Author Topic: Not enough Durian Discussion  (Read 54291 times)

cassowary

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #425 on: February 03, 2023, 12:40:11 AM »
Whenever a vigorous growing shoot is broken the auxin dominance is no longer there so there will be auxin dominance somehwere else.
So learning about auxin and how the shoot grows will help to make better decisions when it comes to pruning.
"Science in agriculture" by Arden Andersen is a great source.

"So your upside down tree" is due to the loss of the auxin dominant shoot. Atleast from what I know.
The top is now setback and it will take time before a new shoot comes out and starts being a sink again. So it might look like the lower part grows faster in contrast to the now stunted top shoot.

I only have Penang 88 seedlings and they grow like the others, i think the shape of the tree have more to do with soil, sun, shade. These are all zibethinus after all but even the graveolens, kutjensis, oxleyanus and hybrids have same or similar growth pattern to zibethinus, from my field observations i have deducted that the environment dictate the shape of durio more then the variety etc. However the vigour is different, graveolens is really vigorous compared to the others!

Potential root stock for anyone grafting durian.

Root's are in one way similar to shoots.
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Gone tropo

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #426 on: February 03, 2023, 03:58:09 PM »
Cassowary it’s the top half of my tree that grows vigorously the bottom half is stunted you had it back to front

TropicalFruitHunters

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #427 on: February 03, 2023, 08:25:59 PM »
Peter...have you come across this guy's videos on Youtube?  He's in Malaysia promoting durian growing.  I've enjoy his videos and most, if not all, are subtitled in English.  He does a good job explaining his reasons/actions and really speaks out on mound planting.  https://www.youtube.com/@facultyofdurian9644/videos

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #428 on: February 04, 2023, 12:22:03 PM »
Hi Jay
I met that guy!
I didn’t know about the videos so I’ll be looking at those.
I have been grafting durian trees here in CR with a technique that is inspired by the post you made of the Thai nursery. I showed the photos of my work and the guy liked it a lot and wanted copies of the photos.
The mounds seem very high and not so wide. Seems to me they should be a tad lower and wider.
It was at a 300 acre farm in Pahang where we met.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #429 on: February 04, 2023, 05:32:14 PM »
Wow!  Small freaking world Peter!  That is pretty wild.  I enjoy his videos and I think what he says makes a lot of sense.  We've chatted online a few times and he's in agreement with what one of our local durian experts had advised me to do here to get my trees going.  Lots of work and time involved, but interesting.  Only time will tell if it was worth it.  That Thai nursery blog was a long time ago!  Fun to do.  I agree that many of the mounds didn't seem as wide as I would have thought, but they seem to be working.  I think the higher they are, the less chance of the roots getting down into any water logged soil.  I want to make mine high as possible, but it's going to take enough soil being brought in as it is.  Then take away settling.  I'll be happy if I can have two feet of height in the end.  I probably cannot go as wide as I should/want either.  We'll see.  Should be quite the journey.  I'm enjoying it though and it keeps me busy and sane here.

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #430 on: February 04, 2023, 07:26:18 PM »
The mounds are pretty high.  What makes me nervous is that the branch tips easily extend past the edge of the mounds. So you’d assume that the roots are passing through an area that is quite wet since the water would be running down the sides of the mounds in a heavy downpour.  That farm had areas with mounds, without mounds and planting on steep terracing.  The oldest trees are about 4.5 years old.  300 acres of mostly Musang king.
I got to be there because I was with Lindsey and Richard.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #431 on: February 04, 2023, 07:43:15 PM »
LOL!!  I'm not at all surprised that Lindsay is acquainted with this dude!  I do like the terracing and if you have the land and terrain for it, probably the way to go.  I got my first two durians in Chanthaburi's Local Durian Education Center.  They grow older varieties.  I noticed that their trees are planted on raised rows with canals on either side.

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #432 on: February 05, 2023, 08:30:51 AM »
I think that Lindsay hadn’t met mr. Lim before but was well aware of him. We were touring a 300 acre farm and he happened to be there on a monthly consultation. We spent less than an hour sharing durian and talking with him and the farm owners family.
Most of the durians were planted as small grafted trees there. But what I saw in two other farms were seedlings that were being grafted at about one year old.
The thing about the terracing is that there isn’t any top soil left the way these guys works. They load up a large hole with medium and plant but it seems that it is if the tree is in a large pot.
Interestingly, that farm combines a lot of natural practices. They don’t use herbicide and they apply EM as part of their routine.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #433 on: February 05, 2023, 11:47:16 PM »
Tropo - you can get musang king in Australia. In Townsville they only have the frozen flesh but sydney you can get whole frozen. It’s pretty pricy compared to frozen mon thong but its taste is so much better it’s worth paying the extra. Most Asian supermarkets have the frozen flesh and cairns have a big SEA population I’d be suprised if they didn’t have whole frozen aswell.
 I know opening a fresh durian is half the fun but in the off season you have to make do. I don’t find there’s any loss of quality at all.

ben mango

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #434 on: February 06, 2023, 02:08:14 PM »
Isn’t Malaysia like a 3 hour flight for you aussies anyway? Good god, just go already

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #435 on: February 06, 2023, 09:05:18 PM »
It’s more than 30 hours for me but totally worth it. I’ve been 3 times in less than 5 years. There’s no substitute!
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #436 on: February 06, 2023, 10:47:37 PM »
Isn’t Malaysia like a 3 hour flight for you aussies anyway? Good god, just go already

