The Tropical Fruit Forum
Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: Cookie Monster on April 03, 2012, 12:18:00 AM
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Is the Golden Queen a synonym for the Ivory mango? It looks similar
http://www.sulit.com.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/130838/Exotic+Grafted+Golden+Queen+Mango (http://www.sulit.com.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/130838/Exotic+Grafted+Golden+Queen+Mango)
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Is the Golden Queen a synonym for the Ivory mango? It looks similar
http://www.sulit.com.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/130838/Exotic+Grafted+Golden+Queen+Mango (http://www.sulit.com.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/130838/Exotic+Grafted+Golden+Queen+Mango)
Isn't the mango in that picture a little big for an Ivory ?
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Forgive my ignorance but isn't Ivory a Thai mango? Golden Queen (jin huang) mango is Taiwanese.
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Forgive my ignorance but isn't Ivory a Thai mango? Golden Queen (jin huang) mango is Taiwanese.
Now isn't it fitting the global moderator points out that Thailand and Taiwan are not the same. ;D ;) :P
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Here is pic of an ivory from last years Fairchild mango festival, as you can see the ivory is a smaller size mango. My tasting notes were no sour taste, fiberless, creamy with hint of vanila. Haven't tasted any mango like it! Is it your plan to still graft more trees up Jeff? Keep me posted if you decide...
From looking at that sellers picture that mango does not look like this ivory mango but that sellers pics are small.
(http://i1136.photobucket.com/albums/n487/joep450/85a9121c.jpg)
_JoeP450
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Jeff - now that I'm re-reading this post, my apology if I came off sounding like a jerk ;D
I've been curious about this mango for some time now. Also a bit curious as to why, perhaps marketing value, they changed the name from Jin Huang to Golden Queen mango. If so, I would hate to see someone's hard work becoming someone else's cash cow. Of course I'm assuming all this, for all I know, they could have purchased renaming right from the original breeder himself, or it's also called Golden Queen in Taiwan? If anyone has further knowledge on this, I would love to hear what you have to say.
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:-) No, I didn't take it that way. Thanks for saying though. After searching the net a little, I pretty much figured out that the golden queen is most likely not ivory. It sounds like a really interesting mango though. I guess it's a seedling of the nam doc mai. The trick is finding budwood for this baby.
Jeff
Jeff - now that I'm re-reading this post, my apology if I came off sounding like a jerk ;D
I've been curious about this mango for some time now. Also a bit curious as to why, perhaps marketing value, they changed the name from Jin Huang to Golden Queen mango. If so, I would hate to see someone's hard work becoming someone else's cash cow. Of course I'm assuming all this, for all I know, they could have purchased renaming right from the original breeder himself, or it's also called Golden Queen in Taiwan? If anyone has further knowledge on this, I would love to hear what you have to say.
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...I guess it's a seedling of the nam doc mai. The trick is finding budwood for this baby.
Jeff
That's what I'd gathered too, hence my immediate connection to Xoài Tượng, came to find out this Jin Huang mango was imported in 1997 from Taiwan so there went that assumption.
I'm sure someone in HI has this mango, Oscar just has to do some digging for us ;D
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i know a guy with a tree, but he doesn't give out budwood...sorry for posting this...I guess it's no help. :(
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i know a guy with a tree, but he doesn't give out budwood...sorry for posting this...I guess it's no help. :(
Google earth should work, what's his address? ;D ;D ;D
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If oscar has budwood, then jeff wants to buy some :-).
...I guess it's a seedling of the nam doc mai. The trick is finding budwood for this baby.
Jeff
That's what I'd gathered too, hence my immediate connection to Xoài Tượng, came to find out this Jin Huang mango was imported in 1997 from Taiwan so there went that assumption.
I'm sure someone in HI has this mango, Oscar just has to do some digging for us ;D
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Have you been able to find a source for the Golden Queen ( Jin Huang ) or any other information? sounds like an interesting variety.
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Hi everyone,
I'm positive that the Golden Queen of Taiwan is not the Ivory of Thailand. I have eaten the Golden Queen in Thailand many times and it is never as slim/narrow as an Ivory. Funny thing when fruits are imported to other countries their original/names names are usually lost. Not always, though >> Nam Doc Mai, etc.
The Ivory is probably not called "Ivory" in Thailand (at least as far as I have seen). Mangoes in Thailand have Thai names, so I'm pretty sure I've eaten an Ivory over the course of a year there (mango binge for the entire time!) but I just didn't know it.
The Golden Queen on the other hand, is labeled as "Taiwan mango" in upscale Paragon-International Market, in Bangkok. The fruit tag on the mangoes have "Golden Queen" written on them in impossibly small letters. The fruit tree nurseries in Chatuchak have the Taiwan mango labeled as "Kim Hong, Jing Hwong, Jin Hwang" probably because the Thai language is phonetical, with complex tones, and with an even more complex alphabet-- which does not transfer over to English easily. Adding to the confusion, the Taiwanese keep improving their strains of Golden Queen mangoes via annual mango competitions, and have read of several improved strains grown locally in Taiwan. This is all, of course, IMHO and experience.
I do have two seedlings of the Golden Queen BUT sorry to report that they are most certainly monoembryonic in every instance I have seen (around 12 seedlings total grown in Thailand) and under my local conditions, the seedlings struggle a bit. Low/moderate anthracnose resistance but very vigorous. Mine were both stunted severely by grubs recently. Heaven weeps.... Now I am trying to initiate multi-rootstock to increase vigor... I just started with them, so we will see what I have in a few years... or maybe 20?
Greenthumb on eBay sells Golden Queen (or something very very similar) from time to time... Taiwan mango...Kim Hong.. Jin Hwang...Jin Hwong... who knows what is being sold by who anymore? I kid..LOL
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If oscar has budwood, then jeff wants to buy some :-).
...I guess it's a seedling of the nam doc mai. The trick is finding budwood for this baby.
Jeff
That's what I'd gathered too, hence my immediate connection to Xoài Tượng, came to find out this Jin Huang mango was imported in 1997 from Taiwan so there went that assumption.
I'm sure someone in HI has this mango, Oscar just has to do some digging for us ;D
Sorry don't have it, never heard of it.
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Bernie Dixon is the only source I'm aware of, have only seen him logged on twice. Check with him via email on getting scions, perhaps it's possible.
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Here is pic of an ivory from last years Fairchild mango festival, as you can see the ivory is a smaller size mango. My tasting notes were no sour taste, fiberless, creamy with hint of vanila. Haven't tasted any mango like it! Is it your plan to still graft more trees up Jeff? Keep me posted if you decide...
From looking at that sellers picture that mango does not look like this ivory mango but that sellers pics are small.
(http://i1136.photobucket.com/albums/n487/joep450/85a9121c.jpg)
_JoeP450
Ivory is an amazing mango...super creamy you could eat it with a spoon. I tasted a hint of guava what an unusual tasting mango!
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I ended up buying a golden queen tree from the guy on ebay. The tree was in really bad shape and eventually died. However, I was quick enough to harvest budwood from the dying tree and now have a couple tiny grafted trees :-).
Hi everyone,
I'm positive that the Golden Queen of Taiwan is not the Ivory of Thailand. I have eaten the Golden Queen in Thailand many times and it is never as slim/narrow as an Ivory. Funny thing when fruits are imported to other countries their original/names names are usually lost. Not always, though >> Nam Doc Mai, etc.
The Ivory is probably not called "Ivory" in Thailand (at least as far as I have seen). Mangoes in Thailand have Thai names, so I'm pretty sure I've eaten an Ivory over the course of a year there (mango binge for the entire time!) but I just didn't know it.
