The Tropical Fruit Forum

Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: simon_grow on March 28, 2019, 03:37:36 PM

Title: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on March 28, 2019, 03:37:36 PM
I want to start this thread to begin tracking the performance of the top tier Mangos varieties when grown in SoCal. Any information from growers in other Mango growing regions would be greatly appreciated. Varieties that are highly disease resistant in one mango growing region may be a good indicator that they could potentially be a good reliable producer in SoCal although we know this is not necessarily true in many instances.

I will include a few varieties that are not necessarily top tier in everyone’s ratings but some people love these varieties and they are very common in the nurseries so I will include them here.

So far, here is a short list of varieties that taste good and are reliable in SoCal:

Leo 2
Peggy
Leo Z
Sweet Tart
Venus
Edward
Maha Chanok
Glenn
Kesar
Valencia Pride
CAC
Parson
Fairchild
Villa Clara
Thompson
Ivory
Ugly Betty
Cypress
Magcom
Dale
Sunrise
Juicy Peach
Sindhri
Imam Passand
Coconut Cream
Honey Kiss
Peach cobbler
NDM
Kent
Gary
Cotton Candy
Leo Keitt Seedling

 There are a lot more that I can’t remember right now but I just want to get this topic started.

If you are growing a good tasting variety and you notice it produces reliably for you, please post here so that we can compare it to how it performs for others in SoCal.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on March 28, 2019, 03:48:29 PM
Good thread Simon!

I would Add a few that are reliable. The only one I question from your list is Kesar. I’ve had lots of drops with that variety. Here is my list:
LZ
Harvest Moon mutant
Edward
Parson
Cac
Fairchild
Thomson
Ivory
Villa Clara
Ugly betty
Cypress
Magcom
Dale
Sunrise
Juicy Peach
There are many others but I can’t think right now.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on March 28, 2019, 03:55:33 PM
Thanks Frank, the more data points we get, the better. What performs well in one persons yard may not necessarily perform well in someone else’s yard and the list of varieties that don’t perform well is just as important as the list of good performers.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: EvilFruit on March 28, 2019, 04:15:28 PM
Why don't you guys grow Pakistani Mango Cultivars ?. They should do much better than SE Asia or Indian cultivars (or their seedlings/selections), I mean both Lahore (the capital city of Pakistani Mangoes) and San Diego are almost in the same latitude.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on March 28, 2019, 04:19:26 PM
Why don't you guys grow Pakistani Mango Cultivars ?. They should do much better than SE Asia or Indian cultivars (or their seedlings/selections), I mean both Lahore (the capital city of Pakistani Mangoes) and San Diego are almost in the same latitude.


We do. Here is 3 year old Sindhiri  very reliable

(https://i.postimg.cc/mh2hN2tg/4-A3-DDC19-0367-44-AE-B234-4-A3-D11-D54514.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mh2hN2tg)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on March 28, 2019, 05:33:55 PM
For me the following have produced well:
Imam pasand - longer it stays on tree the better
Sweet tart
Peach Cobbler
Coconut Creame

Best tasting, production pending maturity of plant:
LZ
Honey kiss
Peach cobbler
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: hawkfish007 on March 28, 2019, 05:48:42 PM
Please also add if these cultivars do well in Southern California regardless of rootstocks, e.g., turpentine, or only on California Manila rootstock.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: CA Hockey on March 29, 2019, 03:33:58 AM
Fruit punch on Florida rootstock has done well x 2 years

Venus on Florida rootstock has done well x 1 year

Ambrosia on Florida rootstock has grown vigorously x 2 years

Keitt on Florida rootstock has done well x 2 years

Lemon zest on Florida rootstock has grown well x 1 year

Lemon zest and CAC on seedling rootstock has done well x 1/2 year

Fruit punch and lz on Manila is ok

Pina colada on seedling - nada. Maybe 1 inch of growth in 1.5 years and that growth was  2 flower panicles in january.

Pineapple pleasure by contrast is growing well x 1.5 years

Nam doc mai on Brokaw rootstock is vigorous x 6 months

Maha xhanook on seedling rootstock good x 6 months

Ppk from exotica -looks like Florida rootstock woth yellow tag but not sure how exotica propagates their trees. Only 1 flush first year. Did better second year.

Orange sherbet Florida rootstock -solid growth with minimal flowering last year.

M4 on Florida rootstock -stable x 1 year.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Mikey on March 29, 2019, 01:44:17 PM
Valencia Pride and keow savory does well for me.  Coconuts cream died and lemon zest died for me.  I live near the coast and we don’t get too hot where i live. 
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on March 29, 2019, 09:32:10 PM
Fruit punch on Florida rootstock has done well x 2 years

Venus on Florida rootstock has done well x 1 year

Ambrosia on Florida rootstock has grown vigorously x 2 years

Keitt on Florida rootstock has done well x 2 years

Lemon zest on Florida rootstock has grown well x 1 year

Lemon zest and CAC on seedling rootstock has done well x 1/2 year

Fruit punch and lz on Manila is ok

Pina colada on seedling - nada. Maybe 1 inch of growth in 1.5 years and that growth was  2 flower panicles in january.

Pineapple pleasure by contrast is growing well x 1.5 years

Nam doc mai on Brokaw rootstock is vigorous x 6 months

Maha xhanook on seedling rootstock good x 6 months

Ppk from exotica -looks like Florida rootstock woth yellow tag but not sure how exotica propagates their trees. Only 1 flush first year. Did better second year.

Orange sherbet Florida rootstock -solid growth with minimal flowering last year.

M4 on Florida rootstock -stable x 1 year.

CA Hockey, thanks for the information but this thread is to track reliable production and not growth of the trees. Some varieties like Lemon Zest grow ok on Florida Turpentine rootstock but have trouble setting fruit due to its susceptibility to fungal diseases. Generally, in terms of growth, the more vigorous growers grow ok here in SoCal, even on Florida rootstock but they seem to get really droopy and also get gummosis.

To the list of reliable producers, im adding NDM, Kent, Peach Cobbler, Coconut Cream and Honey KISS. These varieties have proven reliable in either Leo Manuel, AZ or PM’s orchards.

I also wanted to clarify that we need as many data points regarding reliability, as possible. This means that even if someone already posted that Sweet Tart or Honey Kiss did well in their yards, I would still want you to post that it did, or didn’t set and hold fruit for you.

In this manner, we can build up our database which will eventually enable us to give recommendation for gardeners attempting to grow Mangos in Southern California.

Varieties that are found to be reliable in some yards but unreliable in other yards will be given a moderate rating in terms of reliability. Varieties that are consistently listed as reliable will obviously be rated as reliable.

Simon


Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on March 29, 2019, 09:37:53 PM
Honey kiss on turpentine rootstock fruited prolific on a 15gal. However, I took out fruitlets when they were marbled size.

Sweet Tart on turpentine fruited prolific too. I let this hold approx 13 fruits on a 15 gal, however, last heatwave june or july when we got 122f. The fruits wrinkled.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: barath on March 29, 2019, 11:17:06 PM
Which mangos seem to be the most disease resistant in Southern California, independent of whether they are the best tasting?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on March 30, 2019, 12:15:41 PM
Thanks Frank, the more data points we get, the better. What performs well in one persons yard may not necessarily perform well in someone else’s yard and the list of varieties that don’t perform well is just as important as the list of good performers.

Simon

Yes agree. My point was that kesar has not been proven to be productive here in my area. I’ve fruited in one branch more kesars than( and that’s not many)  Az and Behl in some 7 kesar trees they have. So I’m glad it’s productive where you are at...... I’m assume that’s where you are getting yr data. The jury is still out here in Orange County.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on March 30, 2019, 07:21:27 PM
Thanks for the clarification Frank. Yes, I have a small Kesar graft on my multigraft tree and it readily sets fruit. It is the regular Kesar and not the Jumbo Kesar. This Kesar graft is now completely shaded by a nearby tree but it still has some small blooms on it this year so I’ll see if it sets any this year.

Carrie has also been reliable for me before it died of Phomopsis.

Simon

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on March 30, 2019, 07:38:07 PM
Thanks Frank, the more data points we get, the better. What performs well in one persons yard may not necessarily perform well in someone else’s yard and the list of varieties that don’t perform well is just as important as the list of good performers.

Simon

Yes agree. My point was that kesar has not been proven to be productive here in my area. I’ve fruited in one branch more kesars than( and that’s not many)  Az and Behl in some 7 kesar trees they have. So I’m glad it’s productive where you are at...... I’m assume that’s where you are getting yr data. The jury is still out here in Orange County.

I remember seeing approximately 10-15 fruits on ur kesar graft last year. Hope to see some more as ur graft matures.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on March 30, 2019, 08:25:13 PM
That sounds about right....the branch is next to señorita.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 04, 2019, 12:18:40 AM
Which mangos seem to be the most disease resistant in Southern California, independent of whether they are the best tasting?

The varieties that Leo Manuel are very reliable. They are not necessarily disease resistant, they get Powdery  Mildew, but they set and mature fruit regardless.

Paul Thomson and Rudy Haluza also have varieties that perform well in SoCal.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: barath on April 04, 2019, 10:27:58 AM
Which mangos seem to be the most disease resistant in Southern California, independent of whether they are the best tasting?

The varieties that Leo Manuel are very reliable. They are not necessarily disease resistant, they get Powdery  Mildew, but they set and mature fruit regardless.

Paul Thomson and Rudy Haluza also have varieties that perform well in SoCal.

Simon

Sounds great!  How is the "Leo Z" variety in particular?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 04, 2019, 04:46:13 PM
I haven’t tried a perfectly ripened one yet but a bunch of people got together at Leo’s place and rated it very highly.

From the underripe fruit I ate, there is great potential.

Leo 2 is great if your looking for a sugar bomb but it lacks acid balance. If you eat it on the firm side, it can be excellent.

Leo’s Keitt seedling is also great and tastes like a big Sweet Tart.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: barath on April 04, 2019, 04:51:14 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on April 04, 2019, 05:59:51 PM
I haven’t tried a perfectly ripened one yet but a bunch of people got together at Leo’s place and rated it very highly.

From the underripe fruit I ate, there is great potential.

Leo 2 is great if your looking for a sugar bomb but it lacks acid balance. If you eat it on the firm side, it can be excellent.

Leo’s Keitt seedling is also great and tastes like a big Sweet Tart.

Simon

Hi simon i had a conversation with JF regarding Leo's varieties, And according to JF the best mango in Leo’s yard and close to ST is a variety called T-1.  Could u verify?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: barath on April 04, 2019, 07:04:20 PM
I haven’t tried a perfectly ripened one yet but a bunch of people got together at Leo’s place and rated it very highly.

From the underripe fruit I ate, there is great potential.

Leo 2 is great if your looking for a sugar bomb but it lacks acid balance. If you eat it on the firm side, it can be excellent.

Leo’s Keitt seedling is also great and tastes like a big Sweet Tart.

Simon

Hi simon i had a conversation with JF regarding Leo's varieties, And according to JF the best mango in Leo’s yard and close to ST is a variety called T-1.  Could u verify?

I remember T-1 is one of the original Paul Thomson selections -- is it widely grown?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: BonsaiBeast on April 04, 2019, 08:35:53 PM
Does lemon meringue produce well here? What are the heaviest producing zill varieties?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: wslau on April 04, 2019, 09:42:15 PM
Does lemon meringue produce well here? What are the heaviest producing zill varieties?

In CA...Generally no without spraying with fungicides.  Lemon meringue (aka PPK...which is not a Zill’s creation) and it’s offspring Lemon Zest are powdery mildew magnets.  We are still trialing the offspring orange sherbert, but I would imagine it would have the same PM problem.

The heaviest producing newer Zill’s varieties has been Sweet Tart.  Some have had good luck with Coconut Cream, but not me.  Overall, I haven’t heard of any newer Zill’s varieites being heavy producers.  Most have been classified as low to moderate at best.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: BonsaiBeast on April 05, 2019, 03:13:16 AM
Does lemon meringue produce well here? What are the heaviest producing zill varieties?

In CA...Generally no without spraying with fungicides.  Lemon meringue (aka PPK...which is not a Zill’s creation) and it’s offspring Lemon Zest are powdery mildew magnets.  We are still trialing the offspring orange sherbert, but I would imagine it would have the same PM problem.

The heaviest producing newer Zill’s varieties has been Sweet Tart.  Some have had good luck with Coconut Cream, but not me.  Overall, I haven’t heard of any newer Zill’s varieites being heavy producers.  Most have been classified as low to moderate at best.

So what varieties outside of zills are productive here?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on April 05, 2019, 12:24:44 PM
I haven’t tried a perfectly ripened one yet but a bunch of people got together at Leo’s place and rated it very highly.

From the underripe fruit I ate, there is great potential.

Leo 2 is great if your looking for a sugar bomb but it lacks acid balance. If you eat it on the firm side, it can be excellent.

Leo’s Keitt seedling is also great and tastes like a big Sweet Tart.

Simon

Hi simon i had a conversation with JF regarding Leo's varieties, And according to JF the best mango in Leo’s yard and close to ST is a variety called T-1.  Could u verify?

That’s absolutely right Gonz. t-1 is planted in the East side ,90% shaded, of Leo’s yard so it doesn’t produce well but in term of quality it’s right up there w ST. There are dozens and f mangos of high quality from Southern California there are just not propagated. Here are a few I have to look in my archives  one day and post.

