Author Topic: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!  (Read 2167 times)

Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« on: April 23, 2021, 01:44:14 PM »

Dear friends, few days ago I received very fresh seeds of the most interesting and rare Annonaceae from Perů:

Annona nitida: 3 Euro per seed
Annona papilionella: 2 Euro per seed
Annona edulis: 3 Euro per seed
Annona hypoglauca 3 Euro per seed
Annona amazonica 3 Euro per seed

As you may imagine, all species are very difficult to get and produce amazing fruits. Shipping costs to be added depending on destinations.

This is probably the last sale of peruvian seeds I make here since all the rest has been sold through facebook. PM to me if you wanna have the last chance to get such treasures!

All shipments will be made from Italy. I ship worldwide at your own risks. Most part of the cash will be devolved to our heroic explorers of the jungles!

All the best

Giampaolo























Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2021, 11:36:42 AM »
Next weekend all orders will be out. In case of new orders, contact me soon if you want your out as well!

Thanks,

Giampaolo

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2021, 10:52:10 PM »
Good day Giampaolo. Thanks for making this collection of rare seeds available to us.  Do you still have seeds available? Thanks
Leo

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2021, 04:00:42 AM »

Hi Leo, some species are still available. PM to me so we can arrange the deal.

All the best,

Giampaolo


Good day Giampaolo. Thanks for making this collection of rare seeds available to us.  Do you still have seeds available? Thanks
Leo

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2022, 12:45:48 AM »
Seeds received well packaged and good communication by tfb.
I only had one seed germinate out of the lot I got. One A. edulis and it was quite weak.
So I am not sure how fresh the seeds I got where.
Have had great success with illama and other annonace since then and before so I don't think it's my method that is completely flawed.
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Saltman

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2022, 06:50:06 AM »
I am not sure which seeds you bought, but in my experience the tinier the seeds of an Annona species, the harder they are to germinate. On the other hand, if you put many tiny seeds in a small pot, they seem to stimulate each other.

Since not all of the species have super tiny seeds, you should also be aware of the biology of the offered species as they are very specialized rain forest species.

Annona hypoglauca for example is said to have an only 5% germination rate and is spread by fishs. Their germination might profit from a chemical compound, that is found within the gastro intestinal system of the fishs.
Annona nitida on the other hand has a special seed coat/parenchyma, that allows the seeds to float over very long distances during the rain season, without soaking with water risking early germination. I received the hint to really grind the seed coat with sand paper and let them soak, maybe even in GA3, until you can see the seeds inflated.

However these are just my two cents on this subject. But what I can tell for sure is, that from the many conversations I had with him, I can tell, that he is very concerned about the future of the Annonaceae rainforest species. He really wants to spread them as far as possible. So there would be no interest on his side to sell old seeds in my opinion.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2022, 06:52:03 AM by Saltman »

elouicious

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2022, 09:46:21 AM »
I can agree with Saltmans observation-

I am nearing 50 Annona paludosa planted with no sprouts- the seeds are coming from Richard and everything else sprouts so I have no doubt they are fresh

Annona are tricky, How was your germination Giampaolo?

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2022, 04:03:04 PM »
The one of the of the smaller ones germinted, a. edulis. All other species had 0% germination.
In my experience key is temperature, humidity and insect protection, I have sprouted a lot of annonace without using any hormones.

I didn't get any germination instructions.
I speculate. Even if tfb germianted them successfully at one point in time, by the time he sent them to me they might have been to old already.

I am speculating here, not condeming anyone, have had success with Richards seeds myself. Those 50 a. paludosa could be from one fruit and he's dropping them over a long time without doing germination tests regularly beacuse people think annona sp. store long because they have hard shells. This could be a falasy as the germ can still be dead without the seed rotting on the outside.

I think regular germination tests are neccessary for seeds that can store dry.

"He really wants to spread them as far as possible. So there would be no interest on his side to sell old seeds in my opinion."
I think this is true for many people on this fourm which is great but does not provide objective evidence of actual seed quality in my opinion.