Yeh mate I’ve just gotta convince the wife of some other reason to go there other than durians….. she has no idea why I’m so interested in going to Malaysia lol

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #437 on: February 07, 2023, 08:28:10 AM »
Aside from fruit, best food in the world. That goes especially for Penang. Their durian trees are starting to show flowering now. They’re expecting a very good season around May/early June.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #438 on: February 11, 2023, 10:08:11 AM »
So I’ve been trying to learn more and more about how they grow durian in Malaysia. This quest has led me to a lot of farms on the peninsula and Borneo. Part of that routine is to inquire about what fertilizers, amendments, agro chemicals they apply.
Of course this is a big discussion and there’s still a lot that I don’t know. But I was impressed with how much natural strategies are being incorporated. I’m seeing less herbicide use and none of the farms seemed to be using systemic fungicides. What I have heard is that in Thailand the use of aliete, an aluminum based systemic fungicide, is very common on durian farms.
I’m wondering Jay, if you or anyone else know much about specific application practices in Thailand.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #439 on: February 12, 2023, 06:07:29 AM »
Peter...I will reach out to a friend of the family who has a huge durian farm and ask him.  I know that the Faculty of Durian dude has some videos covering this, but I haven't paid much attention to these vids yet.  Here is an article from Lindsay:  https://www.yearofthedurian.com/2020/03/thailand-durian-pesticides-explained.html


Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #440 on: February 12, 2023, 01:50:22 PM »
Yeah Jay, ask around. I’ve seen Lindsay’s article and talked to her about it. I’ve looked at lots of Mr. Lim’s videos and spoken with the owner of a large farm that Lim is the consultant on. They are combining many natural practices with some conventional fertilizers and pesticides when needed. But it seems to me that they are not using systemic pesticides. I’ve looked in lots of sheds at Malaysian farms and it’s not that bad.
But I’d like to know about Thailand which is the largest producer and has many practices that are different from Malaysia.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #441 on: February 12, 2023, 07:13:54 PM »
So an update I had 3552mm of rain last year and already 1186mm of rain this year, Im on heavy clay soil and can confirm this is too much rain they are starting to show rotten growth coming out on some of them and I can just tell they aren't that happy at the moment.  My durians are on small mounds but its not enough to combat the huge saturation the soil here gets I can see why they plant them on steep hills in malaysia.

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #442 on: February 12, 2023, 08:40:10 PM »
We can get that much rain. Penang gets less but some parts of Malaysia get that and have good production. The videos that Jay and I have been talking about show the durians planted on steep mounds if they are on the flat. The guy also sometimes makes ditches for drainage. We are planting on hills now but have good trees where the ground gets pretty wet and water can stand in depressions. I cringe when I see that but, we’re still in business.
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #443 on: February 13, 2023, 12:33:46 AM »
Maybe start grafting onto wild durians instead or using them to multiple rootstock graft onto your current tree??  The wild durians are supposed to handle wet feet much better than the normal varieites.  Gone Tropo...if your trees are not real big, any chance that they can be removed and build up your mounds??

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #444 on: February 13, 2023, 01:05:09 AM »
I think they will be fine they just aren’t as happy as I’ve seen them, I think if the rain ever stops and dries out a bit they will be happy again.

TropicalFruitHunters

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #445 on: February 13, 2023, 10:59:49 PM »
Peter...I found this on Youtube.  It clearly shows them using a systemic fungicide, but unfortunately no subtitles.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1a9pDi6TdI&t=196s

fruit nerd

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #446 on: February 14, 2023, 06:29:29 AM »
I think they will be fine they just aren’t as happy as I’ve seen them, I think if the rain ever stops and dries out a bit they will be happy again.

We could be picking up another couple hundred mm in the next few days unfortunately. I have started planting durian onto small mounds made from composted wood chips, crusher dust and top soil. Have also planted avocados in the same way. Will see how it goes.

Finca La Isla

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #447 on: February 14, 2023, 08:53:58 AM »
Jay, that’s a strange video. Yes, I hear the guy say systemic fungicide but the application is more like a contact treatment of an obvious infestation.
What concerns me more would be a program systemic application which would be directed at the foliage and the fruit would always, in that case, loaded with fungicide.

Tropo I feel for you…
Funny thing is that when it’s dry in Oz and fires are the problem it’s raining like crazy in my neck of the woods. The last year has been very dry here. Not that good for planting but great for fruit production. We’re eating durian now!
Peter

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #448 on: February 14, 2023, 05:55:50 PM »
Forecast for next few days is falls up to 700mm here, i just lost an E4 abiu to wet feet about 6ft high an 18months old. Lessons learnt abiu are not flood or wet feet tolerant at all this is not the first abiu tree i have lost to flooding and wet feet. Luckily my abiu in drier parts are doing very well. 

Durian are gunna have to hang in there for another huge wet hit by the looks, relentless rain

TropicalFruitHunters

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Re: Not enough Durian Discussion
« Reply #449 on: February 14, 2023, 08:16:16 PM »
I watched one other video where they were pouring a mixture into to the soil around the tree out to the drip line.  It was disturbing to see insects, including worms, down in the soil, claw their way out only to die.  Whatever they were pouring on was some hot shit of a mix!  It's too bad more aren't subtitled.