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Messages - Jack, Nipomo

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Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / Re: ISO Orton Cherimoya
« on: January 23, 2024, 09:45:16 AM »
Best part of the Orton cherimoya is the originator Orton Englehart.  Interesting early member of the CRFG and cause of -hart added to name of many fruits.  Good info on Google.


Vernon C. edulis white sapote leaf, #7 C. tetrameria leaf showing wooly or fuzzy underside.  It is most noticable when feeling the fuzz with fingers.  Light reflection is limited on the fuzz (wool)  These are not the only differences with these trees, also growth habit (size at maturity), seed characteristics and fruit flavor (not fruit interior color).  Then there are possible hybrids like Suebelle white sapote with fuzzy leaf underside.

Sure looks like C. edulis.  The fuzz on a C. tetrameria is very apparent, even so C. edulis "Suebelle" has some fuzz on the leaf underside.  Sometimes called "wooly leaf" sapote due to the very apparent "wool". My mature tetrameria trees on tetrameria rootstock (#6 and #7) are small like a peach tree.  The several mature edulis trees on edulis r/s are giants with corresponding base and height.  One trunk base is over 26 in diameter and 35 ft tall.  That tree has several grafts done years ago.  A Vernon edulis grafted on tetrameria R/S  that is over 20 years old is less than 6 ft tall.  The seeds on tetrameria fruit are roundish and much smaller than edulis (1/3 to 1/2) even on same sized fruit.  Many edulis and tetrameria fruits have a yellowish interior, all tetrameria (here) are yellowish.  Most edulis have white interior (here).  Flavor is distinctively different between the two.  #6 and #7 tetrameria were selected by CA CRFG group as having best flavor.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Papaches, Papachi, (Randia echinocarpa)
« on: January 12, 2024, 09:24:03 AM »
I have a Papache, Randia megacarpa, endemic to Baja California growing, but not fruiting.  Having eaten it in Baja, it was shaped like a fig, very sweet and seedy, and quite black interior. Popular among locals.  My Papache grows slowly and is many years old.  We are in a cool coastal area it probably doesn't like

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: figs!!!! an underated fruit
« on: January 08, 2024, 07:41:05 PM »
Kevin, might have been the Lattarula “Italian Honey” Fig.  Next to greenhouse is large tree that is Spangler's Jelly Fig.  Hope you enjoy them and pass them on (saw post that Exotica is closing down)  Both of the above are my favorites, but we are in a cool climate.  Jack

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: figs!!!! an underated fruit
« on: January 08, 2024, 11:18:56 AM »
Have several figs here in Nipomo, my favorite for years has been Steve Spangler's "Jelly Fig".  Don't know the origin nor any other name for the tree.


Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: White sapote roots — are they invasive?
« on: January 02, 2024, 08:30:40 AM »
If it is a Suebelle it is a much smaller tree, like a peach tree.  Check for fuzzy leaf undersides.

Take a look during the night with a flashlight.  Look at the newest growth, even buds.  I agree with Kevin that it appears to be from new leaves just expanding and being tasted by insect or snail/slug.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Modified Frolich Method at home
« on: December 19, 2023, 08:17:06 AM »
Brokay Nursery in CA has been using a modified Frolich method since about 1975.  You might Google them and/or contact them.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Anyone Have Ripe Avocados in December?
« on: December 18, 2023, 05:42:33 PM »
Actually, Hellen is one of my favorites for flavor and its size.  It was Julie Frink who suggested it to me. 

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Anyone Have Ripe Avocados in December?
« on: December 18, 2023, 09:01:34 AM »
Just finished last two Hellen avocados for this year, still hanging on tree.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Avocado Tree help needed
« on: November 30, 2023, 08:35:46 AM »
My usual question on observing a dying avocado "was it recently fertilized?"  Being guilty of overfertilizing and/or fertilizing a sick plant (especially avocados) I learned the hard way about using fertilizer sparingly.