(https://i.postimg.cc/k6zHh7QB/1946-B383-3-A60-4415-AD6-C-295-E62-ECFE0-D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/k6zHh7QB)

(https://i.postimg.cc/gLhTC1s4/1-C6113-DA-971-C-44-A2-A04-B-350-B96-CA965-F.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gLhTC1s4)

(https://i.postimg.cc/Tp8SVY2s/34-BBAC29-BFA7-40-B4-9094-910-FEBC6-C857.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Tp8SVY2s)

(https://i.postimg.cc/K43w3gbL/528-BFFDB-FB27-463-F-A979-402263-CEF623.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/K43w3gbL)

(https://i.postimg.cc/bD5XcxhY/B742-AF38-7-B55-4-C32-9291-2-D2-FA4-D6-AE31.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bD5XcxhY)

(https://i.postimg.cc/cvhbGR7q/DD71-F756-4-E87-452-E-B798-5-FC674765-AAD.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/cvhbGR7q)

(https://i.postimg.cc/Wq05WgpH/E839073-B-F7-F8-4-CF1-B8-B6-C607612-D937-D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Wq05WgpH)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 05, 2019, 08:04:28 PM
Does lemon meringue produce well here? What are the heaviest producing zill varieties?

In CA...Generally no without spraying with fungicides.  Lemon meringue (aka PPK...which is not a Zill’s creation) and it’s offspring Lemon Zest are powdery mildew magnets.  We are still trialing the offspring orange sherbert, but I would imagine it would have the same PM problem.

The heaviest producing newer Zill’s varieties has been Sweet Tart.  Some have had good luck with Coconut Cream, but not me.  Overall, I haven’t heard of any newer Zill’s varieites being heavy producers.  Most have been classified as low to moderate at best.

So what varieties outside of zills are productive here?

CAC performs well here as does VP. I prefer CAC over VP any day.

Frank knows Leo’s varieties really well. I’m sure I’ve reviewed it before but I just can’t remember. Some of his varieties have an off season after a good year. I’ll try to review it later this year when it’s ready.

Thanks to everyone that has shared their information so far. I’d like for everyone growing Mangos in SoCal to share their experiences with the varieties they’re growing because we need a lot more data before we can make recommendations to the general public.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: BonsaiBeast on April 06, 2019, 12:33:23 AM
I planted:

Ataulfo (15 gallon) 18 months ago. Tree tripled in size, set fruit last season, and is in full bloom this season. Produced about 20 medium sized mangos last year. Fruits first tasted fibrous and ok, but improved in texture and flavored through the season into fall.

Alphonso on Turp (15 gallon) 18 months ago. Grew pretty well, doubling in size but droopy. It set fruit, but fruit dropped after reaching size of a marble.

Manilla seedling from home depot (3 gallon) 12 months. Has barely grown at all. Flushes are very stunted.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Eirlis on May 01, 2019, 12:42:32 AM
I have 5 mango trees so far in south Orange County:
LZ on turpentine rootstock - 4.5 years in ground, only ~4 feet tall with very slow growth, lots of panicles but poor fruit set so far. Lots of PM despite 2x fungicide applications. It only set 2 fruit last year of poor quality.
Coconut Cream on turpentine rootstock - 4.5 years in ground, 6-7 feet tall and very vigorous, tons of panicles but poor fruit set so far. Lots of PM despite 2x fungicide applications. It set zero fruit last year. :-(
Malika on turpentine rootstock - 4.5 years in ground, ~4 feet tall with very slow growth. However this tree has been heavily shaded until very recently (another tree was blocking its light). It has a number of panicles with flowers that are just beginning to open. No PM issues. No fruit last year.
Multi-graft tree I purchased from Frank ~2 years ago. It has Sweet Tart, Juicy Peach, Zinc, and Puneet. The tree overall has grown poorly with the ST and JP grafts are doing the best. Both are flowering now with no signs of PM. The other two grafts have done nothing.
I also have a LaVerne manila I planted 2 years ago which is now 5 feet tall and growing beautifully. It currently has 1 LZ graft I added last summer. No flowers so far. I'm planning on grafting a number of other varieties on to it this year if I can find budwood!
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on May 01, 2019, 01:51:20 AM

Multi-graft tree I purchased from Frank ~2 years ago. It has Sweet Tart, Juicy Peach, Zinc, and Puneet. The tree overall has grown poorly with the ST and JP grafts are doing the best. Both are flowering now with no signs of PM. The other two grafts have done nothing.


So far with my experience with JF mango trees they seem to be flourishing on a harsher environment . Here a few trees i got frim him grafted on a manila rootstock.


(https://i.postimg.cc/KKPtWNdb/Screenshot-20190430-224818-Gallery.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/KKPtWNdb)

16/1 variety

(https://i.postimg.cc/7f504Dpm/Screenshot-20190430-224753-Gallery.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7f504Dpm)
Recently planted guava

(https://i.postimg.cc/KRCLvwbF/Screenshot-20190430-224800-Gallery.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/KRCLvwbF)
Lemon zest finally setting fruitles. No PM noticed as i dnt use any spray

(https://i.postimg.cc/grk3M349/Screenshot-20190430-224809-Gallery.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/grk3M349)

Peach cobbler



It may be possible u are doing something wrong. What are u using to fertilize ur trees?

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: boxturtle on May 06, 2019, 03:26:51 PM
can you  also put in side note what taste category the mango falls in ex. sugar bomb, citrus, coconut, etc would help noobs like me :)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on May 06, 2019, 06:26:24 PM
Good thread Simon!

I would Add a few that are reliable. The only one I question from your list is Kesar. I’ve had lots of drops with that variety. Here is my list:
LZ
Harvest Moon mutant
Edward
Parson
Cac
Fairchild
Thomson
Ivory
Villa Clara
Ugly betty
Cypress
Magcom
Dale
Sunrise
Juicy Peach
There are many others but I can’t think right now.

I believe the LZ was added by mistake. In areas where fungal disease pressures are lower, LZ can produce very well like it does for Gary in Palm Springs but in many other locations, LZ appears to fruit poorly unless sprayed with fungicides.

This year, I tried to spray my LZ trees blooms with the hose about once a week, no fungicides, and so far my fruit set looks good although I expect much of the fruit to eventually drop. Powdery Mildew actually doesn’t like moist conditions and overhead spraying is supposed to wash away the spores although my training in microbiology makes me feel that overhead spraying may also spread spores lower down the canopy.

Thanks to Chris and Har from Truly Tropical for their wonderful video on “Spraying when mango trees have young fruit”.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ueyE_SOCYqo&t=730s
I will take Har’s advice and try spraying with Silica and Kelp in the hopes that my tree will retain more fruit.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on May 06, 2019, 06:59:52 PM
can you  also put in side note what taste category the mango falls in ex. sugar bomb, citrus, coconut, etc would help noobs like me :)

Gary has some Coconut flavor and the VPs grown in SoCal also have a slight coconut flavor.

Sweet Tart is a flavor bomb and Venus is similar but less potent in terms of sweetness and acidity.
Peach Cobbler is also a flavor bomb.

Maha, Glenn, Edward, NDM, CAC are all unique but not flavor bombs.

NDM, Sweet Tart, Leo 2 can also be considered sugar bombs as they are ultra sweet.

Simon

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: rliou on May 06, 2019, 07:14:44 PM
In my yard is cerritos, the following produces well

Coconut cream (droopy on turpentine but produces reliably after 3-4 years in ground)
Pickering
Ice cream (bought as 15gal tree with florida rootstock)
Galaxy (scion from dongeogio)
Valencia Pride (taste is subjective for some but it's a nice large colorful mangos for your relatives who don't know mangos)
Peach cobbler (on turpentine rootstock)

These following are the ones that are least productive in my yard
-alphonso (blooms like crazy and has lots of vegetative growth but very little fruits)
-lemon zest (powdery mildew problem)
-Venus (powdery mildew problem but it may be because of the location in my yard which is too shady and dark)

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on May 06, 2019, 08:22:39 PM
Good thread Simon!

I would Add a few that are reliable. The only one I question from your list is Kesar. I’ve had lots of drops with that variety. Here is my list:
LZ
Harvest Moon mutant
Edward
Parson
Cac
Fairchild
Thomson
Ivory
Villa Clara
Ugly betty
Cypress
Magcom
Dale
Sunrise
Juicy Peach
There are many others but I can’t think right now.

I believe the LZ was added by mistake. In areas where fungal disease pressures are lower, LZ can produce very well like it does for Gary in Palm Springs but in many other locations, LZ appears to fruit poorly unless sprayed with fungicides.

This year, I tried to spray my LZ trees blooms with the hose about once a week, no fungicides, and so far my fruit set looks good although I expect much of the fruit to eventually drop. Powdery Mildew actually doesn’t like moist conditions and overhead spraying is supposed to wash away the spores although my training in microbiology makes me feel that overhead spraying may also spread spores lower down the canopy.

Thanks to Chris and Har from Truly Tropical for their wonderful video on “Spraying when mango trees have young fruit”.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ueyE_SOCYqo&t=730s
I will take Har’s advice and try spraying with Silica and Kelp in the hopes that my tree will retain more fruit.

Simon
First 3 photos are LZ... so far no problems with PM. I dont spray copper or sulfur except foliar seaweed every other night.



(https://i.postimg.cc/zbkz9VVX/20190505-212119.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zbkz9VVX)

(https://i.postimg.cc/WdJ2s9hy/20190505-212130.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WdJ2s9hy)

(https://i.postimg.cc/GH4RjMJp/20190505-212111.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/GH4RjMJp)


Sweet tart..
(https://i.postimg.cc/PpKHS9RC/20190505-212706.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PpKHS9RC)

Im stoked to see new growth compare to old growth of OS on pot..im letting this tiny os hold fruit once it sets.

(https://i.postimg.cc/Bj5V5Dy6/20190505-110346.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Bj5V5Dy6)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on May 06, 2019, 08:49:53 PM
on stunted mango trees that grow only 4 feet in 4 years, dont bother, those are root bound or their roots are not establishing, I have yanked suck trees only to find the trees hanging on tiny roots, barely staying alive. Mangoes takeoff in 2nd year and if they dont by 3rd, there is permanent problem, you are better off yanking them, I dont recommend 15 gal mango trees to be put into ground, majority of such potted plants are root bound and dont respond well unless you get lucky OR really know how to push them hard.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on May 06, 2019, 08:56:17 PM
on stunted mango trees that grow only 4 feet in 4 years, dont bother, those are root bound or their roots are not establishing, I have yanked suck trees only to find the trees hanging on tiny roots, barely staying alive. Mangoes takeoff in 2nd year and if they dont by 3rd, there is permanent problem, you are better off yanking them, I dont recommend 15 gal mango trees to be put into ground, majority of such potted plants are root bound and dont respond well unless you get lucky OR really know how to push them hard.

I concur.

My 3 gallon turpentines do fairly better than my 15 gallons turpentine.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on May 07, 2019, 12:21:50 AM
on stunted mango trees that grow only 4 feet in 4 years, dont bother, those are root bound or their roots are not establishing, I have yanked suck trees only to find the trees hanging on tiny roots, barely staying alive. Mangoes takeoff in 2nd year and if they dont by 3rd, there is permanent problem, you are better off yanking them, I dont recommend 15 gal mango trees to be put into ground, majority of such potted plants are root bound and dont respond well unless you get lucky OR really know how to push them hard.

Behl, I completely agree with you. Some trees just take off and show explosive growth, some can take a couple years to really get going and there are those that are just stunted.

Here are some pictures of my recently set LZ fruit. The early panicles were completely covered with Powdery Mildew and there was no fruit set. When the second blooms started showing up, I started spraying the blooms with water from my garden hose and there appeared to be slightly less PM and I’m starting to see fruit set.
(https://i.postimg.cc/QBsXZCMz/624-DCC78-5850-4984-97-C5-76-DADEDD547-A.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/QBsXZCMz)

(https://i.postimg.cc/RWwMYKvf/A0-A58-D3-E-74-D7-4895-8532-7-EA1-F0-B29423.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/RWwMYKvf)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 19, 2019, 07:12:36 PM
I had a bunch of LZ fruit get to 1-1.5 inches long and they all dropped suddenly.

My Kesar graft that is in mostly shade has set some fruit although some are still dropping.

Kesar fruit fruit
(https://i.postimg.cc/kB2dTccg/208-AD193-DCDC-47-F8-9-C72-F7-D657-F4-D70-E.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kB2dTccg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/w7nYZmfc/F566234-E-D638-465-F-92-FD-C7654-D73-DE05.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/w7nYZmfc)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: FMfruitforest on July 20, 2019, 05:36:04 AM
I had a bunch of LZ fruit get to 1-1.5 inches long and they all dropped suddenly.

My Kesar graft that is in mostly shade has set some fruit although some are still dropping.

Kesar fruit fruit
(https://i.postimg.cc/kB2dTccg/208-AD193-DCDC-47-F8-9-C72-F7-D657-F4-D70-E.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kB2dTccg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/w7nYZmfc/F566234-E-D638-465-F-92-FD-C7654-D73-DE05.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/w7nYZmfc)
Simon

Reason for your LZ to drop mangoes?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 20, 2019, 01:55:17 PM
Lemon Zest is known to be a poor holder of fruit and it is highly susceptible to fungal diseases. If you get past the Powdery Mildew in the bloom stage, you still have to deal with fruit drop that is variety specific and LZ is one of those varieties that tends to drop a lot of fruit in SoCal.

There is anecdotal evidence that LZ will hold more fruit as is matures and gets fully established.

I may start spraying my LZ tree with copper, Sulfur and sodium bicarbonate to minimize fungal infections and see if I get more fruit to hold.

