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Messages - lajos93

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1
Thanks

Yes, I phrased inadequately. Meant as in avocadoes grown in the coldest zones

Ive looked up Brissago in Switzerland, Do you think it would be possible to plant one next to Lake Balaton in Hungary?
Its not exactly the same, but almost the same latitude wise, and the thermal mass from the lake would protect it I believe, obiously Id still need the most cold hardy ones but they might have a change, what do you think?

2
Anyone has pictures of avocado trees that grow way beyond what one is used to seeing?

Were talking Zone 8a or even slightly further?

3
Can you hybridize them to create a cold tolerant black sapote tasting fruit tree?

4
wrote you PM

5
Did you find it?

6
not available now though, thats a bummer  :-\

7
@CarolinaZone

They are from Austria? :O Wow so close to me

8
@Epiphyte

I thnk the issue is not the cold, as in the tree's ability to survive but to get it to fruit well.
So not sure if thats achievable with grafting

Not even sure there are varieties that bloom in spring, allegedly there are but it smells fishy if I really look into it, almost as if it was anecdotal lol

9
Like russians developed many pomegranate varieties that can handle much colder temps than temps they are originally exposed to

Can you do the same thing with loquat?
The only issue that comes into mind is that they start flowering in december so unless it mutates to flower in spring instead its not gonna happen

But it makes you wonder about the possibilities of zone pushing

10
To make the tree essentially tolerant to pretty deep freezes, yet its fruits to die at barely around -1C/-2C temps

Is it because normally the fruit matures before winter where the plant is originated from?

11
...than temperate climate trees?

Its as if tropical fruit trees are unable to "do the work" of bringing flowers, leaves at lower temps whereas temperate trees (apples, plums, apricot, pears etc.. ) do that with ease..
What is the science behind this?

Interestingly enough it not only affects tropical fruit trees but non-tropicals as well that came from the tropics, subtropics (but somehow evolved to handle colder temps eg: Asimina Triloba). They are really starting to wake up once night time temps go above 10C/50F

Can it be that as science advances we'll be able to manipulate whatever that is causing it to wake up early (and thrive), or push it with selective breeding?

12
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Cold hardy avocado - from seed
« on: April 25, 2023, 03:53:52 PM »
Hi

Do you have any updates?

13
@drymifolia

Have you read this?
https://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=24627.0

This guy has some success with finding the hardy ones from allegedly supermarket seeds in Zone 8b. Not Zone 7b-8a, but still something to get inspired by

14
Probably one of the largest commercial Avocado nurseries in the US.


This nursery also seem to produce large quantities of plants. They have Zutano between their varieties.
https://www.viverosbrokaw.com

It's located in Spain

They are a multinational company with large commercial nurseries in the U.S., Spain, Mexico, and likely other places too.

Ok, got it

Zutano, Bacon is lot less hardy than Joey, Lila, Poncho etc.. so you might try those knowing that you arent utilitizing the current potential that already is known avocados to have. Its kinda pointless I think

15
Yes! You're probably referring to Mike, who found a seedling in his compost in southern England. I'm in regular contact with Mike, who posts photo updates on his trees here:
https://imgur.com/a/5gflnlU

His location may technically be zone 8, but really closer to zone 9. Most winters since that tree sprouted he has not seen temperatures below -4C (25F), and he hasn't updated that page after this current winter, where the tree suffered significant dieback based on an email he sent a month ago. Here's a relevant excerpt from the email:

Yes, Its him, saw his post somewhere before.

But there are quite a few in London, I wonder what their parents are. Allegedly there was -10 in 2012 there, they and apparently they are still alive, so they did survive that.


What about your hardy seedlings? Any news, how many did survive this winter and can you tell what were your lows?

16

If it's 1/100 we would already have plenty of non pure mexican hardy varieties by now. Even george in that article says it will take years.

Originally pomegranates were also subtropical. This should mean something, it does for me lol

17
@drymifolia

He answered to me in chat that hes no longer able to do the experiment due to personal reasons but he knows some guy who is doing it seriously . not much to work with :D

18

I've planted hundreds of hardy seeds and dozens of Hass seeds and I think it's extremely unlikely for a Hass seedling to be as hardy as he claims that one was unless he just lucked out with a 1 in a million seedling.

Wait youve already tried this with no success? Planting hundreds of seeds??

Ive read some success stories of a random seedling surviving in the compost in zone 8 climate I think

19
@drymifolia
Thanks for sharing your experience. That's unfortunate because i was hoping for this to work as for me also it's much easier to find hass avocados seeds. I will give it a try anyway but guess i will have to think of other solutions as well

Actually this guy gave me the idea. According to him, Hass avocadoe seedlings do have the potential to be very cold hardy, lets say 1/100
https://georgestancliffe.medium.com/the-b-c-avocado-project-670ed22a74d7

20
@pagnr
im usually buying hass from the store, I planted about 28 plants in a small garden. now only 9972 to go  :D

21
@drymifolia

Actually I managed to get some hardy named varieties, so Im just about doing what you are doing, getting most of them to fast as quick as possible, then plant the seeds
In the meanwhile I wanna get another 10000 from seed vendors if possible

22
Do they really grow that fast??

It would take 6-8 years for an apple/pear whatever tree to get to that size

23
https://www.viverosblanco.com/en/rootstocks - mexicola and "water-hole" seed

That site looks promising

That second one is a typo, it should be "Walter Hole," which is one of the varieties available from the UC Riverside collection, and is flowering for the first time this spring on one of our multi-graft trees. Here's Walter Hole a few days ago:

@drymifolia , would you agree that starting with Walter Hole / Mexicola seeds would be of the best way to do this?

24
Has there ever been done such a long term breeding project for any trees to get the tree to adapt to a completely different climate that it was originally accustomed to?

I know that the soviets did grow lemons in a special way, they werent necessarily bred for hardiness, at least not to a significant degree..They simply made structures, set them up in a way so they dont get not even close to the temps trees there normally do get

And they did some hybridization with the oranges and others citruses, most resulted in hardy AND horrible tasting fruits.
Along side that they had more room to experiment with citruses since they have that one special rootstock (poncirus trifoliata) that has everything a citrus needs as far as compatibility is concerned YET its super HARDY

That is what Avocadoes are missing, if there was some sort of an interstem or something that allowed other Lauraceaes to be used as rootsock for avocadoes that'd speed it up big time

25
@shot

You mean to get the hardy ones or just random seeds? I think you meant 10 thousands of random seeds. Its not bad, but if I wanted to be 99.999 sure its working the hardy ones would be needed

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