Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - bovine421

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 88
1
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: 2025 Mango season
« on: February 02, 2025, 09:03:37 PM »
PPK🙂








2
Sounds like a great experiment. Let us know how it turns out.







I'm parallel with Dade City 62 ft lower elevation so this makes me optimistic
30 miles north of Kenansville. Where I'm actually typing this latest update





3
Have Pawpaw on my Reddit and my meta AI advertising from that. The University of Kentucky recommends Collins variety for Florida Growers. With the hardiness Zone Changing biannually I think I'm back in Zone 9b. It's a long shot but one thing I have is plenty of shade from all these mango trees. I ordered from two different nurseries one a Seedling ofCollins and the other a grafted tree of Collins. Hopefully seedling will be a pollinator but since I'm in a gardening frame of mind will probably go to Stark Brothers and Order different varieties. Maybe even ask for their recommendation.

Update problem solved just noticed that they have Gainesville #1 at Just fruit and Exotics up by Perry Florida

4
This time of year my energy level is pretty high because I don't have the sun giving me a beatdown and I've worked myself out of all my winter projects. Actually got so bored then I dug up a tree for my neighbor. Anywho mentioned what type of balance I was growing this season to the wifey. Of course she started with Ah raw raw raw I want Snow Leopard melon it's sweet. So this morning I ordered another rain barrel for another gravity flow irrigation system. Other than finding a dozen 25 gallon pots I have most of the irrigation materials. So system a I will grow the most disease resistant varieties that I think I have a good chance of making produce. System B will be the Exotic roll the dice iffy varieties. I pretty much already have the seeds because of impulse buying glasses. Snow leopard Green Machine and a Korean variety I believe shot recommended. Got the seed incubator at least that's what I call it off the top shelf and dust It Off. Gardening seems like a productive activity until spring grafting






5
Last week I moved my gravity flow drip irrigation system to a new location. Yesterday went to ever sawmill and bought nine bags of potting gardening soil. Last night cleaned under my workbench to put my grow light. I had the timer from last season plugged in at my workbench so the grow light came on according to schedule. Also went through my seeds to see what I will use and what I need to order. Last season I went with the personalized cantaloupes and some exotic ones. Sugar cube did the best the rest not so much. Decided to grow the full size four to five pounders season. Went back and looked at the recommendations I got last season from this forum and ordered Athens cantaloupe. Late last season I did order one that was recommended here and also another that is sweet and tart. Out of these three I will see which ones Thrive the best and build on that for next season. If successful will expand with another drip irrigation system. Will also grow some pole beans. The sun is about to rise so I'm going to go out and spray potassium bicarbonate on my mango bloom










6
In the midst of this cold spell I did see a few flies messing around on a bunch of blooms on my Maha. I take that as a good sign,
but we'll see.
I also saw pollinators today big black flies tiny flies honey bee and small sugar bee.
More importantly my neighbor with a fishing pole in his hand so I asked for a couple of fish heads for my fly Factory🙂

7
Most of our mangoes bloomed several weeks ago that have been in kind of a dormant State and haven't opened yet. We've had several weeks with the night time temperatures getting down in the 40s with a couple of nights the high mid 30s. I've always heard that common answer that it effects the male female ratio. What is the basis for this thinking. Is it hormonal? Has anyone really immersed in the subject. Are some varieties more affected by this. VP antidotically produces like a Rockstar consistently season to season in Central Florida





Jonah preparing to do battle with the pickle worm this season. Going to grow the full size cantaloupes this season.🙂

8
let's say that i send 12 seeds of my ficus hybrid (opposita x carica) to galatians522.  i also send 12 seeds of my hybrid to bovine421.  bovine421 sows the seeds, tenderly cares for the seedlings and when they start to produce figs, he pollinates them with carica pollen.  galatians522, on the other hand, takes the 12 seeds i gave him and sells them on ebay.  he gets $2,012 for them, which he spends on wine and women.  when i visit florida i meet with both of them.  bovine421 gives me 12,057 seeds of (opposita x carica) x carica.  galatians522 has nothing to offer in return for the 12 seeds i gave him. 

both of you already know the original story... the parable of the talents.  the original story is a "bit" different.  none of the servants actually squandered their talents on wine and women.  the servant who did the least with the money he was given, actually just buried it.  but the master scolded him within an inch of his life... 