My LZ tree was significantly infected with dieback this Winter and it lost approximately 1/4 it’s canopy because I had to cut back many infected branches. Because it was in such poor shape, I had to give it fertilizer and minor and micro nutrients to help stimulate new growth.

The fertilizers did the job and it’s completely filled in its canopy again but I did notice that shortly after I gave it the fertilizers, when new growth was starting to emerge, it coincided with the fruit drop.

Excessive fertilizers or even normal fertilization after fruit set may be detrimental to LZ trees holding fruit.

This is just pure speculation but if more members report back, we may eventually find out why LZ drops so much fruit.

We know that in desert climates like in Palm Springs, LZ sets and holds a lot of fruit. It is difficult for PM to survive at those temps so reduction of fungal pathogens is something that is obvious and one of the main things we should be looking at.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: johnb51 on July 20, 2019, 03:15:24 PM
It almost seems not worth all the effort, Simon.  Are PPK or OS any easier to grow there??
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 20, 2019, 05:09:12 PM
I have PPK and OS but it is too early to tell. LZ is absolutely amazing when you can get it to hold fruit. We will know more in the coming years. I’ve harvested small numbers of fruit from my LZ trees without spraying but in bad years, you can get zero fruit.

I still have hopes that my LZ trees will hold more fruit as it becomes fully established with a large canopy to push past disease pressures.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on July 20, 2019, 08:39:38 PM
It's interesting your LZ suffered from die back. I had no such issues with my two trees grafted with Lemon Zest. My LZ trees are starting there 2nd flush of the year and are the fastest-growing thus far for 2019. My Nam Doc Mai wants to keep flowering and I wish it would just get growing.

I do regularly spray with Sulfer and on occasion cooper just like you. I did have some powdery mildew with LZ but this also effected some of my manila rootstock trees as well.

By the way, I regularly apply Rock Sust (Azomite) to all of my fruit trees and that solves all micronutrient issues.  Our soil especially needs calcium replenishment from time to time and Azomite has 2% calcium.

Time will tell how well LZ does in our area in the long run.

Johnny
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 21, 2019, 12:49:12 AM
Yeah both my LZ and PPK got hit really bad with dieback. I believe that when I get frost at my house, it can cause micro injuries that allow fungus and disease to enter the tree. I also have a lot of sharpshooters that suck the sap from my mango trees and I’ve seen the area where they bite eventually turn black and start dying back.

I don’t currently have my mango trees on a fungicide rotation but I plan on starting really soon. My yard is super wet in the mornings because of all the fog we get.

Leo Manuel is doing it right by planting mango varieties, many of his own, that are highly productive even in high disease areas. He does this without spraying unless absolutely necessary.

Many, if not most of his trees are seedlings he planted out and grew to fruition. By planting seedlings, he did not have to worry about his trees wasting energy on flowering and his seedlings grew strong. If the seedlings produced good fruit, he would keep it and if it didn’t, he would graft over it. Learning from the pioneers is a blessing.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: johnb51 on July 21, 2019, 11:07:43 AM
Simon, is your fundamental problem lack of heat, rain, and air circulation?  Our humidity is outrageous, BUT it's hot and I get plenty of ocean breeze.  Never had any disease or fruit set issues.  (A friend from L.A. said to me the other day, "The things I like most about Florida are mangoes and rain.")
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: hawkfish007 on July 21, 2019, 01:02:06 PM
I still have hope growing mangoes successfully in Southern California. I can’t confirm because I planted most of my mangoes last September but trees like the one below can be seen in many backyards of garden grove area in this time of year. Full of mangoes with new growth, picture taken yesterday.

(https://i.postimg.cc/4YJvp5C8/6501-C7-FC-CA69-4765-86-B2-F3564-DA43346.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4YJvp5C8)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 21, 2019, 04:14:49 PM
Simon, is your fundamental problem lack of heat, rain, and air circulation?  Our humidity is outrageous, BUT it's hot and I get plenty of ocean breeze.  Never had any disease or fruit set issues.  (A friend from L.A. said to me the other day, "The things I like most about Florida are mangoes and rain.")

John, that’s pretty much what it is but the frost is really bad also. I get frost at my place almost every year. We don’t really get heat until this time of year but when we do get the heat, you can see everything flushing and pushing past all the fungal diseases.

During most of the year when it is cooler, the plants are just languishing and disease sets in and the trees are unable to fight off any infections. many people in my neighborhood grow fruit and veggies so there is a lot of sources for fungal spores.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 21, 2019, 04:24:42 PM
I still have hope growing mangoes successfully in Southern California. I can’t confirm because I planted most of my mangoes last September but trees like the one below can be seen in many backyards of garden grove area in this time of year. Full of mangoes with new growth, picture taken yesterday.

(https://i.postimg.cc/4YJvp5C8/6501-C7-FC-CA69-4765-86-B2-F3564-DA43346.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4YJvp5C8)

Hawkfish007,

Trees like that is very possible but most of the larger trees you see like that are seedling trees. Without the influence of florigenic hormones from grafted, mature scions, seedling trees grow with vigor.

Now imagine you take this bit of knowledge and grow seedlings from Polyembryonic mango varieties.  You will get the benefit of delayed sexual maturity so the seedling will grow vigorously for several years and you get the benefit that by growing out a polyembryonic mango variety, there is no need to graft the tree to get good quality fruit. This is assuming you selected the clone or if you have been following my threads, you will grow out at least two seedlings from each Polyembryonic seed in the hopes that at least one seedling is a clone. This is what Brad and I are doing over at the orchard.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on July 22, 2019, 01:46:55 PM
I lost all LZ, Honey Kiss, and Peach Cobbler this year, PM kicked it hard. we had bad late spring. Although I got late small fruitlets on Peach Cobbler that were set recently, they are pea size now.

all these three seem to be intolerant of PM. I sprayed but in vein, didn't help.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: mangomanic12 on July 22, 2019, 03:05:39 PM
Just a reminder to everyone here please let people know whether your trees are grown in POTS or IN THE GROUND.
It makes a huge difference in how the tree performs / fertilization/ water/ disease / sun exposure  issues.
People give examples how a tree performs 2 years or so in a pot and that they produce fruits for them and that's not a true indicator  for a person who may want to grow that same cultivar in ground.
So if you guys remember please indicate whether your mangoes are POT Grown or In-Ground. Thanks!

Mike
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 22, 2019, 03:54:12 PM
Hey Behl,

I’m surprised even your Peach Cobbler got PM.

My in ground Peach Cobbler grafted onto Kent seedling rootstock flowered twice already and set fruit but I removed everything in hopes of getting a vegetative flush but it flowered again. I have not seen PM on my Peach Cobbler yet but there are many strains of Powdery Mildew.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on July 22, 2019, 04:00:19 PM
Hey Behl,

I’m surprised even your Peach Cobbler got PM.

My in ground Peach Cobbler grafted onto Kent seedling rootstock flowered twice already and set fruit but I removed everything in hopes of getting a vegetative flush but it flowered again. I have not seen PM on my Peach Cobbler yet but there are many strains of Powdery Mildew.

Simon

yes, I am surprised too. its 4 yr in ground and this is first time I had this happen, plus a lot of die back lately. I have been chopping it left and right all dead branches. I will spray abound after the heat wave.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: sapote on July 22, 2019, 05:32:01 PM
Maha Chanok, Okrung Tong, Lancetilla are so reliable in fruiting.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 22, 2019, 07:30:08 PM
Manila mango does not seem productive at all here in Glendale. I got a grafted one 3 years ago (the grower said it was 2 years old when I bought it), 2 years in the ground but still cannot hold any fruit. It seems healthy and grows about 1 ft each year. Flushes new growth, plenty of flowers resulted in fruitlets, but all of the fruitlets drop. I will give it one more year before it goes to compos bin.
On the other hand, Little Gem (aka Little Jim) on Florida rootstock is very precocious and productive. Only 4 months in the ground (barely 1 ft, bought it online last March/April) but already held 18 fruitlets and all the fruitlets were growing. I took most of them off but leave 3 hanging on, so far they are growing nicely.
Pickering on Florida rootstock is the 1st year in the ground, flushes new growth and grow big leaves but no flower yet.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on July 22, 2019, 09:47:48 PM
There are lot of reliable mangos in SoCal but we are looking for quality not quantity. I would recommend
ST
Venus
HK
Parson
Harvest moon
OS
And some others
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 26, 2019, 07:37:51 PM
Manila mango does not seem productive at all here in Glendale. I got a grafted one 3 years ago (the grower said it was 2 years old when I bought it), 2 years in the ground but still cannot hold any fruit. It seems healthy and grows about 1 ft each year. Flushes new growth, plenty of flowers resulted in fruitlets, but all of the fruitlets drop. I will give it one more year before it goes to compos bin.
On the other hand, Little Gem (aka Little Jim) on Florida rootstock is very precocious and productive. Only 4 months in the ground (barely 1 ft, bought it online last March/April) but already held 18 fruitlets and all the fruitlets were growing. I took most of them off but leave 3 hanging on, so far they are growing nicely.
Pickering on Florida rootstock is the 1st year in the ground, flushes new growth and grow big leaves but no flower yet.

Palingkecil,

Manilla mango, ungrafted, makes a good rootstock but the fruit is not great. I wonder what kind of Manilla mango you got, most Manilla Mangos in SoCal are seed grown and not grafted. Manilla Mango blooms are susceptible to Powdery Mildew but they can still hold fruit depending on weather conditions and the health of the tree. Trees can have a couple bad years before finally holding some fruit.

Your Little Gem may not grow much, if at all if you let it hold the three little fruits to maturity.

One of the biggest mistakes new mango growers make is to let little, unestablished trees hold fruit to maturity. Read through this thread and it will give you some more information
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=23124.msg286982#msg286982 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=23124.msg286982#msg286982)

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on August 25, 2019, 07:09:54 PM
I will soon be compiling a list of top tier mango varieties that consistently yield well here in SoCal. I will update the first post on this thread with all the varieties that people have chimed in on. If you feel a variety is top tier in terms of taste, that’s good enough for me. The variety still needs to be productive to make it onto this list. If I get mixed reports, I may leave that variety off the list until we get more data.

Even consistently productive varieties can have an off year. That is why I would like everyone to help build this database. The more years we can build upon this database, the better.

I forgot to add that Carrie is also consistently productive here, at least in my yard when I had the tree.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: BonsaiBeast on August 28, 2019, 02:59:32 PM
I see people praising orange sherbert in Florida.

How does it do in southern California? How does it compare to some other good picks like ST, Edward, cac, etc
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on August 28, 2019, 04:19:50 PM
I see people praising orange sherbert in Florida.

How does it do in southern California? How does it compare to some other good picks like ST, Edward, cac, etc

it grows well, have not fruited yet given it was released recently. Not sure how well it will perform compared to how badly LZ does here.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on August 28, 2019, 07:03:07 PM
Manila mango does not seem productive at all here in Glendale. I got a grafted one 3 years ago (the grower said it was 2 years old when I bought it), 2 years in the ground but still cannot hold any fruit. It seems healthy and grows about 1 ft each year. Flushes new growth, plenty of flowers resulted in fruitlets, but all of the fruitlets drop. I will give it one more year before it goes to compos bin.
On the other hand, Little Gem (aka Little Jim) on Florida rootstock is very precocious and productive. Only 4 months in the ground (barely 1 ft, bought it online last March/April) but already held 18 fruitlets and all the fruitlets were growing. I took most of them off but leave 3 hanging on, so far they are growing nicely.
Pickering on Florida rootstock is the 1st year in the ground, flushes new growth and grow big leaves but no flower yet.

Palingkecil,

Manilla mango, ungrafted, makes a good rootstock but the fruit is not great. I wonder what kind of Manilla mango you got, most Manilla Mangos in SoCal are seed grown and not grafted. Manilla Mango blooms are susceptible to Powdery Mildew but they can still hold fruit depending on weather conditions and the health of the tree. Trees can have a couple bad years before finally holding some fruit.

Your Little Gem may not grow much, if at all if you let it hold the three little fruits to maturity.

One of the biggest mistakes new mango growers make is to let little, unestablished trees hold fruit to maturity. Read through this thread and it will give you some more information
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=23124.msg286982#msg286982 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=23124.msg286982#msg286982)

Simon

Thank you for the advise, Simon. I took the little fruitlets off. For the Manila mango, I am not sure what the rootstock is, but I can see the notch graft. Anyway, I bought it for only $40 from a backyard grower in Los Angeles. I have zero experience in grafting, maybe I should buy some scions and just try doing it.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Ant21 on August 30, 2019, 05:39:35 PM
Glenn mango on the ground.I prune the tree as the fruits get ripe.
(https://i.postimg.cc/06N0Zsmd/Screenshot-20190830-143032-Photos.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/06N0Zsmd)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on August 30, 2019, 08:10:19 PM
I would also like to know how Orange Sherbet, Orange Essence, Seacrest and other newer Zill varieties perform here in SoCal. I don’t have the real Orange Sherbet but I do have multiple Orange Sherbet seedlings.

From one of my Orange Sherbet seeds, I got two sprouts. I grafted scions from each seedling onto my double rootstock  multigraft potted mango tree and one of the OS seedlings flowered this year. This is just an OS seedling, I don’t know if this is a clone or not, but whatever it is, the blooms were not affected by Powdery Mildew and it set a fruit. I just removed the fruit yesterday and the sap smells just like Orange Sherbet fruit turpenes. Here’s a picture of the fruit before I removed it. You can see how small the scion is.
(https://i.postimg.cc/gwSPqMWg/2-D773-CE7-E1-E6-4-FAD-853-E-96-C7-A63-EDA93.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gwSPqMWg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/zb4Z4V3W/62398-F9-B-BCA2-4-B68-B30-C-4-BE751569798.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zb4Z4V3W)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: wslau on August 31, 2019, 12:01:36 AM
I would also like to know how Orange Sherbet, Orange Essence, Seacrest and other newer Zill varieties perform here in SoCal. I don’t have the real Orange Sherbet but I do have multiple Orange Sherbet seedlings.

