Author Topic: Growing Mango trees in Southern California  (Read 131818 times)

Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #725 on: April 18, 2022, 09:49:45 PM »
Thanks for all the input.

I was hoping to go to Florida this mango season to try more mangoes as my exposure has been super market mangos, and what Iíve had in Malaysia. And I was going to stuff my bags with fruit to try growing from seed, but unfortunately the timing doesnít work out well for me. Iím hoping to get to try some more, and not just have to wait for my varieties to fruit! My Valencia pride last year was the best mango Iíve had, but Iím sure Iím bias.

All of my non fruiting trees I fertilized over the weekend with the oscomote 6 month slow release fertilizer, so should be good for this growing season. My big tree Iíve just been fertilizing with fish and kelp emulsion every two weeks, with a 0-0-7 kelp extract mixed in. Trying to keep nitrogen on the lower side and focus on fruits.

I guess I will hold back on grafting my other seedlings, but my seedling I grafted the Valencia pride to was 9 feet tall and had a trunk of two inches when I chopped and grafted. Am I good to graft the scaffold branches that have popped out? Or should I let those grow taller then graft them? Iím just eager to get great fruits!

I hope to get some good fruits, seeds, and seedlings however I can. Grow some in the ground and get some in pots going. I donít know if my home will be my forever home so I would like a head start on if I move or acquire another property

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #726 on: April 18, 2022, 11:36:18 PM »
You may be able to obtain some seeds by posting on the buy/sell forum. Iím sure there will be members that would sell you some seeds or even gift you some seeds.

For me, the height of the tree isnít the determining factor for when to top work a tree because some trees grow tall and lanky.  A two inch diameter tree is fine for grafting but nine feet would be too tall for my personal liking.

I try to create trees with 3-4 scaffold branches at around 3-4 feet and then I top work each one of the scaffold branches. Once you top work your tree, you should allow it to have at least 2 growth flushes before allowing it to hold fruit so that it doesnít get stunted or die back on you. This is only relevant in colder climates.

If you plan on moving soon, itís a good idea to have some seedlings in pots but donít allow the seedlings to get potbound.

Simon


Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #727 on: April 19, 2022, 12:04:45 AM »
Thanks Simon!

I hope to be able to participate in a socal mango tasting eventually and bring a crop! Appreciate the input from all, I have read a lot of your posts from over the years and appreciate all the knowledge youíve brought and facilitated to the scene

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #728 on: April 20, 2022, 12:14:11 AM »
No problem!

I just also want to mention that itís very difficult to predict what Mother Nature will do.

When I say ď I try to create trees with 3-4 scaffold branches at 3-4 feetĒ, that is my goal but in reality, trees donít always grow the way we want them to. I realize that Iíve been talking about how ideal trees should look but Iíve failed to explain that these trees are more the exception than the norm.

Things donít always go as planned and sometimes you just have to work with what you have. Most of what I have learned is from making mistakes, lots and lots of mistakes.

Yes, itís good to do as much research as possible before you do something in order to avoid making unnecessary mistakes but donít be afraid to make mistakes, especially on trees. I learn so much more from my mistakes because I get first hand experience of what Not to do and itís outcome.

I have many mango trees where I grafted them too small (young) and I discovered thatís not a good thing because in our cold climate, the tiny trees try to bloom and hold fruit which ultimately stunts them. Iíve also grafted to small branches on big trees only to discover that the surrounding canopy shaded out my grafts and ultimately killed it. Through this, I learned the importance of maintenance pruning list grafting and also to consider apical dominance and site selection prior to grafting.

All this just to say go for it, kill a tree or fifty and learn from your mistakes. Measure twice, cut once is a great saying but to never have cut at all is a shame.

Simon

mbmango

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #729 on: May 20, 2022, 03:06:14 AM »
A Gary seedling, sowed last July:
I've only tried maybe 200 or so seedlings over the years, and the oldest survivors I have, in-ground, started flowering at around 5 years old at the earliest.  Just a curiosity, as it's among dozens of others next to the house.

MasonG31

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #730 on: June 02, 2022, 01:17:25 PM »
A Gary seedling, sowed last July:
I've only tried maybe 200 or so seedlings over the years, and the oldest survivors I have, in-ground, started flowering at around 5 years old at the earliest.  Just a curiosity, as it's among dozens of others next to the house.