Quote
24 Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
29 For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

it's interesting to compare this story with the story of the prodigal son.  the prodigal son was welcomed home with open arms, even though he behaved so badly, in comparison to the "slothful" servant, who was cast out.  i guess it's only natural to be more forgiving with children than with servants. 

but how many of us would trust any of our kids with our rarest seeds?   

when we have seeds, the rarer they are, the more selective we are about whose hands we put them in. 

reminds me of...

Mike, to insure survival of the species send those seeds to forum members on the Big Island in Hawaii. There are 3 serious people I can think of on the suitable wet side . Or to any committed person in true tropics. Pet projects in subtropics can wait for the next batch. You don't know when big cyclone can wipe them out forever. By the way, I'm not asking for any. I'll wait last in line :)

today i watched fnf's video and two of his durian seedlings looked really good.  i believe that this is their 2nd winter.  in the video comments he said that the sale of his property fell through. 

bovine421 said to visit florida in july for mangoes and muscadine grapes.  but look at the thumbnail pic of fnf's video!  he's got a big handful of garcinia madruno fruits in january!  he harvests them at the end of his video.  i'm sure that the madruno fruit doesn't hold a candle to even an average mango.  but whose fault is that?  who dropped the ball?  which servant should we fire?  i don't want to get fired.  so i want to sow all those madruno seeds in my orange grove and select for the sweetest ones that are fruiting when mangoes are nervous about having their flower buds all wiped out by frost. 

heaven on earth shouldn't have an obviously best month when to visit.  each month of the year there should be a crazy abundance of diverse and delicious fruit.  if we don't shoulder the responsibility of making this a reality, then we should rot in hell.  or at least we should be cast into outer darkness to weep and gnash our teeth.  in any case, we shouldn't be forgiven, ever. 

my family was fond of debating righteous by faith versus righteous by works.  personally i've always been on team works...

Quote
The greatest service which can be rendered any country is to add a useful plant to its culture. -  Thomas Jefferson

let's roll up our sleeves, make some crazy crosses, sow the seeds and select for the most useful plants.  voila!  heaven on earth.
Well you lured me in with your Tropical Fruit Talk. Then got me thinking biblically which is probably overdue. Sent a message to my Caribbean Caravan driver on the lemon drop mangosteen. He still hasn't acquired one but gives you the thumbs up on your plan. He's successfully grown jackfruit just east of the Orlando International Airport. He's trying to grow breadfruit which I think it's a stretch but he has a jungle with a dense canopy and uses propane to retain the heat during Frost or freeze. I'm pretty happy tonight this may be the lowest temperature of this season 36° with a dew point of 28. So this may be the second season we have had no Frost or freeze in my area of Osceola County. In previous seasons you typically have three Frost and one freeze but of a short duration. So back to the biblical fun dialogue I was reflecting on the prodigal sons Envy of how well his employer was feeding the swine and no one cared about he had nothing to eat. So got me to thinking have I ever been envious of an animal. The first thought was when I visited my nephew who has cattle we were eating ribeye steaks of large portions. So as we were having conversation I asked what's that extra steak is someone coming? He says no. He feeds that to his dad's retired coyote Hound. So I curiously ask how often do you feed this dog like that and they say all the time. Well they were feeding me well so I wasn't envious but I'm sure other people would be. Then I remembered the other night i had a light lunch there wasn't much in the house to eat. My daughter forgot to buy dog food for the poodle. So she brought home meatballs from her work. I had burnt a lot of calories that day and was famished .As she was feeding the poodle those meatballs in my Hunger at that moment I was envious of that dog LOL.
Then looking back at Jonah who was reluctant slow to obey quarrelsome and didn't always agree with God's plan. But God still used him. Yep fruit in January is a sweet thing. I would have had avocados if the squirrels had not got greedy and ate them when they were only about the size of my thumb.