From one of my Orange Sherbet seeds, I got two sprouts. I grafted scions from each seedling onto my double rootstock  multigraft potted mango tree and one of the OS seedlings flowered this year. This is just an OS seedling, I don’t know if this is a clone or not, but whatever it is, the blooms were not affected by Powdery Mildew and it set a fruit. I just removed the fruit yesterday and the sap smells just like Orange Sherbet fruit turpenes. Here’s a picture of the fruit before I removed it. You can see how small the scion is.
(https://i.postimg.cc/gwSPqMWg/2-D773-CE7-E1-E6-4-FAD-853-E-96-C7-A63-EDA93.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gwSPqMWg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/zb4Z4V3W/62398-F9-B-BCA2-4-B68-B30-C-4-BE751569798.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zb4Z4V3W)
Simon

Simon,
For in ground trees...
Seacrest on turpentine is a vigorous tree in SoCal.  Even more vigorous than Seacrest is Ambrosia on turpentine.  Can’t comment on Orange Sherbert....but I did lose an in-ground tiny OS, but not sure why.
Still waiting 1 more year before fruiting.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: JF on August 31, 2019, 01:21:54 AM
Turpentine work in most cases varieties in SoCal. Several varieties do not do well here like:
Guava
Cotton candy
Ice cream
Carrie
and some others but you can always try those varieties on Manila type rootstocks. Here is cotton candy on Manila.
(https://i.postimg.cc/z35XgYXw/562-A1-E25-0-C35-4821-8-DC1-7-A49-A15-AD93-D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/z35XgYXw)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: hawkfish007 on August 31, 2019, 01:49:03 PM
Turpentine work in most cases varieties in SoCal. Several varieties do not do well here like:
Guava
Cotton candy
Ice cream
Carrie
and some others but you can always try those varieties on Manila type rootstocks. Here is cotton candy on Manila.
(https://i.postimg.cc/z35XgYXw/562-A1-E25-0-C35-4821-8-DC1-7-A49-A15-AD93-D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/z35XgYXw)

I second JF, most varieties do well in Southern California regardless of rootstock as long as mangoes are not exposed to low 30s for weeks or even months. Manilla sold by local nurseries mostly originated from La Verne are subject to same phomopsis. I lost my 5 year old La Verne manilla to phomopsis after I unsuccessfully tried to graft onto it last November and cut the dead scion/branches in early February. It showed classic symptoms of drying up from outside to inside. When dried branches are cut brown reddish saps could be seen. Combination of near freezing cold weather and physical stress are fatal to mangoes.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on August 31, 2019, 04:51:58 PM
Turpentine work in most cases varieties in SoCal. Several varieties do not do well here like:
Guava
Cotton candy
Ice cream
Carrie
and some others but you can always try those varieties on Manila type rootstocks. Here is cotton candy on Manila.
(https://i.postimg.cc/z35XgYXw/562-A1-E25-0-C35-4821-8-DC1-7-A49-A15-AD93-D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/z35XgYXw)

All u mentioned on turpentines died on me 2 carrie, 2 guava, 1 cotton candy, 1 ice cream.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on August 31, 2019, 06:51:21 PM
I do not recommend growing dwarf or slow growing varieties here in SoCal but if you absolutely must have a variety that is known to be a dwarf or slow grower, it should be top worked onto a single variety mature tree unless that mature tree is also being top worked with other dwarf or slow growing varieties.

Many people kill their trees by not correcting the roots of pot bound trees, over amending planting holes with too much organic matter and over watering their trees, especially in Winter.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: K-Rimes on September 05, 2019, 02:50:21 PM

(https://i.postimg.cc/rzJhHRdH/1-A50810-D-A91-F-4-AA6-A17-C-7064-E88-F22-C4.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rzJhHRdH)

Getting a decent flush out of this diamond grafted mango. Hope it continues as such for awhile.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: sapote on September 05, 2019, 03:15:50 PM
From one of my Orange Sherbet seeds, I got two sprouts. I grafted scions from each seedling onto my double rootstock  multigraft potted mango tree and one of the OS seedlings flowered this year.

Simon, I'm surprised that  the small scion from the OS seedling having fruit! How old is the OS graft? My experience is that a seedling needs about 3 to 4 years in SoCal before flowering and so I would think the same for the seedling scion.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on September 05, 2019, 05:17:06 PM
I was surprised too, I was hoping it wouldn’t flower for at least 3-4 years. I believe that the mature double rootstocks hormones pushed the scion to flower. This was the first year the rootstock flowered.

The OS graft is under 1 year old if I remember correctly. I’m not at home right now but the metal tag I show in the picture has the graft date.

The seedling that the scions came from is approximately 2 years old.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: behlgarden on September 06, 2019, 05:12:37 PM
I was surprised too, I was hoping it wouldn’t flower for at least 3-4 years. I believe that the mature double rootstocks hormones pushed the scion to flower. This was the first year the rootstock flowered.

The OS graft is under 1 year old if I remember correctly. I’m not at home right now but the metal tag I show in the picture has the graft date.

The seedling that the scions came from is approximately 2 years old.

Simon

its rare but we do get seedlings to bloom under 2 yrs, most in 3-4 yrs. The sad part is these suckers bloom and then get sick due to lack of growth. I have lost a lot of branches on my Peach Cobbler due to Phomosis, its unpredictable on how things happen here. My Coconut cream seedling is now 4 yrs old, its been blooming for 2 yrs but cant handle PM. My Lemon Zest seedling is big now and not bloomed, its 4-yrs there too.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: sapote on October 28, 2019, 06:49:24 PM
Peach cobbler on turpentine rootstock ( wrongly labeled as Edward by TT from Florida) gave me 15 to 20 fruits every year, no PM issue. Thick shoulder skin but dark orange and very good inside. Skin doesn't have strong bitter taste.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on October 29, 2019, 07:51:56 PM
My Peach Cobbler on Seedling rootstock also held fruit in a heavy Powdery Mildew year for me.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 15, 2020, 09:31:53 PM
This year has been especially gloomy and rainy so it will be a good year to evaluate which of the better tasting Mangos are most productive in wet years.

Please share with us which varieties are holding fruit for you this year. If we compile this type of information over multiple years, we can begin to make better recommendations for SoCal mango growers.

The few mango trees I have at my place are still blooming and everything is covered with Powdery Mildew but so far it looks like CAC, Sweet Tart and Peach Cobbler May hold onto some fruit. They are still super tiny but that’s what I see so far.

Simon



Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on April 15, 2020, 10:50:51 PM
Maha tried to hold a bumper crop, but I removed it favoring vegetative growth for it's second year in the ground.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: yonip69 on April 16, 2020, 12:42:56 AM
My 5 years old maha with Florida rootstock in ground is so reliable for me here in San Diego. It is holding around 10 fruits right now and alot of fruitlets.
 But my 5 years old lemon zest flowers like crazy but will not set fruits due to white powdery mildew and I  refused to spray it with chemical so few days ago I top grafted it to what Simon told me that is good here in San Diego. 
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 16, 2020, 12:33:29 PM
Maha is a very consistent producer in SoCal. In my opinion, it’s a good Mango but not top tier. A couple years ago, I removed my tree so that I can replace it with either M4, E4 or Orange Essence. These three varieties are still unproven in terms of reliability when grown in SoCal.

Thanks for the information everyone, keep it coming if you have anything to add!

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: BonsaiBeast on April 16, 2020, 06:30:04 PM
Maha is a very consistent producer in SoCal. In my opinion, it’s a good Mango but not top tier. A couple years ago, I removed my tree so that I can replace it with either M4, E4 or Orange Essence. These three varieties are still unproven in terms of reliability when grown in SoCal.

Thanks for the information everyone, keep it coming if you have anything to add!

Simon

What made you choose M4, E4, and Orange Essence given that they are not proven here?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on April 16, 2020, 06:43:27 PM
Maha is a very consistent producer in SoCal. In my opinion, it’s a good Mango but not top tier. A couple years ago, I removed my tree so that I can replace it with either M4, E4 or Orange Essence. These three varieties are still unproven in terms of reliability when grown in SoCal.

Thanks for the information everyone, keep it coming if you have anything to add!

Simon

The Maha I tasted from my tree was exceptional. If you (Alex as well it seems) say it's only mid-grade it really stirs my interest in the newer top cultivars.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on May 27, 2020, 08:22:34 AM
J12 on Kent seedling rootstock appears to be at least somewhat disease resistant. I have absolutely horrible Powdery Mildew on my mango trees this year and this little J12 is starting to set some tiny fruit. I’m going to remove all these fruit this week to encourage vegetative growth.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Wh9zQhbN/1-D5922-CD-D4-F8-435-C-9775-C7-A941-D98-FD6.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Wh9zQhbN)

(https://i.postimg.cc/rKyznSTZ/E4-BEC530-3-C10-46-AD-AEA0-883-E7-DDF324-A.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rKyznSTZ)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on May 27, 2020, 10:11:09 AM
My J12 results are encouraging as well. Growth and fruit set look awesome on both random seedling (Exotica) and Turpentine rootstock. This is despite strong PM, which I'm not seeing on your bloom, but is everywhere here.

It's reported that this one is exceptionally vigorous in Fl, so looks like we may have something that will make the grade here.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: RobPatterson on June 04, 2020, 08:05:10 PM
I'm looking to get a mango tree to add to my garden. I live in Ontario, CA, and I want to get a more mature tree that I can plant in the ground, get good fruit with reasonable yield, but Im having trouble finding specifics on A) which variety to get for my area, and B) where I can get a tree that's older than just a one gallon Home Depot sapling. My thing is dragon fruit, so Im very green when it comes to mangos and fruit from proper trees. I'm not looking for a 30 year old monster Id have to airlift into the yard, just something that has at least a year or two of growth behind it. Is that something Id have to go to a private grower for, especially to get a decent variety?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Viraldonutz on June 04, 2020, 08:37:45 PM
Are Lemon Zest worth growing in SoCal, or nah?  Should I try PPK instead?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 05, 2020, 03:23:05 AM
Maha is a very consistent producer in SoCal. In my opinion, it’s a good Mango but not top tier. A couple years ago, I removed my tree so that I can replace it with either M4, E4 or Orange Essence. These three varieties are still unproven in terms of reliability when grown in SoCal.

Thanks for the information everyone, keep it coming if you have anything to add!

Simon

What made you choose M4, E4, and Orange Essence given that they are not proven here?

Sorry, just saw your question. I’m planting these based on flavor and a little bit of information from my friends in Florida. Without testing out new varieties here in SoCal, we would never know for sure how well they will perform.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 05, 2020, 03:30:26 AM
I'm looking to get a mango tree to add to my garden. I live in Ontario, CA, and I want to get a more mature tree that I can plant in the ground, get good fruit with reasonable yield, but Im having trouble finding specifics on A) which variety to get for my area, and B) where I can get a tree that's older than just a one gallon Home Depot sapling. My thing is dragon fruit, so Im very green when it comes to mangos and fruit from proper trees. I'm not looking for a 30 year old monster Id have to airlift into the yard, just something that has at least a year or two of growth behind it. Is that something Id have to go to a private grower for, especially to get a decent variety?

You should call around your local nurseries to see if they have larger rootstocks for sale. I know Ongs Nursery in San Diego has some larger Manilla type trees but it’ll cost you more.

I would also recommend you just plant some Kent seeds while you are looking for your larger tree. The seedlings adapt really well and can grow fast if you fertilize them appropriately.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Jose Spain on June 05, 2020, 03:34:09 AM
Hi everyone, :)

I follow with interest this topic because your climate is pretty similar to mine so there are good chances that same cvs will perform in a similar way here. I don't mean any disrespect by what I'm going to comment now, it's just my opinion. I think there is an unjustified phobia to "chemicals" (everything is chemical, even water) often favored by certain companies of "bio" products. Unless there are strong evidences (with serious, thorough studies to support it) that a particular fungicide product (not chemicals in general) can produce health risks even respecting safety periods, I use it and don't give up varieties like LZ (for many the best cv) because they require fungicides during flowering. The safety periods of these products are based on very exhaustive tests and a mango requires months to mature, that is, many times the safety period of most fungicides against powdery mildew. As I said, I don't mean any disrespect by bringing this up, simply I see more and more people getting into this chemophobia and I think alternatives points of view can be useful. Of course everyone is free to do whatever he decides, I just think that many times we could be missing useful information about which particular fungicides are better to treat some plagues just because it's becoming little by little kind of an anathema. I let you a paper about this topic that could be of interest.


https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257789222_Food_chemistry_and_chemophobia (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257789222_Food_chemistry_and_chemophobia)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 05, 2020, 03:57:00 AM
Are Lemon Zest worth growing in SoCal, or nah?  Should I try PPK instead?

I love Lemon Zest Mangos, one of my favorites. I personally have 3 LZ trees/grafts at my house and I planted more at my friends and families yards. The fruit is absolutely top notch but the tree is a Powdery Mildew magnet.

The PM infects the young leaves really bad and the blooms get them really bad as well. The flower panicles often abort due to the fungal infection but here in SoCal, our trees can bloom about three times. If you are lucky, one of those blooms will occur during a period where there is little or no fungal diseases and you may get some fruit.