I planted a Gary seed last year as well.  To my surprise, it's polyembryonic! There are at least four shoots growing out.  Unfortunately it's a slow grower, but I'm excited because Gary was a standout mango for me last year.  To me, it had more coconut flavor than Coconut Cream and M4.

mbmango

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #731 on: June 03, 2022, 02:13:22 AM »
Interesting about the flavor.  Seemed like creamy citrus to me, but I would totally appreciate coconut.  I wish I would have been able to sample CC and M4.  The most coconut I tasted was in some Pickerings, and maybe a few Pina Coladas (but those were more pina than otherwise).

For Gary, I tried 4 seeds, but only 1 sprouted 3. I split them just after sprouting to avoid having to untangle more roots later.  The runtiest didn't survive the winter, but #2 is hanging on, although very sluggish.

 

K-Rimes

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #732 on: June 03, 2022, 07:37:03 PM »







Crazy performance from this neglected potted mango my gf family has. Barely watered, never fertilized. Unknown Home Depot with no graft.

John B

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #733 on: June 24, 2022, 11:58:59 PM »
Anyone else get late blooms in the last week? I thought my sweet tart was going to start flushing vegetatively but they decided to bloom again. My atulfo, manila, and other recently grafted sweet tart are all growing without more blooms.

hawkfish007

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #734 on: June 25, 2022, 10:22:45 AM »
My NDM #4 bloomed again within the last week. It was already loaded with fruitlets of various sizes but decided those were not plenty enough, no complains though  :D
Cotton candy and Carrie are blooming now while holding ftuitlets but not as much as the NDM.

Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #735 on: June 25, 2022, 11:04:56 AM »
My Valencia pride sent out a bloom two weeks ago, but I think this last bit of hot weather has finally switched over to veg mode I believe. It seems the fruit holds better on the tree when it blooms in warmer weather, this cluster is the largest Iíve ever had mangoes develop in cluster like this. Hoping more than one of them hang in there.





I am continually amazed by the vigor of this espada seedling. It constantly sends out 6-7 new shoots at node sites. So before itís next flush I cut all the tips below the nodes to get better structure. It worked beautifully, but in addition to pushing every bud beneath the cut it is also pushing multiple buds from the nodes below. Guess Iím just going to let it do it thing




Johnny Eat Fruit

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #736 on: June 25, 2022, 01:56:36 PM »
My Nam Doc Mai #4 was also blooming again recently so I did some trimming to remove the blooms as there is already fruit on the tree (See 1st photo)

I do wish all of my mango trees produced as much fruit as my apple trees. I would be loaded every year. (See 2nd photo)

Johnny


Nam Doc Mai Mango Tree (6-22-2022)



Apple Tree loaded (6-22-22)

Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #737 on: June 25, 2022, 02:04:50 PM »
I hope to have a mango tree half as productive as my nectarine tree some day haha

John B

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #738 on: June 25, 2022, 05:45:01 PM »
That's some good growth, guys! NDM is one of the ones I'm considering to graft on the atulfo. Seems to do well here.

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #739 on: June 25, 2022, 09:20:04 PM »
Try planting NDM seedlings. I planted a few NDM seedlings and they grew vigorously for me. Since NDM is Polyembryonic, you may get lucky and not have to graft it. You also gave the added benefit that since itís a seedling, it will grow vegetatively for several years before it blooms.

Simon

Eggo

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #740 on: June 26, 2022, 12:50:46 AM »
Well what started out looking like it will be a great year turn out bad.  Lost most of my fruits to what I think may be a powdery mildew symptom when it effects fruits.  Anthracnose symptoms seems to look different.  I could tell there was trouble when it gets to the size of an apricot. Skin gets rough and develop what seems to be microfractures.  Fruit stays stunted. There's no seed embryo and the seed husk premature hardens off.  I had this 2 years in a row after 3 years of great production.  What do you guys think? Seen anything like this before.  Below is a fruit not effected accompanied with one's that are, same variety.  It seems to effect some varieties slightly different. NDM#4 seems to have a lil bit of the rough skin but fruits split open in half, no seed embryo. Laverne Manila seems less effected but the fruits effected stays stunted and develop a premature hard seedhusk early, no seed embryo.  I will have to try Sapote's method next year of just trimming off all the early blooms and wait for the 2nd flush. 



« Last Edit: June 26, 2022, 12:59:42 AM by Eggo »

UplanderCA

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #741 on: August 02, 2022, 07:26:35 PM »
Hello Eggo,

Well what started out looking like it will be a great year turn out bad.  I understand that sentiment.  I had very similar issues with my NDM and Maha with the early fruit.  I will be lucky if this years harvest is 1/2 the size of last years mango crop.  No Orange Sherbet, Lemon Zest, or Sweet Tart this year - the few I had all dropped by end of May. On the positive side, the trees have had two very good growth flushes (with signs of a third starting).  I'm focusing on vegetive growth now.