The Golden Queen on the other hand, is labeled as "Taiwan mango" in upscale Paragon-International Market, in Bangkok. The fruit tag on the mangoes have "Golden Queen" written on them in impossibly small letters. The fruit tree nurseries in Chatuchak have the Taiwan mango labeled as "Kim Hong, Jing Hwong, Jin Hwang" probably because the Thai language is phonetical, with complex tones, and with an even more complex alphabet-- which does not transfer over to English easily. Adding to the confusion, the Taiwanese keep improving their strains of Golden Queen mangoes via annual mango competitions, and have read of several improved strains grown locally in Taiwan. This is all, of course, IMHO and experience.
I do have two seedlings of the Golden Queen BUT sorry to report that they are most certainly monoembryonic in every instance I have seen (around 12 seedlings total grown in Thailand) and under my local conditions, the seedlings struggle a bit. Low/moderate anthracnose resistance but very vigorous. Mine were both stunted severely by grubs recently. Heaven weeps.... Now I am trying to initiate multi-rootstock to increase vigor... I just started with them, so we will see what I have in a few years... or maybe 20?
Greenthumb on eBay sells Golden Queen (or something very very similar) from time to time... Taiwan mango...Kim Hong.. Jin Hwang...Jin Hwong... who knows what is being sold by who anymore? I kid..LOL
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Nicely done, Jeff.
Here's to you not getting the Patrick treatment from this guy ;D cheers!
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Cool Jeff, now i know where i will be able to get one of these from when the time comes.
Thank the gods for the wonderful collectors. ;D
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:-) whether or not it's really golden queen (and not a maha chanot) is still an open question.
Nicely done, Jeff.
Here's to you not getting the Patrick treatment from this guy ;D cheers!
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I ended up buying a golden queen tree from the guy on ebay. The tree was in really bad shape and eventually died. However, I was quick enough to harvest budwood from the dying tree and now have a couple tiny grafted trees :-).
Hi everyone,
I'm positive that the Golden Queen of Taiwan is not the Ivory of Thailand. I have eaten the Golden Queen in Thailand many times and it is never as slim/narrow as an Ivory. Funny thing when fruits are imported to other countries their original/names names are usually lost. Not always, though >> Nam Doc Mai, etc.
The Ivory is probably not called "Ivory" in Thailand (at least as far as I have seen). Mangoes in Thailand have Thai names, so I'm pretty sure I've eaten an Ivory over the course of a year there (mango binge for the entire time!) but I just didn't know it.
The Golden Queen on the other hand, is labeled as "Taiwan mango" in upscale Paragon-International Market, in Bangkok. The fruit tag on the mangoes have "Golden Queen" written on them in impossibly small letters. The fruit tree nurseries in Chatuchak have the Taiwan mango labeled as "Kim Hong, Jing Hwong, Jin Hwang" probably because the Thai language is phonetical, with complex tones, and with an even more complex alphabet-- which does not transfer over to English easily. Adding to the confusion, the Taiwanese keep improving their strains of Golden Queen mangoes via annual mango competitions, and have read of several improved strains grown locally in Taiwan. This is all, of course, IMHO and experience.
I do have two seedlings of the Golden Queen BUT sorry to report that they are most certainly monoembryonic in every instance I have seen (around 12 seedlings total grown in Thailand) and under my local conditions, the seedlings struggle a bit. Low/moderate anthracnose resistance but very vigorous. Mine were both stunted severely by grubs recently. Heaven weeps.... Now I am trying to initiate multi-rootstock to increase vigor... I just started with them, so we will see what I have in a few years... or maybe 20?
Greenthumb on eBay sells Golden Queen (or something very very similar) from time to time... Taiwan mango...Kim Hong.. Jin Hwang...Jin Hwong... who knows what is being sold by who anymore? I kid..LOL
Clever, clever CookieMonster!! What a smart guy! That's how you recover your costs for sure! Buy one tree and get several more in the process. LOL! I didn't have the guts to buy from him after my shipment was tied up at the local customs office... Several trees died waiting to be released, with a single seedless guava surviving. Such an expensive mistake and initial learning experience for me... Wish I had done what you did instead.
So... apparently the "Golden Queen" has arrived in the U.S..... eBay guy seems to be somewhat truthful about his plants if that Maha someone ordered from him turns out to be just that... I'm still waiting for my seedless guava to fruit, then I will see for myself if he is really truthful.
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is the mistery of golden queen mango unsolved yet? because there new member named Bern from piliphine who said has the plant and even offer some budwood. maybe he know this golden queen true ID?
i have my own story about it :
tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=221.msg36944#msg36944
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It sure looks like one of the elephant tusk thai types alright and several of these types have been renamed in other SE Asian countries.My thai contact said it is a common and good thai mango.The name ivory may indicate an elephant tusk origin.
I also cleared another question I had about sam ru du and choc anon if they are the same thing.They are not, choc anon is not considered high quality being like a poor okrung.It does often fruit out of season.Sam ru du by contrast is a highly valued village mango and is a lovely tasting type that crops three times during the year.There are similarities in appearance.
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is the mistery of golden queen mango unsolved yet? because there new member named Bern from piliphine who said has the plant and even offer some budwood. maybe he know this golden queen true ID?
i have my own story about it :
tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=221.msg36944#msg36944
Has anyone here ever order scions or plants from B. Dizon ? If so, how is it done and how did it go?
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Making another trip State side, in a few weeks, and just checking to see if there are any sources for this mango in Fla. I know my chances are slim but what the heck, gotta keep on trying.
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Making another trip State side, in a few weeks, and just checking to see if there are any sources for this mango in Fla. I know my chances are slim but what the heck, gotta keep on trying.
I am not sure, and even have my doubts, this mango is truly available in the states, whatever it really is....
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Hi everyone,
I'm positive that the Golden Queen of Taiwan is not the Ivory of Thailand. I have eaten the Golden Queen in Thailand many times and it is never as slim/narrow as an Ivory. Funny thing when fruits are imported to other countries their original/names names are usually lost. Not always, though >> Nam Doc Mai, etc.
The Ivory is probably not called "Ivory" in Thailand (at least as far as I have seen). Mangoes in Thailand have Thai names, so I'm pretty sure I've eaten an Ivory over the course of a year there (mango binge for the entire time!) but I just didn't know it.
The Golden Queen on the other hand, is labeled as "Taiwan mango" in upscale Paragon-International Market, in Bangkok. The fruit tag on the mangoes have "Golden Queen" written on them in impossibly small letters. The fruit tree nurseries in Chatuchak have the Taiwan mango labeled as "Kim Hong, Jing Hwong, Jin Hwang" probably because the Thai language is phonetical, with complex tones, and with an even more complex alphabet-- which does not transfer over to English easily. Adding to the confusion, the Taiwanese keep improving their strains of Golden Queen mangoes via annual mango competitions, and have read of several improved strains grown locally in Taiwan. This is all, of course, IMHO and experience.
I do have two seedlings of the Golden Queen BUT sorry to report that they are most certainly monoembryonic in every instance I have seen (around 12 seedlings total grown in Thailand) and under my local conditions, the seedlings struggle a bit. Low/moderate anthracnose resistance but very vigorous. Mine were both stunted severely by grubs recently. Heaven weeps.... Now I am trying to initiate multi-rootstock to increase vigor... I just started with them, so we will see what I have in a few years... or maybe 20?
Greenthumb on eBay sells Golden Queen (or something very very similar) from time to time... Taiwan mango...Kim Hong.. Jin Hwang...Jin Hwong... who knows what is being sold by who anymore? I kid..LOL
I eat mango's in Thailand for 10 years but never had Ivory or Golden Queen. I have seen them in Siam Paragon supermarket but i won't buy it there. Supermarket mango's always taste boring so i prefer them from the markets.
I think i also have a plant from Kim Hong but that should be my purple mango which never flowered so far. Thai don't label their mangotree's on the wholesale places so they can sell me anything and i will find out what it is many years later. I bought that Kim Hong for 500 baht (which is much for a small tree) and it has 2 stems going into the soil. They are grafted but i don't know why they did not cut one stem off. It should be a nice purple mango from Taiwan they told me, we will see next year i hope.