One year, I had extremely heavy fruit set with maybe 100 or more baby LZ fruit that got to around 1 inch long and they slowly dropped one by one and I only ended getting 1-3 fruit that year, I can’t remember exactly.

If you want a highly productive tree, don’t get LZ unless you are willing to spray and have a regimented IPM system.

My initial thoughts were that I will let Mother Nature take its course but now I really want my LZ tree to start producing more so I am starting my IPM this year and will continue it to see if I can get significantly higher yield from my trees.

There are rumors that LZ needs many years to get settled down before it will start producing. The fruit is so good, I’m willing to wait it out but in the meantime, I’m going to start spraying.

You can read this thread where I’m going to track my progress
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=33398.msg375454#msg375454 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=33398.msg375454#msg375454)

On a side note, I am also growing grafted PPK and Orange Sherbet seedlings. I’ve tasted all three multiple times before and LZ is still my favorite although the other two are also excellent.

Seacrest/Triple Sec may be another good mango to test out. I recently grafted several onto my seedlings so we will see in the coming years if this variety is productive here in SoCal.

Remember that our microclimates are unique and if you get good air flow at your location, LZ may do fine for you. Everyone should try for themselves just in case.

There is a little bit of good news with LZ, I’ve noticed over the years that my LZ grafted onto Lavern Manilla gets significantly less PM and also sets and natures more fruit than my LZ on Florida rootstock. I’ll update with pics soon in my other thread.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 05, 2020, 04:07:05 AM
Hi everyone, :)

I follow with interest this topic because your climate is pretty similar to mine so there are good chances that same cvs will perform in a similar way here. I don't mean any disrespect by what I'm going to comment now, it's just my opinion. I think there is an unjustified phobia to "chemicals" (everything is chemical, even water) often favored by certain companies of "bio" products. Unless there are strong evidences (with serious, thorough studies to support it) that a particular fungicide product (not chemicals in general) can produce serious health risks even respecting safety periods, I do not understand why to give up varieties like LZ (for many the best cv) because it requires fungicides during flowering. The safety periods of these products are based on very exhaustive tests and a mango requires months to mature, that is, many times the safety period of most fungicides against powdery mildew. As I said, I don't mean any disrespect by bringing this up, simply I see more and more people getting into this chemophobia and I think an alternative point of view can be useful. Of course everyone is free to do whatever he decides, I just think that many times we could be missing useful information about which particular fungicides are better to treat some plagues just because it's becoming little by little kind of an anathema. I let you a paper about this topic that could be of interest.


https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257789222_Food_chemistry_and_chemophobia (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257789222_Food_chemistry_and_chemophobia)

Jose Spain,

I completely agree with you and I do not oppose using chemicals, I’m going to start my IPM this year but it will be well thought out if I’m going to do it.

The reason why I haven’t done it yet is because I’m lazy and I know many other LZ growers here in SoCal don’t want to spray frequently in order to get fruit from this variety when there are many other varieties that will produce without spraying.

I’m not one of those people, anymore. I love the fruit so much that I’m going to pony up and purchase the different fungicides and stickers. I’ll post more detailed info in the link above.

There are some great systemic fungicides that are OMRI listed such as Magnabon CS 2005 which Mark has mentioned several times. I will be using Phyton 35 instead because it’s easier to purchase for me. I will be combining this fungicide with other fungicides that have different modes of action so that the organisms will not build resistance.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Jose Spain on June 05, 2020, 04:32:35 AM
Hi Simon,

I have actually a similar problem to yours with PM, this spring was specially rainy and I alternated cupric-based and triazol fungicides and PM was controlled pretty well both in mangos and roses. It may be a good idea to cover with a plastic the soil before spraying to don't affect the soil microbial community and avoid too high Cu concentrations. Since we usually have just a few trees to spray it's not a big deal to do so.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 06, 2020, 01:25:23 PM
Hey Jose, thanks for the suggestion!

I just want to bring up another important point here for those members that may have not seen my post in the fogger thread.

I used to use hand pump/backpack sprayers for foliar feeding and for insect/disease control. I stopped using the pump sprayers after I got my fogging backpack sprayer. Foggers are completely next level and if you have more than a few trees, I highly recommend at least doing your research on fogging.

The fogger saves me an incredible amount of time and money, so much that I couldn’t even believe it. I posted in another thread my actual savings but I can’t remember exactly right now so I’m just going to go off my memory.

I believe I was able to complete my spraying in about 1/4-1/3 the time by fogging instead of pump spraying. So if it normally takes me 2 hours to spray all my trees, now it only takes me 30 minutes. This is because with a pump sprayer, you have to invert your spray head upside down in order to spray the underside of the leaves and you also have to stick your wand into the canopy and poke hole around to get just ok coverage, I never could get full coverage on larger trees because the wand/spray just couldn’t reach up high enough.

The foggers creates a mist that penetrates into the canopy so you don’t have to fumble around.

The foggers also use significantly less solution because it atomizes the particles. Instead of using 6-8 gallons of solution for all my trees, I only need to use about 2 gallons.

All this was just to say that with a fogger, there is very little drip so it minimizes impact of soil microbial life when compared to traditional hand pump/backpack pump spraying.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: UplanderCA on June 08, 2020, 08:00:20 PM
I'm looking to get a mango tree to add to my garden. I live in Ontario, CA, and I want to get a more mature tree that I can plant in the ground, get good fruit with reasonable yield, but Im having trouble finding specifics on A) which variety to get for my area, and B) where I can get a tree that's older than just a one gallon Home Depot sapling. My thing is dragon fruit, so Im very green when it comes to mangos and fruit from proper trees. I'm not looking for a 30 year old monster Id have to airlift into the yard, just something that has at least a year or two of growth behind it. Is that something Id have to go to a private grower for, especially to get a decent variety?

Hello Rob,
I live in Upland and we share similar climates - except for the heavy winds that Ontario experiences.  I would recommend planting a Home Depot mango tree (Manila) and graft the variety you want onto the tree.  The Manila tree grows fast.  I'm top-working my Manila tree with other varieties at the moment.   My Manila tree has been on the ground for 5 years and is now over 13 ft tall.  I have  Valencia Pride and Nam Doc Mai, both from Florida and have been on the ground for 6 years and are under 7 ft tall.  Both the VP and NDM produce fruit reliably in Upland (Inland Empire including  Rancho Cucamonga, Ontario, Pomona).  This year would be the fourth straight year of successful fruiting. 

If you want to purchase a large Mango Tree in the Inland Empire area try:
SOCAL NURSERY
9312 BEN NEVIS BLVD
RIVERSIDE CA 92509
(951) 295-3525
OPEN MON-FRIDAY 7AM TO 5PM SATURDAY 7AM TO 3PM
CLOSED SUNDAYS
I have been there a few times and they have large fruit trees (many over 6 ft tall) - including Mangos.  Hope this helps.

Tony
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on June 11, 2020, 05:26:22 PM
Honey Kiss is very productive in SoCal. This picture from my friends tree has been posted before but it’s great visual proof it produces well here. The Honey Miss was grafted onto an established LaVern Manilla rootstock.
(https://i.postimg.cc/rDkJFQ2p/45641-F2-B-4-FD2-42-CC-A348-4-D3349-CC02-B9.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rDkJFQ2p)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Calreef18 on April 17, 2021, 11:23:57 AM
Any updates from people for this season?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: spaugh on April 17, 2021, 01:28:21 PM
My winters 20222 tree is LOADED with fruitless.   This will be the first year letting it set a good load.  Its around 5 years old and is a strong grower, very erect and strong growth.  Its one that many of the local nurseries sell because it grows strong here. 

I will top work some other droppy trees over to this variety. 

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 20, 2021, 12:50:30 AM
I know some people have bad luck with PPK but my PPK tree gets lots of fungus on its blooms and dropped all of its fruit so far this year. It’s disease resistance to the fungus in my yard is very weak, similar to Lemon Zest.

Pineapple pleasure was setting good amounts of fruit in my yard and E4 and M4 looked good so far but still much too early to tell.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: sapote on April 20, 2021, 04:26:22 PM
The most reliable and less decease of my trees in this order:

Peach cobbler
Iman Pasand
Maha
Okrung Tong
LZ
Alphonso

Fort my location, pick off all flowers until March 1 when it's warmer and high chance of fruits set.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palmcity on April 20, 2021, 06:51:44 PM
The PM infects the young leaves really bad and the blooms get them really bad as well. The flower panicles often abort due to the fungal infection but here in SoCal, our trees can bloom about three times. If you are lucky, one of those blooms will occur during a period where there is little or no fungal diseases and you may get some fruit.

One year, I had extremely heavy fruit set with maybe 100 or more baby LZ fruit that got to around 1 inch long and they slowly dropped one by one and I only ended getting 1-3 fruit that year, I can’t remember exactly.

My initial thoughts were that I will let Mother Nature take its course
Simon

Just my observations over the years...
I believe Temperature plays a major role in the year to year fluctuation of powdery mildew seen on my trees. (Humidity, sunlight,air flow, humidity, etc. also factor in spore growth).

Unfortunately I see little to no studies on mango trees powdery mildew growth vs. temperature, but other plants have received some studies and IMO the hawthorne study closely resembles my location yearly temperature vs. powdery mildew growth over the past many years.

I Graph shows peaking growth rate at about 23C (73.4F) and rapidly dropping when temperatures hit 27C (80.6F) and stopping almost Completely at 29C (84.2F)...

So... Hope for some hot 84.2F (29C) weather during flower bloom and powdery mildew should be far less if my guess is correct... This is also why I think most of the 2nd and 3rd blooms are more successful in setting mango crops in south florida as usually the temperature is much warmer (also why I believe Miami has less of a powdery mildew problem than in Martin County, Fl where I live and it is cooler here and hotter in Miami).

Go to Figure 2 in below site
https://bsppjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1046/j.1365-3059.2000.00520.x

Well, no one's commenting thus I will add some suggestions:::
It would be easy for one like Mark in Tx. to test this by enclosing his area if able to regulate temperature between 85 and 90F During bloom and till fruit set if facilities allow... It might save some expense on fungicides but will probably cost more on electricity & gas... Just a thought. Perhaps others with green houses have tried these temps during bloom to decrease/stop powdery mildew???  Then again, perhaps just too fun opening up the green houses & shutting off the heat... lol.



Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Lovetoplant on April 21, 2021, 03:49:42 AM
The most reliable and less decease of my trees in this order:

Peach cobbler
Iman Pasand
Maha
Okrung Tong
LZ
Alphonso

Fort my location, pick off all flowers until March 1 when it's warmer and high chance of fruits set.

Sapote,  this will be my first year grafting mango scions on to the seedlings.  You do not live that far from me and I am interested in the verities you have growing.    Will you able to sell me some scions for grafting this summer?  TIA
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: fruitnut1944 on April 21, 2021, 08:57:47 AM
The PM infects the young leaves really bad and the blooms get them really bad as well. The flower panicles often abort due to the fungal infection but here in SoCal, our trees can bloom about three times. If you are lucky, one of those blooms will occur during a period where there is little or no fungal diseases and you may get some fruit.

One year, I had extremely heavy fruit set with maybe 100 or more baby LZ fruit that got to around 1 inch long and they slowly dropped one by one and I only ended getting 1-3 fruit that year, I can’t remember exactly.

My initial thoughts were that I will let Mother Nature take its course
Simon

Just my observations over the years...
I believe Temperature plays a major role in the year to year fluctuation of powdery mildew seen on my trees. (Humidity, sunlight,air flow, humidity, etc. also factor in spore growth).

Unfortunately I see little to no studies on mango trees powdery mildew growth vs. temperature, but other plants have received some studies and IMO the hawthorne study closely resembles my location yearly temperature vs. powdery mildew growth over the past many years.

I Graph shows peaking growth rate at about 23C (73.4F) and rapidly dropping when temperatures hit 27C (80.6F) and stopping almost Completely at 29C (84.2F)...

So... Hope for some hot 84.2F (29C) weather during flower bloom and powdery mildew should be far less if my guess is correct... This is also why I think most of the 2nd and 3rd blooms are more successful in setting mango crops in south florida as usually the temperature is much warmer (also why I believe Miami has less of a powdery mildew problem than in Martin County, Fl where I live and it is cooler here and hotter in Miami).

Go to Figure 2 in below site
https://bsppjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1046/j.1365-3059.2000.00520.x

Well, no one's commenting thus I will add some suggestions:::
It would be easy for one like Mark in Tx. to test this by enclosing his area if able to regulate temperature between 85 and 90F During bloom and till fruit set if facilities allow... It might save some expense on fungicides but will probably cost more on electricity & gas... Just a thought. Perhaps others with green houses have tried these temps during bloom to decrease/stop powdery mildew???  Then again, perhaps just too fun opening up the green houses & shutting off the heat... lol.

I'll be growing mango in a warm dry greenhouse soon. Do you think there will be PM or other fungal issues even with no rain? The only other fruit with PM is grapes. Nothing else on a wide variety of fruits. I can get to 90-100F if wanted even on most days in winter. There will be humidity at night but not when it's warm and of course no rain.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palmcity on April 21, 2021, 09:46:48 AM
Just my observations over the years...
I believe Temperature plays a major role in the year to year fluctuation of powdery mildew seen on my trees. (Humidity, sunlight,air flow, humidity, etc. also factor in spore growth).