The pawpaw (\(Asiminatriloba\)) is closely related to other fruits in the Annonaceae family, also known as the custard apple family. These fruits include the cherimoya, custard apple, sweetsop, and soursop.


I think you mentioned you liked Durain ice cream. One of the forum members described Durain as bacon flavored custard.

9
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Mango varieties for the north?
« on: January 22, 2025, 05:50:15 AM »
Glenn
Glenn is a solid Choice Very popular with backyard Growers. Medium size tree which will do well in a pot. The others are commercial varieties that are probably readily available especially Osteen in Europe. Though originally from Florida, the Osteen mango is most prominently grown in southern Spain, particularly in regions like Malaga.  Known for its distinctive purple-red skin and sweet, juicy yellow flesh, making it a widely sought-after mango variety in Europe.

https://www.tropicalacresfarms.com/product-page/glenn

10
bovine421, the word "prodigal" means spending money in a wasteful way.  what's the story of jonah and the pickle worm?  i googled it and the 1st result was for Johah 4.  jonah was displeased because god wanted to save the people of nineveh.  in order to teach jonah a lesson, overnight he grew a gourd vine to provide jonah with shade from the intense sun.  jonah really appreciated the shade.  but then the next night, god sent some worms to devour the vine overnight.  the next day jonah was very depressed. 

Quote
10 Then said the Lord, Thou hast had pity on the gourd, for the which thou hast not laboured, neither madest it grow; which came up in a night, and perished in a night:

11 And should not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand; and also much cattle?

it's certainly true that, the more labor i put into a plant, the more i'm going to care about it.  but this doesn't mean that i won't care if the only mulberry tree in a local park gets chopped down. 

i haven't tasted any of the apricot peach hybrids, but i've heard mixed reviews. 

i'm not sure if durian was an acquired taste for me.  1st i had a durian smoothie, which i enjoyed.  then i tried some durian ice cream which i also enjoyed.  after that i also enjoyed some frozen durian.  when i finally tasted fresh durian i also enjoyed it.  would i have enjoyed it if i had tasted it 1st?  i don't know.
What I get from that story Is that God can temporarily bless us Even when we don't deserve it. And as we get comfortable with the blessing he can take it away. So  do we take them for granted or appreciate what is given temporarily to us. So do we get angry when something that we did not produce did not deserve is taking away from us. Last season I grew some cantaloupes and was not aware of the moth that lays the egg for the pickle worm. The cantaloupes were beautiful I was happy until I noticed something had eaten holes in them. I was thankful that a few had fallen off the vine and that I got to sample these cantaloupes and get motivated for next season. Unknown to me was a blessing that fall that took me to a farm I hadn't been in 40 years. I got to sample some very large cantaloupes from the Sangamon River Valley in Cass County Illinois. Thankfully I didn't get angry with God or the pickle worm. Another Blessing was from this group giving me the knowledge of how to deal with Mr pickleworm. If you come to Central Florida try to come in July. There will be plenty of mangoes and muscadine grapes
]








Blessings I don't deserve

11
The Prodigal Son illustrates the depravity we are capable of becoming turning animalistic and envying the swine. More then Redemption forgiveness and squandering. One thing I am envious of The Californians is there plum apricot Peach hybrids . I like the lessons from Jonah and the pickle worm LOL
There was a thread on here on fruit and tropical fruit that are overrated and really not worth growing other than the novelty of it.started by an Australian probably one of Mike T's cohorts
That's where I learned that 70% of Hawaiians don't care for Durain it's an acquired taste according a Hawaiian Forum member.

