Author Topic: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping  (Read 645 times)

Plantinyum

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Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« on: June 11, 2022, 04:17:37 PM »
So i want to try this and i'm still at the right time of the year to do it. My cherymoyas are growing mad and one of them has some flower buds growing atm also.
Found some relic treads on this in here ,but one thing i wonder is.....  after i trim a little the new growth , can i strip the lowest several leaves and not the top ones? I want to do this as a size measure, to have the new branches at the lowest possible point of the stems, but still have a top part with some leaves so i do not set back my plants as much ,by removing all of their leaves. Now i will pass the very first verry small leaves that all of the new growth has ,directly at the base.
Will the remaining leaves at the top section prevent the exposed lowet buds to grow properly ??
Also, do i need to do this in waves, i mean to do several branches today, some more two days later etc etc, becouse ive found that when flowers show up at the same time, they also bloom at the same time, making it hard to have both gender stage flowers pressent at a given time....??
Thanks for helping me !!!  ;) :D
« Last Edit: June 11, 2022, 04:26:54 PM by Plantinyum »

Oolie

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2022, 04:57:21 PM »
If it's to restrict the overall size, then I would be persistent and continually remove leaves throughout the season, that said it will remove much of the vigor of the tree, but you can gauge the amount of energy removed throughout the growing season. Because you are so far north, you will have many more daylight hours during the summer, so I'd be more forceful with leaf removal earlier in the season to time the new growth flushes with the longer days.

I would definitely say timing will be important if you combine leaf stripping with branch pruning/thinning. As it's going to remove a lot of energy from the tree to do either, so staggering them would produce better results, like strip leaves in spring, thin branches in fall.

Leaf stripping doesn't always generate a branch, more so if the stripped branch is in a bare, exposed area, but it's consistent at producing flowers.

When I strip leaves, I don't head back the branches unless I'm pruning for scions.

You can stagger stripping to try to have better timing, but I've never noticed a benefit to doing so, as most buds produce multiple blooms.
That said, I'd make sure if that is the plan to strip the leaves further up the branch earlier, that way the male flowers are on the thinner portion of the branch around the time the female flowers are on the thicker portions that could support a large cherimoya fruit.

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2022, 05:19:37 PM »
Thanks Oolie, i already removed the smallest of branches two days ago, the ones that were like a toothpick thick. I want to prune the remaining ones a little since they are kinda leggy now.
If you say there isn't a bennefit to the spaced out deffoliation i will not do it then. I will do what you said, to strip the top leaves first, and after several days /2 do the rest, following the logic of having male ones bloom further away on the branches.
The one plant that has buds on now , has them in a double manner mostly, one is bigger then the other...
« Last Edit: June 11, 2022, 05:23:02 PM by Plantinyum »

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2022, 05:50:36 AM »
Heres what i did, pruned a little , left the two top leaves an the branches and removed 2-3 leaves, i will wait 3 days and will remove 2- 3 more on each branch. I left all of the leaves on all of the verry thin branches, so that i do not force the plants into some kind of shock, dunno.....
Here are both of them ...
The first one has some flower buds that are surely taking their time,  growing very slowly .
The fish tail leaf was present on this plant, a neat look...











Here is the second one






 Trunks are getting fatty on both of them ,as seen in the pic.
All of the prunings were fed back to the plants.

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2022, 04:59:11 PM »
Just wanted to say that this worked like a charm,  both of the plants are now having flower buds at various stages of development, one of them prolly has around a 100 or more flower buds, no flowers overlapping at this stage thought, the earliest ones are blooming ,but awlays together or with too much of a gap between them.....
The flowers smell quite nice, actually just like a ripe cherimoya .

Oolie

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2022, 07:08:53 PM »
Great news.
I have found that the smell of the blooms can sometimes mimic that of the fruit aroma, that said the fruit aroma can vary dramatically year to year, so it's not always an accurate reflection.

I'd be a little concerned about the narrow crotch angle at the bottom branch, as cherimoyas tend to split when carrying heavy crops.

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2022, 01:23:02 AM »
Great news.
I have found that the smell of the blooms can sometimes mimic that of the fruit aroma, that said the fruit aroma can vary dramatically year to year, so it's not always an accurate reflection.

I'd be a little concerned about the narrow crotch angle at the bottom branch, as cherimoyas tend to split when carrying heavy crops.

Some of the branches on my trees inside the gh can be considered as prone to splitting or brakage in the future, but in reality the plants will be short and stout, pruned every year for size measure, the cherimoyas are the ones that get pruned  harder and i will have to make some serious chops in the future.
What i mean is that they wont be getting tree size ,they will be sitting at the bush size forever. I'm severely limiting the crops of the plants this way' but theres no way around it....