Unfortunately I see little to no studies on mango trees powdery mildew growth vs. temperature, but other plants have received some studies and IMO the hawthorne study closely resembles my location yearly temperature vs. powdery mildew growth over the past many years.

I Graph shows peaking growth rate at about 23C (73.4F) and rapidly dropping when temperatures hit 27C (80.6F) and stopping almost Completely at 29C (84.2F)...

So... Hope for some hot 84.2F (29C) weather during flower bloom and powdery mildew should be far less if my guess is correct... This is also why I think most of the 2nd and 3rd blooms are more successful in setting mango crops in south florida as usually the temperature is much warmer (also why I believe Miami has less of a powdery mildew problem than in Martin County, Fl where I live and it is cooler here and hotter in Miami).

Go to Figure 2 in below site
https://bsppjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1046/j.1365-3059.2000.00520.x

Suggestions:::
If able to regulate temperature between 85 and 90F During bloom and till fruit set if facilities allow, might save some expense on fungicides but will probably cost more on electricity & gas... Just a thought. Perhaps others with green houses have tried these temps during bloom to decrease/stop powdery mildew??? 

I'll be growing mango in a warm dry greenhouse soon. Do you think there will be PM or other fungal issues even with no rain? The only other fruit with PM is grapes. Nothing else on a wide variety of fruits. I can get to 90-100F if wanted even on most days in winter. There will be humidity at night but not when it's warm and of course no rain.

My guess... Do not exceed 95 F as most fruiting plants begin to have problems growing upward of this temp. except dates/cacti etc. Probably 84.2 to 90F would be the better experiment temperature to slow or stop powdery mildew in green house during bloom to fruit set.

Just curious if adjusted ambient temperature could significantly slow/stop powdery mildew regardless of humidity/air flow/ sunlight hitting the leaves/ etc. (Ex.Often the leaf temperature will be 95F when sunshine hits the leaf even if ambient temperature is far less like 90F... so if 95F ambient then leaf temp. might be 100F in sunlight etc.)

With my limited reading, it is obvious that many fruiting plants have different powdery mildew spores and/or specific survival temperature ranges for the powdery mildew and the temperatures needed to stop powdery mildew growth would be higher than 84.2F.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on November 16, 2021, 08:26:10 PM
I harvested a bunch of CAC mangos this year and they were all good but not excellent. I’m removing it from the top tier list even though one individual fruit I ate a couple years ago was super amazing. I still recommend planting CAC because it is Polyembryonic and makes a good rootstock with good quality fruit but it’s inconsistent in eating quality and more often than not, it’s more of like a cross between Kent and NDM. CAC is also great for using as a rootstock because it requires more stimulus to fruit.

On another topic, Venus has been one of my best producers of large and consistently excellent quality fruit. The fruit are between 1-2 lbs, colorful with a medium sized seed, super juicy and the floral inflorescence is resistant to disease. Venus is a vigorous grower and even with the barge size fruit, it can produce fruit in clusters.

The Venus nubbins were super concentrated in flavor and there were very few nubbins compared to Sweet Tart. This may indicate that the Venus Blooms may be more resistant to fungal diseases or perhaps the blooms have a wider acceptable temperature range for pollination.

The flavor profile of Venus is a very sweet tropical mango base flavor with good levels of Sweet Tart like Indochinese spice. There is just enough acid balance to make this a perfectly balanced mango in terms of sweet and tart. This mango is super juicy and mostly fiberless. Although some people may consider Venus as a toned down version of Sweet Tart, I feel that Venus can hold its own and for some people that may not like ultra sweet fruit, they may prefer Venus over Sweet Tart. I really love Sweet Tart but man, my Venus the last several years have been phenomenal and I rank it right up there with Sweet Tart, E4, Lemon Zest, Peach Cobbler, Pina Colada, Coconut Cream and Pineapple Pleasure.

For everyone growing in SoCal, get yourself a Venus!
(https://i.postimg.cc/bs7TNY02/08-DE9-A51-C047-46-E4-BEB5-D5770-F18-C8-DB.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bs7TNY02)

(https://i.postimg.cc/0rHnF0bn/4-AC0430-B-A0-D8-45-BF-B3-FE-2221-DFE79-C9-A.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/0rHnF0bn)

(https://i.postimg.cc/gr04gTkr/69-CB4-CF2-AD9-B-44-CE-A7-E3-877-D3225-EC85.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gr04gTkr)

(https://i.postimg.cc/kB6smRSm/84-C5250-A-B7-A4-45-CD-9-F70-B1-D0-A71856-D7.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kB6smRSm)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Hermitian on November 17, 2021, 04:43:24 AM
I recommend Valencia Pride.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: jtnguyen333 on November 17, 2021, 10:47:38 PM
Has anyone try to grow / taste Golden Lady?  I believe only Wong farm near palm desert sells this variety?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: duren on April 08, 2022, 12:29:30 PM
Has anyone try to grow ST Mauii, Bombay and Dupuis Saigon?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on April 08, 2022, 11:38:22 PM
VP is a good mango that I won’t turn down and it grows wonderfully here but I wouldn’t put it on my top tier list although many will disagree with me.

I haven’t tried to grow Golden Lady so I don’t know how well it will do here.

ST Maui grows and fruits fine here, Bombay has production issues at some locations and not others.

Dupuis Saigon does fine for me at my location, it gets some Powdery Mildew like NDM but it still hold some fruit to maturity. The fruit quality can be quite good.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: MarktLee on April 09, 2022, 10:07:51 PM
My orange sherbet, Thom Pi Khan and harvest moon are holding thumbnail size fruit. I'm really thinning the fruit, they should grow nice through the summer.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: love_Tropic on June 30, 2023, 04:02:11 PM
Can anyone having success growing , please post Top 3 in each of the Flavor for "Best tasting and most reliable" to Grow in SoCal? Updated the flavor from tropicalacresfarms.com site may not be 100% for SoCal.

Classic - Sindhri, Kent , Honey Kiss,
Coconut - Coconut Cream
Indochinese -
Indochinese hybrid - Sweet Tart
Indian/West Indian -
Indian Alphonso - Kesar,
Thai - NDM
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on June 30, 2023, 06:47:48 PM
Aloha is a classic flavored fruit, and does very well. Oro is something difficult to categorize, it's close to Julie, but without resin, just coconut notes and flavor similar to White Sapote. It does great.

For the resin Oro lacks, Val-Carrie more than makes up for it. The resin is similar to Kesar, and the tree is a very upright grower.

I have another seedling that performs well, but the blooms are susceptible to disease. The tree is extremely vigorous, but with a citrus smell. It may hold fruit this year.

Reliable ones are hard to find, as too much production can sap vigor.

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on June 30, 2023, 07:24:54 PM
I will give you my experience based on reliability and Fruit quality here in California.

Note: Trees should be at least five years old with strong rootstock and sandy loam soil, not clay for best growth.

Angie:  This precocious mango produces very well at my location and tastes wonderful. I love this mango.

Val-Carrie:  I am impressed with the consistency and production of this mango in SoCal. (See my attached photo from late June, much young fruit)

Sweet Tart: Patience is a virtue with this variety. At seven years my tree is loaded in 2023 (See Photo)   

Mallika:  I liked the fruit from 2022 and again it is productive, This is grafted onto the same tree as the Val-Carrie. (see photo)

Fruit Punch:  My three-year-old graft has numerous fruit sets in 2023. I need more time for evaluation but so far it's looking good.

Guava: Also looking good with a nice fruit set.

Seacrest:  My three-year-old graft is holding a number of fruit. We will see on this one. Need more time.

Here are the duds at my location:

Coconut Cream:  My seven-year-old tree has no fruit. Who knows maybe at 10 years it might start producing. The tree does grow very well though.

Nam Doc Mai:  This tree blooms constantly but has mediocre fruit quality, avoid in my opinion.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/rdqkCmWV/8-U1-A2489-Mallika-Val-Carrie-Mango-Tree-in-RB-after-Trimming-6-29-23.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rdqkCmWV)
Val-Carrie and Mallika Mango Tree (6-29-23)



(https://i.postimg.cc/w7J8CJQx/8-U1-A2547-Sweet-Tart-Mango-Tree-with-Small-Fruit-at-10-AM-6-29-23.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/w7J8CJQx)
Sweet Tart Mango Tree in Early Summer
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palmcity on June 30, 2023, 07:56:09 PM
I harvested a bunch of CAC mangos this year and they were all good but not excellent. I’m removing it from the top tier list even though one individual fruit I ate a couple years ago was super amazing.
Simon
There are a few mangos that IMO taste better in the refrigerator. IMO CAC is definitely one of them. Bovine421 mentioned that Cac left in the refrigerator almost to dehydrating/wrinkling state tasted to him like Cola and he then offered it to his wife as he did not believe the taste perception he received from this old refrigerated CAC... But, it tasted like Cola to his wife also....

I just replicated in my refrigerator this feat and yes it tasted like sweet, non seltzered, non acidic Cola. The indochinese zing was gone... lol (I actually get tired of too many indochinese mango choices). I now prefer my Cac being in the frig for a few days.  It was cut in half and placed open air in the refrigerator to dehydrate/change faster...

So it probably got converted to the milder flavoring like many fruits tasting pineapple will convert to a milder coconut taste with time in the refrigerator...

Just a possibility as to why years ago you really liked that one Cac so much... Also a new test to perform lol...




Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Elijah on July 01, 2023, 01:49:02 PM
This thread is so valuable for the new members like me who live in SoCal. Thank you for the posts.
Please keep update with any changes.
So far, it looks like Sweet Tart, Val Carrie, Venus, and Maha are well resistant to disease, consistently productive and doing well here. Can someone add or remove more varieties doing well here ?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 01, 2023, 02:29:39 PM
I ate quite a few CAC this year and I have to bump it back up a notch. I have tried CAC when it’s refrigerated. I don’t wait until it’s wrinkled but just put it into the fridge for several hours to chill and this years fruit were excellent with great sugar levels and a great subacid component with just the mildest indochinese hint to add a bit of complexity. The slight indochinese is right next to the skin. With the disease resistance, vigorous growth, great size fruit, great flavor and it being Polyembryonic, I have to put this back into the top tier category even though it isn’t a flavor bomb.

Elijah, I would add Cotton Candy, Fruit Punch, Pina Colada seedling, CAC, Pineapple Pleasure, Angie, E4, M4 and I’ll probably remember a few more later. My yard gets about the minimum heat required to mature mangos and I get slight frost almost every year and have a crazy resistant powdery mildew strain and these varieties all produced for me.

Remember that each yard and microclimate is different and even if you live just a few blocks away from me, the performance of each variety could vary dramatically.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 01, 2023, 02:40:22 PM
Reminder that after about twenty years of experimenting with mangos in SoCal that the takeaway is to get your trees as large as possible in the early years. This is accomplished by planting a bunch of random seedlings and selecting for the ones with the most vigorous growth. Ideally, these seedlings are Polyembryonic so there (may?)be no need to graft.

Alternatively, purchase seedling rootstocks from Home Depot or another nursery. Maximize growth by fertilizing especially before and during the heat of Summer when the majority of our growing season is in SoCal.

The third way which could give you the fastest growth based on my experiments is to use the California Super Mango Rootstock technique by innarching 1+ extra rootstocks to a Polyembryonic seedling. This will require the most work but the double or triple rootstock trees will grow approximately 30-50% faster but results could vary depending on the vigor of the innarched seedlings.

Simon

https://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Elijah on July 02, 2023, 12:11:22 PM
Use the California Super Mango Rootstock technique by innarching 1+ extra rootstocks to a Polyembryonic seedling. This will require the most work but the double or triple rootstock trees will grow approximately 30-50% faster but results could vary depending on the vigor of the innarched seedlings.

Simon

https://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0

Thank you for sharing your insight. Could you explain "innarching 1+ extra rootstocks to a Polyembryonic seedling" more, please?  I cannot picture it.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on July 02, 2023, 02:37:38 PM
By planting the poly seed of the desired variety you're skipping the flowering which deprives the tree of energy for the first few years in the hopes it gets established before the prolonged flowering period robs the tree of vigor each year. The goal of inarching is to get the tree more vigor to help it establish more readily.
You add roots to the poly seedling by planting a second mango seed near enough the trunk that you can bend the trunk of the additional sapling close to the poly seedling and by making an opening in the bark of the poly tree, you decapitate the sapling and insert the growing tip under the bark so that the cambium of the sapling is in contact with the cambium of the poly seedling.
Easy method is to slice the sapling like you were to saddle graft it, and slip it under the incision of the bark of the poly seedling where the incision is the shape of an inverted "T".
You can choose any shape which allows the cambium of the two to heal together, and then remove the tip of the sapling when healed.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 02, 2023, 06:41:15 PM
Has anyone try to grow / taste Golden Lady?  I believe only Wong farm near palm desert sells this variety?

I bought a  Golden Lady tree from Wong Farm in 2019. According to them, it grafted on their own rootstock which they said proven to be superior than turpentine or manila rootstock.
It was not the case in my backyard. Despite of the extra care, this tree did not grow much in my backyard, kept struggling until it just died last year.
Maybe it depends on each person's yard and position of each tree. Weirdly in my yard, Florida turpentine rootstock does better than any other rootstocks including Manila and 'California superior rootstocks' I bought from local So-Cal nurseries.
The best grower and most reliable mango in my yard is Sugarloaf on turpentine rootstock. I bought it on eBay from a backyard grower in Florida.
Almost neglected, with just automatic drip system, the Sugarloaf grows beautifully and always gives me full size flawless fruits since the year I bought it. I thin it aggressively and only left 2-3 fruits each year since the tree is only 5 ft tall now from a 3 gallon on 2020.
OS on turpentine is super vigorous and productive, but the PM always heavy on this tree. OS fruit is delicious, but because of the PM, most fruitlets won't make it to maturity.