12
The reason I asked you about your elevation because it has a bearing on the frequency of Frost in the severity of a freeze. It also would affect the water table. As far as your experimentation with tropical and Ultra tropical which is a layman's term. I would build a greenhouse and plant trees right in the ground and try to keep the temperature above 50° for the tropicals and 70 for the ultra. There's a few people in this area that grow Mountain soursop but nothing on a commercial level it's a real hit and miss. And anodically in my small Grove I've observed that or less or at least I think the cherimoya hybrid crosses seem To not defoliate as much as my other Annona. I guess if I put in a request for your experimentation it would be a cold hardy soursop and a low chill Pawpaw



Things are bad when you have to be fed by crows. There's nothing like Working on a pig farm to get a fellow focused on a different career path. At least  one that smells better

13
The name for your farm should be poo farm! because you are full of BS
And you shall be judged by your fruit

January fruit soon to be Juiced

Reward
Would like to be able to grow Paw paw in 9b

14
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Rat proofing fruit trees
« on: January 19, 2025, 07:32:20 PM »
Most of us experiencing tree rats are enjoying Rattus rattus, subfamily Murinae, commonly called tree rats, black rats, roof rats, palm rats, ship rats, etc.  They are introduced to all continents except antarctica. Not native to CA, they are thriving due to the weather, food, and lack of serious predation by other animals. They were native to Africa, Europe (old world rats), Asia, Australia. It was the black rat, Rattus rattus, that spread the fleas causing the Bubonic plague (Black Death) in Europe.  The tree rat (Rattus rattus) is smaller (7 oz) than Norway rat (11 oz) and actually better looking for a rat. Tail is longer than body and a tan or white underbelly.  They rapidly climb trees and move through a tree canopy easily.   Our orchard is mature and has interlocking limbs, a virtual highway for them.  Snap traps work, must be tended regularly.  Best bait here is a shelled macadamia nut, they ignore peanut butter etc. preference is the macadamia. They ruin avocados on the tree, bite white sapotes and other fruits and nuts. Their nocturnal habit makes shooting them difficult.  Poison is not used due to benign creatures living in the area like possums, raccoons, cats.  Neighbor had pest control place poison in their attic, rats died and someone had to find the dead bodies in the attic due to the pervasive odor in their house. Snap traps need to be screened to avoid catching birds.  Probably no final solution, but gophers seem to be forever also.
Only if they made a poison that dissipated from the carcass quickly. Poison is most effective. There's a song if you can make it in New York you can make it anywhere. Maybe someone should make a song. If you can grow in California you can grow anywhere.🙂

15
That's good that you're south of Orlando what is the sea level elevation? Having irrigation is extremely beneficial for your experimentation as far as Frost and freeze. The first thing that comes to my mind is lychee and avocado
Awful wordy thread but a dollar donation for Duran cold tolerance.Save your coins! you would be lucky to even grow that in Key West🤣

16
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Rat proofing fruit trees
« on: January 19, 2025, 05:54:47 PM »
I have used thin aluminum flashing that wife picked up at swap meet, it's thin and 24" wide so, easy to wrap around tree to keep critters from climbing up tree also, have made upside down funnels to wrap around tree trunks. Lesson to what Jack, posted about rats because he has had to deal with them for years, now unfortunately I have tree rats in my macadamia trees and trying to trap them with same method that Jack, uses.
Corrugated sheets better than stove pipes because most tree trunks are not straight





I didn't say I used stove pipes I use alumimun flashing!
Didn't say you did! Just adding to the Arsenal of ideas.  Yes flashing is a good idea. What type of rats do you have in California?  Norwegian or the Roof rat maybe something else? As stated above not just rats andsquirrels travel through the canopy  If you have a distance of 10 ft in between canopies that could help. A squirrel can jump about 8 ft straight out and five feet up according to the bird feeder people not sure about rats.

17
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Rat proofing fruit trees
« on: January 18, 2025, 01:55:20 PM »
I have used thin aluminum flashing that wife picked up at swap meet, it's thin and 24" wide so, easy to wrap around tree to keep critters from climbing up tree also, have made upside down funnels to wrap around tree trunks. Lesson to what Jack, posted about rats because he has had to deal with them for years, now unfortunately I have tree rats in my macadamia trees and trying to trap them with same method that Jack, uses.
Corrugated sheets better than stove pipes because most tree trunks are not straight






18
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Florida Cold Fronts (and Mangos)
« on: January 17, 2025, 09:53:02 PM »
Testing my outdoor forced air electric heater. Very satisfied multi-purpose use. Sitting outside in my rocking chair drinking coffee in my Bermuda shorts. Money well spent.