On the pic with the sharp croch theres a smaller branch which is coming directly drom inside the croch, i am thinking of removing it some time soon.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2022, 01:25:47 AM by Plantinyum »

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2022, 07:47:19 AM »
The plants are in full bloom mode now, i have been pollinating flowers from two days ago, i just now happen to have overlapping male and female flowers to work with.
I think i also have the first fruit set on one of the plants, the fruitlet is the size of medium to large pea bean now. Non pollinated flowers just fall off in a week or so, but this one i pollinated with a kinda oldish pollen kept in the fridje but it seems to have worked.
Now what i do is i collect the pollen in the evening, usually its ready arround 7 pm, keep it in a small jar in the fridje till the next day when i pollinate the new females. What remains after pollination i just discard.
What i am wondering is when should i pollinate the females, i mean at what time of the day is best to do this. Today i pollinated about 12 flowers at 2 pm, some of them were barely starting to open but was visible that they would open today later. I wonder since the flowers didnt had any smell to them at the time, should i wait till the fragrance is notecable? Is this a sighn that the flower is ready to accept the pollen ?

Oolie

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2022, 08:15:33 PM »
Usually fragrance is more pronounced at male stage. If I'm pollinating, I usually do it when the flowers first open, if you break a petal to mark the pollinated flower and see that the pollen is well adhered to the center of the flower, you're usually good to go.

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2022, 12:23:39 AM »
Usually fragrance is more pronounced at male stage. If I'm pollinating, I usually do it when the flowers first open, if you break a petal to mark the pollinated flower and see that the pollen is well adhered to the center of the flower, you're usually good to go.
Strange, for mey seem to have the most fragrance while their in the female stage. When i do them i do not see the pollen that sticks to the flower , its too small to be seen, however i know i am at leasr getting something in there since i see it on the brush after i dip in the jar. I have around 24 hours from when the flowers first open ,till they start shedding pollen...

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2022, 08:51:16 AM »
An update, the plants are in peak bloom right now, the one that had around 20 buds is almost finished with the blooming, a few flowers left to open. This is the first one.... some of the pollinated flowers are starting to size up, but still too early to tell...




The second one is def the star , clusters of flower buds didnt count but they are many ! The first flower i hand pollinated set and this is the biggest fruit set on the plant to date, numerous smaller ones that appear to have also set are dragging their asses behind. I am still pollinating flowers and at the second plant i esstimate theres one third of them all that have yet to flower. My plan is to just pollinate everything and at a later stage thin fruitset probably.
Heres some pics of the second plant ...
 








I also have some questions which are....

 1 - Does cherimoya generally thin alot of its fruitset on its own ,like persimmon, or do what sets from the beginning generally stay on?

2- i am wondering lately if i am giving them too much or too little water, how much moisture do i have to have in the soil, like a feel to it if u can describe it this way?

3- is there a chance for the plants to discard the fruit set if i averfeed them ,if that happens .....?

Thanks in advance for the tips and the help !

spaugh

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2022, 04:44:07 PM »
You should thin the fruit so that they are not right next to one another.  Keep the best looking ones and the ones further down the brqnches so thry are not hanging far out. 

The plants look like thry are being watered well.  They dont need tons of water or fertilizer.  Just an occasional fertilize with avocado/citrus type food or something else well rounded. 

My experience is they dont really self thin.  I saw other people say they do but has not been the case here.  What I saw was they are just smaller fruit if not thinned. 
Brad Spaugh

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2022, 12:47:39 AM »
Ok i will thin the fruitset once the blooming is done, i saw several pollinated ones that dropped so want to know which ones are a sure set. The ones that drop do not gain size ,they just stay for around a week and drop off. Anyway i'm seeing at least 10 that are growing well and look promising, its just too early to tell for most of them ...
I usually fertilize with green / red cristalon fert every 10 days or so. I have some ready fish emulsion so will be using it on the gh plants in a bit...will add a bit of citrus feed to the cherimoyas next time !
« Last Edit: August 06, 2022, 12:49:32 AM by Plantinyum »

Plantinyum

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Re: Forcing cherymoya to flower via leaf stripping
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2022, 04:39:27 AM »
Sorry for bragging on this everyone! I am becomming a helicopter gardener probably, but do theese leaves look willted, like tat they need more water? Both of the plants have some of the new leaves slightly curved inward, this happens only in the day, the temp at the time that it happens is around 35 C. The soil is slightly moist to moist 3-4 cm down, def not wet ! Is this just a reaction to the hot temps ,that will be happenning regardless soil moisture? The tips of the new growths are sturdy and arent drooping more than they naturally do...
When something is fruiting i really get paranoid i'd los3 the crop if i did this or that etc .....










« Last Edit: August 06, 2022, 04:41:30 AM by Plantinyum »

 

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