Peace,
cassowary
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akanonui

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2022, 12:14:32 AM »
I had low germination rate as well, while curiously I got 2/3 of my hypoglauca seeds to sprout from a seller directly in Peru. HOWEVER this is not a complaint against Giampaolo I would still buy from him, this is just something that is part of the gamble when buying tropical seeds online. I find it’s always better results buying directly from sellers in the country of origin just by nature of how fresh those seeds ought to be
I am not sure which seeds you bought, but in my experience the tinier the seeds of an Annona species, the harder they are to germinate. On the other hand, if you put many tiny seeds in a small pot, they seem to stimulate each other.

Since not all of the species have super tiny seeds, you should also be aware of the biology of the offered species as they are very specialized rain forest species.

Annona hypoglauca for example is said to have an only 5% germination rate and is spread by fishs. Their germination might profit from a chemical compound, that is found within the gastro intestinal system of the fishs.
Annona nitida on the other hand has a special seed coat/parenchyma, that allows the seeds to float over very long distances during the rain season, without soaking with water risking early germination. I received the hint to really grind the seed coat with sand paper and let them soak, maybe even in GA3, until you can see the seeds inflated.

However these are just my two cents on this subject. But what I can tell for sure is, that from the many conversations I had with him, I can tell, that he is very concerned about the future of the Annonaceae rainforest species. He really wants to spread them as far as possible. So there would be no interest on his side to sell old seeds in my opinion.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2022, 08:12:49 PM by akanonui »

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2022, 02:12:27 PM »
Yes I agree, going to the source usually results in better seeds.

Could you please share where you got the a. hypoglauca seeds? Thanks
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akanonui

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2022, 08:12:18 PM »
Yes I agree, going to the source usually results in better seeds.

Could you please share where you got the a. hypoglauca seeds? Thanks

From a page called Selva Mia on the annonaceae forum on facebook.

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2022, 01:27:05 AM »
Thanks for taking your time and sharing that :)
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Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2022, 10:37:38 AM »
Seeds received well packaged and good communication by tfb.
I only had one seed germinate out of the lot I got. One A. edulis and it was quite weak.
So I am not sure how fresh the seeds I got where.
Have had great success with illama and other annonace since then and before so I don't think it's my method that is completely flawed.

Dear Cassowary, as I said many times ago, there are species of Annonaceae that are not for beginners. The Annona nitida is probably one of them. The same question you made, If seeds are in their perfect conditions of temperature/soil/humidity mix may have lower probabilities of germination. Said that, I also didn't have the chance to get seedling from my past experiences. It happened exactly the same to my Annona glauca I had years ago: the seeds were very fresh and in perfect shape, but very few seeds found the perfect mix conditionsie in order to germinate. Anyway, alsop in that case, this was absolutely a specie worth to try again!

Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2022, 10:42:22 AM »
I am not sure which seeds you bought, but in my experience the tinier the seeds of an Annona species, the harder they are to germinate. On the other hand, if you put many tiny seeds in a small pot, they seem to stimulate each other.

Since not all of the species have super tiny seeds, you should also be aware of the biology of the offered species as they are very specialized rain forest species.

Annona hypoglauca for example is said to have an only 5% germination rate and is spread by fishs. Their germination might profit from a chemical compound, that is found within the gastro intestinal system of the fishs.
Annona nitida on the other hand has a special seed coat/parenchyma, that allows the seeds to float over very long distances during the rain season, without soaking with water risking early germination. I received the hint to really grind the seed coat with sand paper and let them soak, maybe even in GA3, until you can see the seeds inflated.

However these are just my two cents on this subject. But what I can tell for sure is, that from the many conversations I had with him, I can tell, that he is very concerned about the future of the Annonaceae rainforest species. He really wants to spread them as far as possible. So there would be no interest on his side to sell old seeds in my opinion.

You are right. please read the answer I gave back to Cassowary as well. Some Annonaceae are really NOT for beginners, or, in other words, you must be prepared to have a try many times for some species. This already happened to me with Annona glauca: I lost at least 100 seeds before getting appreciable results.

Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2022, 10:46:55 AM »
I can agree with Saltmans observation-

I am nearing 50 Annona paludosa planted with no sprouts- the seeds are coming from Richard and everything else sprouts so I have no doubt they are fresh

Annona are tricky, How was your germination Giampaolo?