19
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Tropical Fruit in video games
« on: January 14, 2025, 05:50:12 AM »
Maybe shocking that Boomers have knowledge of video games. Maybe not to the extent of younger Generations but because we have children and grandchildren of course we have knowledge of video games and cartoons. Remember going to a hamburger joint to play Pinball and seeing a Pong table for the first time. I also remember Radio Shacks first personal computer that ran off of Dos. I expected to be able to talk to it like we to AI on our phones now. I despise Electronic Arts for killing Titanfalls and Anthem. I could imagine inside The Traveler of Destiny a mango tree  in the center being the essence of life of our universe.


343 Industries is a Microsoft-owned video game developer that took over the Halo series from Bungie


20
I'm pretty confident it is. Per California guidelines I rotate my fungicides after two applications. But recently I've been rotating after one application. On this season's bloom at first sight of emerging i sprayed a strobin. Then Dr Earth final stop. Will rotate to Potassium bicarbonate for two applications. After fruit set strobin again.
 It is recommended to rotate fungicides after one application to prevent the development of fungal resistance; ideally, you should switch to a fungicide with a different mode of action after each application or after a few applications depending on the specific product and disease you are treating.
Key points about fungicide rotation:
Prevent resistance:
The primary reason for rotating fungicides is to prevent fungi from developing resistance to a single active ingredient



Last season my Dot mangoes were blemish free. Mid-season i may apply phyton 35 just because I have it

21
Potassium bicarbonate (\(KHCO_{3}\)) kills fungus by collapsing the hyphal walls of the fungus and shrinking its conidia. It can also elevate the pH, which may contribute to the fungus's death.            Explanation    Potassium bicarbonate is a contact fungicide that can be used to treat powdery mildew and early blight.  It's approved for use in organic growing.  Potassium bicarbonate is a white, odorless, water-soluble solid.  It's used in horticulture to control fungal diseases, strengthen plant tissue, and stabilize soil pH levels.         How it works     The bicarbonate ion in potassium bicarbonate inhibits the growth of some fungi and bacteria. The bicarbonate ion causes the hyphal walls of the fungus to collapse and the conidia to shrink. The pH elevation may also contribute to the fungus's death. Growing A Greener Worldhttps://www.growingagreenerworld.comControlling or Eliminating Powdery MildewPotassium bicarbonate– Similar to baking soda, this has the unique advantage of actually eliminating powdery mildew once it's there. Potassium bicarbonate is a ...SciELO Méxicohttps://www.scielo.org.mxEffect of potassium bicarbonate on fungai growth and sclerotia ...There are reports about the effectiveness of potassium bicarbonate (KHCO3) on the reduction of foliar damage produced by fungi, as well as the benefit of Tricho...Portal Produktowy Grupy PCChttps://www.products.pcc.euPotassium carbonate and potassium bicarbonate and their use in plant cultivation - PCC Group Product PortalOct 9, 2023USDA Agricultural Marketing Service (.gov)https://www.ams.usda.govPotassium Bicarbonate - CropsNov 25, 1999 — Specific Uses: Disease control of powdery mildew (Sphaerotheca fuliginea) and early blight (Alternaria cucumerina) on cucurbits and tomatoes respect...       Other uses     Potassium bicarbonate can also be used to strengthen plant tissue, stabilize soil pH levels, and prolong plant cells' natural resistance to pathogens

Dr. Earth's Final Stop Fungicide works by utilizing a blend of natural essential oils, like rosemary oil, clove oil, and peppermint oil, which come into direct contact with fungal spores on plant surfaces, disrupting their cell membranes and effectively killing them on contact, providing immediate disease control while also offering continued protection for several weeks; it is considered a "contact fungicide" and is OMRI listed for organic gardening use.
Key points about Dr. Earth Final Stop Fungicide:
Natural ingredients:
It relies on a blend of plant-based essential oils instead of synthetic chemicals.
Contact kill:
The fungicide works by directly contacting and killing fungal spores on plant surfaces.
Broad spectrum control:
Can be used against a variety of fungal diseases including powdery mildew, rust, black spot, leaf blotch, and more

Dr. Earth Final Stop Disease Control Fungicide is intended to be safe for pollinators and bees when used as directed.

