Plant Bags

[Tropicdude]

Plastic Pot, with extra holes, coated with Microkote are my current choice.  I place extra hole about one inch from the bottom along with extra holes in the bottom.

Carlos how are the results, with that Microkote stuff, I remember you made a video a while back, did you make an update video on the results. ?

[plantlover13]

So warm weather is weeks away (finally ! )  and I'm ready to start potting my tropicals into fabric pots. However, I'm at a loss as to what brand to use (smart pots, rootmakers, what type of rootmaker etc.). What do you guys recommend?

[Tropicaliste]

I've used GroBag for the past few years, but I want to give you some advice ... I'm in Maryland and must overwinter my plants inside ... The fabric pots wick away moisture and they do it fast, add to that, they are not protected as easily from the cold air circulating the house.  Unless you have a grow room or a warm house then you will most likely put the pots into bigger pots of plastic.  The problem is they then don't air root prune, they grow through the bags.  I used a more compacted soil as a solution to the wicking away moisture, but the bag "separates" from the compacted soil bag, requiring the need to break the soil up.  If I use a more gritty mix the water goes right through as if it's a sieve.  I would recommend using a coat like Microkote on plastic pots, this is my solution to the whole fabric pot idea.  I don't mean to sound malcontent.  It's my advice on using fabric pots.  If you were in a warm climate where the overwintering wasn't necessary, then it wouldn't matter ...

[plantlover13]

well, my house is relatively warm in the winter, and i'm fine with frequent watering.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

I've used both Smart Pots and Root Pouches. I had 10 or so Smart Pots to start, now I have 100 Root Pouches in sizes from 1 to 15 gal. The Root Pouches are stronger, sturdier, have better handles and are vastly cheaper, at least from Greenhousemegastore.com. I've used both the black (4-5 year) and gray (3-4 year) and don't see much difference. Maybe the black is stronger and they even make a brown version that's really heavy duty, but I've stuck with the cheaper gray versions. They all feel far more substantial than Smart Pots.

I've never used Rootmakers or any of the plastic deals -- picking up the bags and moving them is important to me and the plants seem to love the bags, so I don't see any reason to switch. Just remember to mulch the top so the soil dries out evenly.

Hope that helps!

[plantlover13]

Few questions about these root pouches.

First, do they root prune?

Second, do they degrade over time? it looks like they are meant to decompose?

Third, do you have any pics?

thanks.

[nullzero]

Few questions about these root pouches.

First, do they root prune?

Second, do they degrade over time? it looks like they are meant to decompose?

Third, do you have any pics?

thanks.

They will start to wear out after 3 years (if on concrete). The fabric containers will degrade faster on wet dirt rather then concrete. The fabric containers produce more smaller airy roots and less thick roots. Most times if left on dirt the trees will root into the ground. I would not use them on dirt unless you were planting outside in zone +9b and did not mind the tree rooted into the ground. Easy transplant, you can just plant the whole bag into the ground when you are ready to transplant (after a year it will break down and allow roots to spread out, if in ground).

[plantlover13]

Few questions about these root pouches.

First, do they root prune?

Second, do they degrade over time? it looks like they are meant to decompose?

Third, do you have any pics?

thanks.

They will start to wear out after 3 years (if on concrete). The fabric containers will degrade faster on wet dirt rather then concrete. The fabric containers produce more smaller airy roots and less thick roots. Most times if left on dirt the trees will root into the ground. I would not use them on dirt unless you were planting outside in zone +9b and did not mind the tree rooted into the ground. Easy transplant, you can just plant the whole bag into the ground when you are ready to transplant (after a year it will break down and allow roots to spread out, if in ground).

Thanks. And you are referring to the root pouches right? 

I think i'm gonna go for the root pouches, mostly because of the price. The smart pots look 10 times more expensive?

[nullzero]

Few questions about these root pouches.

First, do they root prune?

Second, do they degrade over time? it looks like they are meant to decompose?

Third, do you have any pics?

thanks.

They will start to wear out after 3 years (if on concrete). The fabric containers will degrade faster on wet dirt rather then concrete. The fabric containers produce more smaller airy roots and less thick roots. Most times if left on dirt the trees will root into the ground. I would not use them on dirt unless you were planting outside in zone +9b and did not mind the tree rooted into the ground. Easy transplant, you can just plant the whole bag into the ground when you are ready to transplant (after a year it will break down and allow roots to spread out, if in ground).

Thanks. And you are referring to the root pouches right? 