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on July 02, 2023, 07:39:03 PM
Has anyone try to grow / taste Golden Lady?  I believe only Wong farm near palm desert sells this variety?

I bought a  Golden Lady tree from Wong Farm in 2019. According to them, it grafted on their own rootstock which they said proven to be superior than turpentine or manila rootstock.
It was not the case in my backyard. Despite of the extra care, this tree did not grow much in my backyard, kept struggling until it just died last year.
Maybe it depends on each person's yard and position of each tree. Weirdly in my yard, Florida turpentine rootstock does better than any other rootstocks including Manila and 'California superior rootstocks' I bought from local So-Cal nurseries.
The best grower and most reliable mango in my yard is Sugarloaf on turpentine rootstock. I bought it on eBay from a backyard grower in Florida.
Almost neglected, with just automatic drip system, the Sugarloaf grows beautifully and always gives me full size flawless fruits since the year I bought it. I thin it aggressively and only left 2-3 fruits each year since the tree is only 5 ft tall now from a 3 gallon on 2020.
OS on turpentine is super vigorous and productive, but the PM always heavy on this tree. OS fruit is delicious, but because of the PM, most fruitlets won't make it to maturity.

post photos of your trees. :)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on July 02, 2023, 09:20:04 PM
"Almost neglected, with just automatic drip system, the Sugarloaf grows beautifully and always gives me full size flawless fruits since the year I bought it. I thin it aggressively and only left 2-3 fruits each year since the tree is only 5 ft tall now from a 3 gallon on 2020."  By Palingkecil

Interesting my Sugarloaf mango tree on Turpentine in greenhouse conditions has not grown at all here in Socal. After over one year in the greenhouse, the tree is still only 27" tall. (See Photo)

Perhaps I have a dud, Low vigor with little growth. Would be nice for others that have Sugarloaf to post.  A wide-angle photo would be nice so we can actually see and compare. Let's see your flawless Sugerloaft fruits Palingkecil.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/4H7xg9zR/8-U1-A2270-Sugarloaf-Mango-Tree-in-7-Container-6-25-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4H7xg9zR)
Sugarloaf Mango Tree on Turpentine in Socal
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: mbmango on July 03, 2023, 12:54:59 AM
I had a Sugarloaf graft (Alex 2020) on an in-ground Ataulfo seedling rootstock and it was much less vigorous than M4 and Seacrest on the same roots.  This winter was apparently too much for it though, and the whole branch died back past the graft.  No other dieback on the other 2 varieties.

I have 1 remaining graft on a backup potted seedling, which hasn't grown much either since 2020.  I've tried to baby that thing by  bringing it in my office over the first winter and putting it in a cold frame the next, but it only gives 1 or 2 weak pushes a year.

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 12:23:32 PM
By planting the poly seed of the desired variety you're skipping the flowering which deprives the tree of energy for the first few years in the hopes it gets established before the prolonged flowering period robs the tree of vigor each year. The goal of inarching is to get the tree more vigor to help it establish more readily.
You add roots to the poly seedling by planting a second mango seed near enough the trunk that you can bend the trunk of the additional sapling close to the poly seedling and by making an opening in the bark of the poly tree, you decapitate the sapling and insert the growing tip under the bark so that the cambium of the sapling is in contact with the cambium of the poly seedling.
Easy method is to slice the sapling like you were to saddle graft it, and slip it under the incision of the bark of the poly seedling where the incision is the shape of an inverted "T".
You can choose any shape which allows the cambium of the two to heal together, and then remove the tip of the sapling when healed.
wow I didn't know such thing. Thank you for explaining well.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 04, 2023, 02:37:23 AM
"Almost neglected, with just automatic drip system, the Sugarloaf grows beautifully and always gives me full size flawless fruits since the year I bought it. I thin it aggressively and only left 2-3 fruits each year since the tree is only 5 ft tall now from a 3 gallon on 2020."  By Palingkecil

Interesting my Sugarloaf mango tree on Turpentine in greenhouse conditions has not grown at all here in Socal. After over one year in the greenhouse, the tree is still only 27" tall. (See Photo)

Perhaps I have a dud, Low vigor with little growth. Would be nice for others that have Sugarloaf to post.  A wide-angle photo would be nice so we can actually see and compare. Let's see your flawless Sugerloaft fruits Palingkecil.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/4H7xg9zR/8-U1-A2270-Sugarloaf-Mango-Tree-in-7-Container-6-25-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4H7xg9zR)
Sugarloaf Mango Tree on Turpentine in Socal

I apologize for the quality of my pictures, my movements are very limited now since I am still recovering from surgery. I did not neglect my trees on purpose, but because I had to be on bed rest for about 7-8 months although I still managed to turn the drip system on and off depends on the rain forecast last year and this year.
I have around 15 mango trees, and only 2 are on Manila rootstock now, and those 2 seem really struggling. Some are seedlings, which grow fine but none of my seedlings have flowers in the 4th year.

My Sugarloaf lost 2 of it's big branches due to the strong wind last winter, I usually protect my trees before the storm, but I was in bed rest since last fall. The 2 circles are where the big branches broke because of the wind.
Last week I took off most of the fruits from the Sugarloaf and left 3 only. They are about the size of my thumb now.
Sugarloaf:

(https://i.postimg.cc/18fYLpd5/SL1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/18fYLpd5)

(https://i.postimg.cc/dktCx9W5/SL2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dktCx9W5)

(https://i.postimg.cc/7582k4sG/SL4.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7582k4sG)

This is my Orange Sherbet:
Unfortunately all the fruit dropped because of the heavy PM during the wet spring this year.


(https://i.postimg.cc/3kxHW4bP/OS1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3kxHW4bP)

(https://i.postimg.cc/7CpvBBYk/OS2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7CpvBBYk)

I met a friend from a So-Cal mango grower in facebook, he lives about 3 miles away from me. according to him, his mango trees on turpentine are also grow better and more productive than the ones on Manila or Kent rootstocks.
One thing we do in common, we put about 6" mulch all over our yard. Maybe that is what makes the difference for the turpentine rootstock?
Also, annonas does not do well in my yard, I dug and gave away my annonas because they grow too slow and always drop their fruits before maturity. So the kind of soil that annona hates seems to do turpentine rootstock well.

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: love_Tropic on July 04, 2023, 04:10:55 PM
can anyone suggent good online or loca store for val-Carrie and Venus mango trees?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on July 04, 2023, 06:39:23 PM
Both are mono, nurseries don't want to get a bad name selling trees unlikely to do well.

Just plant a seed and graft when it's big enough.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Kankan on July 04, 2023, 06:58:50 PM
Valencia Pride and keow savory does well for me.  Coconuts cream died and lemon zest died for me.  I live near the coast and we don’t get too hot where i live.

Coconut Cream died on me as well....San Diego County
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on July 04, 2023, 07:21:53 PM
Interesting your Coconut Cream mango tree died. I live near the coast too and my CC grows quite well. I constantly have to trim the tree to maintain form and control vigor. This issue I have will Coconut Cream is production or lack thereof. I have about 40% of the tree top worked to Seacrest which has grown well from a three-year graft and now has fruit on it. (See 1st photo)

Lemon zest has grown well for me. My five-year-old tree is now 9-10 feet tall. (See 2nd photo). Still no fruit yet but I am willing to give this variety more time but just in case I have already added Peach Cobbler and Cotton Candy grafts.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W/8-U1-A2525-Coconut-Cream-Seacrest-Mango-Tree-with-Small-Fruit-6-29-23.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W)
(Coconut Cream-Seacrest Mango Tree 6-29-23)



(https://i.postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC/8-U1-A2584-Lemon-Zest-Mango-Tree-at-10-Noon-6-29-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC)
 (Lemon Zest Mango Tree 6-29-23)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on July 04, 2023, 08:32:30 PM
Interesting your Coconut Cream mango tree died. I live near the coast too and my CC grows quite well. I constantly have to trim the tree to maintain form and control vigor. This issue I have will Coconut Cream is production or lack thereof. I have about 40% of the tree top worked to Seacrest which has grown well from a three-year graft and now has fruit on it. (See 1st photo)

Lemon zest has grown well for me. My five-year-old tree is now 9-10 feet tall. (See 2nd photo). Still no fruit yet but I am willing to give this variety more time but just in case I have already added Peach Cobbler and Cotton Candy grafts.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W/8-U1-A2525-Coconut-Cream-Seacrest-Mango-Tree-with-Small-Fruit-6-29-23.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W)
(Coconut Cream-Seacrest Mango Tree 6-29-23)



(https://i.postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC/8-U1-A2584-Lemon-Zest-Mango-Tree-at-10-Noon-6-29-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC)
 (Lemon Zest Mango Tree 6-29-23)

I've seen his trees in person & they are nice. It all goes down to the roots. What are medium are they growing in?

I have started to tweak my mix on mangoes more on builders sand this time. :) My Mangoes that are on 50% sand does thrive better as oppose to dirt mixed potting mix & potting mix.

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 04, 2023, 10:12:45 PM
can anyone suggent good online or loca store for val-Carrie and Venus mango trees?

I always have good experience with everglades.farm
They don't have Venus right now but they have Val Carie.
Val Carie is productive and grows well for me, but the branches are droopy.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on July 04, 2023, 10:27:37 PM
can anyone suggent good online or loca store for val-Carrie and Venus mango trees?

I always have good experience with everglades.farm
They don't have Venus right now but they have Val Carie.
Val Carie is productive and grows well for me, but the branches are droopy.

Mine might have good rootstock, it's the most upright of my grafted trees.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 04, 2023, 11:40:15 PM
can anyone suggent good online or loca store for val-Carrie and Venus mango trees?

I always have good experience with everglades.farm
They don't have Venus right now but they have Val Carie.
Val Carie is productive and grows well for me, but the branches are droopy.

Mine might have good rootstock, it's the most upright of my grafted trees.

Do you know what your rootstock is, Oolie?
I will take a pic of my Val Carie tomorrow. It looks ridiculous with the branches all over the ground even though the tree is really healthy and trouble free.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: palingkecil on July 04, 2023, 11:51:58 PM
Interesting your Coconut Cream mango tree died. I live near the coast too and my CC grows quite well. I constantly have to trim the tree to maintain form and control vigor. This issue I have will Coconut Cream is production or lack thereof. I have about 40% of the tree top worked to Seacrest which has grown well from a three-year graft and now has fruit on it. (See 1st photo)

Lemon zest has grown well for me. My five-year-old tree is now 9-10 feet tall. (See 2nd photo). Still no fruit yet but I am willing to give this variety more time but just in case I have already added Peach Cobbler and Cotton Candy grafts.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W/8-U1-A2525-Coconut-Cream-Seacrest-Mango-Tree-with-Small-Fruit-6-29-23.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fSNyYg2W)
(Coconut Cream-Seacrest Mango Tree 6-29-23)



(https://i.postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC/8-U1-A2584-Lemon-Zest-Mango-Tree-at-10-Noon-6-29-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Zv4YWvnC)
 (Lemon Zest Mango Tree 6-29-23)

Your LZ is really good looking!
Is it on Manila rootstock? My CC on Manila is half dead now, and I am thinking to replace it with LZ on turpentine rootstock.
Did your LZ have any flower in 5 years but just don't fruit because of PM?
I never spray my trees and my OS lost most of it's fruit to PM every year. It makes me hesitate to get an LZ.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on July 05, 2023, 12:05:05 AM
can anyone suggent good online or loca store for val-Carrie and Venus mango trees?

I always have good experience with everglades.farm
They don't have Venus right now but they have Val Carie.
Val Carie is productive and grows well for me, but the branches are droopy.

Mine might have good rootstock, it's the most upright of my grafted trees.

Do you know what your rootstock is, Oolie?
I will take a pic of my Val Carie tomorrow. It looks ridiculous with the branches all over the ground even though the tree is really healthy and trouble free.

Turpentine, but even poly are not 100% true to seed, there is variability.
Your description sounds like my old alphonse tree RIP.

There are strategies to combat PM in the susceptible trees. If the tree is well established and not go into shock from repeated pruning/hedging, you can continually remove blooms until the rainy season is past, but this only helps if you don't have early morning marine layer. I you're closer to the coast or at a lower elevation then the best bet is to spray sulfur or skim milk.

Calcium can help the tree if that's what the issue is, and I know of at least one case where LZ did start holding onto fruit with Gypsum application.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: gozp on July 05, 2023, 12:33:15 PM
Priyoor aka guava seedling

(https://i.postimg.cc/4nyS9JJ0/20230703-141009.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nyS9JJ0)

M4 seedling

(https://i.postimg.cc/r0Q7Lsq1/20230704-214109.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/r0Q7Lsq1)

(https://i.postimg.cc/ns1Pvrjy/20230704-214145.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ns1Pvrjy)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: love_Tropic on July 06, 2023, 12:36:08 PM
I really Love Kent, very classic!  can it grow well in Socal with Florida rootstock? Though, I can get from stores, sometimes those are just Haden. thinking to add Val Carrie and Kent
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Oolie on July 06, 2023, 12:45:51 PM
I really Love Kent, very classic!  can it grow well in Socal with Florida rootstock? Though, I can get from stores, sometimes those are just Haden. thinking to add Val Carrie and Kent

I love Kent as well, but it's gotta be picked at full maturity/ swoll shoulders. This is an extreme rarity, and the really good ones are pretty unusual to find.
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: FruitFool on July 06, 2023, 04:41:03 PM
“Farmers best” brand Kent mangoes are really good.
I think those are Mexico grown.
I buy them at Indian grocery stores in San Diego.
It hasn’t made appearance yet this season though.