I also will go see Chatuckak again then to see what species they have now. If there is Ivory then i will buy it. The problem is they again can easy cheat me by selling an expensive species which is not what they say it is but we will see. I really would like to have Rapoza if they have it.
It is annoying that the thai always use the thai names but what can we do about it?
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i know a guy with a tree, but he doesn't give out budwood...sorry for posting this...I guess it's no help. :(
Google earth should work, what's his address? ;D ;D ;D
And what time does he go to church on Sunday? Just asking.
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Sam ru do can bloom 3 times a year. That is what the name says in Thai language. Sam=3.
There are always mango's for sale in Thailand, all year around. Out of season they eat them green in salads or with sugar/condiments. I have never seen people scared for green mango's but i read on the web that it is very dangerous to do that. Also they pick and peel/prune mango's without any precautions at all, i read on some websites that the sap can be very dangerous on your skin.
On the street they peel them using gloves but i guess that is for hygienic reasons not of being scared for the sap.
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I eat mango's in Thailand for 10 years but never had Ivory or Golden Queen. I have seen them in Siam Paragon supermarket but i won't buy it there. Supermarket mango's always taste boring so i prefer them from the markets.
I think i also have a plant from Kim Hong but that should be my purple mango which never flowered so far. Thai don't label their mangotree's on the wholesale places so they can sell me anything and i will find out what it is many years later. I bought that Kim Hong for 500 baht (which is much for a small tree) and it has 2 stems going into the soil. They are grafted but i don't know why they did not cut one stem off. It should be a nice purple mango from Taiwan they told me, we will see next year i hope.
I also will go see Chatuckak again then to see what species they have now. If there is Ivory then i will buy it. The problem is they again can easy cheat me by selling an expensive species which is not what they say it is but we will see. I really would like to have Rapoza if they have it.
It is annoying that the thai always use the thai names but what can we do about it?
Hi Bangkok
You love mango like me!
My friend is traveling around Thailand and he tell me that he likes to buy some different trees when he comes back. Of course the trees will be small size and most of them mangos. How can be sure about the quality and the varieties of them if you say they sell anything? Is Chatuchak the best place for it?
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Well Mike that is also hard for me to get what i order. I bought a plumeria variety on Chatuchak which should be Bali Palace but when i finally grafted it and had it flower it was a yellow one but the same one we had on a big tree allready. I saw them on Bali and they were totally yellow and ours had also white parts in the flowers.
He can try Chatuchak but then the tree should be labelled before you arrive there, in that case they can not give you some tree and tell you it is the one you ask for. On the other hand i bought many tree's without labels and those guys have 10 species standing all over the shop and they can see which one is which species by looking at the leaves and stem. I cannot do that but i am not a thai and in the mango-business.
Well the tree's are not expensive for us so if he decides to bring some then just buy some extra from other shops. They will not all be cheating i guess. On Chatuchak i was stupid one day and paid with a billiet from 1000 baht which i thought it was a 100 bill. When i walked away the lady followed me to give me my change.
If he goes to Kanchana Phisek road around the area of Bang Bua Thong he will see loads of mangoshops along the road. That area is not the centre of BKK but there the shops from Chatuchak might buy them, it is a very long area where they sell them and you can see them from out of the car/taxi/bus. Go where Kanchana Phisek road meats Ratthana-thibet road that area has loads of plantshops all over, you cannot miss them. They are along the road for many km/miles
Most tree's are full of diseases so spray them at home. If i was him and just want to buy it simple then buy on chatuchak. Also i read story's that the plant market there is open on wednesday, i thought friday but they are also there in the weekend but maybe not that many as on the plant day. Check internet if you want to be sure. Google on chatuchak and plant market and you will find many hits.
All the tree's there are grafted and mostly 1 meter high or taller. Good luck to him i think he will find what he wants.
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I meant Bang Yai instead of Bang bua Thong, solly.
http://maps.google.nl/maps?hl=nl&q=bang+yai&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&ei=_mCnUIupKonUrQe11IDwAg&ved=0CAsQ_AUoAg (http://maps.google.nl/maps?hl=nl&q=bang+yai&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&ei=_mCnUIupKonUrQe11IDwAg&ved=0CAsQ_AUoAg)
Where the Western Outer ring meats Ratthana thibet on both sides of the Western Outer ring (which is Kanchana Phisek road) you will find loads of plant shops. Nobody speaks english so good luck haha.
Do you have nam doc mai = Miee Ma-Muang Nam doc mai mai?
Or Miee Ma-muang Mahanchanok mai? (Do you have mango mahanChanok?).
Better go Chatuchak or you must be in for an adventure.
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Bangkok don't get your plumerias,lotus seeds or desert roses from chatuchuk as they are won't grow true.I could show you my purple,triple corolla and splash desert roses that all turned out to be pink trash ones after more than 2 years of close care.I have fallen for that trick more than once.It is like buying jewelery or gemsin thailand.The specialized nurseries on the outskirts of bankok are alright but not as got for fruit trees as those around ubon,udon,chanthaburi,chang mai and other regional centers.The nurseries in Ubon over the Mun River are impressive and cheap with big diversity.
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Yes Chatuchak is known for bad quality products but sometimes the salespeople also got cheated by their wholesaler.
I am also still looking for a good gardencentre in Bkk but i think they do not exist here. You can buy tree's with fruits on them but they are too big to fit in your suitcase or even in a taxi.
My plumeria's were almost dead after the floodings, i cut the rotting stems off and let the trunks root again and now they grow well. Many mangofarms also were flooded last year and after that the prices of ndm went up a lot because of the tree's all died or got anthracnose from the humidity.
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Well Mike that is also hard for me to get what i order. I bought a plumeria variety on Chatuchak which should be Bali Palace but when i finally grafted it and had it flower it was a yellow one but the same one we had on a big tree allready. I saw them on Bali and they were totally yellow and ours had also white parts in the flowers.
He can try Chatuchak but then the tree should be labelled before you arrive there, in that case they can not give you some tree and tell you it is the one you ask for. On the other hand i bought many tree's without labels and those guys have 10 species standing all over the shop and they can see which one is which species by looking at the leaves and stem. I cannot do that but i am not a thai and in the mango-business.
Well the tree's are not expensive for us so if he decides to bring some then just buy some extra from other shops. They will not all be cheating i guess. On Chatuchak i was stupid one day and paid with a billiet from 1000 baht which i thought it was a 100 bill. When i walked away the lady followed me to give me my change.
If he goes to Kanchana Phisek road around the area of Bang Bua Thong he will see loads of mangoshops along the road. That area is not the centre of BKK but there the shops from Chatuchak might buy them, it is a very long area where they sell them and you can see them from out of the car/taxi/bus. Go where Kanchana Phisek road meats Ratthana-thibet road that area has loads of plantshops all over, you cannot miss them. They are along the road for many km/miles
Most tree's are full of diseases so spray them at home. If i was him and just want to buy it simple then buy on chatuchak. Also i read story's that the plant market there is open on wednesday, i thought friday but they are also there in the weekend but maybe not that many as on the plant day. Check internet if you want to be sure. Google on chatuchak and plant market and you will find many hits.
All the tree's there are grafted and mostly 1 meter high or taller. Good luck to him i think he will find what he wants.
Very good and with details your information. Thank you very much Bangkok. I will transfer the information to my friend. He is now in the area of Sakon Nakhon.
I have to plan my next travel to Thailand as soon as possible! Can you be my guide for tree and fruit hunting? ;) haha!
Last time when my friend was there a few months ago took some tree in his suitcase traveling back home. Small trees like mangos, durian, jackfruit, etc. about 60-70cm high. I do not know where he bought all these. He packed the tree in plastic bags bare root without anything. They arrived fine but in about 4-5weeks all the tree died. He didn't know how to handle such stuff. I hope this time is better prepared. If you find another good place where some one can buy really good stuff let me know.