I think i'm gonna go for the root pouches, mostly because of the price. The smart pots look 10 times more expensive?

These work and are usually well priced from this business;
http://www.htgsupply.com/Product-10-Gallon-Phat-Sacks

[LivingParadise]

I am on a budget, so while some may not be into what I have chosen, I want to add it for those like me who want to grow lots but can't afford the trendy means of gardening found everywhere nowadays. For me, this was especially important as I grow hundreds of plants, both inside and outside, and many of them need to be moved around from time to time:

I bought plastic grow bags in bulk - 10 gal, and 30 gal. [I also bought 2 50-gal cloth bags.] While I got them really cheap, I now realize they're not a lot better than heavy-duty trash bags with a hole-puncher used on them, so consider this and find whichever you get the best deal for. I thought they would be square-bottomed, like in pictures (I got mine off Amazon), but when filled they don't really have the best shape. Still, any bag that is filled at least halfway full will stand up fairly well with its own weight and not look too messy.

I did put money into top quality organic soil, but just temporarily while I get my compost at my new house.

I save tons on soil, and get to recycle, by using the packing peanuts I have an excessive amount of (many of which came from Top Tropicals shipments). I fill the bags about half full of the peanuts, whole or crushed into small pieces depending on the root structure of the plant (note - ONLY do this with the white non-biodegradable styrofoam, the greenish new biodegradable ones will decompose and ruin your soil by making it pack down hard over time), and then fill the rest with the soil. This makes the bags exceptionally light, too, so they're easy to move around. I made greenhouse shelving out of wire storage cubes, and even those can hold a whole wall of 10-gal plants because of this.

So far, I have a range of things in these bags, from 15-gal trees to seedlings. They have been in them more than 3 months, both outside and inside, and all seem very happy. Trees need to be staked outside of the bag though so they won't fall over. For the indoor plants, and those that I need to keep extra moist, I fashioned water trays out of heavy-duty aluminum foil to go underneath. The aluminum foil is also great for indoor plants that don't get enough light - I simply make an x underneath the bag with 2 long strips of foil, bring the ends up over the top 4 sides of the bag, and fold them inside the bag - making sort of a silver foil bag over the plastic one that holds water (just crease the corners together to seal it), and reflects light back onto the plants on all sides. It seem to work well.

In some cases I have plants that are in plastic pots that need to be planted soon, that have outgrown their pots. I buy myself some extra time by slipping one of the bags around the pot, which holds water and keeps moisture in better than the pot alone that the plant has outgrown and keeps it much happier for an extra few months while I figure out where to plant it.

The bags are not so ugly if you roll the sides down a little so they have a neat rim like a pot would. They come in black or white, and you can even paint them to make them look attractive or more like real pots. They don't usually have handles, but you could staple some on, and in my case they are so light generally they don't need handles, as long as I pick them up from the bottom, or drag them with 2 hands.

They can be reused almost infinitely, and I have already reused a few when the plant using one got planted in the ground. A drawback is that if you use the soil with the styrofoam pieces in the manner I have, plants that have been recently planted in there and do not have a large root structure yet are not easily transplanted again, because the soil is loose and very light. If I want to plant something in the ground that has grown for years in the pot, if I have trouble getting it out without losing too much soil around the roots, I will just place the bag into the hole I dug for the plant, cut down two sides of it, and slip it right out, leaving the plant with dirt intact in the hole.

This may sound bizarre, but I did all this because I was shocked to find that I could not get pots/planters of the size and shape I wanted for less than $7 each, and even fabric bags I found on sale were $10 each (some going for $25 each)! Gardening has gotten so trendy it's not even affordable anymore for many people. So I improvised, and now my cost is only pennies/bag. Unused ones take only a few inches of space to store, which is also a plus since I have a hundred or so yet waiting for me to use them.

I thought I should share, in case anyone else is facing a lot of container gardening and is daunted by the cost.

The great thing about heavy-duty plastic bags is, you can just punch more holes in it if you want it to be extra airy, or less if you want to keep more moisture.

My plants have had no complaints, nearly all of them with lots of new growth - in fact I have even been able to bring a few back from the dead with no leaves on them at all using this method - so I doubt that fabric pots are any better for results.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Hey plantlover,

Here's a shot of one of my three grow areas from the beginning of the season, I'd take updated pics but it's dark. I prop the bags on 2x4s or on little stands so the roots don't grow into the soil and air can get to the bottom of the bag. My 2 year old bags aren't really showing signs of wear. The fabric is kinda like felt, but treat them well and they'll stay good. That said, I abuse the hell out of them, jamming them with trowels and such and they seem indestructible.