Hi Elouicious,

all I had germinated except the Annona nitida. But this is for sure due to a specie very difficult to find the right balance in envieronmental conditions, that's why I'm gonna try again! ;-)

Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2022, 10:56:15 AM »
I had low germination rate as well, while curiously I got 2/3 of my hypoglauca seeds to sprout from a seller directly in Peru. HOWEVER this is not a complaint against Giampaolo I would still buy from him, this is just something that is part of the gamble when buying tropical seeds online. I find it’s always better results buying directly from sellers in the country of origin just by nature of how fresh those seeds ought to be
I am not sure which seeds you bought, but in my experience the tinier the seeds of an Annona species, the harder they are to germinate. On the other hand, if you put many tiny seeds in a small pot, they seem to stimulate each other.

Since not all of the species have super tiny seeds, you should also be aware of the biology of the offered species as they are very specialized rain forest species.

Annona hypoglauca for example is said to have an only 5% germination rate and is spread by fishs. Their germination might profit from a chemical compound, that is found within the gastro intestinal system of the fishs.
Annona nitida on the other hand has a special seed coat/parenchyma, that allows the seeds to float over very long distances during the rain season, without soaking with water risking early germination. I received the hint to really grind the seed coat with sand paper and let them soak, maybe even in GA3, until you can see the seeds inflated.

However these are just my two cents on this subject. But what I can tell for sure is, that from the many conversations I had with him, I can tell, that he is very concerned about the future of the Annonaceae rainforest species. He really wants to spread them as far as possible. So there would be no interest on his side to sell old seeds in my opinion.

Hi Akanonui, most Annonaceae are easy to germinate while other are few are very difficult beacuse I empirically found out they need the exact mix of conditions, including microorganism, which can catalyze the germination process. Those rare Annonas unfortunately represent really a gamble! Since it's a try every time. THe same happpened to me with Annonaglauca from Africa. An ultra rare one which I spent almost a year in order to get the germination of some seedlings. But they worth to do it: I had the opportunity to save from extinction a ultra rare specie really endangered. Some Annona are not for people pretending to get result easily at the very first try.

Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2022, 11:16:02 AM »
Thanks for taking your time and sharing that :)

Dear Cassowary, since you have so many doubts about the freshness and viability of the seeds I had for sale, and considering the source of Akanonui is the same source of mine and taken into account I always sold seed of good quality not for profit but just to save rare species giving economic help to local explorers pursuing their discoveries, then let's make a bet: if you give proof of better germination results than me with Annona nitida in your next order placed to your new source, then I refund you all you spent in your order. But in case not, then you make public excuses to me. Fine for you?

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2022, 12:26:08 AM »
Doesn't sound like a bet to me... Why not keep it light tfb :)

Even if you got seeds from the same original source that does not equal that you sent seeds that where fresh and alive, your seeds might have germianted beaucse you sowed them when you first got them but mine not so cause they migh have been to old already when you sent them.
I think I gave you fair and objective feedback ( have said "think or suspect" where I am subjective"), can't make a excusse for that. Giving my experience, also said what was positive with dealing with you, communication and package.

Didn't ask for a refund as there is always risk and I have not said blame is on you, I said I have had very good success with other annonace and for me it's an anamoly to see close to 0% germination of all species of all of the seeds I got from you.

Why couldn't you give your germination methods to customers or post them publicly? Wouldn't that help others preserve the species better then?

"just to save rare species giving economic help to local explorers pursuing their discoveries" I think anyone buying this kind of seeds do that automatically pretty much, not limited to you. Not throwing an adhominem to you, just voicing what I see is a common spirit on this forum.
But I have never questioned your motives or ambitions just the seeds condition upon departure from you. I am sure you are a great human and you where always kind and professional in chat with me.

Atleast I got to document the look of the seeds so that I can tell real from fakes in the future or while foraging. I never daubt that you sent wrong seeds, only the opposite. Thank you for that :)

Peace.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2022, 02:05:15 AM by cassowary »
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Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2022, 04:31:08 AM »
Doesn't sound like a bet to me... Why not keep it light tfb :)

Even if you got seeds from the same original source that does not equal that you sent seeds that where fresh and alive, your seeds might have germianted beaucse you sowed them when you first got them but mine not so cause they migh have been to old already when you sent them.
I think I gave you fair and objective feedback ( have said "think or suspect" where I am subjective"), can't make a excusse for that. Giving my experience, also said what was positive with dealing with you, communication and package.