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Well i can show you the shops Mike but it is not so relaxed to hang around there. Those shops are at a very busy road (outer ring) so it is very noisy, smelly and bloody hot there in the sun. Also there is a lot of traffic jam and not many places to park easy. The shops are on the pavement right next to the road but i know some sidestreets where they also sell them but there it costs a little more but is much more relaxed.
I will go see chatuchak plant market soon on a wednesday, i have never been on wednesday because i thought it was on friday and then the market is also open with plants. All species availlable on the place i mentioned i have allready so i need to find a new spot with new species.
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http://www.00ff00.com/2009/02/05/elephant-tusk-mango/ (http://www.00ff00.com/2009/02/05/elephant-tusk-mango/)
This is the elephant tusk mango and also the name in Thai language.
I know a shop that has a tree from 1.5 metre high and am still in doubt to buy it. For 16 us$ i should just not think and give it a new home in a big pot i think. Tomorrow i will go see if they still have it.
Does anybody know if this one is nice? I have never seen nor eaten it.
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that mango reminds me of an emperor penguin, with no black coloration on it's back.
it is a beautiful and unique looking fruit.
it looks like you could club someone with that thing!
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I let google search on that thai word for Ivory Red and found an interesting website with new fruits. Red Dragon mango (Swan) has a brix up to 24.
(http://s11.postimage.org/awi67sgqn/swan_mango.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/awi67sgqn/)
Saffron you should check this website and let google translate it. There is an Annona with durian flavor or it is a Durian with custard flavour i dont know because the translation to Dutch is not that good. You can see the pic and Annona Muricatal is the name. Maybe you got them allready but you never know.
http://soclaimon.wordpress.com/tag/%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A9%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%9C%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A9/ (http://soclaimon.wordpress.com/tag/%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A9%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%9C%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A9/)
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I let google search on that thai word for Ivory Red and found an interesting website with new fruits. Red Dragon mango (Swan) has a brix up to 24.
(http://s11.postimage.org/awi67sgqn/swan_mango.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/awi67sgqn/)
Saffron you should check this website and let google translate it. There is an Annona with durian flavor or it is a Durian with custard flavour i dont know because the translation to Dutch is not that good. You can see the pic and Annona Muricatal is the name. Maybe you got them allready but you never know.
http://soclaimon.wordpress.com/tag/%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A9%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%9C%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A9/ (http://soclaimon.wordpress.com/tag/%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A9%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%9C%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A9/)
Nice colors on that one, from the thumbnail they looked like flowers.
been trying to get Jin Huang ( Golden Queen ) in Fla, I think only Jeff has one, not sure if they have specimens at Fairchild or Spice park, over here. maybe next year I will have luck finding a tree or scion for it.
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Well the pic looks the same as Jakrapat (emperor cost 200 baht) mango. That one is also from Taiwan.
I also just found out that my Aywen mango is just Irwin, i think the taiwanese could not say that word so they make it Aywen. The Taiwanese mango's are mixed species from Irwin mango from Florida.
For me it is good news, now i will go grow the Irwin in a big pot and hope to get nice red mango's.
If the brix is really 24 i dont know, that was what i read in the translation but 24 is pretty high, sweeter then a namdocmai which is very sweet allready.
Red Dragon is also for sale here but expensive (1000 baht= 34 us$). Normally the best things cost the most in Thailand but that Aywen mango that i bought was only 100 baht so that makes it strange to me. Why is emperor so cheap then?
I m sure that next year or the year after that we can buy that Red Dragon for a much lower price on the streets. I did not buy it yet but i m still thinking if it is worth the money or not.
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bangkok,
thanks for the great link,
there is a strange annona at the bottom of the page I've never seen!
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If the brix is really 24 i dont know, that was what i read in the translation but 24 is pretty high, sweeter then a namdocmai which is very sweet allready.
Brix ratings need to be standardized some how, you can really only compare them with varieties tested at the same location by the same meter, and person.
Some stations will test brix at the time the fruit is harvested ( not fully ripe ) and other locations will measure when they are at optimum ripe stage ( this is when I think they should be measured ) and finally some places seem to take measurements of "Maximum" Brix, this may mean they are over ripe.
Same goes for Papaya measurements, they seem to be all over the place for the same varieties. but one can get an idea if a fruit is high brix or not, when they compare readings from the same testers.
also I think brix can vary depending on location and minerals in the soil.
another factor is the ratio between Brix, and acid. so just having a super high brix doesn't necessarily mean its a great tasting fruit.
here is some numbers on 9 different mangoes popular in Thailand, probably one of the most in depth details on things that effect taste. pretty cool.
https://www.uni-hohenheim.de/fileadmin/einrichtungen/sfb564/events/uplands2002/Full-Pap-S3B-3_Vasquez.pdf (https://www.uni-hohenheim.de/fileadmin/einrichtungen/sfb564/events/uplands2002/Full-Pap-S3B-3_Vasquez.pdf)
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Well i can show you the shops Mike but it is not so relaxed to hang around there. Those shops are at a very busy road (outer ring) so it is very noisy, smelly and bloody hot there in the sun. Also there is a lot of traffic jam and not many places to park easy. The shops are on the pavement right next to the road but i know some sidestreets where they also sell them but there it costs a little more but is much more relaxed.
I will go see chatuchak plant market soon on a wednesday, i have never been on wednesday because i thought it was on friday and then the market is also open with plants. All species availlable on the place i mentioned i have allready so i need to find a new spot with new species.
Did you visit Chatuchak market on Wednesday to transfer us some impressions?
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Yes Mike i wrote it in another thread. I bought Irwin which is allready growing on the tree (grafted).
They sold Red Dragon, jakrapat and ndm-red but i did not buy it. Also a red ivory mango.
The website about thai mango's is nice info but it says ndm4 is not that sweet compared to other ones in thailand. I never ate a very sweet keow savoi but they are also nice green or half ripe.
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Last night I came across a newly uploaded youtube video report ( in Spanish ) , an Ecuadorian mango exporter is doing a trial on Nam Doc Mai, which they may export to the US. I think it would be nice if you could find NDM in supermarkets during the off season, instead of Tommy Atkins, which seems to be what I have seen in stores here during my visit.
Exportación de Mango en Ecuador | Elproductor.com (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz3c-WGX9bg#ws)
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Here we have NDM in the supermarkets year around. They do not taste as good as in the season though and cost 4us$ a kilo or more.
What i was wondering yesterday is that i have never seen or eaten an Atemoya or Anonna in Europa. On this forum many people love them a lot but if they are that good why are they not shipped then? Maybe it is too hard to keep them fresh? They even grow in Madeira Island and that is a popular holiday-destination with airlines going there daily i guess.
I found out my new Irwin mango is attracted by small ants a lot. Also something like a scale insect likes to sit on that small tree and it also has a small hole in the stem. I will see what happens if it fruits one day but i think it is a pest-attracted mango compared to the thai ones.
Here it is hard to find a Mahachanok mango in the supermarkets. I still have never eaten one. Also Ivory is still on my list to eat.
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I think the reason is they just do not ship well. they get really soft, fast. my A. squamosa went from ripe to mush in a single day. soursops, which are popular, are hardly ever found in supermarkets in the DR. and if you do find them, they are fruit picked prematurely and hard like a rock.
I do not think they will ever be viable as a supermarket fruit, maybe in farmer type markets though. and of course processed into frozen pulps and things like that.
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I think the reason is they just do not ship well. they get really soft, fast. my A. squamosa went from ripe to mush in a single day. soursops, which are popular, are hardly ever found in supermarkets in the DR. and if you do find them, they are fruit picked prematurely and hard like a rock.
I do not think they will ever be viable as a supermarket fruit, maybe in farmer type markets though. and of course processed into frozen pulps and things like that.