In the picture, you can see the black bags are 10 gal Smart Pots. The handles are flimsy compared to the Root Pouches (all the gray ones). I'm growing corn in the black bags, now the corn is 4 ft tall. The big bags are 15 gal. The ones on the table are 1 gal and the ones without handles are 3. There's also a couple 7 and 5 gals floating around.

Besides, it's $3.60 for a 15 gal pot and $1.31 for a 5 gal when buying in packs of 10. They're cheaper than most anything out there and, in my opinion, superior to the other cheap options. They root prune and keep the soil and even temp. When repotting out of black plastic, I can see where the roots die back due to the extreme heat. The pouch soil is always cool. And when they break down in 3-4 years, it'll be time for me to repot and refresh the soil anyway

I also started putting the bags inside other planters (that's one I made for dragon fruit) so the roots prune and the soil is easier to manage.

[ricshaw]

Besides, it's $3.60 for a 15 gal pot and $1.31 for a 5 gal when buying in packs of 10. They're cheaper than most anything out there and, in my opinion, superior to the other cheap options. They root prune and keep the soil and even temp. When repotting out of black plastic, I can see where the roots die back due to the extreme heat. The pouch soil is always cool. And when they break down in 3-4 years, it'll be time for me to repot and refresh the soil anyway

I also started putting the bags inside other planters (that's one I made for dragon fruit) so the roots prune and the soil is easier to manage.

   Just curious...  how are you going to repot the Dragon Fruit plants in 3 - 4 years?

[Bush2Beach]

I had heard about companies selling soil mixed with styrofoam before in the South , is this a somewhat common practice? Mixing anything that is not biodegradable into soil seems counter intuitive to gardening. I totally respect the free cycle aspect of making your materials for nothing in comparison to overpriced options. I have used the plastic bags and 1-15 gallon smart pots. Side by side the regular black plastic pots did work best. There is a wholesale commercial gardening store near you and many others on the forum that us much cheaper than box stores. CPS crop production services sell you the soil,nutrients and containers. 15 gallon containers $3.50,25 gal $8-$10, 45 gal, $13, 65 gal. $18 and 100 gal for $28.
These will last many seasons. They are sold out near me for the time being. I like going there, I sign the receipt not where it says signature but Grower/Applicator. Big Business.

I am on a budget, so while some may not be into what I have chosen, I want to add it for those like me who want to grow lots but can't afford the trendy means of gardening found everywhere nowadays. For me, this was especially important as I grow hundreds of plants, both inside and outside, and many of them need to be moved around from time to time:

I bought plastic grow bags in bulk - 10 gal, and 30 gal. [I also bought 2 50-gal cloth bags.] While I got them really cheap, I now realize they're not a lot better than heavy-duty trash bags with a hole-puncher used on them, so consider this and find whichever you get the best deal for. I thought they would be square-bottomed, like in pictures (I got mine off Amazon), but when filled they don't really have the best shape. Still, any bag that is filled at least halfway full will stand up fairly well with its own weight and not look too messy.

I did put money into top quality organic soil, but just temporarily while I get my compost at my new house.

I save tons on soil, and get to recycle, by using the packing peanuts I have an excessive amount of (many of which came from Top Tropicals shipments). I fill the bags about half full of the peanuts, whole or crushed into small pieces depending on the root structure of the plant (note - ONLY do this with the white non-biodegradable styrofoam, the greenish new biodegradable ones will decompose and ruin your soil by making it pack down hard over time), and then fill the rest with the soil. This makes the bags exceptionally light, too, so they're easy to move around. I made greenhouse shelving out of wire storage cubes, and even those can hold a whole wall of 10-gal plants because of this.

So far, I have a range of things in these bags, from 15-gal trees to seedlings. They have been in them more than 3 months, both outside and inside, and all seem very happy. Trees need to be staked outside of the bag though so they won't fall over. For the indoor plants, and those that I need to keep extra moist, I fashioned water trays out of heavy-duty aluminum foil to go underneath. The aluminum foil is also great for indoor plants that don't get enough light - I simply make an x underneath the bag with 2 long strips of foil, bring the ends up over the top 4 sides of the bag, and fold them inside the bag - making sort of a silver foil bag over the plastic one that holds water (just crease the corners together to seal it), and reflects light back onto the plants on all sides. It seem to work well.

