Author Topic: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial  (Read 88348 times)

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #575 on: November 03, 2023, 06:57:57 PM »
Thanks, Ilya, next Spring I hope to use 5* as a female parent in crosses. I actually do have a number of 5* fruit resulting from crosses with Bishop Citrandarin and Conestoga 010 pollen.

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #576 on: November 12, 2023, 04:38:38 PM »
Photos of several Meyer lemon X Conestoga 026 seedlings changing leaf colors as colder weather approaches. Some of these seedlings are trifoliate, others exhibit monofoliate, bifoliate as well as mixed leaf types.






kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #577 on: November 13, 2023, 08:57:18 PM »
F seedlings from C-35 Citrange. These are self-pollinated Conestoga 010 seedlings showing mixed leaf types, including trifoliate, bifoliate and monofoliate.  It appears that unlike Conestoga 026, Conestoga 010 may have a percentage of zygotic seedlings.






« Last Edit: November 13, 2023, 09:12:32 PM by kumin »

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #578 on: November 13, 2023, 09:02:29 PM »
l
« Last Edit: February 11, 2024, 04:47:06 AM by kumin »

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #579 on: November 22, 2023, 05:01:33 PM »
Fruit of the unidentified tree that's either a Nucellar C-35 seedling, or an F seedling of C-35. These are the largest fruits of any of my selections. Approximately 30% were seedless, with an average of 6 seeds per fruit. The Brix reading was only 9.5. However, the fruits are very juicy, yielding 24 oz of juice per 12 fruits. There was practically no wax inside, unlike 5* Citrumelo.5* Citrumelo had noticeable wax, but was sweeter than these fruits.

These are the first fruits on a 5 year old seedling. I'll be propagating some of these in the Spring and will also do a test for Zygotic embryony in early Spring.






 5* rinds have slightly lower juice content due to thicker rinds and internal membranes. :blank:

s.



The spent Citrange rinds are empty with no wax accumulation on the juicer cone.


« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 05:21:57 PM by kumin »

Peep

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #580 on: November 22, 2023, 05:13:41 PM »
From the pictures they look like quite high quality fruit!

Mulberry0126

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #581 on: November 30, 2023, 08:10:38 AM »
Only one of the seedlings has fruited at this point, although 2 additional trees have begun to flower for the first time. This particular fruit has acid flavors in addition to hints of Grapefruit taste. There are no grapefruit genetics involved, the faint bitterness likely came from the Poncirus parentage. The fruits are rather seedy, very thin rinded, subsequently will not keep for long periods.
Ripening is early as Poncirus. The tree is completely deciduous and has been acceptably hardy here in zone 6b.

Fruit with seeds removed.


The juice has an orange color.


Diluted to 30% juice/70%  water and sweetened it makes a desirable beverage.


Awesome project! Having a poncirus hybrid fully hardy to zone 6 is quite a feat! I'm also interested in what the fruit from Conestoga 058 will be like and if it will be hardy to zones 7-8.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2023, 08:17:51 AM by Mulberry0126 »

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #582 on: November 30, 2023, 08:33:25 AM »
058 is less hardy than the unnamed tree with large fruit. 067 is somewhat like 058 in appearance, but hardier. 067 survived outdoors last Winter at 2F in very windy conditions. Neither of the two have fruited at this point, but I anticipate flowering within a year or two.

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #583 on: November 30, 2023, 01:44:45 PM »

Variation in cold sensitivity among Bishop Citrandarin seedlings



Grafted Conestoga 011, 010, 006 and 001 Segentranges have built up some caliper. A number of these flowered late in the Summer and should fruit next year.


US 1279 Fruits struggle to attain size and color this late in the season.
 
« Last Edit: November 30, 2023, 01:46:21 PM by kumin »

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #584 on: December 05, 2023, 04:28:48 PM »


Solar shelter used for overwintering potted citrus, even Poncirus is vulnerable in pots. There's just a bit shy of 2,000 gallons of water in this enclosure. Auxillary heat is available to prevent the water in the barrels from freezing and splitting. There should be minimal, if any heat needed above 10F outside temperature. The enclosure measures 12' x 24'. The barrels and walkway take up a considerable amount of space

Millet

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #585 on: December 05, 2023, 04:57:41 PM »
Kumin, I have the same type of water set up in my greenhouse as you have.  In my greenhouse, I have 100 X  55-gallon drums full of water, the free heat that they release into the greenhouse every night is measurable.   I also use them as benches for my container plants, witch grow amazingly will with the bottom heat. During the winter nights the water temperature in each barrel normally drop 3 or 4 degrees F, thus giving off 1,344 Btu each night per barrel  (134,400 free BTU per 100 barrels each night).
« Last Edit: December 06, 2023, 12:27:14 PM by Millet »

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #586 on: December 05, 2023, 06:05:58 PM »
Interesting Millet, what are the dimensions of your enclosure? Mine has 5 gallons of water per square foot of glazing. Greater insulation value would be beneficial for mine; such as ground perimeter rigid foam board and rolling insulated curtains on the roof glazing. My previous Solar greenhouses never got ice inside except for the roof surface. This one may need a bit of supplemental heat.

