not to have taken the plant into pot directly after winter for recovery. But the last years we nearly had no snails so I didn' t took that into account.
But you are right, that bigger plants have no problem to loose a few leaves or sprouts by snails.
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Poncirusguy, sorry for the delay, here the pictures
(https://i.postimg.cc/yJPBb3Ch/IMG-20210828-140852543.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/yJPBb3Ch)
Thomasville
(https://i.postimg.cc/DSvxcS53/IMG-20210828-141004894.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/DSvxcS53)
Ichangquat, after snailattack to fresh sprouts I hadto repot, but now only rootstock sprouts ::), don' t know if the ichangquat will survive.
regards Frank
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update of citsuma Prague and Ivia, which are grown, but not so much as Sanford and Yuzu.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8sWMLXtB/IMG-20211007-113539712.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8sWMLXtB)
Sanford for comparison, about 80 cm high
(https://i.postimg.cc/Yv4WqXGW/IMG-20211007-113729652.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Yv4WqXGW)
Citsuma Prague
(https://i.postimg.cc/rzcxCCbB/IMG-20211007-113804613.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rzcxCCbB)
Ivia
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winter preparations are starting although no freeze annonced for the next 10 days.
This time will try to make bricks arround the plants and then wrap around cocos mats. Perhaps this time I still add one or two water bottles if place is enough. And finally I hope we not get again down to 3,2 ° Fahrenheit ;).
<br />(https://i.ibb.co/89cQ8Ym/IMG-20211016-132225.jpg) (https://ibb.co/89cQ8Ym)<br />
Yuzu, last year no protection was to optimistic, freeze nearly to ground, ( but didn' calculated to get 3,2°)
<br />(https://i.ibb.co/m8sgwKP/IMG-20211016-132112.jpg) (https://ibb.co/m8sgwKP)<br />
Citsuma Prague
<br />(https://i.ibb.co/vwqBJjz/IMG-20211016-132131.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vwqBJjz)<br />
Ivia
<br />(https://i.ibb.co/gWGZ75y/IMG-20211016-132158.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gWGZ75y)<br />
HRS 899A, new try at new location (plant last year died after winter and spring freezes)
regards Frank
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Winter preparations (first step sun protection with fleece) finished.
For Ichangensisxsinensis and Satsuma Collot a 80 Watt heating cable is installed if temperatures exceed -8 ° Celsius for several days it will be connected and additional isolating material as now on the top will be wrapped around.
(https://i.postimg.cc/tYcdr2vf/IMG-20211213-125524050.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/tYcdr2vf)
the hardier citrus with sun protection. If cold spells are deeper than -10 ° Celsius for several days are announced, an additional cocosmat will be also wrapped around.
This year there is a new citrus CitrumeloxYuzu in ground, lets see how it will go over the freezing period.
Last years January to March are the periods with deepest temperatures.
(https://i.postimg.cc/mtgVpcLc/IMG-20211213-125619739.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mtgVpcLc)
regards Frank
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While up to now our winter is not to cold, the coldest period have been 4 days with temperatures at night with about 20 ° F (-7° C).
But this is still not the end of our winter, due experiences of the last years, the most challenging months in the last years have been January and February. Today and the next days we have temperatures of 48 - 57 ° F ( 9- 14 ° C ).
Nevertheless its always interesting to gather informations about winter protection strategies in our cold climate (for citrus), so quite interesting to read the article in the link below, perhaps also interesting for some of you.
https://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/citrus/cold/L2287.htm
Regards Frank
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Some news of my 2021 new in ground planted 1 year old seedlings and new 2021 grafting from Morton on existing Poncirus, since a few years in our garden.
All 2020 in ground planted citrus in best shape due to up to now very mild winter t min was about -8 ° C, 18°F, hope February will continue like that.
(https://i.postimg.cc/d7tkc9M7/IMG-20220203-122050835.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/d7tkc9M7)
1 year old Ichangensis SRA 241 seedling without protection, very good shape
(https://i.postimg.cc/YhPMCfmG/IMG-20220203-122115101.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/YhPMCfmG)
in front Ichangstar60 seedling from Ilya, looks pretty good ( little bit minerals necessary in spring). Behind IVIA, both had a slight fleece protection
(https://i.postimg.cc/vg5dPpP5/IMG-20220203-122130223.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vg5dPpP5)
IVIA with stone and fleece protection, top of the plant not in good shape
(https://i.postimg.cc/9DqVRRGx/IMG-20220203-122212587.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/9DqVRRGx)
Dunstan seedling, stone and cocosmatprotection, top of the plant frozen, perhaps cocosmat touched planttop.
(https://i.postimg.cc/fJyMsgkQ/IMG-20220203-122315910.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJyMsgkQ)
2021 graft Morton on Poncirus looks pretty good
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Sanford Curafora F2 after (nearly) second winter
(https://i.postimg.cc/PpYyCMTx/IMG-20220216-163206913.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PpYyCMTx)
Citrumelo x Yuzu after first winter
(https://i.postimg.cc/jCr0ZgWM/IMG-20220216-163222509.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/jCr0ZgWM)
Rest of February no frost announced, so I' m assuming no winter damages this year. All other in ground citrus, Citsuma Prague, Yuzu, Morton, Ichangensis IVIA, Citrangequat Thomasville in best shape. T min this winter was -8 ° C ( 18 ° F). Also Satsuma Collot, Keraji Mandarin and Ichangensis x sinensis in ground which have been prepared with heating cables, which I didn' t had to use, no damages at all.
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Great vigor on the Curafora growth flush. Nice to see healthy Citrus.
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Thanks Kumin for your appreciatung comment. Yes in late winter it is aleays interesting to see how the plants managed the cold and I' m glad this modrate 2 nd winter gives a good chance to further strengthen the plants. I like the Curafora also vry much for her habit and groth, now waiting for blossoms in late spring. Only problem will be ripening of fruit not in the same year - so much likely frost damage of the fruit. But lets see, one step after the other ;).
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A few days ago I freed my inground citrus from winter protection fleece and all looked in very good shape. Regarding my Citsuma Prague it was to early, at least sun protection should have been stayed established. So a few mornings with freeze and days with about 10 h sun led to slight frostcracks, picture 1.
Now I still installed a sun protection, picture 2.
Near to my Citsuma is a Citrumelo x Yuzu, which has no problems with freeze and sun, picture 3.
(https://i.postimg.cc/HrKqHShg/IMG-20220322-122858833.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/HrKqHShg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/Lq33v5fb/IMG-20220322-122603474.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Lq33v5fb)
(https://i.postimg.cc/w1K5pLQr/IMG-20220322-122706854.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/w1K5pLQr)
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Today we had wonderful weather, so I reconstructed my wall of sandstones and made place for 3 citrus candidates to plant in open ground.
On the right I try a Slava Micurina Orange, in the corner left this is a bigraft on Poncirus with Bloomsweet and Staraji 55 and on the left there is a Duncan Grapefruit.
These citrus are perhaps not fully hardy for my zone so in every case I have to watch meteoforecast and secure with heating cables the next winters. If the winters are not as mild as this years winter.
Total left behind the grape trunk is a Keraji mandarin, which managed two winters now. Hope to get blossoms this year.
(https://i.postimg.cc/c6gjFTSz/IMG-20220326-133200434.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/c6gjFTSz)
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Yesterday I used the sunny weather to give my Sunford two little children which will have fruits with earlier maturity, if all works well - we' ll see 😅
(https://i.postimg.cc/75t4WtcP/IMG-20220411-180600836.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/75t4WtcP)
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which will have fruits with earlier maturity, if all works well - we' ll see 😅
(https://i.postimg.cc/75t4WtcP/IMG-20220411-180600836.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/75t4WtcP)
Why do you think so?