In some cases I have plants that are in plastic pots that need to be planted soon, that have outgrown their pots. I buy myself some extra time by slipping one of the bags around the pot, which holds water and keeps moisture in better than the pot alone that the plant has outgrown and keeps it much happier for an extra few months while I figure out where to plant it.

The bags are not so ugly if you roll the sides down a little so they have a neat rim like a pot would. They come in black or white, and you can even paint them to make them look attractive or more like real pots. They don't usually have handles, but you could staple some on, and in my case they are so light generally they don't need handles, as long as I pick them up from the bottom, or drag them with 2 hands.

They can be reused almost infinitely, and I have already reused a few when the plant using one got planted in the ground. A drawback is that if you use the soil with the styrofoam pieces in the manner I have, plants that have been recently planted in there and do not have a large root structure yet are not easily transplanted again, because the soil is loose and very light. If I want to plant something in the ground that has grown for years in the pot, if I have trouble getting it out without losing too much soil around the roots, I will just place the bag into the hole I dug for the plant, cut down two sides of it, and slip it right out, leaving the plant with dirt intact in the hole.

This may sound bizarre, but I did all this because I was shocked to find that I could not get pots/planters of the size and shape I wanted for less than $7 each, and even fabric bags I found on sale were $10 each (some going for $25 each)! Gardening has gotten so trendy it's not even affordable anymore for many people. So I improvised, and now my cost is only pennies/bag. Unused ones take only a few inches of space to store, which is also a plus since I have a hundred or so yet waiting for me to use them.

I thought I should share, in case anyone else is facing a lot of container gardening and is daunted by the cost.

The great thing about heavy-duty plastic bags is, you can just punch more holes in it if you want it to be extra airy, or less if you want to keep more moisture.

My plants have had no complaints, nearly all of them with lots of new growth - in fact I have even been able to bring a few back from the dead with no leaves on them at all using this method - so I doubt that fabric pots are any better for results.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Besides, it's $3.60 for a 15 gal pot and $1.31 for a 5 gal when buying in packs of 10. They're cheaper than most anything out there and, in my opinion, superior to the other cheap options. They root prune and keep the soil and even temp. When repotting out of black plastic, I can see where the roots die back due to the extreme heat. The pouch soil is always cool. And when they break down in 3-4 years, it'll be time for me to repot and refresh the soil anyway

I also started putting the bags inside other planters (that's one I made for dragon fruit) so the roots prune and the soil is easier to manage.

   Just curious...  how are you going to repot the Dragon Fruit plants in 3 - 4 years?

Good question. The planter has openings on the bottom so my plan is to cut away the old bag, shake out the soil, put a new folded bag in through the bottom and, since the dragon fruit is already supported and the roots are now just dangling, wrap the new bag up around the root ball and fill with new soil. The vertical supports aren't touching the soil so they won't rot, which is a major problem with traditional dragon fruit trellis designs. Hopefully this way I can keep the plant producing for years to come.

[ricshaw]

   Just curious...  how are you going to repot the Dragon Fruit plants in 3 - 4 years?

Good question. The planter has openings on the bottom so my plan is to cut away the old bag, shake out the soil, put a new folded bag in through the bottom and, since the dragon fruit is already supported and the roots are now just dangling, wrap the new bag up around the root ball and fill with new soil. The vertical supports aren't touching the soil so they won't rot, which is a major problem with traditional dragon fruit trellis designs. Hopefully this way I can keep the plant producing for years to come.

Think 8 - 10 years or longer.  If it takes most Dragon Fruit cuttings 3 years to start producing fruit and the plant top can weigh 150+ pounds, plan for the long term.

[JeffDM]

Thanks for all the new input on plant bags.
I just ordered a 10 pack of 7 gal. grey Root Pouches (from Greenhouse Megastore) for my cherry tomato seedlings.
If they work out then I'll order some larger ones for my papaya seedlings.

[LivingParadise]

I had heard about companies selling soil mixed with styrofoam before in the South , is this a somewhat common practice? Mixing anything that is not biodegradable into soil seems counter intuitive to gardening. I totally respect the free cycle aspect of making your materials for nothing in comparison to overpriced options. I have used the plastic bags and 1-15 gallon smart pots. Side by side the regular black plastic pots did work best. There is a wholesale commercial gardening store near you and many others on the forum that us much cheaper than box stores. CPS crop production services sell you the soil,nutrients and containers. 15 gallon containers $3.50,25 gal $8-$10, 45 gal, $13, 65 gal. $18 and 100 gal for $28.
These will last many seasons. They are sold out near me for the time being. I like going there, I sign the receipt not where it says signature but Grower/Applicator. Big Business.