I think you are right. As an example of prematurely picked fruits I can mention the imported mangoes from Brazil. They are sold here in the local SMs very hard and until you get them ripe they loose their flavor. At the end you eat a tasteless mango.
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I found a little background history on the Jin Huang ( aka: Golden Queen, Elephant ) Mango. and according to this article Jin_Huang parents are "White" and "Keitt". which i find a bit strange, not sure what the "White" variety looks like, but Jin-Huang looks more like an over grown Nam Doc Mai, and I remember coming across a post somewhere saying it was a chance seedling of NDM.
http://enquarterly.tzuchiculture.org.tw/?mod=tc_monthly_en&act=detail&id=94 (http://enquarterly.tzuchiculture.org.tw/?mod=tc_monthly_en&act=detail&id=94)
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
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From what you say, you have not tasted Rapoza, correct? Putting Oscar and Hawaii aside, I can tell you from having it grown in Florida that it is not that great...I would say average at best. Could it produce differently in Hawaii compared to Florida, of course, climate, soil and overall growing conditions are different. With that being said, there is a reason it is not known or available in Thailand and I would bet my money that if you grew it you would not become rich off of it...in fact, my guess is you would wind up with an abundant supply of fruit for your own consumption. There are just too many varieties available in Thailand that are far better. Just my 2 Bahts...
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
From the varieties that are not very common like Mahachanok, Chokanon, etc what can someone find there in the big markets of Bangkok if you know?
mod edit: I fixed the Mahachanok spelling for easier searching on the forum.
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Hawaiian Grown TV - Rapoza Mango - Poamoho Organic Produce (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrydA_rV2H4#ws) just skip the first 5 minutes of the video.
Well Asia has a status-culture. If you put big rapoza's with nice color on the market you sure will sell them for a good price because people will buy it as a present or think it must be very good because of the price. Even if it is not that good, there are no red or purple mango's for sale here, i have never seen them neither has my wife.
If you say this is from Hawaii then that makes it even more interesting. I also have never seen or tasted a Rapoza but from internet i got very curious to taste and grow them. Anthracnose resistant is also great for us.
Why people buy the expensive mangotree's here without ever tasting or seeing the fruit? Only for color and to show that they have something different. If Rapoza is not as nice as a thai mango then people will know it soon but maybe they grow better in Thailand then in Florida? I have no idea but i dont understand why you Americans have such different mango's then the Asians have. You grow also the asian versions beside the normal ones but here they grow only the asians, nothing else.
Now on the markets is green mango's as Kaew (means glass and nice sweet if ripe), Mundanao (or something like that), Falan and some more green ones but i cannot read the thai description from them.
Yellow mango is Okrung and NDM from new harvest.
Chocanon is nothing special here but not for sale now. Mahachanok i only see in expensive supermarkets sometimes but at the moment only NDM which they have year around. I bought r2e2 once in the ssupermarket but i was not impressed. I also grow them myself the r2e2 but only for the color.
Jakrapat as a tree is sold in many shops now but i have never tasted the fruit. On the kasetsart agriculturefair the fruits were for sale but very expensive i remember. My graft from jakrapat just flushed since today so i have to wait long, it is on a chocanon tree which i multigrafted with 4 red species to give away and i m also grafting it on my 2 ndm tree's.
To grow fruit for a living i would go for the hype-effect. I also saw the mango with that nob on the side from Florida, we have never seen something like that here and sure it will sell no matter how it tasts. If you sell something like that to the richer capital city's in Asia i think you can sell easy because people will buy it for the looks. Or to give to their friends on the country-side like: Look what we have in BKK now! Here i bought one for you!
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What kind of grafted mango trees can you find now in the nurseries except the common varieties?
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According to what I have read on the Golden Queen, it seems to have good disease resistance.
as for marketing, I understand that having something exotic to sell to a niche market at a higher price can be a good idea, specially when the market is already flooded with common varieties.
but one has to take into account that those common varieties are popular for a reason, usually because they produce well in the region, and have a flavor preferred by the majority of the people.
If you can get popular varieties to produce outside their normal season, you can get a lot better price, so this is another option.
there are so many disease resistant varieties that have commercial potential, Rapoza may be an excellent mango in Hawaii, and may or may not do well at other locations, but will it have a flavor that your market will like? I have only tried a few Eastern type mangoes and have noticed they seem to have a stronger or different flavor than American types.
If you have noticed in this forum, people have a preference for certain varieties they grew up on, the Aussies love their KP, Hawaiian Rapoza, in Mexico its the Ataulfo, in the Dominican Republic, the Banilejo. and on and on. to the locals that grew up on a particular variety, its that variety that they use to measure and compare all other varieties they try.
As an example, Banilejo, is a small slightly fibrous mango that is very sweet. and is a favorite to locals in the DR. give someone a Kent or Haden, and they find them bland in comparison. another variety is the "gota de oro" this is the second favorite, and it is like eating a mop soaked in sweetened mango juice. Keitt is becoming popular now, because it has a decent strong flavor, and farmers love it for many other reasons.
My solution is to collect about a dozen popular commercial varieties and then test them with people to see how they will do. since Dominican seem to have a preference for intensely sweet varieties, they may actually love varieties from the east. So far I have Kesar, Alphonso, Maha Chanok, Manila, also have the new Zill varieties, except Angie which I still want to get. also want to get the Golden Queen, and a few more like the Sindhu, Xoai Cat Hoa Loc, Cat chu, Chausa and Neelam
I will be testing, Rapoza, Osteen, and a couple others as potential export varieties. who knows maybe there will be a market locally for them, not everyone has the same tastes.
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Well in Thailand the looks are the most important of all else. Also the price should be high so people get curious and if you name it Hawaii mango then nobody knows where hawaii is but they heard that word in some movie probably and get curious. They will buy it as a gadget and if it really is nice enough then they will come back i guess.
You should see how many people use whitener here, totally crazy. It is even in lipstick or deodorant or any creme. Thai will not go in the sunshine to protect their skin (i mean the Hi-so Thai with money) or they will wear a full wetsuit to go swimming. Looks count a lot here.
Asian people don't travel much because it is expensive and you have to speak english for that. They are curious though about other worlds. I think a white mango will also sell well here if you call it "snow-white mango" or Polar-bear or something like that which is sure not an asian word and has to do with cold and snow or a cute bear (Thai think you can cuddle polar-bears like a Panda).
Also for sale here are huge red apples from Japan, cost more then 10us$ for 1 in the supermarkets. Fiji Apple for 6-7 us$ are also for sale. They are big and red and also nice for an apple but my wife thinks they are sour, she prefers the Snow Pear from Korea more because they are more sweet and more juicy.
"Japanese fruit" Shop in Ginza Shopping District Tokyo Japan (World Travel Report) MTP (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSsCcfVZ_MU#ws)
Look at this fruitshop in Tokyo, they are the richest Asians and are an example for many other asians.
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
Red Dragon may be the brand name of a mango selling company. Here is what I found: http://www.agriculturesource.com/p-cat-hoa-loc-mango-550139.html (http://www.agriculturesource.com/p-cat-hoa-loc-mango-550139.html)
Look at what it says for brand.
Also check this out: http://www.reddragon.vn/?Acat=12&lg=eg&start=0 (http://www.reddragon.vn/?Acat=12&lg=eg&start=0)
Maybe someone is selling the trees from the variety that Red Dragon usually sells? Or maybe there is a new mango cultivar named Red Dragon.
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Lol Thais are selling Vietnamese mangoes now?
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I found the same links when i searched for red dragon.
In the wholesale mangotree shop that sold them they showed me a pic of it on a leaflet some weeks ago. It was a red colored mango. They sell this one also on Chatuchak market and i saw it in other mangotree shops but always 1000 baht =30us$
I only want a scion of it but i m sure within some months i get that for a few bucks grafted on a rootstock.