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After my knowledge and experience Sanford matures not within one year, so the fruit will not be ripe before april or may in Germany. So the idea was to graft relativ frosthardy citrusvarieties which mature earlier. Nippon Orangequat had a ripe fruit in January and Keraji end of December.
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Just a short update
first picture, small 2020 planted Thomasville in winter shadowy place now starts growing, never damaged, but slowgrowing on Poncirus and in this winter shadowy place.
(https://i.postimg.cc/QB3qgv4g/1040354.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/QB3qgv4g)
new plantation in April 2022, right an Orange slava micurina, in the middle a bigraft of Bloomsweet and Staraji 55 on Poncirus and left a Duncangrapefruit on Poncirus.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Js1nbq3D/1040360.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Js1nbq3D)
Rest of all planted citrus varieties of 2020, now good growing.
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chimera Prag is slow and confuse growing but now it presents the first flower bud of all my in ground citrus 😅.
(https://i.postimg.cc/dLkdSPqH/1040450-citsuma-prague.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dLkdSPqH)
(https://i.postimg.cc/87gFK7Xc/1040455bl-te-prague.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/87gFK7Xc)
Morton Citrange on FA5 is good growing and further recovering of winter damage 2020/2021. This winter no damage.
(https://i.postimg.cc/XBvh0N2y/1040444citrange-morton.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XBvh0N2y)
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I suppose FA5 is less hardy than Morton. Why did you choose this rootstock?
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I suppose you are right. But the rootstock FA5 was a recommendation for earth with higher ph and it was assured that FA5 is nearly as hardy as Poncirus, so I thought to try it. And I even was not disappointed in Winter 2020/2021 when the young plant supported -15 ° C with passive protection. Meanwhile I also have Morton grafted on a Poncirus in ground and a flying dragon in ground, so I can compare the next winters and seasons. Perhaps the effevt of deep dormancy is perhaps an additional advantage of poncirus.
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today 14 months after grafting my Dunstan was left free in ground. Second chance for Dunstan. But now on Poncirus, the one I lost in winter 20/21 was on Citrumelo Broza (no worthful rootstock, because it died also after the winter).
(https://i.postimg.cc/hXSmBz5M/1040519.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hXSmBz5M)
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Chimera Prague, first flower after 2 years in ground :D
(https://i.postimg.cc/n9KMy9nH/1040677.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/n9KMy9nH)
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Congratulation. Looking good. Hope you get fruit from this.
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thank you, yes I' m also excited if the plant will keep a fruit.
If so I will show a picture ;).
Regards Frank
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The Chimera Prague lost the small fruit after a few weeks.
Two new plants for winterhardytest are new in ground.
First a multigraft on Flying Dragon with Morton Citrange, Dunstan and 5* Citrumelo.
Bloomsweet and Keraji are new grafts on the Flying Dragon.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8s6Zr219/20220707-193351.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8s6Zr219)
Following picture is Ichangquat on Poncirus
(https://i.postimg.cc/FkLCrqRt/20220707-193403.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/FkLCrqRt)
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Just a short update of my frosthardy citrus.
They all are doing well after 2 years in ground.
Though only Chimera Prague and Ichangensis Ivia had one flower each the others none. But all are good growing though some are slowly growing, especially my Thomasville and Ivia but also Chimera Prague is abmore slow grower.
Here two pictures of the smallest one, Thomasville, and the fastest grower Sanford Curafora F2 with an heigt now of 1,3 m, after restarting in may 2021 by 20 cm after frost damage in the 1. winter.
Enjoy your frosthardy citrus , ;D
(https://i.postimg.cc/qzFnRR5Y/IMG-20220825-181709526.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/qzFnRR5Y)
(https://i.postimg.cc/HjxVymXC/IMG-20220825-182116904.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/HjxVymXC)
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In ground Ichangensis Ivia, slow growing, still get flower buds in early autumn.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Lq9kSZMh/IMG-20220926-160006103.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Lq9kSZMh)
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After a long search still got some scions of Clemyuz 2-2 ( Ten degree tangerine), all took very good, also this one which I grafted directly on inground Poncirus. Interesting to see, how the first winter will get managed ;)
(https://i.postimg.cc/t14MWqc0/IMG-20221023-122559001.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/t14MWqc0)
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Hi, just chiming in with my project of trying to grow outdoor yuzus in Helsinki/zone 6b.
- Started on March 2022 after ordering fresh yuzu for some seeds. Germination March-April.
- Moved small plants on my balcony during May for the summer. They seem to grow better indoors with lamps, but I'm low on space indoors.
- On October I decided to split plants into two groups. About a third I'm trying to make survive on my balcony during the winter. I'm planning to use various methods and see how they react to them. Some will be left fully exposured to the weather. Some will be stored on open and closed styrofoam containers. Some will be wrapped in frost-protecting blanket. Two thirds of the plants I brought indoors to grow some better roots & stem, and I will repeat the outdoor procedure next winter. Some of the plants I will plant outdoors next spring and see if they will survive at all in 6b zone.
The plants I'm trying to make survive the winter: https://imgur.com/a/g7wkLIE
Last winter Helsinki experienced temperatures going as low as -18c. My balcony stays about five degrees higher than this. Freezing temperatures lower than -25c are very rare in vicinity of the ocean, but occasionally do happen.
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Hello Raze, interesting and challenging project with nice plants ;). Referring to my experiences, and reports of others, Yuzus can bear about -14 ° C in open ground.
So perhaps You also could use a heating cable for the cases when unfortunately some very cold frosty days will occur. In this way I could protect and save a Satsuma Collot in open ground in the very cold February 2021.
If you have fun with citrus you also could try Citrange or Citrumelo varieties or chimera Prag, which can take still a few ( 2-3 ° C) degrees more low temperature.
Best regards and good success.
Frank
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Hi, just chiming in with my project of trying to grow outdoor yuzus in Helsinki/zone 6b.
- Started on March 2022 after ordering fresh yuzu for some seeds. Germination March-April.
- Moved small plants on my balcony during May for the summer. They seem to grow better indoors with lamps, but I'm low on space indoors.
- On October I decided to split plants into two groups. About a third I'm trying to make survive on my balcony during the winter. I'm planning to use various methods and see how they react to them. Some will be left fully exposured to the weather. Some will be stored on open and closed styrofoam containers. Some will be wrapped in frost-protecting blanket. Two thirds of the plants I brought indoors to grow some better roots & stem, and I will repeat the outdoor procedure next winter. Some of the plants I will plant outdoors next spring and see if they will survive at all in 6b zone.
The plants I'm trying to make survive the winter: https://imgur.com/a/g7wkLIE
Last winter Helsinki experienced temperatures going as low as -18c. My balcony stays about five degrees higher than this. Freezing temperatures lower than -25c are very rare in vicinity of the ocean, but occasionally do happen.
Welcome to the forum and to the wonderful world of citrus.
Your seedlings look strong and healthy. However, you will have to be patient for them to flower (5-7+ years). If you plant them too small and they freeze back, you might never see flowers.
If you don't know it already, you should learn how to graft and sow some Poncirus rootstocks. It saves you so much time (and money too). As far as I know, there are no or few restrictions within the EU, so you should be able to source budwood from other growers fairly easily.
Poncirus trifoliata is the only citrus that could theoretically handle your zone without protection. Have a look at less awful selections like Poncirus+ or Swamp Lemon.
And finally, citrus coldhardiness depends on a lot of factors. They don't like too much winter sun followed by freezes or prolonged freezes. It doesn't matter that a Yuzu can take -12 C or lower. If your daytime highs stay below 0C for several days or even weeks, it will cark it much sooner.
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My wife bought me very excellent Clementines, unfortunately there was no variety named. Due to a information from a french citrusfriend that clementine clemenules survived one winter with -14 ° C, I thought to try to graft the small twiggs which came with the clementines on some of my Poncirus and citrumelos in pots but I also made two grafts on my Sanford Curafora in ground. Not sure if this will work during winter but we' ll see in spring/ summer, if it worked. I thought it worth a try ;).
(https://i.postimg.cc/mzfhqw0d/IMG-20221119-112351034.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mzfhqw0d)
(https://i.postimg.cc/mtXNPPzb/IMG-20221119-135223742.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mtXNPPzb)
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Those grafts can take even now, I've done them with 3 different mandarins and tangerines with stem from the grocery store fruit
around this time as well just make sure they are warm and have enough light. They will turn black or mold if they were not fresh enough
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Thank you, yes I put the most grafts in my greenhouse, only the two ones on Sanford stay outside by temperatures between 3 and 12 ° C the last and the following days - spring will tell 😅
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Some new candidates for winterhardiness test.
Depending on freeze depth and duration no or one or double layer frost cloth as protection in planning.
From left to right:
Meyer lemon seedlings, 1,5 years
ichangquat graft on PT, 1 year old
Ichangstar 60 seedlings in the middle
Star ruby seedlings, 1,5 year old on the right
(https://i.postimg.cc/tsmSbdkz/IMG-20221130-124205666.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/tsmSbdkz)
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Thomasville is a good story, Yuzuquat is an unlucky story.
Do you have a Yuzuquat?
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Hello Mikkel,
no sorry, there I made a wrong spell, this was an Ichangquat.
I have no Yuzuquat.
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thank you!
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Winter preparations ready, longer lasting freezes down to -11° C / 12 ° F announced, will be good hardiness test for some in summer or last year planted citrus, while last winter was mild.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vDk6YW0N/IMG-20221210-160246076.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vDk6YW0N)
Dunstan has to proof hardiness without protection
(https://i.postimg.cc/Mn8MRz20/IMG-20221210-160303687.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Mn8MRz20)
Ichangensis IVIA takes her 3. winter, only light stem protection.
(https://i.postimg.cc/PN3Qmp2W/IMG-20221210-160401287.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PN3Qmp2W)
two year old seedlings of Meyer lemon, Ichangstar 60, Meyer lemon and a graft of Ichangquat on Poncirus have ti proove their cold hardiness with light protection.
Goal is not to kill the plants but to select the hardiest for further cultivation.
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First cold spell (hopefully the only) this winter brought several frostdays down to - 8,6 °F / -12.9 ° C.
Interesting how microclimate differs by different places and passive protection.
Here the coldest place
(https://i.ibb.co/q5JRXg0/IMG-20221220-094149023.jpg)[/url]
Only 3 m distance but in protection of a short wall brings 2 ° C of higher temperature
(https://i.ibb.co/NrLgjdx/IMG-20221220-094354833.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Vxv0ScV)
the 2 year old seedlings, see last post, with backwall greenhouse and front protection airbubblefleece shows
a gain of about 4° C
(https://i.ibb.co/7yspjKf/IMG-20221220-094527875.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vz0dVkF)
last (warmest) place and double protection with fleece and air bubble fleece shows a gain of nearly 7 ° C of cold reduction.
On second picture are the protected plants, one and two year old graftings of slava micurina, Duncan grapefruit and Bloomsweet graft.
(https://i.ibb.co/7JX6Gx0/IMG-20221220-095500934.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Y73qt4V)
(https://i.ibb.co/Ltt8yhK/IMG-20221220-095630766.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XssbPkH)
Conclusion, for shorter periods passive protecton can be very helpfull against frost damage, also protected places in the garden.
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First cold spell (hopefully the only) this winter brought several frostdays down to - 8,6 °F / -12.9 ° C.
Quick fix:
-12.9 °C is +8.6 °F.
-8.6 °F would be -22.6 °C.
Poncirus can survive that, but you probably need a windbreak for it. With some luck, they've been found on the 5b/6a border.
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[
(https://i.postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs/IMG-20190131-071746.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs)
(https://i.postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2/IMG-20190504-183033.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2)
A few F² Citranges survived -11,8 F ( -24,5 C) in January 2019.
(https://i.postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5/IMG-20190131-071759.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5)
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First cold spell (hopefully the only) this winter brought several frostdays down to - 8,6 °F / -12.9 ° C.
Quick fix:
-12.9 °C is +8.6 °F.
-8.6 °F would be -22.6 °C.
Poncirus can survive that, but you probably need a windbreak for it. With some luck, they've been found on the 5b/6a border.
Yes Bussone, your are fully right, temperature was +8,6 F, my head was perhaps already to early at the ° C
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[
(https://i.postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs/IMG-20190131-071746.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs)
(https://i.postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2/IMG-20190504-183033.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2)
A few F² Citranges survived -11,8 F ( -24,5 C) in January 2019.
(https://i.postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5/IMG-20190131-071759.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5)
Kumin, you did really a extraordinary breeding and selection, not sure if Poncirus is really much hardier. Only a pity, that frosthardiness and edibility are still in a big distance and will need a lot of further time and work. To my knowledge the only citrus with excellent fruit when ripe and really frosthardy citrus is Thomasville Citrangequat with hardiness about - 15 ° C but still one problem is that fruit ripens in spring and will be spoilt in winter freeze under -5 ° C.
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[
(https://i.postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs/IMG-20190131-071746.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nVrFHDs)
(https://i.postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2/IMG-20190504-183033.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2bcF0GC2)
A few F² Citranges survived -11,8 F ( -24,5 C) in January 2019.
(https://i.postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5/IMG-20190131-071759.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/r0V21Vp5)
Kumin, you did really a extraordinary breeding and selection, not sure if Poncirus is really much hardier. Only a pity, that frosthardiness and edibility are still in a big distance and will need a lot of further time and work. To my knowledge the only citrus with excellent fruit when ripe and really frosthardy citrus is Thomasville Citrangequat with hardiness about - 15 ° C but still one problem is that fruit ripens in spring and will be spoilt in winter freeze under -5 ° C.
Tedburn, good point regarding early fruit maturity. Deciduous foliage is also quite important. I see a goal of breeding for Citrus fruit approaching the quality of conventional cultivars on a tree similar to Poncirus, minus the thorns.
Several of my selections approach, but don't quite equal the hardiness of Poncirus. Only one has fruited and while the juice is acceptable as a drink, the flavors are too intense for fresh eating.
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Tedburn,
I have not measured temperatures in different places of my garden, only one sensor rather close to the house. Minus 8C one night, three days without ground defrost.
None of my unprotected citruses including three oranges grafted on high stem of PT show damage for the moment.
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Kumin, you did really a extraordinary breeding and selection, not sure if Poncirus is really much hardier. Only a pity, that frosthardiness and edibility are still in a big distance and will need a lot of further time and work. To my knowledge the only citrus with excellent fruit when ripe and really frosthardy citrus is Thomasville Citrangequat with hardiness about - 15 ° C but still one problem is that fruit ripens in spring and will be spoilt in winter freeze under -5 ° C.
Tedburn, good point regarding early fruit maturity. Deciduous foliage is also quite important. I see a goal of breeding for Citrus fruit approaching the quality of conventional cultivars on a tree similar to Poncirus, minus the thorns.
Several of my selections approach, but don't quite equal the hardiness of Poncirus. Only one has fruited and while the juice is acceptable as a drink, the flavors are too intense for fresh eating.
Interesting to observe that zanthoxylum, one of the few Rue genera that is hardier than poncirus, is also deciduous.
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Today made a check at my 5 graft Flying dragon. After a low of 8,6 F and passive protection also the new grafts of summer 2022, Clemyuz 2-2 ( ten degree tangerine),Bloomsweet and Poncirus #7 look very good with small green buds. Morton and 5* Citrumelo grafts of 2021 also look nice and healthy.
Also Ichanggqat, plant on the left side,
in ground since spring 2022 looks good.
(https://i.postimg.cc/KRjqn5Xk/IMG-20230204-152027742.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/KRjqn5Xk)
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A few days ago I liberated all my passive protected citrus from frost protection fleece.
All have been in propper shape, no damage.
Yesterday at a short inspection I noticed light stem cracks at my Dunstan.
When regarding my Wlan thermometer and I saw how fast temperature rises from -4°C to 6 ° C now I can still more understand how necessary sun protection in weather conditions with night frost and full daytime sun is.
(https://i.postimg.cc/DJQgS1pP/Screenshot-20230216-111009.png) (https://postimg.cc/DJQgS1pP)
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After my citrus survived very good freezy February 2023,
March with nightfreezes and daysun stressed some
of my citrus more than I thought.
(https://i.postimg.cc/3dCx8kt2/IMG-20230319-082643031.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3dCx8kt2)
New Clemyuz22 graft on Poncirus and Citrumelo x Yuzu also now look very good
(https://i.postimg.cc/jW16dgMw/IMG-20230319-082604525.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/jW16dgMw)
Ichangensis x sinensis looked very good, when I removed winter protection fleece end of February, now after a few weeks with nightfreezes and daysun it looks stressed, sun protection would have been necessary.
(https://i.postimg.cc/N93jMmhk/IMG-20230319-082715701.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/N93jMmhk)
New grafts of Nippon Orangequat left and Keraji right on Sanford Curafora, looked also very healthy after removing of protection fleece. Now Nippon graft seems to be much damaged, Keraji only light damage.
(https://i.postimg.cc/tsqCY9cw/IMG-20230319-094119571.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/tsqCY9cw)
Satsuma Collot, which is planted near Ichangensis x Sinensis shows no damage of late night freezes.
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Interesting difference in hardiness between Ichangensis x Sinensis ( I x S), due to rootstock and sun exposition
(https://i.postimg.cc/nC1s2fpS/IMG-20230410-153219381.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/nC1s2fpS)
Small I x S graft on PT, which saw - 8 ° C under passive protection and from March on without protection nightfreezes with daysun. Absolut no damage 8).
The plants beside are star ruby seedlings, more frost hardy tjan I thought.
(https://i.postimg.cc/HjwjW1cW/IMG-20230410-153304535.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/HjwjW1cW)
I x S, on unknown rootstock, with passive protection until March and heater when temps. fallen under -7 ° C.
In March nearly no damage, after no protection in March with night freezes and daysun got a lot of damage at small twigs with deadly bark cracks.
Difference to small I x S, no Poncirus rootstock and morning sun about 1 h earlier and longer sun in the afternoon.
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Well My zone 7 experiment failed. Arctic Frost, Orange Frost, and Bumper all succumbed to this years winter. I thought they could male it unprotected but alas they are dead to the roots.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/Rqd4L03X/PXL-20230411-212100588.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Rqd4L03X)
Bishop Citrandarin, possible progeny of 852 Citrandarin. This tree is grafted onto Poncirus and has only been field planted since last Summer. The tree was exposed to prolonged to 2°F temperatures accompanied by high winds. The tree exhibits obvious damage, but appears to be recovering. The original tree was planted and fruited by Hardy Vermont.
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Well My zone 7 experiment failed. Arctic Frost, Orange Frost, and Bumper all succumbed to this years winter. I thought they could male it unprotected but alas they are dead to the roots.
Oh that s a pity, but I wouldn' t say failed, the first try failed ;), there are still a lot of varieties worth for a try in zone 7, though not all have very good fruits. But I think Prag Citsuma, and Carolina lime from Stan Mc Kenzie nurseries should be very frosthardy and have good fruits.
My Prag Citsuma survived very good 3 winters down to -16 ° C. The only protection was a frost cloth, espeacially for night frosts with day sun in spring.
Have good luck.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/Rqd4L03X/PXL-20230411-212100588.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Rqd4L03X)
Bishop Citrandarin, possible progeny of 852 Citrandarin. This tree is grafted onto Poncirus and has only been field planted since last Summer. The tree was exposed to prolonged to 2°F temperatures accompanied by high winds. The tree exhibits obvious damage, but appears to be recovering. The original tree was planted and fruited by Hardy Vermont.
That sounds very hardy, even for the not so big plant. Did you already taste the fruits ?
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I received fruits and tasted them. My grafted plants haven't fruited yet, but should within a year or two.
(https://i.postimg.cc/1fNtndnn/PXL-20230414-124958815.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/1fNtndnn)
Bishop has indeed survived.
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I thought my Bishop citandarin was dead. But yesterday I saw two tiny green leaves. Impressive here in central Kansas. Zone 6. Trunk and branches don't look good. It might still die. But still impressive.
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Well My zone 7 experiment failed. Arctic Frost, Orange Frost, and Bumper all succumbed to this years winter. I thought they could male it unprotected but alas they are dead to the roots.
Oh that s a pity, but I wouldn' t say failed, the first try failed ;), there are still a lot of varieties worth for a try in zone 7, though not all have very good fruits. But I think Prag Citsuma, and Carolina lime from Stan Mc Kenzie nurseries should be very frosthardy and have good fruits.
My Prag Citsuma survived very good 3 winters down to -16 ° C. The only protection was a frost cloth, espeacially for night frosts with day sun in spring.
Have good luck.
Has anyone ever clarified what Carolina Lime is? Other than it appears to have poncirus ancestry.
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Has anyone ever clarified what Carolina Lime is? Other than it appears to have poncirus ancestry.
Very good liime substitue from what ive gathered tho iive yet to try it
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/dVf37w9fk1A
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Carolina Lime is an unknown seedling that came to Stan Mckenzie from Bernhard Voss. It was probably the original seedling and Stan now has the mother plant. But the parentage remains a mystery.
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Cold Hardiness results, low of 9F. -13C:
Dead
Bloomsweet High grafted and some poncirus growth allowed below.
Juanita
Brown Select
US 119
A lot of damage
Keraji, one larger tree dead. Another will recover
Curafora
10 Degree 3-3
In better shape, minimal or no damage
10 Degree 2-2
CiClem 10
Ventura Lemondarin
Morton
Swingle
Bishop 852
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Cold Hardiness results, low of 9F. -13C:
Dead
Bloomsweet High grafted and some poncirus growth allowed below.
Juanita
Brown Select
US 119
A lot of damage
Keraji, one larger tree dead. Another will recover
Curafora
10 Degree 3-3
In better shape, minimal or no damage
10 Degree 2-2
CiClem 10
Ventura Lemondarin
Morton
Swingle
Bishop 852
Very interesting your experience this winter.
Have your trees been protected ?
Also interesting, because most results are according to my experience, only Keraji and Bloomsweet differ.
We also had a low of 9° F, -13° C, but my Keraji and Bloomsweet graft survived without damage. But perhaps you had more consecutive frost day and no frost cloth.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I always find this helpful for relative frost hardiness comparison.
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None of the trees described here were protected except US 119.
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I received fruits and tasted them. My grafted plants haven't fruited yet, but should within a year or two.
(https://i.postimg.cc/1fNtndnn/PXL-20230414-124958815.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/1fNtndnn)
Bishop has indeed survived.
Is anything known about the parents of this cross anf if it is also spread in Europe - would be worthfull here too ;)
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It's believed to be a seedling of US 852, perhaps by self pollination. 852 is a hybrid of Changsha mandarin and Poncirus trifoliata. Changsha is among the hardiest edible Citrus types.
(https://i.postimg.cc/nsMBwgsR/PXL-20230414-222723829.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/nsMBwgsR)
This is a slightly more recent photo showing newly emerged buds.
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thanks Kumin :)
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This year some of my inground citrus shows small progresses but at least for me a great pleasure ;).
(https://i.postimg.cc/2bDj2CC1/1050557.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2bDj2CC1)
after 3 years in ground Sanford Curafora shows first flower buds
(https://i.postimg.cc/WtsbZp9K/1050582.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WtsbZp9K)
last years graft of Nippon Orangequat on Sanford Curafora survived just over graft unit
(https://i.postimg.cc/sv16HS6h/1050583.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/sv16HS6h)
Also one year old Keraji graft on Sanford Curafora with nearly no problems
(https://i.postimg.cc/CdJMsyXK/1050564.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/CdJMsyXK)
Citsuma Prag also starts to build flower buds the second year, though the plant is still small and slow growing after 3 years in ground ::)
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZCMTX8Tt/1050569-0.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ZCMTX8Tt)
Citrumelo x Yuzu for the first time with flower buds, seems to be very cold hardy up to now
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Final results after this winter
From 3 now 2 year old N1 tri Voss seedlings finaly this one survived (in March it still seemed to have at least two survivors), they took passiv fleece protected -11 °C
(https://i.postimg.cc/dhMNXxLW/IMG-20230505-104947236.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dhMNXxLW)
from other 2 year old seedlings one Meyer lemon, star ruby Grapefruit and one Ichangstar 60 died, they took as lowest -8 ° C in their passive fleece protected area.
Survivors two Ichangstar 60, two star rubys and a young graft I x S on flying dragon
(https://i.postimg.cc/bD6FBYtb/IMG-20230505-105149712.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bD6FBYtb)
My I x S, now 3 winter protected and heating under -7 ° C, looks very bad with a lot of bark cracks from several night frosts with day sun and to early opening of fleece. But I think I will replant this plant or replant it to waste >:(.
(https://i.postimg.cc/YvWKLFmP/IMG-20230505-105324439.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/YvWKLFmP)
The last problem plant is my Ivia - without protection in winter it showed good shape in march and now it seems to have a trunk disease. I already took a graft, because I don' t know if it will survive ?
(https://i.postimg.cc/sBGFShQ8/IMG-20230505-105351546.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/sBGFShQ8)
(https://i.postimg.cc/bdBB0J8f/IMG-20230505-105401221.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bdBB0J8f)
Other Plants in ground have done very well, also new ones as Clemyuz22, from planting last summer.
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are these IchangStar60, seedlings or grafted ones?
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These are seedlings. The grafted ones are still in pot.
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Did all the seedlings survive or did some freeze to death?
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I had some Ichangstar60 seedlings, most of them died but about 3 or 4 are coming back from the roots after 4 days below freezing and a low of 9F.
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Did all the seedlings survive or did some freeze to death?
From 3 Ichangstar 60 seedlings did 2 survive. But lowest temperature was only -8. But I think more severe have been several late frosts with daysun
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I had some Ichangstar60 seedlings, most of them died but about 3 or 4 are coming back from the roots after 4 days below freezing and a low of 9F.
That sounds good, frost hardiness also should get a little better with age and size.
I have a 2 year grafted ichangstar 60 on PT which gets in ground the bext days. Im very excited how hardy it will be compared to my other in ground citrus hybrids.
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I had some Ichangstar60 seedlings, most of them died but about 3 or 4 are coming back from the roots after 4 days below freezing and a low of 9F.
That sounds good, frost hardiness also should get a little better with age and size.
I have a 2 year grafted ichangstar 60 on PT which gets in ground the bext days. Im very excited how hardy it will be compared to my other in ground citrus hybrids.
Yep. This time I'm going to let them grow out and gain some size so they won't die again back 2 back years and die completely. Excited to see how it compares to other zygotic seedlings in the same pot.
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Which zygotic seedlings do you still raise in your pot ?
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I just tossed some Ichangstar60 and N1tri seeds in a pot. So I don't know if its either Ichangstar60 or N1tri, but I'm leaning towards Ichangstar60
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After 2 and 3 years in ground most of my hardy citrus gets flowers here
HRS899a
(https://i.postimg.cc/1nJBsnQc/1050740.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/1nJBsnQc)
Yuzu x Citrumelo
(https://i.postimg.cc/PPc6Cw8S/1050746.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PPc6Cw8S)
Chimera Prag
(https://i.postimg.cc/gwb65Yfz/1050747.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gwb65Yfz)
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First flowers of Sanford Curafora, planted in ground in 2020
(https://i.postimg.cc/HnXXJkCC/Sanford-Curafora-erste-Bluete-IMG-20230526-203339660.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ZvYC2ZRf)
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Keraji after 3 years in ground with first flowers
(https://i.postimg.cc/Hctxwnfd/IMG-20230602-153944496.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Hctxwnfd)
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With your tree flowering in June what time will the fruit be ready to harvest?
Mike Adams
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thats a good question ? While it' s the first time flowers in ground I think I have to harvest in December, depending of first deeper freezes. May be it will not be the sweetest Keraji ;D.
If interested, I can report ;). I have also flowering Satsuma Collot at the moment with first flowers, also in ground, so this will be an interesting comparison.
Regards Frank
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Yes keep us posted.
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I will do so, today about 40% of my Sanford Curafora fruitlets cut of in the hope of better and earlier ripe fruits ;)
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thats a good question ? While it' s the first time flowers in ground I think I have to harvest in December, depending of first deeper freezes. May be it will not be the sweetest Keraji ;D.
I've heard that Keraji is also still useful when unripe and used as lime.
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Yes I think this also is possible.
From my other Keraji, in ground but in greenhouse,
I harvested fruit already End of December and the
taste was already good. So in ground out of greenhouse the fruits I suppose will be a little bit later ripe, but before big freezes normally only End of Dec or January in our region, also in ground I expect good fruits, perhaps as you assume not fully sweet but already very useful.
So up to now for me Keraji is one of the best coldhardy citrus regarding cold hardiness and fruit taste !
tedburn » 27 Déc 2021, 15:49
Aujourd ' hui grande recolte :lol: , l' un et seul fruit de mon première greffe, un citrus keraji.
Le goût de fruit je trouvais bon. Bon le fruit un peut petit
avec 4 cm de diametre, mais je crois que c' est normal pour keraji
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My Sunford Curafora grows nice and has some fruits. Also grafts of Keraji, Nippon Orangequat and new Silverhill, on top, growing well. New graft of Clemyuz22 has been added today.
(https://i.postimg.cc/k2Xk14m2/IMG-20230629-184133334.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/k2Xk14m2)
First fruit of Yuzu x Citrumelo still growing, hope to test the fruit in autumn.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Ny8CQvY3/IMG-20230629-183802514.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Ny8CQvY3)
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Yuzu X Citrumelo looks like a very interesting cross. Please update us on the taste when it reaches maturity. That seems like a very probable hardy lemon like fruit...
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Yes sure, if i get it to maturity I will report ;)
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From 5 blooming citrus in ground keraji and HRS899a lost their fruitlets.
Sanford Curafora, Satsuma Collot and Yuzu x Citrumelo keep their fruits, at least one ;).
As Yuzu x Citrumelo in the picture grows nice
(https://i.postimg.cc/231Zbsbr/IMG-20230722-164821093.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/231Zbsbr)
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This summer 3 new citrus hybrids planted in ground for winter hardiness test.
On the picture in front a graft of Ichang lemon on Dunstan citrumelo.
Behind FA5 and at an other Place I planted two year old graft of Ichangstar 60 on PT.
(https://i.postimg.cc/1gsQMyGX/IMG-20230809-092834585.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/1gsQMyGX)
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Short fruitupdate of two inground citrusplants
Satsuma Collot with first two fruits, curious to month of ripeness
and taste, shall be a variety of Owari
(https://i.postimg.cc/cKvt5cYz/1060155.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/cKvt5cYz)
(https://i.postimg.cc/phGWbNHY/1060156.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/phGWbNHY)
Yuzu x Citrumelo is good growing, 6 cm diameter now
(https://i.postimg.cc/jWdfTbfL/IMG-20230816-142323505.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/jWdfTbfL)
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Yuzu x Citrumelo,
now nearly about 7 cm in diameter, curious to the ripe fruit but
guess this will still need another 2 to 3 months.
But as citrus nerds we are used to wait ;)
(https://i.postimg.cc/rKT7Jr7P/IMG-20230925-180932713.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rKT7Jr7P)
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Seedling of Nippon Orangequat, 10 months old, shows extremly leathery leaves.
Will plant him in ground next spring, hope that this is also a sign of cold hardiness ?
Does everyone know if there is a correlation between leathery leaves and cold hardiness ?
(https://i.postimg.cc/CB37v7K8/IMG-20231010-110932259.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/CB37v7K8)
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Fruits of inground citrus making good progress to maturity,
current weather forecast sees no bigger freezes the next weeks,
so maturity can go on.
(https://i.postimg.cc/3yRYvXDH/IMG-20231025-171834430.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3yRYvXDH)
Yuzu x Citrumelo slowly getting yellow. It' s the first fruit so I have no expirience when to pick, but I guess
mid November to mid December should be fine
(https://i.postimg.cc/yWS6jyp1/IMG-20231025-171855818.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/yWS6jyp1)
Sanford Curafora growing good and looks nice, but I think before bigger freezes in January or Februarywill come, I will have to pick them. One fruit - test pick 3 weeks ago - already made a good tasty refreshing drink.
(https://i.postimg.cc/TLNyb2Pt/IMG-20231025-171920007.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/TLNyb2Pt)
Satsuma Collot (clone of Owari), two first fruits, look good, size gets acceptable, but still will wait to pick. As I have read best time to pick for Owari should be about December to January.
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Finally, ;D, after 4 years in ground I could eat my first delicious
inground citrus fruit, Sanford Curafora, though the fruit got split it was good to eat.
Mild grapefruit and mandarin taste, very juicy.
Always thought it s only ripe and tasty in March or April, but that s not the case, inground
it get s ripe November to December :P.
(https://i.postimg.cc/WFXYbTf2/IMG-20231027-115911200.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WFXYbTf2)
(https://i.postimg.cc/62k2ZGPz/IMG-20231027-120157564.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/62k2ZGPz)
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Mild grapefruit and mandarin taste, very juicy.
Congratulations! Very interesting.
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Thank you Boris :), in the next few weeks ( depending on freezes), I will still harvest my first fruit/s of Yuzu x Citrumelo, Satsuma Collot and further fruits of Sanford Curafora and taste them.
A tastetest update will follow then ;).
What s about your climate, should be very good for Citrus in ground ?
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I live in Feodosia. The city is open to the north winds. Winters here are quite cold for citrus. Almost always in winter there are several nights with -10 ... -12°C, once in several years it can be -15°C, once in ten years it can be up to -18°C, and once in thirty years it can be colder than -20°C. I have been growing keraji, changsha, Rusk, Margarita for two years in the ground, but I hide them. Keraji is now giving the first harvest. Changsha and Rusk are not bearing fruit yet. This year, fresh grafts of Morton, US-119, citrandarin FA-5 will be wintered.
-
My coldest temps drop to -31C
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What kind of protection do you give your citrus in Feodosia?
Mike Adams
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A box made of 1×1 meter styrofoam panels. The thickness is 50 mm. The top cover is usually slightly open and completely closed only during frost.
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Thank you. Any Christmas lights or heating source?
Mike Adams
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Hello Boris,
very interesting your Infos to your climate and your plants.
I' m astonished that it gets quite cold at
the shores on thf black see.
@ Poncirusguy, with your deep winter temperatures it is really a hard work
to bring citrus over the winter - respect !.
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Sorry for not responding for a while. There was no access to the forum from my region.
There was no heating last winter. There were only 3-4 bottles of 10 liters of water.
I found some September photos of my Keraji on my phone.:
(https://i.postimg.cc/s1rbHScF/IMG-20230915-173747.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/s1rbHScF)
(https://i.postimg.cc/DJdp3jc9/IMG-20230915-173803.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/DJdp3jc9)
(https://i.postimg.cc/r0LZbX5G/IMG-20230915-173814.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/r0LZbX5G)
Now the fruits look twice as large and some are already changing color.
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Yes, I think Keraji is a good Citrusvariety for colder regions. Mine flowered this year after 4 years in ground, but kept no fruits :-\ but she grows very fast, 2m high now.. Hope for next year.
But Keraji has late, but really delicious fruits.
Enjoy your harvest ;).
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What I didn't like about Keraji is that it vegetates for quite a long time. Nearby growing Changsha and Rusk stopped growing in August-September, while Keraji is still trying to push the buds that I break out (autumn is warm this year).
Here are today's photos of fruits:
(https://i.postimg.cc/68rmDRzT/IMG-20231116-080334.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/68rmDRzT) (https://i.postimg.cc/rKtbN7r1/IMG-20231116-080344.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rKtbN7r1) (https://i.postimg.cc/p9P6xT1C/IMG-20231116-081920.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/p9P6xT1C)
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Nice pictures of your Keraji 👍.
Yes Keraji is long and vigorous growing but it seems not really a problem
for frosthardiness.
Here a comparison of size from my Sanford F2 Curafora in ground with a
Clementine of Scilia (from pot, weight of 53 g ).
(https://i.postimg.cc/FkLZ9CLr/20231118-103006.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/FkLZ9CLr)
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My Owari Satsuma I planted this past spring. It flowered in May. This fruit started to develop in early June. I am protecting it with christmas lights, plastic, and styrofoam. I plan to pick it as late as Christmas if I can.
(https://i.postimg.cc/XpGzd9Sw/owari-sat.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XpGzd9Sw)
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Looks promising your Owari Satsuma.
We have now announced colder weather with freeze by night.
So I have harvested some fruits of my inground citrus
for trying to let them ripen still some weeks indoor,
while letting other fruits of this plants outdoor to compare
maturity and resistance of the fruits to freezes.
In the picture the upper 3 fruits are from inground citrus (ausgepflanzt),
others from pots (Topf).
(https://i.postimg.cc/9r22ZSHf/20231122-143409.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/9r22ZSHf)
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Hmm. So that the persimmon ripens faster, I put it in a bag with apples. It ripens in 5 days at room temperature. It seems that citrus fruits are also treated with ethylene to accelerate maturation. You can experiment with apples.
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No, citrus fruits are not climacteric, they do not depend on the presence of ethylene for maturation.
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I see. So it won't work.
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;D 8), 3,5 years now after planting my frosthardy citrus
I could this year now harvest first fruits from my inground
Citrus in zone 7, only passiv protected, exception Satsuma Collot
which I protected with heater below -7 ° C.
(https://i.postimg.cc/JtWJC86B/20231202-153734.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/JtWJC86B)
The 3 varieties, Yuzu x Citrumelo, Satsuma Collot and Sanford F2 Curafora
(https://i.postimg.cc/LJr5kkGZ/20231202-154031.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/LJr5kkGZ)
(https://i.postimg.cc/0rf6gwKL/20231202-154336.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/0rf6gwKL)
Yuzu x Citrumelo, nearly 40 seeds in the fruit.
Taste of the rind lemony now when ripe. Flesh medium juicy, taste lemon grapefruit mix, light bitterness, but
but not with any aftertaste. Overall not bad for a very frosthardy
Citrushybrid and a good hybrid for further breeding.
(https://i.postimg.cc/pm9ynccH/20231202-162150.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/pm9ynccH)
Sanford F2 Curafora, after the harvest this year, with nearly ripe
fruits End of November, now for me one of the best frosthardy citrus hybrids.
Taste, mandarin grapefruit taste, very juicy, about 10 seeds per fruit.
(https://i.postimg.cc/qzvNpv8g/Satsuma-Collot-20231125-193711.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/qzvNpv8g)
Satsuma Collot, very good taste, sweet, nearly no acid. Astonished that already mid/ end of November
fruits are very delicious.
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cold protection here
(https://i.postimg.cc/KkVY1fNw/IMG-3101-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/KkVY1fNw)
Left side of greenhouse.
(https://i.postimg.cc/LqWSDX1Z/IMG-3102-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/LqWSDX1Z)
Right side of GH
Greenhouse is 4 layers of glass thick.
(https://i.postimg.cc/nM48jT0m/Fukushu-kumquat.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/nM48jT0m)
9 year old Fukushu left out of green house for failure to fruit. 9 feet tall 5 foot diameter heavily branched.
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Poor Fukushu haha. I see fruit on it though?
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Just a few and that is about 1/3 of it's total production. I get the same volume of one "cutie" mandarin. My lemon tree of the same size produced 74 lemons in 1 year for a total weight of 60 pounds.
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Is he on his own roots? Perhaps a good kumquat can be grafted on it?
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Finally, ;D, after 4 years in ground I could eat my first delicious
inground citrus fruit, Sanford Curafora, though the fruit got split it was good to eat.
Mild grapefruit and mandarin taste, very juicy.
Always thought it s only ripe and tasty in March or April, but that s not the case, inground
it get s ripe November to December :P.
(https://i.postimg.cc/WFXYbTf2/IMG-20231027-115911200.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WFXYbTf2)
(https://i.postimg.cc/62k2ZGPz/IMG-20231027-120157564.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/62k2ZGPz)
Wow, congratulations! After so many years of hard work, must be quite an accomplishment.
Out of curiosity, do you still protect your 3 year old trees over winter? I note the brick protection around your trees in the older photoes, do those actually keep the temperature around the tree warmer or is it mostly used to keep a fleece/PVC sheet around?
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Thank you, yes first flowers of citrus in ground, challenging climate, and long time waiting is really great and satisfying :D.
Concerning your question, primarily I use now that the plants are bigger the bricks, especially ones with the shape of a " U", for fixing 4 bamboo sticks to have a framework for fixing the fleece with clamps. So winter protection gets quickly installed. For smaller plants I put the bricks with U form directly together and I think this still brings minimal thermal advantage. For the older/ bigger plants the fleece shall bring a small shorttime isolation and an other very important reason of the fleece is sun protection after very cold freezy nights which we often get between February and May.
Wish you good luck with your citrus and attention, citrus can get
a madness ;).
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This summer I tried my first crossings, but only one seems to be successful,
Cross of Yuzu x Citrumelo with Bloomsweet.
The first seedlings show interesting leave shapes, hope this is an indicator for a
succesful cross :D.
(https://i.postimg.cc/MX4T1tRh/20240105-162230.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/MX4T1tRh)
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This summer I tried my first crossings, but only one seems to be successful,
Cross of Yuzu x Citrumelo with Bloomsweet.
The first seedlings show interesting leave shapes, hope this is an indicator for a
succesful cross :D.
That's a cool cross. Will be interesting to see the leaves develop as they grow a little bigger.
Can't wait until I can make my own crosses.
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Hi Peep, yes I also be curious to see the differences if the seedlings are grown more in spring/ summer.
I can fully understand your unpatience to make crossings.
But citrus craziness goes like this - first have a few nice plants with flowers and fruits , second collecting more interesting varieties and try/ learn to graft. Third enjoy all that but thinking the frosthardy plant should have better fruits and try/ do crossing - and the citrus crazyness still takes even more times with always great pleasure .
Also in our climate with citrus in ground and citrus in pots you never get bored.
But fourth step is to fight against the problem of not enough space in greenhouse and garden ;).
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Seedlings generation 23/24,
all are frosthardy variants with the expectation to
find good seedlings/ plants with better
characteristics than the motherplants, concerning
frosthardiness and/or fruittaste.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vcYhG06r/20240117-193700.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vcYhG06r)
All current seedlings, with the exception of clemenules, from own plants
some surely open pollinated while standing all together.
From 1 row to 2 row and left to right:
5* Citrumelo, Sanford Curafora, Kinga, Kinga
Clemenules, Kinga, YuzuxCitrumello x Bloomsweet
Kinga= Unknown parentage, very frosthardy and better fruits than Poncirus,
acidic, no poncirus aftertaste and very low bitternes
(https://i.postimg.cc/LhRBVxDc/20240117-165925.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/LhRBVxDc)
YuzuxCitrumello x Bloomsweet, show good development
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After more than 10 days freeze down to 14°F or -10 ° C and now 3 days very mild weather I inspected my
inground Citrus.
The following 3 pictures show the current status.
(https://i.postimg.cc/N2cY9jjd/20240124-160730.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/N2cY9jjd)
1 year old seedling in pots have been in wintertest, only with fleece protection.
Surprising on right side of picture, Valentine - and Chandler x Bloomseet seedlings with nearly no visible damage.
While 5* citrumelo seedlings, on left side, have burnt tips.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vxbF820j/20240124-112449.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vxbF820j)
Positive surprise, Citrangerin, unprotected in first winter with no damage
(https://i.postimg.cc/HcG1RkXT/20240124-160609.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/HcG1RkXT)
Positive on left side Bigraft Bloomsweet and Staraji55 under fleeceprotection no damage, in 2. winter.
On right side Slava Micurina with burnt new twigs is deceiving concerning hardiness.
Now hoping that February don' t brings still harder freezes ;)
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Today I opened the fleece protections of my inground citrus.