Thanks for the info. I don't know if this is a common practice, I just did it because it made sense for me.

I don't think of non-biodegradable things in the soil being counter-intuitive to gardening. After all, there are already plenty of things that are not soil in dirt that plants grow well in - rocks, ancient trash, etc. And plants are thrilled to grow in it, which is why so many people make a life out of pulling weeds or yanking pesky plants. So in any way replicating the environment that works seems intuitive to gardening to me.  I am just using this to my advantage. The soil cost me $40/2cu.ft., the peanuts were free. Roots generally do not touch every square inch of soil around them (if they do, they need more room!). So it's really a waste of money to fill an entire bag with black gold when only 1/2 at max is going to be used. When you crunch up non-biodegradable matter in there (whatever it is), it helps keep the soil from compacting too heavily, makes for good drainage, and adds volume - thus being way cheaper. Just the same as plant roots grow around rocks to reach the soil and water that they need, they grow around styrofoam. They don't notice the difference, and I save money.

I was just solving two problems in one that I faced - too many plants to afford all the soil to fill that many pots and bags - again, I just moved so did not have any compost yet, and like a billion styrofoam peanuts that I despise and had no use or space for. So, I filled all of my plant containers half full of packing peanuts (as I say, some crushed, some whole depending on the plant), and found that it provided many practical benefits for me (like the containers being extremely easy to move because they're so light), plus my plants are growing well in it.

I thought I'd mention, because other people here may have shipments of plants (or other items) that include these stupid packing peanuts, and I think it's way better to use them for the very plants that one bought than to throw them out.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Thanks for all the new input on plant bags.
I just ordered a 10 pack of 7 gal. grey Root Pouches (from Greenhouse Megastore) for my cherry tomato seedlings.
If they work out then I'll order some larger ones for my papaya seedlings.

7 gal is what I have my tomatoes in, I've done 10 and 5 in the past and 7 seems like the ideal size.

[NewGen]

Are these soft fabric bags (Phat Sacks, Root pouches,...) intended to be used as temporary containers, since they will break down within 2-3 years? If so, how do guys plan on  up-potting the trees once the roots fill out the bags? I'd imagine in 2-3 years time, the bags will be very brittle.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Are these soft fabric bags (Phat Sacks, Root pouches,...) intended to be used as temporary containers, since they will break down within 2-3 years? If so, how do guys plan on  up-potting the trees once the roots fill out the bags? I'd imagine in 2-3 years time, the bags will be very brittle.

Yeah, they're kinda temporary -- when the bag breaks down, I'll refresh the soil mix and put it in a new bag. I keep most of my trees in 15 gal and will keep them in that size indefinitely. Some I'll move to bigger sizes, it just depends on how big I want the tree to be.

But the important thing is the bags prune the roots naturally so you never get root circling issues that'd require you to pot up due to plant stress. It's kinda like a larger bonsai, the tree stays the size the bag allows.

Also, I don't know about the bags becoming brittle, my oldest bags (3 years) aren't brittle, just soft and thin. None of them have broken apart yet and they seem really solid. At least, the Root Pouch and Smart Pot ones I have. Root Pouch makes some extra thick ones called "Boxer Brown". The gray ones I have are only $3.60 for a 15 gal so I'm not really concerned about replacing them in 4 years when they fall apart.

[NewGen]

Thanks Josh for your response,

I'm just curious, if your plan is to keep the plants in the same size containers, then why not put them in hard, plastic, root pruning pots? Is cost the only reason? $3.60 vs. around $10.

 

Are these soft fabric bags (Phat Sacks, Root pouches,...) intended to be used as temporary containers, since they will break down within 2-3 years? If so, how do guys plan on  up-potting the trees once the roots fill out the bags? I'd imagine in 2-3 years time, the bags will be very brittle.

Yeah, they're kinda temporary -- when the bag breaks down, I'll refresh the soil mix and put it in a new bag. I keep most of my trees in 15 gal and will keep them in that size indefinitely. Some I'll move to bigger sizes, it just depends on how big I want the tree to be.

But the important thing is the bags prune the roots naturally so you never get root circling issues that'd require you to pot up due to plant stress. It's kinda like a larger bonsai, the tree stays the size the bag allows.