22
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Tropical Fruit in video games
« on: January 13, 2025, 12:46:04 PM »
Here's some good news Columbia Pictures making a Herizon Zero Dawn movie. Who will they cast as alloy? Whoever hopefully will be pale with freckles and red hair. With that being said what video game should have they Incorporated tropical fruit especially mango into the crust or epicenter of the storyline. Just off the top of my head Gears of War the Locust people came to Earth to burrow in the ground to take over our tropical fruit resources. Think the Covenant from Halo looks like mango eaters if I ever saw any. Hopefully Dr Halsey can genetically modify squirrels to become gigantic and work with the Spartans.  Envision Master Chief riding on the back of agigantic parrot who are also Fond of mangoes. That theme is not too far fetched because I think French and English fought over sugarcane and bananas in the Caribbean





Got to have dairy for those tropical fruit smoothies

23
Bovine, have you already started spraying for powdery mildew? I’m in north Orlando, 9B as well, and my bigger concern has been the temperatures lately. Another low to 36F this upcoming Friday. My smaller trees are covered, but larger ones (up to 15 ft tall) are on their own.

Regarding PM spraying — Do you wait until the flowers are mostly or completely lengthened out but not opened? Right now a majority of my blooms are maybe 1” long, and some are still buds.
I'm south of Orlando and the temperatures around 6:30 a.m. has been mostly 40 but it did dip down to 39 couple days ago. When my weather station says the humidity is 70% Plus makes me nervous it's either raining fog or heavy Dew. I go out and check the windshield and hood of my truck to make sure there's no Frost but there has been a little evidence on the neighbor's shingles. Since October monthly I've been spraying for  anthrachnose fungus to systemically clean the trees as much as possible until first sign of Bloom. Then I will switch to weekly PM treatments. This weekend was my first application of Dr Earth final stop which is a blend of peppermint clove oil. All my Blooms are still closed. But after reading and asking questions this weekend I'm going to order some potassium bicarbonate. What I've gathered that I like from different statements and posts from people . One fellow said he likes it because he doesn't have to constantly agitate it like sulfur. Another said he sprays it on open boom and has no issues also that sulfur is preventive and potassium bicarbonate as a Curative property to it. I have sulfur but I've never used it because I'm kind of too lazy to constantly agitated in my low-tech handheld sprayer. So this weekend I may spray the sulfur until I can switch to potassium bicarbonate. In past seasons I haven't really troubled to spray for powdery mildew most of my trees are pretty resistant. Last season I didn't spray for powdery mildew and  had a great season. A lot of other folks had some major issues so to be prudent I'm going  to spray weekly until fruit set then switch back to a final application for anthracnose to keep  the fruit pristine.




24
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Powdery. Mildew 2024 Paranoia
« on: January 12, 2025, 12:33:19 PM »
Is now the time to begin spraying to prevent PM?

If your budding flower panicles over 2" long, it would be a good preventative to spray sulfur.
Sulfur doesn't kill powdery mildew, it prevents it from establishing. Once it establishes, you can blast it off with water to try and wash the spores into the ground. Milstop (Potassium Bicarbonate) is the only organic treatment Once it gets established. If you don't have Milstop in your arsenal, it may be too late once you get it shipped.
Sounds like potassium bicarbonate is the ticket I read somewhere else where someone said it's not an issue on open bloom. Good to know that sulfur is preventative not Curative. Overlooked this thread because without my glasses I thought paranoid was a Latin word for a tropical fruit LOL
Well maybe if we did have a mango subgroup I would have realized paranoia is not a fruit

25
I'm trying a mix of 1 tablespoon of Potassium Bicarbonate and 1/2 teaspoon of Castile Soap per 1 gallon of water.





Couple of products the FB people we're talking about a couple weeks ago. Haven't had any issue with spraying on open bloom with the clove/ peppermint oil. But to be prudent sounds like this may be a better alternative always willing to up my game. What brand are you using fliptop

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 88
SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk