Temperate Fruit & Orchards > Temperate Fruit Discussion

More temperate, less tropical for zone8

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Pokeweed:
We have had good success with black Spanish grapes if that tells you anything about our conditions. There is a vineyard of victoria redgrapes South of us. It sounds like our ph is similar. Alkaline, but not extreme. I've been wanting to try more grapes. I'll look for some of those. Thanks!

1rainman:
Black Spanish does well in Florida too. Victoria red is not easy to grow it needs a lot of spraying but some people can do it. Daytona has one parent the same as Victoria red and is probably slightly tougher and slightly better grape though also not super tough but possible. I have bd5-117 crosses I think that's the number. I call it bd. Daytona x stover never got released. It's a good table grape wine grape tougher than Daytona. More similar to stover in toughness but better table grape than stover. Passed on pierce tolerance well so I wanted to use it a lot in crossing.

European grapes grow in alkaline soil as well so do Texas grapes and Florida but the rest of the country is acidic soil. But a lot of hybrids alkaline is not a problem because the domestic grape grows in such soil in Europe.

1rainman:
Actually pedals of past has stover you can order. It's mostly a wine grape but good tasting berries for eating. It will survive without spray but have a lot of leaf damage so just occasional spraying would work. It does well in alkaline soil but does better grafted.

I talked to a guy Tampa he has stover (1/4 shuttleworthii) and taris burgundy 1/2 shuttleworthii) in Tampa. They survive the alkaline soil there unlike a lot of grapes. He found a native aestavalis with good berries and grafted them to aestavalis roots. They do better grow faster and such on native roots but doing fine on their own.

I have stuff that is half taris burgundy but taris had some disease on it and was struggling then a dog chewed on it and it kicked the bucket. It might have made it but my crosses are tougher. Then I have a selfed bd seedling that is mostly healthy but grows slow due to being inbred and I have some crosses with bd but haven't tried stover though it gets more disease than taris. I wouldn't mind crossing with it.

But I had my grapes in this sand dirt and they barely grew at all. I put them in giant pots of mostly potting soil with a little sand and a little clay seems to enhance it then mulch on top and they grow like crazy. They like a small amount of sand but not a lot.

They don't like really acidic or really alkaline most of them. I used seed starter dirt that has neutral pH when I could find it. Other times potting soil which is a bit too acidic but I sprinkle some of the alkaline sand in the mix not much and they live it. A tiny amount of clay just holds more water along with mulch because in hot summer they get bone dry quick so that helped. In pots they dry out faster. Some of them their roots poked out the bottom and growing in sand on the bottom but doing fine.bin the sandy dirt even when I filled a hole with compost and put them in it not much vigor. Maybe it's really alkaline in this spot or something else. But giant pots are the way to go.

1rainman:
I'll say this too. They want $100 for a pecan tree and you need a few for good cross pollination. If you are willing to wait six or so years for them to mature just by uncooked pecans online from the farm. First of all good eating. But just put them in dirt and they sprout. Though germinate indoors because squirrels and stuff will eat them. For deep south sub tropical get Elliot then a second type if you want variety. You need a good disease resistant variety because a lot of popular varieties are susceptible and they put them on root stock. I just know Elliot blooms in Florida is disease resistant and best tasting though smaller nuts and thick shells. I don't know other good varieties off my head.

Almost all of them implanted sprouted but they got eaten even with the plant coming out.

Galatians522:

--- Quote from: 1rainman on January 02, 2023, 04:01:43 PM ---I'll say this too. They want $100 for a pecan tree and you need a few for good cross pollination. If you are willing to wait six or so years for them to mature just by uncooked pecans online from the farm. First of all good eating. But just put them in dirt and they sprout. Though germinate indoors because squirrels and stuff will eat them. For deep south sub tropical get Elliot then a second type if you want variety. You need a good disease resistant variety because a lot of popular varieties are susceptible and they put them on root stock. I just know Elliot blooms in Florida is disease resistant and best tasting though smaller nuts and thick shells. I don't know other good varieties off my head.

Almost all of them implanted sprouted but they got eaten even with the plant coming out.

--- End quote ---

I've been trying to find a pecan that would pollinate Eliott. So far Amling sounds like the best option.

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