Maybe we should google on Red Dragon in Chinese language or Taiwanese or so.
I will let my wife do now in thai characters.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/62360619@N06/6080155204/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62360619@N06/6080155204/#)
The wife is busy with The Voice of Thailand but i found this pic of red dragon......well i saw a more red pic in the shop but this might be it....they call this red??? But that is what i mean, bring a real red Irwin to the market here and they dont believe it is a mango ;D
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I found a little background history on the Jin Huang ( aka: Golden Queen, Elephant ) Mango. and according to this article Jin_Huang parents are "White" and "Keitt". which i find a bit strange, not sure what the "White" variety looks like, but Jin-Huang looks more like an over grown Nam Doc Mai, and I remember coming across a post somewhere saying it was a chance seedling of NDM.
http://enquarterly.tzuchiculture.org.tw/?mod=tc_monthly_en&act=detail&id=94 (http://enquarterly.tzuchiculture.org.tw/?mod=tc_monthly_en&act=detail&id=94)
Ok I think i have finally solved this mystery, the "white" mango is called "Nang Klang Wan" so Golden Queen is a cross between Nang Klang Wan and Keitt. also found out it is poly embryonic .
(http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff510/William_Crowley/nang-klangwan2_zps9142647f.jpg)
This mango sure looks like the Ivory. which would explain the "White" translation from the other website.
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Last time when my friend was there a few months ago took some tree in his suitcase traveling back home. Small trees like mangos, durian, jackfruit, etc. about 60-70cm high. I do not know where he bought all these. He packed the tree in plastic bags bare root without anything. They arrived fine but in about 4-5weeks all the tree died. He didn't know how to handle such stuff. I hope this time is better prepared. If you find another good place where some one can buy really good stuff let me know.
Beware of importing pests, specilly mango malformation disease!!!
On the other hand, I would not waste time and money with ultra tropicals like durian, mangostan, rambutan, chempedak, langsat... Species that could suit at your location would be Syzygium sp, jackfruit, santol...
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Last time when my friend was there a few months ago took some tree in his suitcase traveling back home. Small trees like mangos, durian, jackfruit, etc. about 60-70cm high. I do not know where he bought all these. He packed the tree in plastic bags bare root without anything. They arrived fine but in about 4-5weeks all the tree died. He didn't know how to handle such stuff. I hope this time is better prepared. If you find another good place where some one can buy really good stuff let me know.
Beware of importing pests, specilly mango malformation disease!!!
On the other hand, I would not waste time and money with ultra tropicals like durian, mangostan, rambutan, chempedak, langsat... Species that could suit at your location would be Syzygium sp, jackfruit, santol...
Hi Felipe
I have all these in my mind so the trees take a separate place in the greenhouse for a period. Ι don't say that the risk is eliminated but is lower.
My big desire is to grow durian here. I know is not easy because of the ultra tropic nature of the tree. I will try something different after having more knowledge also through the forum and I hope the result is positive at the end.
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Mike, could maybe have success with durian in a heated greenhouse, but never outdoors. At the canarian research station they (professionals) have tried many times with ultratropicals. The imported a few times durian seeds, seedlings and even grafted plants. Sooner or later they lost the plants. They have one last mangosteen in a heated greenhouse (very high humidity) but it barely doesn't grow. Same story with langsat, rambutan... I like durian a lot, I wish it could grow in subtropical climate :-\
On the other hand there are many other species with very good tasting fruit that could perform at your place: longan, litchi, annonaceas, sapotaceas, myrtaceas... I would focus on them ;)
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Mike, could maybe have success with durian in a heated greenhouse, but never outdoors. At the canarian research station they (professionals) have tried many times with ultratropicals. The imported a few times durian seeds, seedlings and even grafted plants. Sooner or later they lost the plants. They have one last mangosteen in a heated greenhouse (very high humidity) but it barely doesn't grow. Same story with langsat, rambutan... I like durian a lot, I wish it could grow in subtropical climate :-\
On the other hand there are many other species with very good tasting fruit that could perform at your place: longan, litchi, annonaceas, sapotaceas, myrtaceas... I would focus on them ;)
Hi
This is not good news for me :( I am sure they know much more than I know and they have a lot of experience. I will make a try next year when the weather is more appropriated. Thank you for your suggestions for the other trees. Step by step I will try each year more fruiting trees and find out what it grows best in my climate.
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Mike, could maybe have success with durian in a heated greenhouse, but never outdoors. At the canarian research station they (professionals) have tried many times with ultratropicals. The imported a few times durian seeds, seedlings and even grafted plants. Sooner or later they lost the plants. They have one last mangosteen in a heated greenhouse (very high humidity) but it barely doesn't grow. Same story with langsat, rambutan... I like durian a lot, I wish it could grow in subtropical climate :-\
On the other hand there are many other species with very good tasting fruit that could perform at your place: longan, litchi, annonaceas, sapotaceas, myrtaceas... I would focus on them ;)
Hi
This is not good news for me :( I am sure they know much more than I know and they have a lot of experience. I will make a try next year when the weather is more appropriated. Thank you for your suggestions for the other trees. Step by step I will try each year more fruiting trees and find out what it grows best in my climate.
Don't give up hope yet on growing those durians. Mike T on this forum has posted lots of valuable information on types of durians and types of mangosteens that are more cold hardy. You should find this thread and read it thoroughly. Actually this came up in several threads. Or you could contact Mike T in Australia directly with a PM.
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From what you say, you have not tasted Rapoza, correct? Putting Oscar and Hawaii aside, I can tell you from having it grown in Florida that it is not that great...I would say average at best. Could it produce differently in Hawaii compared to Florida, of course, climate, soil and overall growing conditions are different. With that being said, there is a reason it is not known or available in Thailand and I would bet my money that if you grew it you would not become rich off of it...in fact, my guess is you would wind up with an abundant supply of fruit for your own consumption. There are just too many varieties available in Thailand that are far better. Just my 2 Bahts...
Rob, you should realize that climate in Bankok is very different from climate where you live. And although you judege from the one tree? that you grow of Rapoza that it is only average it could very well be excellent in Thailand. Also Thai people have a totally different perception of mangos than you do. Asian preferences are very different than American preferences in mangos. But if Bangkok is looking merely for red coloration in a mango then maybe he should try Florida's favorite: Tommy Atkins? It might be a lot easier to get than the Rapoza and it also produces well and has very nice coloration. Florida growers and world wide it is a very popular mango, never mind that it is almost completely tasteless! :'(
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I have noticed on some websites that Irwin seems to be very popular in some Asian countries, and is grown in Japan, and sold for a very high price.
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I have noticed on some websites that Irwin seems to be very popular in some Asian countries, and is grown in Japan, and sold for a very high price.
I cannot find the link anymore but i saw a pic of 2 irwin mango's growing in japan and costed 2000$ a pair! They were hanging on ropes and looked perfect. 2000 a pair i would like to know what the Japanese see in those fruits or what is the reason that they buy it for that money.
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Its a culture thing, they are sold as "gift fruits" I have seen many videos of tourist freaking out over cantaloupes that cost 400 dollars, and things like that. from what I was told, these are purchased and given away to impress and as status symbols, cheaper costing fruit can be found in markets and stores etc.
I have seen that picture your talking about, the Irwin mangoes are suspended in nets above the trees, which are kept small and are growing in a green house. looks more like something from some futuristic sci fi movie.
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From what you say, you have not tasted Rapoza, correct? Putting Oscar and Hawaii aside, I can tell you from having it grown in Florida that it is not that great...I would say average at best. Could it produce differently in Hawaii compared to Florida, of course, climate, soil and overall growing conditions are different. With that being said, there is a reason it is not known or available in Thailand and I would bet my money that if you grew it you would not become rich off of it...in fact, my guess is you would wind up with an abundant supply of fruit for your own consumption. There are just too many varieties available in Thailand that are far better. Just my 2 Bahts...