Dear Cassowary, this is a speculation. Annonaceae seeds, except very rare cases, do not crash their viability in few weeks! I managed to germinate Annonas seeds even after 2 years from the crop. Obviously is always better to get fresh seed in order to have better germination rate and this is why I always propose fresh seeds. In any case, this become less material if you miss the right balance humidity/temperature/soil required by each specie in order to germinate. Said so, experience has taught me to be much more self-critical about sowing methods rather than always pointing the finger at the quality of the seeds when something goes wrong.


Didn't ask for a refund as there is always risk and I have not said blame is on you, I said I have had very good success with other annonace and for me it's an anamoly to see close to 0% germination of all species of all of the seeds I got from you.

Then you learn this is not an anomaly: some Annona species are not for beginners. In some cases, they are not easy to germinate even in their country of origin, imagine in another country where so many factors that can be decisive for results change. In reality, a lot depends on your ability to replicate these factors in an environment other than that of origin. 

Why couldn't you give your germination methods to customers or post them publicly? Wouldn't that help others preserve the species better then?

I already did at least in two different post time ago. Sorry if you missed but you can search for it. In any case is a good practice asking the seller for any tips & tricks for gemination

"just to save rare species giving economic help to local explorers pursuing their discoveries" I think anyone buying this kind of seeds do that automatically pretty much, not limited to you. Not throwing an adhominem to you, just voicing what I see is a common spirit on this forum.
But I have never questioned your motives or ambitions just the seeds condition upon departure from you. I am sure you are a great human and you where always kind and professional in chat with me.

Just ot be clear: this is NOT true. I have several contacts as well as few friends and collectors in this platform who do it exclusively for cash. This is a business and not all are in line with social & enviromental purposes. Personally, I prefer to share and buy & sell from and to people who share my values close to protection and preservation of the species biodiversity.


Atleast I got to document the look of the seeds so that I can tell real from fakes in the future or while foraging. I never daubt that you sent wrong seeds, only the opposite. Thank you for that :)

If in the next sowing of Annona nitida I manage to germinate some seeds, I will send you some. So I hope you won't be disappointed again.


Peace.

This sentence fits perfect for Annonaceae: "Patience is not the ability to wait, but the ability to keep a good attitude while waiting"

cassowary

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2022, 06:04:04 PM »
Hi tfb,

"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress" Joseph Joubert.
Sometime's I forget this, still learning as I go a long.

I looked back 3 pages of your post history and couldn't find the post about germinating the mentioned species, could find one post
from October 2017 about planting instructions of cerrado plants. I used ctrl-f with "germ" to find the keywords on the page. Maybe have to go further back? Would be great if you could help me out, would be helpful to me in the future :) I guess for me the concern would be to warm as I am 16 degrees of the equator and most germination takes place outside under my shade nursery either under glass or out of it (this is how I regualte humidity and temp usually).

Peace
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Tropical Fruit Bonsai

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Re: Rare Annonaceae seeds sales!!!
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2022, 04:10:39 AM »
Hi tfb,

"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress" Joseph Joubert.
Sometime's I forget this, still learning as I go a long.

I looked back 3 pages of your post history and couldn't find the post about germinating the mentioned species, could find one post
from October 2017 about planting instructions of cerrado plants. I used ctrl-f with "germ" to find the keywords on the page. Maybe have to go further back? Would be great if you could help me out, would be helpful to me in the future :) I guess for me the concern would be to warm as I am 16 degrees of the equator and most germination takes place outside under my shade nursery either under glass or out of it (this is how I regualte humidity and temp usually).

Peace

Hi Cassowary, frankly I donět remember when exactly I posted these tips. I'm just sure I've done because I got the request from two friends of mine who pleased me to do that at that time.

Then I don't want keep going chatting in this platform since takes much time and I rarely check this. You can get in touch with me directly here:

https://www.facebook.com/giampaolo.duran

feel free to contact me there and share green experiences as well as germination tips.

GD

 

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