Fruitfool
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: SDPirate on July 06, 2023, 05:37:16 PM
“Farmers best” brand Kent mangoes are really good.
I think those are Mexico grown.
I buy them at Indian grocery stores in San Diego.
It hasn’t made appearance yet this season though.

Fruitfool

Which store?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: FruitFool on July 07, 2023, 12:04:26 AM
Miramar cash and carry
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 07, 2023, 06:53:16 PM
My E4 seedling that produced fruit last year is holding fruit again this year. This variety is resistant to the crazy strain of powdery mildew that I have here. My tree is still blooming because it’s cooler where I live and it’s partly shaded. The fruit tastes just like E4 but there were some phenotypic differences that may be caused by sunburn. I’ll try to bag the fruit to see if there are any differences this year. For those of us in San Diego, E4 is an excellent variety to grow from seed.
(https://i.postimg.cc/XBWqVfML/IMG-0932.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XBWqVfML)

(https://i.postimg.cc/bd0dmBbB/IMG-0933.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bd0dmBbB)

(https://i.postimg.cc/kRy4D2qm/IMG-0934.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kRy4D2qm)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on July 07, 2023, 07:14:49 PM
Hey Simon,

Nice looking Sugarloaf (E4) fruit on your tree. My grafted E4 has such low vigor I will likely not try any more grafting attempts with this cultivar. Seedling trees are a much better choice in this situation.

When I select a variety now I look for at least Medium vigor. High vigor is preferable for California's growth. Val-Carrie is an example of a medium vigor tree that seems to grow and produce well at my more coastal location. No major issues with powdery mildew.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/fJVfmqXG/8-U1-A2833-Mallika-Val-Carrie-Mango-Tree-in-RB-at-9-AM-7-7-2023.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJVfmqXG)
Val-Carrie/Mallika Mango Tree with Fruit Set (7-7-2023)
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Malhar on July 07, 2023, 08:11:36 PM
@Johnny Eat Fruit: Which one would you consider to be "high vigor" at your location?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on July 07, 2023, 09:05:38 PM
I am growing over 25 varieties of mangoes and evaluating which ones have high and medium vigor. It's a long-term learning process. Listed below are my estimated high vigor varieties. But keep in mind this may change with more time and experience growing. Note: all of my mango trees are on Manila or Ataulfo rootstock. No turpentine due to lack of vigor. The soil is sandy loam with 10% pumice. No heavy or clay soil as this reduces the growth rate and vigor.

I do everything I can to increase vigor and that starts with the soil type then moves up to the rootstock and finally the cultivar. All are very important to maximize mango tree growth in my opinion.

1.  Cotton Candy - Just moved to a larger #25 pot and thus far is growing very well. The root completely filled the smaller #15 pot after only one year.

2.  Fruit Punch - Every graft I have done has grown well. Even the 2022 graft onto my Lemon Zest mango tree is trying to hold fruit. Will remove the Fruit Punch fruit to focus on vegetative growth for the young graft.   

3.  Guava - My 2020 Guava graft is now over 1.5" thick and holding numerous fruit. Appears to be vigorous.

4.  Lemon Zest - After a few years in the ground this takes off vertically.

5.  Orange Essence - Appears to be a strong grower. (Orange Sherbet is of Medium Vigor but a more attractive tree.)

6.  Peach Cobber - Every PC graft I have done has grown well.  So far so good. I also have fruit set from a 2020 graft.

I need more time to ascertain with other cultivars have vigor. This list almost certainly change with more experience growing mango trees in California.

Johnny

Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 08, 2023, 01:33:38 AM
Thanks Johnny!

Here’s E4 seedling #2. This is different than my other E4 seedling (it came from a different seed) but it could be a clone so they could actually be the same. This seedling was grafted onto a larger tree and you can see that it still holds fruit even though it is completely covered in powdery Mildew.
(https://i.postimg.cc/XBFx8NZX/IMG-0980.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XBFx8NZX)
Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Elijah on July 08, 2023, 02:14:05 PM
My E4 seedling that produced fruit last year is holding fruit again this year. This variety is resistant to the crazy strain of powdery mildew that I have here. My tree is still blooming because it’s cooler where I live and it’s partly shaded. The fruit tastes just like E4 but there were some phenotypic differences that may be caused by sunburn. I’ll try to bag the fruit to see if there are any differences this year. For those of us in San Diego, E4 is an excellent variety to grow from seed.
(https://i.postimg.cc/XBWqVfML/IMG-0932.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XBWqVfML)

(https://i.postimg.cc/bd0dmBbB/IMG-0933.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bd0dmBbB)

(https://i.postimg.cc/kRy4D2qm/IMG-0934.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kRy4D2qm)
Simon

Will E4 growing from a seed taste like its parent fruit ( true to seed)?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: simon_grow on July 08, 2023, 02:24:56 PM
I’ve only fruited one E4 seedling which I presume was a clone because it tasted about the same as the real E4. When you grow an E4 seedling, it depends if you grow out the clone or the zygotic seedling. If you grow out the zygotic seedling, it may not taste the same as the real E4.

Simon
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Malhar on July 08, 2023, 04:33:44 PM
Great. Thanks for sharing your experience.

I am growing over 25 varieties of mangoes and evaluating which ones have high and medium vigor. It's a long-term learning process. Listed below are my estimated high vigor varieties. But keep in mind this may change with more time and experience growing. Note: all of my mango trees are on Manila or Ataulfo rootstock. No turpentine due to lack of vigor. The soil is sandy loam with 10% pumice. No heavy or clay soil as this reduces the growth rate and vigor.

I do everything I can to increase vigor and that starts with the soil type then moves up to the rootstock and finally the cultivar. All are very important to maximize mango tree growth in my opinion.

1.  Cotton Candy - Just moved to a larger #25 pot and thus far is growing very well. The root completely filled the smaller #15 pot after only one year.

2.  Fruit Punch - Every graft I have done has grown well. Even the 2022 graft onto my Lemon Zest mango tree is trying to hold fruit. Will remove the Fruit Punch fruit to focus on vegetative growth for the young graft.   

3.  Guava - My 2020 Guava graft is now over 1.5" thick and holding numerous fruit. Appears to be vigorous.

4.  Lemon Zest - After a few years in the ground this takes off vertically.

5.  Orange Essence - Appears to be a strong grower. (Orange Sherbet is of Medium Vigor but a more attractive tree.)

6.  Peach Cobber - Every PC graft I have done has grown well.  So far so good. I also have fruit set from a 2020 graft.

I need more time to ascertain with other cultivars have vigor. This list almost certainly change with more experience growing mango trees in California.

Johnny
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: jdrudnick on December 23, 2023, 11:53:11 PM
I am in 10 B by the coast in El Segundo.  I love this list of mangoes and understand the growth rates.  Fundamentally, I just wanted to see whether we can break down the list to the trees that grow best by the coast versus inland.. just trying to see what I should focus on.  Thank you
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Ivy on February 24, 2024, 06:24:37 PM
I am a newbie in growing mango. I got a Keitt mango 7 years ago from the Home Depot as a new garden enthusiast having no idea at all about mango growing.  The tree is about 9 ft now, looks healthy but if I get any fruit they are usually the size of walnuts or I get no fruit at all.  I have a spot  in my small yard just for 1 more  mango tree that is why I followed the discussion here hoping  that I will make a better choice this time. It looks that Peach cobbler is a winner.
Summarizing what was said I got a following ranking: (The number before the variety is a total number of votes). I hope it might be helping other newbies. Thank you all for valuable information.
Most productive:
9  Peach cobbler
5 Coconut Cream
5 Sweet Tart -
5 Lemon Zest - PM
3 Fruit Punch
3 Guava -
3 Honey Kiss
3 Venus- low fiber
3 Parson
3 Maha Chanok
3 Cotton Candy
2 Orange Essence
2 NDM- sweet
2 Edward
2 Valencia Pride- coconut flavor
2 CAC
2 Fairchild
2 Villa Clara
2 Thompson
2 Ivory
2 Ugly Betty
2 Cypress
2 Magcom
2 Dale
2 Sunrise
2 Juicy Peach
2 Imam Passand
2 Kent
2 Harvest Moon mutant
2 Okrung Tong,
Sindhri- Pakistani
Glenn
Kesar
Peggy
Leo 2- sweet
Leo Z
Gary- coconut flavor
Leo Keitt Seedling
Pickering
Ice cream
Galaxy
Val-Carrie
Mallika
Lancetilla
Alphonso
E4,
Pina Colada,
Pineapple Pleasure.

Least productive :
alphonso (blooms like crazy and has lots of vegetative growth but very little fruits)
lemon zest (powdery mildew problem)
Venus (powdery mildew problem but it may be because of the location )       
Coconut Cream:  grow very well no fruits
Nam Doc Mai:  blooms constantly but has mediocre fruit quality,
Poor On Turpentine :
Guava
Cotton candy
Ice cream
Carrie
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on February 24, 2024, 11:11:37 PM
There are many great tasting mangos that grow well in Florida but are they suited for Southern California?

Here is my new criteria for selection in SoCal.

1.  Vigor - Preferably at least medium vigor but high vigor is best. Seacrest, Coconut Cream, Cac, Guava, Lemon Zest, Orange Essence, Peach Cobbler and 0-15 are examples of vigorous grower.

2.  Disease resistance - Based on what I am seeing at my location Orange Sherbet is better than Lemon Zest. OS flowers later and has fewer disease issues relative to Lemon Zest. This is just one example based on my observation at my location.

3.  Earlier ripening varieties of mango are better than late ripening in general in California and I would also add smaller mangoes are better than larger mangoes as the larger ones take longer to grow and ripen in general.  Kiett is a example of a mango that is not well suited in California due to it’s large size and late ripening except for the warmer inland desert areas. I love the “Angie” mango grown in SoCal. It is not a high vigor mango but it ripens early and produces consistency and if you like the Carrie (Alfonso)  flavor class you will really love this mango. It also has no major disease issues in my area. Between Seacrest and Peach Cobbler I would choose the Seacreast mango.  It ripens earlier. Peach Cobbler ripens late and in 2023 my PC never fully ripened. My Seacrest did and they were delicious.

4.  Early Production – Coconut cream is a great mango but based on my experience it takes seven years to start producing consistently. In contrast Angie starts to produce after three years. Peach Cobbler, Val-Carrie and Seacrest also appear to produce early at my location. My Son-Pari is a modest grower but I have high hopes my young tree will produce early based on the experience of others.

5.  Unknown factors – this is a interesting variable. Sweet Tart is a great tasting mango but has a major problem at my location with fruit split. My ST is seven years old and I lost over 50% of the fruit in 2023 due to this issue.  I am hoping with more age (10 years) this issue will be less of a problem. Lemon Zest has Powdery Mildew problems in a wet winter and spring and many mango trees flower too early resulting in lost flowers and production.  So many potential problems many of which you will soon discover if you grow in this area.

It is best to pick mangoes that have the fewest problems. This will give you the highest probability of success in California.

Johnny
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: johnb51 on February 25, 2024, 12:58:26 PM
There are many great tasting mangos that grow well in Florida but are they suited for Southern California?
It is best to pick mangoes that have the fewest problems. This will give you the highest probability of success in California.
Johnny
So, Johnny, it looks like so far your strongest recommendations are Angie, Seacrest, and possibly Orange Sherbet?  Have you or anyone you know of tried growing PPK/Lemon Meringue?
Title: Re: Best tasting and most reliable Mangos for Southern California
Post by: Johnny Eat Fruit on February 25, 2024, 02:19:48 PM
I have a two year old PPK Seedling tree in a #7 pot. I am going to harvest some scions this summer from that tree and graft it onto my Lemon zest so It will still be a few years until I can determine production and disease issues. So far though my PPK has no Mildew and looks very healthy. I will soon move this up to a #15 pot. (See photo)

I would also say Guava does well at my location. Good growth and good Production.

My Pina Colada mango seeling tree is doing well in a #15 pot. Its putting out a flush right now in my greenhouse. It will soon be too large and I will have to move it ouside. Will likely move this to a 30-36" wood box long term.

My Zill P-22 is staring to flower now and have already grafted scions of this to several other mango trees in the ground. Really looking to try this fruit if it produces this year.

This might be the first year I will get some fruit from my 0-15 mango tree (See photo). It is aslo starting to flower now. My Cotton Candy in a #25 pot is also flowering. Looking foward to more Seacrest and Coconut cream. I have both varieties on one tree and they are flowering like crazy now. (See photo)

Hopefully 2024 will be a productive year. In 2023 we had a late start due to the extended cold weather so everything was delayed 6-8 weeks. Kind of a drag.

Johnny


(https://i.postimg.cc/vx9Fmknx/8-U1-A9507-PPK-Mango-Seedling-Tree-2-25-2024.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vx9Fmknx)
PPK Mango Seedling Tree (2-25-24)



(https://i.postimg.cc/WD4BZhrv/8-U1-A9488-0-15-Mango-Tree-in-Late-Winter-2-24-2024.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WD4BZhrv)
0-15 Mango Tree in Ground (2-24-24)



(https://i.postimg.cc/gnP1DMR4/8-U1-A9362-Coconut-Cream-Seacrest-Mango-Tree-Flowering-2-24-24.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gnP1DMR4)
Coco Cream-Seacrest Mango Tree Flowering (2-24-24)