Just out of curiosity, how are the other Southern California mango growers doing?  How does this year's potential mango harvest look compared to last years: the same, smaller, larger?

Cheers,

Tony

Johnny Eat Fruit

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #742 on: August 02, 2022, 10:02:37 PM »
I have some fruit in 2022 but not a lot. Sweet Tart, Cac, Nam Doc Mai, Guava, and Angie.

Many of my mango trees I trimmed to remove the lower branches and force vegetative growth upwards. I would have had more fruit on my trees but I removed some fruit earlier to refocus on growth especially on, mango trees younger than six years old.

I have come to the conclusion that most mango trees will not start to reach maximum production and high-quality fruit until reaching 8-10 years of age in SoCal. Many new mango growers in California think in a few years they can have good fruit and a productive tree. While this may be possible in Southern Florida with Sub-Tropical conditions in Socal we have much longer winters in a mild Mediterranean climate. Even inland with hot summers the long winter and cool spring temperatures tend to slow growth tremendously and extend flowering relative to Florida.

Growing mango Trees is a long and difficult process and most people are too impatient to wait for the long-term rewards. You can always force a young mango tree to produce fruit after a few years but the real rewards come years later. Just a reality check for our SoCal mango growers.

Johnny
« Last Edit: August 02, 2022, 10:11:34 PM by Johnny Eat Fruit »

Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #743 on: August 12, 2022, 11:01:32 PM »
Just returned from a 2 week vacation and was really pleased with my trees, considering the neglect in nearly the hottest part of the year.

My Valencia Pride holds 4 mangos this year, up from one last year.



Last year the tree had a sprout from low. Usually I always removed these but I let two develop. These have grown more vigorously than the rest of the tree and provided bud wood which took readily (above the graft). I then realized that they are growing below this wound on the trunk which was caused by leaving tangle foot on too long one year and it really messed up the bark.

So now Iím letting some scaffold branches from below the wound grow and hopefully balance out the tree.







My cocktail tree is kicking ass. On July 1st I grafted onto 5 scaffold branches which grew from when I chopped it last year, and 4 out of 5 grafts are going strong and 1 remains to see if it takes. So now the tree has sweet tart, Carrie, and Valencia Pride. If the last graft takes then it will add Edward.









A orange sherbet seedling got absolutely roasted by the sun, Iím hoping it bounces back but I broke my ankle so the trees are kind of to the wolves now.




The CAC seedling on the other side of the planter (where totally covered by the shade cloth when the late afternoon sun) is doing much better and recovering from shipping damage.

I have seedlings I ordered from tropical acres, after recovering from shipping and aggressive repotting (they were pretty root bound) all but the orange sherbet are growing well in either the ground or 3 gallon fabric pots. Itís pretty cool watching the different seedling grow differently. Honey kiss node spacing is so much more compact than any mango tree Iíve seen.

I ordered a box of madam Francis mangos earlier this year (paying way too much) and have 5 good seedlings coming along, which is nice because I really liked some of the ones I had, big flavor, not terrible fiber. Itís a messy delicious fruit. They are growing and Iím excited to see how they grow out

fruitnut1944

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #744 on: August 13, 2022, 12:18:08 PM »
Victoria Ave: I like your report. That's helpful to this novice mango grower. And I hope your ankle is better soon..!!

mysteryknight

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #745 on: August 13, 2022, 12:33:47 PM »
I was fortunate enough to get a big load of mango seeds from a friend in FL. Here is a surprise varigated Mallika seedling! Anyone else ever get varigated seedlings?


Victoria Ave

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #746 on: August 13, 2022, 12:57:52 PM »
That is pretty cool! Interested to see if that variegation sticks. Iíd be careful with putting it into full sun as it will be more prone to sun damage, and as a fruiting tree it may not get enough energy to perform well, as the areas without chlorophyll do not perform photosynthesis. That said it would make a lovely house plant, and if you ever want to sell it to me as such Iíd be interested in adding it to my collection haha!

mysteryknight

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #747 on: August 13, 2022, 09:29:43 PM »
It is currently thriving in full sun so we shall see🌞

Fygee

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #748 on: August 15, 2022, 05:39:14 PM »
Upping the difficulty here. Vegas desert.