Rob, you should realize that climate in Bankok is very different from climate where you live. And although you judege from the one tree? that you grow of Rapoza that it is only average it could very well be excellent in Thailand. Also Thai people have a totally different perception of mangos than you do. Asian preferences are very different than American preferences in mangos. But if Bangkok is looking merely for red coloration in a mango then maybe he should try Florida's favorite: Tommy Atkins? It might be a lot easier to get than the Rapoza and it also produces well and has very nice coloration. Florida growers and world wide it is a very popular mango, never mind that it is almost completely tasteless! :'(
From my post you should be able to surmise that I realize Thailand is different than SFla, and Hawaii. While I know you have spent your fair share of time in Thailand, my comment was based on people I know who make, or have made, regular visits to Thailand and people I have talked to who have lived in Thailand. Yes, Rapoza could produce totally different there but from what I know, which is second hand knowledge, I don't feel it would be a hit there. I also have my doubts that it would even be worthy of growing for export purposes (I repeat, no disrespect to you or anybody who likes the Rapoza, no matter where it is grown)...I just don't see it from what I have tasted. Again, there can be some differences when grown from location to location, however a Tommy Atkins is still a Tommy Atkins, no matter where it is grown.
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I'm pretty sure Rob if you tated Rapozas here in Hawaii you would change your mind. It's very hard to know how a fruit will fare when marketed in another country. I think it's mostly dependent on how it's promoted and marketed, and a lot less on the quality of the fruit itself. I think Tommy Atkins proves this point.
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For red color on my mango's i have enough scions growing now, actually Jakrapat which is Jin Huang (or something like that) it looks very purple on the pic but in real they are brown, i just saw them on the Kasetsart fair but could not taste it.
Now the red Dragon and the Summer Snow are new variaty's which sell for 1000 baht a small grafted tree. I will wait some years before i buy them and taste them first. I have Aiwen growing allready which is also red and from Taiwan and grafts easy.
I believe Oscar that Rapoza is very nice because he has travelled a lot and can taste the differences. I also believe people who say they are not nice but i guess Hawai has about the same climate as Thailand but with more rain but a very different soil.
Anyway i like to hear any opinion wheter it is against mine or whatever. I have heard enough about Tommy mango's and last week a tree was offered to me from Tooommiiiii, which i guess it is Tommy Atkins but i dont know because i dont believe thai sellers on a fair no more.
Ohh now i am thinking about the 400 gram of 0-0-60 i put in the ground under my ndm4, maybe that made my collapsed mango that i ate yesterday so sweet. It grew in the shade in a bag all the time and was not ripe to pick yet but very sweet and also some sour tones. I also have a ndm4 on my other tree and will compare the taste, that tree did not get the 0-0-60.
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Mike, could maybe have success with durian in a heated greenhouse, but never outdoors. At the canarian research station they (professionals) have tried many times with ultratropicals. The imported a few times durian seeds, seedlings and even grafted plants. Sooner or later they lost the plants. They have one last mangosteen in a heated greenhouse (very high humidity) but it barely doesn't grow. Same story with langsat, rambutan... I like durian a lot, I wish it could grow in subtropical climate :-\
On the other hand there are many other species with very good tasting fruit that could perform at your place: longan, litchi, annonaceas, sapotaceas, myrtaceas... I would focus on them ;)
Hi
This is not good news for me :( I am sure they know much more than I know and they have a lot of experience. I will make a try next year when the weather is more appropriated. Thank you for your suggestions for the other trees. Step by step I will try each year more fruiting trees and find out what it grows best in my climate.
Don't give up hope yet on growing those durians. Mike T on this forum has posted lots of valuable information on types of durians and types of mangosteens that are more cold hardy. You should find this thread and read it thoroughly. Actually this came up in several threads. Or you could contact Mike T in Australia directly with a PM.
Thanks Oscar.
It is obviously that like durian very much so I try to follow each thread in this forum. I can say for sure I know much more mow than 1 or 2 yrs ago and that because of the knowledge of many forum members. I hope I can transfer this knowledge in to the action and one day can eat my own durian. One of my dreams will be true. Awesome! ;D
Big thanks to all of you! :).
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Regarding the original topic of this thread "Golden Queen Mango", does anyone know if it has been found in Florida yet?
Thanks,
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Regarding the original topic of this thread "Golden Queen Mango", does anyone know if it has been found in Florida yet?
Thanks,
Well, a few people may have Golden Queen trees if the eBay seller sold the correct tree. Check back in the next year or so when they may finally fruit.
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Thanks Sheehan. I think you tried to save a piece of budwood from the one you bought? Did it make it?
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Thanks Sheehan. I think you tried to save a piece of budwood from the one you bought? Did it make it?
Jeff did the saving. He gave me one to plant out. I guess we'll know in a few, not so short, years.
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Thanks Harry, sounds good. :)
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The member "fruitnursery" ( name Burns ) is offering scions, did anyone make any orders?
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200)
For those requesting scions of Golden Queen Mango or Jin Hwang Mango from Taiwan. Please PM your address as there are also request from growers in Florida. The minimum scions I could send are about 5 each for an individual as we also need to propagate them this May. :) I think Jin Hwang mangoes will weight more if planted in Sub tropical climates. :) I am really surprised that Jin Hwang Mango has not reached yet in California and Florida.
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The member "fruitnursery" ( name Burns ) is offering scions, did anyone make any orders?
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200)
For those requesting scions of Golden Queen Mango or Jin Hwang Mango from Taiwan. Please PM your address as there are also request from growers in Florida. The minimum scions I could send are about 5 each for an individual as we also need to propagate them this May. :) I think Jin Hwang mangoes will weight more if planted in Sub tropical climates. :) I am really surprised that Jin Hwang Mango has not reached yet in California and Florida.
Burns sounds like he might burn you. ;) But his real name is Berns. I've communicated with him many times over the years. Real nice fellow. He's deeply into rare fruits, and a real mangophile. I haven't ordered anything from him but he's ordered from me. ;)
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The member "fruitnursery" ( name Burns ) is offering scions, did anyone make any orders?
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21.200)
For those requesting scions of Golden Queen Mango or Jin Hwang Mango from Taiwan. Please PM your address as there are also request from growers in Florida. The minimum scions I could send are about 5 each for an individual as we also need to propagate them this May. :) I think Jin Hwang mangoes will weight more if planted in Sub tropical climates. :) I am really surprised that Jin Hwang Mango has not reached yet in California and Florida.
Burns sounds like he might burn you. ;) But his real name is Berns. I've communicated with him many times over the years. Real nice fellow. He's deeply into rare fruits, and a real mangophile. I haven't ordered anything from him but he's ordered from me. ;)
LOL this is what I get from watching too much Simpsons, "Berns vs Burns".
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I think i have the real golden queen mangotree now. I bought it from a shop with only taiwanese mangovariety's and they even labelled the tree with their phonenumber!! ;D
Also red dragon is sold in many shops now (the tree) so i guess it is a real mango variety. On the pics they look red ;D
I think the ivory mango got it's name because of it's shape, an elephant tusk. That would make it ma-muang chang (elefant mango). I have been asking for that in the past and they had the tree for sale. Red ivory is chang-daeng which i also have now from Taiwan. It should be a big mango.
I read on mr. Duzon's website that Golden queen also can bloom 3 times a year and it is a great mango. He also rates chokanan as a very good mango though...
Is there any more new info about the Taiwanese varietys?
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Here some pict of my Golden Queen mango from last season. its a 2 years old tree and plant in container
(http://s30.postimg.cc/so2t3m37x/2013_10_20_17_24_08.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/so2t3m37x/)
(http://s30.postimg.cc/qraocs1xp/2013_11_29_16_58_20.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/qraocs1xp/)
(http://s30.postimg.cc/a4t43p8zx/2014_01_10_10_25_54.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/a4t43p8zx/)
(http://s30.postimg.cc/nj66zqfnx/2014_01_26_15_02_55.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/nj66zqfnx/)
(http://s30.postimg.cc/d7tu72nyl/2014_02_08_15_01_27.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/d7tu72nyl/)
(http://s30.postimg.cc/t3ioadej1/2014_02_08_15_39_24.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/t3ioadej1/)
Its a heavy bearing flower and fruit...but since the tree were just too small...i decided to thin the fruit...at first i keep 3 of them but only 1 remain...i think the trees have its own mechanism :)
For the record...its yellow coloration was develop when it ripened properly after harvest. bagging with carbon paper would block the green color to develop, so when it comes to ripening process...the yellow will easily emerge.
It has a firm texture...no fiber...sweet mild almost without sour/acidity and some flavor of Keitt since it was one of the parent. it can be eaten raw green like it other parent...a thai cultivar.
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Thanks for the pics. If you get a chance, could you take a picture of the leaves? I have what I believe to be a golden queen (purchased from thailand), but it would be nice to compare. Mine is really vigorous and has extremely thick stems / oversized leaves.
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Wow that one is huge Jack!
That will sure be more then a kilo and would look great on a small tree in a pot :P
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
Hi bangkok,
I went to a plants nursery nearby yesterday, bought 1 small seedling of grafted mango. The seller mentioned it as Dragon King grafted mango seedling.
cheers
(http://s2.postimg.cc/8spzn5cv9/20141212_174330.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/8spzn5cv9/)
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
Hi bangkok,
I went to a plants nursery nearby yesterday, bought 1 small seedling of grafted mango. The seller mentioned it as Dragon King grafted mango seedling.
cheers
(http://s2.postimg.cc/8spzn5cv9/20141212_174330.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/8spzn5cv9/)
Great! I hope it is a nice mango, i 've never heard of dragon king. Which other mango variety's did they sell there?
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Today i was in the mango specialist shop where i saw 200 Red Dragon mangotree's some weeks ago. They had only 4 pieces left ands till cost 30 us$ which is a very high price for thailand. I wanted to buy Rapoza but i cannot communicate with them and i think they have never heard of it. I want Rapoza because its anthracnose resistance and because it should taste so good (and looks). For that one i will pay 30$ here not for any other.
The mangoshop nextdoor to the big shop told me Red Dragon is probably also the same as Ivory (Elephant) and Jakrapat and that someone just grows them from a species which came from seed mixed.
There is also NDM Red for sale here, they make species faster then internet can follow. Red Dragon is not in Google that means it is very new.
I think if i had loads of Rapoza mango's and sell them very expensive here they will fly out of the shops. Also the tree's will be sold quick after that. Nobody has ever seen a Red Dragon mango in real here and also not on the web. I saw pictures at some shop who sells the tree's but maybe it tastes crap.
I read you asked what i would grow if i started a farm to live from, well i would grow Rapoza in Thailand and sell them only expensive to Thai and Singapore and Honkong and Kuala Lumpur etc. Just make a hype of it like new from Hawai!
Hi bangkok,
I went to a plants nursery nearby yesterday, bought 1 small seedling of grafted mango. The seller mentioned it as Dragon King grafted mango seedling.
cheers
(http://s2.postimg.cc/8spzn5cv9/20141212_174330.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/8spzn5cv9/)
Great! I hope it is a nice mango, i 've never heard of dragon king. Which other mango variety's did they sell there?
Hi bangkok,
A few variety such as Nam Doc Mai, Harumanis, chockanan and etc.
cheers
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Wow that one is huge Jack!
That will sure be more then a kilo and would look great on a small tree in a pot :P
Hello Jeff;
Is that ebay seller still around ?, if so can you provide the link, would love to buy one of those bad-Boys !
Ed
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is this the Golden Queen Mango Tree ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sia-Tong-Mango-Medium-tree-Container-3-gallon-/121498021617?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c49d8aef1 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sia-Tong-Mango-Medium-tree-Container-3-gallon-/121498021617?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c49d8aef1)
Thanks Ed
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is this the Golden Queen Mango Tree ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sia-Tong-Mango-Medium-tree-Container-3-gallon-/121498021617?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c49d8aef1 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sia-Tong-Mango-Medium-tree-Container-3-gallon-/121498021617?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c49d8aef1)
Thanks Ed
Nope......Sia Tong is a yellow Nam Doc Mai......it is not Golden Queen.
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I was ready to pull the trigger:) .
Thanks ed
Can we all make a group purchase ? I will put up $100 for 1 tree maybe we can find a nursery abroad to sell a few of these trees.
Ed.
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A true nursery abroad will most likely have a problem getting the mango trees into Florida. If you could get it in, would need to go through 2 year quarantine that would go under approval/inspection by USDA guidelines .
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Wow did not know that, ok will wait to our Florida growers source them.
Thanks rod.
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My golden queen got stopped at the border and came with a tag specifying that it was my "one time" allowance (ie, further shipments would be destroyed).
The (bare-rooted) tree died, but I was lucky enough to pluck off a couple of pieces of budwood as it was entering throes of death, and I now have a pretty large golden queen top worked on my keitt -- which is totally loaded with blooms right now.
I should get a pretty decent harvest of fruit this summer on it, and if it is indeed golden queen, I will make budwood available.
It appears to be a very vigorous tree, and has the odd characteristic of very thick stems -- almost comically large.
PS, mine was purchased under a different name, the taiwanese version of the name (Jin Huang).
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Jeff Do you know if its legal To Receive It bare Root From Thailand ?
If so I will order afew bare Root Shipped Via Next day Air...
Thanks Ed
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Jeff Do you know if its legal To Receive It bare Root From Thailand ?
If so I will order afew bare Root Shipped Via Next day Air...
Thanks Ed
It is legal with the proper permits and a 2 year post entry quarantine for mango trees. Otherwise, not legal.
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Will have to wait until it is available here in Florida..
Thanks again All..
Ed
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Jeff Do you know if its legal To Receive It bare Root From Thailand ?
If so I will order afew bare Root Shipped Via Next day Air...
Thanks Ed
It is legal with the proper permits and a 2 year post entry quarantine for mango trees. Otherwise, not legal.
There is an echo in here...
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It's as though he asked the same question and got the same answer a day apart....
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Will have to wait until it is available here in Florida..
Thanks again All..
Ed
Ed you better learn how to graft or let somebody else who is experienced graft.
I'm also looking for good mangovariety's....
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Yes grafting will have to do for now.
Thanks all for your help
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Does it go by the name of Kaew Sa Wei Mango looks similar but its green..
Ed
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Does it go by the name of Kaew Sa Wei Mango looks similar but its green..
Ed
Nope, that's another mango mostly eaten green and unripe and also smaller. Keo Yai is a big one though, i grow it but have never seen the fruit.
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so the Golden Queen goes by the name of Jin huang ?
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Yes the guy who developed it in taiwan was named Huang Jin Huang so the mango was named after him. His name literally translates to golden royalty which is why I guess some people call this golden queen.
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Thanks
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http://www.dizonexoticfruittrees.com/mango/gqueen.htm (http://www.dizonexoticfruittrees.com/mango/gqueen.htm)
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Ha That's A Monster Mango ;)..
Thanks Ed
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Here is pice from my farm with 3 years tree
(http://s4.postimg.cc/4pwjuynvd/20150227154404.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/4pwjuynvd/)
(http://s21.postimg.cc/8w4f206dv/20150227154440.jpg) (http://postimg.cc/image/8w4f206dv/)
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Sorry for digging up this old thread. I was wondering if Golden Queen, or Jing Huang, is available in Florida. I have a Kiew Yai tree that many people said was Golden queen. Kiew Yai mangoes did not turn yellow when they ripened, so I don’t think they are Jing Huang.
I watched the documentary about Jing Huang mango and was interested in planting it.
TIA.
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There are some people growing it.