The next day s no freeze in sight, so hopefully the coldest time is behind us
Up to no no real harm to the citrus, some minor leaf damage and
some spoiled late sommer twigs.
(https://i.postimg.cc/YvpvsNZJ/20240208-103517.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/YvpvsNZJ)
HRS 899a looks fresh and good, last year first blooms - now 2024
hopefully also fruits
(https://i.postimg.cc/mtSDCzkV/20240208-103604.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mtSDCzkV)
Chimera Prag leaves seem partially spoiled, twigs look good
(https://i.postimg.cc/bSJ6g28b/20240208-112710.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bSJ6g28b)
Big surprise is last Sanford Curafora fruit, I left it for freeze test.
Seems to have a good cold hardiness, temperatures in fleece
have been Tmin - 7 or -8 ° C.
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First freeze test this winter with about -8 °C outside in pots under fleece,
one year old seedlings of a cross Chandler pomelo x Bloomsweet grapefruit.
Some look bad but some look very good and seem to have a
quite good cold resistance.
(https://i.postimg.cc/WtDFGcCm/1060368.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WtDFGcCm)
(https://i.postimg.cc/47x8LxVx/1060372.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/47x8LxVx)
-
A little bit surprising to see a bifoliate seedling in this cross.
-
A little bit surprising to see a bifoliate seedling in this cross.
Do you think that is necessarily more than mere juvenility? I am personally never sure how to judge whether it's young seedlings being weird, or a meaningful difference in morphology, when I see such unexpected leaves, but you have a good deal more experience with such things!
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I also discocered one such bifoliate seedling in a pot of one year old
Valentine pomelo seedlings in the greenhouse.
In spring I will plant them and the Chandler x Bloomsweet in
open ground and see the next winter ( with good passive protection
what will happen.6
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I have an ichangensis seedling that showed this bifoliate pattern on a single leaf.
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A few weeks of mild temperatures after the freezedays
in January down to - 10 ° C most of the inground citrus
took the freeze very good. My worst/ weakest are:
Slave micurina in the back on the right side.
The others are pretty good.
Left in back Bloomsweet, in front of it Duncan Grapefruit and
in front left Nippon Orangequat.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Q9VThJJJ/20240301-101300.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Q9VThJJJ)
The weakest of my inground citrus is Ichangensis x sinensis.
even a bark crack see in 2. picture
(https://i.postimg.cc/nC9Gvp7G/20240301-101853.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/nC9Gvp7G)
(https://i.postimg.cc/QBfT2y1M/20240301-101906.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/QBfT2y1M)
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Here all the 1 year old seedlings which have seen several freeze days and -8 ° C ,
(pictures of Chandler x Bloomsweet I already posted here) now winter damages shows
from dead/heavy damage (N1 tri Voss) to nearly no damage (Citrumelo N82).
Chandler x Bloomsweet now also shows more damage, but slso some still look quite good
as a positive surprise.
Also very interesting how different the frost hardiness within
one variety.
Because the stickers can' t be red, here the varieties
from left (worst) to right (best):
N1 tri Voss, 5* Citrumelo, Yuzu, Chandler x Bloomsweet, Citrumelo N82
(https://i.postimg.cc/Vd9K9kD2/20240307-172430.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Vd9K9kD2)
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A few weeks of mild temperatures after the freezedays
in January down to - 10 ° C most of the inground citrus
took the freeze very good. My worst/ weakest are:
Slave micurina in the back on the right side.
What is slave micurina?
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Slava Michurina (transl. the glory of Michurin) is supposedly a chimera between an orange and poncirus, along the lines of a Prague Citsuma. However, many here in the Forum report that most of the poncirus traits in the chimerism are lost. It's hardiness is questionable at this point.
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Hello Bussone and Nemaja.
@ Nemaja, thanks for the explanation.
@ Bussone, yes Slava micurina was reported to be cold tolerant more than
-10 degrees ° C , but as seen in my picture, at the same location im my gardean
nearby planted Bloomsweet and Duncan Grapefruit show no freeze
damage, while slava shows. So I guess slav is not much more hardy
than already pretty hardy Navel oranges.
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Hello Bussone and Nemaja.
@ Nemaja, thanks for the explanation.
@ Bussone, yes Slava micurina was reported to be cold tolerant more than
-10 degrees ° C , but as seen in my picture, at the same location im my gardean
nearby planted Bloomsweet and Duncan Grapefruit show no freeze
damage, while slava shows. So I guess slav is not much more hardy
than already pretty hardy Navel oranges.
Ilya reported it did okay -- better than Thomasville/worse than Morton -- a few years back.
https://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=27950.0
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Yes, that' s an interesting report from Ilya and very informative.
But winterhardiness is often very different due to multiple
influences as rootstock, plant age, dormancy,location,....
In the first pictures you see left Bloomsweet with no damage and right
Slava Micurina with some leave damage of small twigs, otherwise
Slava is also O.K.
Good example for influence of only different locations and Rootstock of the same variety in
picture 2 and 3.
Picture 2 Dunstan with late morning sun - very healthy. Rootstock Flying Dragon
Picture3 Dunstan with early morning sun - some spolled twigs. Rootstock Poncirus
(https://i.postimg.cc/k2k6FDm8/20240309-102247.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/k2k6FDm8)
(https://i.postimg.cc/0Mt9nHw3/20240309-093102.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/0Mt9nHw3)
(https://i.postimg.cc/SY2brQq2/20240309-093304.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/SY2brQq2)
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Here the positive surprises of my varieties which managed
the winter very good, conditions this winter I already
described in the previous posts.
Dimicelli grafted in 2023, very thin graft survived and brings new groth
(https://i.postimg.cc/RqBBksKJ/20240401-182115.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/RqBBksKJ)
Staraji55, second winter with new groth, no damage at all
(https://i.postimg.cc/R61jCmK6/20240401-182329.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/R61jCmK6)
Nippon Orangequat first winter, shows new groth
(https://i.postimg.cc/mhRvXcWQ/20240401-182410.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mhRvXcWQ)
Satsuma Silverhill,right, and Clemyuz 22 small graft left, both grafts of
2023 on Sanford Curafora no damage at all and with new groth
(https://i.postimg.cc/p523pSJ0/20240401-182451.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/p523pSJ0)
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In 2023 a lot of new varieties have been grafted or planted in ground.
Two of them are interesting concerning frosthardiness and
better fruit quality ( hopefully ;)).
Ichangstar60, grafted in 2021, planted in ground 2023,
no winter damage and now flowerbuds
(https://i.postimg.cc/qNxyVsyc/20240415-124830.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/qNxyVsyc)
Trifolis, grafted in 2023 on inground Poncirus,
young graft with no damage in winter and
and now starting to grow
(https://i.postimg.cc/3yWRSmBx/20240415-125837.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3yWRSmBx)
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What is trifolis?
-
Madison lists a Citrangequat 10-3-4:
https://madisoncitrusnursery.com/products/citrangequat-hybrid-10-3-4-tree-for-sale?_pos=1&_sid=ede917b52&_ss=r
Anyone know what this is or what it's hardiness is like?
-
don't know, but I bought one to test out in zone 8a.
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What is trifolis?
Trifolis is a Citrumelovariety which is said to have better fruit and
and a very good coldhardiness.
Citrangequat 10-3-4 is as far as I know not available in Europe, at least not under
that name.
We have this, perhaps similar variety:
https://agrumilenzi.it/en/negozio/citrusen/lemons/citrange-quat-4-season-fortunella-margarita-x-poncirus-trifoliata-x-citrus-sinensis/