Unlike avocados, mangoes have been proven to be able to fruit here. It's just really, really rare because barely anyone knows how to grow them in soil, humidity, and weather like ours. High pH, clay soil with rocks and awful drainage. Super hard water. Hot as hell in the summer more often than not. Temps get perilously close to, or occasionally a little under freezing. Every 7 or 8 years we'll get just enough snow to make life miserable for plants.

I have some polyembryonic seeds I started of Lemon Zest, Lemon Meringue, and Coco Cream and my experiment is to grow the cloned shoots without grafting so they have a better chance at being vigorous and more tolerant of our conditions.

Two questions:

When digging the hole, should I mostly stick to native soil? And if so, should I amend it with some organic matter at all, or other things like sand/sulfur? Or just leave it as is and top dress with sulfur and iron sulfate?

My understanding is that even if mangoes hate our dirt, digging a hole and putting good stuff it likes in there will just cause the roots to gird around where that good soil is, and also very negatively affect drainage.

Also, any good sources for manila seeds in case I want to use that as a rootstock later on?
« Last Edit: August 15, 2022, 06:01:01 PM by Fygee »
Continuing my journey to disprove those who say "You can't grow that in the desert" since 2013.

palingkecil

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #749 on: August 16, 2022, 12:51:03 PM »
Upping the difficulty here. Vegas desert.

Unlike avocados, mangoes have been proven to be able to fruit here. It's just really, really rare because barely anyone knows how to grow them in soil, humidity, and weather like ours. High pH, clay soil with rocks and awful drainage. Super hard water. Hot as hell in the summer more often than not. Temps get perilously close to, or occasionally a little under freezing. Every 7 or 8 years we'll get just enough snow to make life miserable for plants.

I have some polyembryonic seeds I started of Lemon Zest, Lemon Meringue, and Coco Cream and my experiment is to grow the cloned shoots without grafting so they have a better chance at being vigorous and more tolerant of our conditions.

Two questions:

When digging the hole, should I mostly stick to native soil? And if so, should I amend it with some organic matter at all, or other things like sand/sulfur? Or just leave it as is and top dress with sulfur and iron sulfate?

My understanding is that even if mangoes hate our dirt, digging a hole and putting good stuff it likes in there will just cause the roots to gird around where that good soil is, and also very negatively affect drainage.

Also, any good sources for manila seeds in case I want to use that as a rootstock later on?

I am not an expert at all, just want to share my own experience.
Native soil is way to go, but if you have clay muddy soil, I will use cactus/palm soil mix to fill up the hole. Mixing the native soil with sand could work, but my trees seem happier with cactus/palm soil mix from home depot. I usually do some prep first. Dig the hole about a week in prior and make sure to loosen up some soil around it so the hole has a good drainage. I've killed some mangoes because the clay soil around the hole was too dense.
Make sure that when you put the mango tree, it is higher than the ground level around it. Some varieties cannot stand wet feet at all. My Son Pari and Dwarf Hawaiian died just after one full day of rain in the winter.
You are smart by starting from seeds. Even Manila rootstocks cannot beat seed growing mango trees in my yard.
My yard received about 12 hours of direct sun in summer, and very dry heat with occassional Santa Ana wind.
I have about 8 mango seedlings from different varieties, and it all grow well. My Coconut Cream on Manila is actually struggling a little.
Some varieties are just a strong grower no matter what rootstock they are on. These are very strong grower on turpentine rootstock in my yard (i don't do much care on my trees):
- Orange Sherbet --> it grew 4 ft in height and 5 ft in width in 2 short years. Very drought tolerant.
- CAC ---> it only grow 2 ft in height but about 6-7 ft width in 2 years from a little stick in 3 gallon pot.
- Super Alphonso --> I just bought the grafted tree about 3 months ago, and it was only 2 ft without any branch. Now it is about 5 ft with 8 branches, I never even tip off the top.
- PPK --> this tree just want to grow and make new branches, it does not even bother to flower. Same, grew about 3 ft height and width in 2 years.
 Varieties that didn't survive in my yard on turpentine rootstocks (they all died in winter after rainy days):
- Venus
- Peach Cobbler
- Son Pari
- Dwarf Hawaiian
- Little Gem
- Triple Sec
 Just a little to add, Manila grown from seeds are also very variable. Some of my Manila rootstocks are strong, some are just weak.
I hope I can help just a litle bit. There are many very experienced mango growers here, and I learn from them.


 

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