Also, I don't know about the bags becoming brittle, my oldest bags (3 years) aren't brittle, just soft and thin. None of them have broken apart yet and they seem really solid. At least, the Root Pouch and Smart Pot ones I have. Root Pouch makes some extra thick ones called "Boxer Brown". The gray ones I have are only $3.60 for a 15 gal so I'm not really concerned about replacing them in 4 years when they fall apart.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Good point and I'm not really opposed to the plastic root pots. I like how the fabric ones have handles so I can move them around (which I do way too often). And black plastic gets crazy hot while the fabric containers keep the soil really cool. The downside is the fabric ones need more watering. Also, the plastic root pots look kinda ugly so something that's at least half way stylish is how I sell this crazy fruit tree hobby to my wife.

Thanks Josh for your response,

I'm just curious, if your plan is to keep the plants in the same size containers, then why not put them in hard, plastic, root pruning pots? Is cost the only reason? $3.60 vs. around $10.

 

Are these soft fabric bags (Phat Sacks, Root pouches,...) intended to be used as temporary containers, since they will break down within 2-3 years? If so, how do guys plan on  up-potting the trees once the roots fill out the bags? I'd imagine in 2-3 years time, the bags will be very brittle.

Yeah, they're kinda temporary -- when the bag breaks down, I'll refresh the soil mix and put it in a new bag. I keep most of my trees in 15 gal and will keep them in that size indefinitely. Some I'll move to bigger sizes, it just depends on how big I want the tree to be.

But the important thing is the bags prune the roots naturally so you never get root circling issues that'd require you to pot up due to plant stress. It's kinda like a larger bonsai, the tree stays the size the bag allows.

Also, I don't know about the bags becoming brittle, my oldest bags (3 years) aren't brittle, just soft and thin. None of them have broken apart yet and they seem really solid. At least, the Root Pouch and Smart Pot ones I have. Root Pouch makes some extra thick ones called "Boxer Brown". The gray ones I have are only $3.60 for a 15 gal so I'm not really concerned about replacing them in 4 years when they fall apart.

[Mark in Texas]

Good point and I'm not really opposed to the plastic root pots. I like how the fabric ones have handles so I can move them around (which I do way too often). And black plastic gets crazy hot while the fabric containers keep the soil really cool. The downside is the fabric ones need more watering. Also, the plastic root pots look kinda ugly so something that's at least half way stylish is how I sell this crazy fruit tree hobby to my wife.

I just wonder if the roothairs are damaged by every time you move them?

I've been using root pruning systems for years and swear by them.  Conventional pots painted on the inside with a copper hydroxide laden latex paint is 100% effective and am now using RootBuilder, plastic rolls that you make pots yourself that can be increased in diameter easily.

Mark

[Mark in Texas]

After playing with these a while, my conclusion is do not waste your time with the smaller versions.   1-3 gallon.   I got opposite expected results, poor root development.  My theory on this is, that the air pruning goes in too far, so roots get root pruned closer to the tap root.

You waited too long to upcan.  According to Dr. Whitcomb the fibrous lateral root development is no farther behind the terminated root tip than 4".  You must upcan but the need to do so is far less than using conventional pots that induce root spinout.

[Josh-Los-Angeles]

Hey Mark, you're probably right, the soil deforms a bit when I pick up the bags. I don't know how much damage there is. This year, I'm trying out the 5-1-1 mix and that might be rougher on the roots when I move the bags around. In years past, I used regular potting mix and my biggest issue were the roots growing out the bags and attaching to anything that was damp. For my more established trees, I'm planning on building stained planter boxes for the bags to sit in.

Also, do you have any issues with heat and the plastic root pots? I'd imagine they breath easier than nursery pots. I recently potted up a 5 gal meyer from black plastic and the side that was facing the sun had practically no root development, maybe 30% of the pot was a dead zone.

Good point and I'm not really opposed to the plastic root pots. I like how the fabric ones have handles so I can move them around (which I do way too often). And black plastic gets crazy hot while the fabric containers keep the soil really cool. The downside is the fabric ones need more watering. Also, the plastic root pots look kinda ugly so something that's at least half way stylish is how I sell this crazy fruit tree hobby to my wife.

I just wonder if the roothairs are damaged by every time you move them?

I've been using root pruning systems for years and swear by them.  Conventional pots painted on the inside with a copper hydroxide laden latex paint is 100% effective and am now using RootBuilder, plastic rolls that you make pots yourself that can be increased in diameter easily.

Mark