« Last Edit: December 23, 2023, 12:29:29 PM by kumin »

poncirsguy

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #587 on: December 05, 2023, 09:13:07 PM »
My setup has,  for good insulation 4 layers of glass.




« Last Edit: December 06, 2023, 11:47:53 PM by poncirsguy »

caladri

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #588 on: December 06, 2023, 01:37:48 AM »
I have a wall of 8 IBCs full (well, mostly full) of water in my greenhouse for similar purposes. Unfortunately, it's of diminished effect in our climate because there isn't that much insolation to heat 'em up. They do make great benches when stacked one high, but unfortunately the horizontal space usage is too inefficient for me compared to shelves, for the moment, so all but one pair are stacked two high. Over the summer, with a lot more (too much!) sun, their overnight output was a pretty steady 1.75kW on average (just about 6kBTU/h), if I did my math right. I envy Millet's setup!

bussone

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #589 on: December 06, 2023, 11:20:26 AM »


Solar shelter used for overwintering potted citrus, even Poncirus is vulnerable in pots. There's just a bit shy of 2,000 gallons of water in this enclosure. Auxillary heat is available to prevent the water in the barrels from freezing and splitting. There should be minimal, if any heat needed above 10F outside temperature. The enclosure measures 12' x 24'. The barrels and walkway take up a considerable amount of space
Kumin, I have the same type of water set up in my greenhouse as you have.  In my greenhouse, I have 100 X  55-gallon drums full of water, the free heat that they release into the greenhouse every night is measurable.   I also use them as benches for my container plants, witch grow amazingly will with the bottom heat. During the winter nights the water temperature in each barrel normally drop 3 or 4 degrees F, thus giving off 1,344 Btu per each barrel  (134,400 free BTU per 100 barrels each night).

Should either of you experience a barrel rupture, you probably don't have to worry about watering for awhile.

Millet

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #590 on: December 06, 2023, 12:32:19 PM »
Because of the business we are in, the 55 gallon plastic barrels I use are free.

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #591 on: December 08, 2023, 04:11:00 PM »
Close up photo of Conestoga 121 a 5 year outside survivor exhibiting quite low thorniness. This selection isn't the very hardiest, but is unique nevertheless for its relative thornless habit. Unfortunately, it's evergreen making it susceptible to desiccating Winter winds.

 

Ilya11

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #592 on: December 10, 2023, 03:56:35 AM »
If its flower buds are formed in the autumn and  protected by scales like those of poncirus it could nevertheless flower in the spring.
Best regards,
                       Ilya

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #593 on: December 11, 2023, 05:22:38 PM »




Bishop Citrandarin fruits measure 12 Brix and have discernable sweetness combined with agreeable acid taste. It's the most edible selection to survive outdoors last Winter in our zone 6b climate. The fruit and juice are highly colored.
I'm not the originator of this tree, merely a fortunate collector/breeder and propagator.

vnomonee

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #594 on: December 11, 2023, 06:25:15 PM »
The Bishop fruit looks good. I'm glad to hear it survives in zone 6b!

My graft on taitri grew well over the summer. Hope to see a fruit or two in the spring.

Zitrusgaertner

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #595 on: December 12, 2023, 05:55:15 AM »
All HRS 899 are offspring of US852 or another hybrid with Changsha x Poncirus parentage.

Hi Mikkel,
I don't think 899 F2-series has US852 parentship. Otherwise Bernhard would have called it 852A - K. As far as I know 852 does not give zygotic embryos. Or only few. Whereas 899-seeds were all zygotic. As far as I can remember Bernhard was donated some fruits but was not allowed to take cuttings.

caladri

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #596 on: December 12, 2023, 06:39:52 AM »
The USDA's official release of US852 says that about half of the offspring of US852 are nucellar. See https://citrusrootstocks.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/US-852.pdf

mikkel

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #597 on: December 12, 2023, 06:54:43 AM »
Hi Robert, I'm still wondering what HRS means. I think it is an abbreviation for a particular collection. If so, it could be that HRS is the catalog number of US852 in a collection. Bernhard said HRS came from the Florida Arboretum, but I can't imagine how HRS could be related to the Florida Arboretum.... At that time, it was already permitted to pick seeds from the collection. Augusta Citrangequat also comes from a seedling from the Florida Arboretum.

Since half of the seedlings of US852 are nucellar, I think the other half must be zygotic. Bishop citrandarin, for example, is a US852 seedling

Mulberry0126

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #598 on: December 12, 2023, 07:27:32 AM »




Bishop Citrandarin fruits measure 12 Brix and have discernable sweetness combined with agreeable acid taste. It's the most edible selection to survive outdoors last Winter in our zone 6b climate. The fruit and juice are highly colored.
I'm not the originator of this tree, merely a fortunate collector/breeder and propagator.
Does Bishop Citrandarin taste best at this stage of ripeness? I wonder if it's juicier but less (pleasantly) flavorful when a little less ripe.

kumin

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Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« Reply #599 on: December 12, 2023, 10:59:17 AM »
2 were past peak in juiciness, especially the largest one. The smaller ones had more juice and better flavor.