Trees here are densly planted as original 15 ft spacing has diminished due to overplanting.  Cold temps we experienced 20 years ago (low once of 17º-killed many mature eucalyptus trees in area), used return-stack heaters in those early days, covers, etc.  Trees are fully grown now and canopy effect and global warming (recorded evidence for local winter temps) there has been no real damage in past few years.  During the fight against freezing played with many alternatives.  Found temperature, freeze duration, humidity (dry cold nights were the worst) and soil moisture relevant to damage.  Canopy effect keeps humidity high along with soil moisture.  Freeze duration is shortened with higher humidity.  We are in 300 ft of dune sand so never worried about overwatering.  Did burn lot of diesel fuel in heaters in those days.  Plant maturity today makes a difference.  Those were immature plants back then, we are now close to 50 years here on 1 1/2 acres.  Never had C. tetrameira burned except new leaves.  C. edulis have been lost to freeze.  Then again, tree location, humidity, etc. are factors to consider more than temperature.  I have a 10 degree difference from one part of property to another.  Colder areas get citrus, warmer areas hold avocados etc.  If it was easy it wouldn't be fun.

Nice to see your opinion on yellow sapote (Casimiroa tetrameria) # 7 is in agreement with an old CRFG taste test.  CRFG #6 is out there, but most prefer CRFG#7.  I've posted this before, doing it again: using C. tetrameria as a rootstock for C. edulis severely dwarfs the white sapote down to 4 ft. Using C. edulis as a R/S for C. tetrameria makes a much smaller tree, about 8 ft. Both have remained  compatible for over 20 years and produce normal sized fruit.  It would be interesting to see what an interstock of various lengths would do.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Sad Avocado Tree
« on: November 22, 2023, 03:57:22 PM »
Any chance it was recently fertilized?

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Feijoa hardiness in Concord, NC , , , , ?
« on: November 16, 2023, 02:22:41 PM »
Have Triumph and Mammoth (NZ varieties) and they produce well.  Large fruit with good flavor.  Never been hit with frost (over 20 years) down in middle 20's maybe lower.  They groundlayer easily (low branch covered with soil, roots within a year, cut off is new plant).

Have had C. edulis damaged by 30º F, but that was before growing C. tetrameria.  C. tetrameria are now mature trees and have not seen damage at 28ºF.  However, damage experienced on white sapote was when trees were isolated and yellow sapote have been grown for the past 15 years surrounded by closed-in mature trees.  45 years ago we killed many sensitive plants/trees (many little macadamias, now fully grown) when we got down to low 30'sF and even once 17ºF.  Canopy of trees covering 1 1/2 acres is very protective as are the effects of global warming.  Orchard thermometers have not been below 30ºF the past 5 years.  A side-by-side comparison therefore cannot be made as so many variables have changed.  Another factor is simply the tree's maturity.  One that grows through several frost-free years has the capability of surviving frost/freeze due to its maturity.

My two NZ varieties of Feijoa are outstanding in flavor and size compared to Coolidge etc.  They are Mammoth and Triumph and very productive.  Have not had success with cuttings, but ground layering (on ground or in a pot still connected to mother plant) have rooted well.  Ripe now, I prefer to bite off top of fruit and squeeze out fruit insides. Not just a good fruit, frost hardy, and ornamental too.

Based on a taste test included in an old CRFG yearbook (long since donated to Mexican grower), #6 and #7 came out on top in taste. I have several C. tetrameria about 20 years old and both #6 AND #7 are good, but prefer #7.  Fruit are huge, seeds much smaller than C. edulis seeds, and all have the "wooly" or fuzzy leaf.  Trees tend to be much slmaller than C. edulis by far.  There is graft compatibility between C. edulis and C. tetrameria as some of my trees with mixed grafts are over 20 years old.  Both C. tetrameria on C. edulis and visa versa produce dwarfing one combination more than the other.  Other than the "wooly" leaves characteristic, many of my C. edulis produce yellowish colored fruit when ripe.  Have had C. edulis damaged by frost, but never had C. tetrameria show any effect.  Interestingly "Suebelle" is thought to be a cross between C. edulis and C. tetrameria due to its "wooly" leaf underside.  For me, it is also a small tree compared to the monster white sapote treees, yet seeds resemble the white sapote.

So Mike, how is the fruit? Taste like "bubblegum"?

I have three small plants, growing well (3 ft).  Tried to determine if dioecious or not and info is lacking.  Hopefully with three plants will have answer in time.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Cocktail Trees
« on: October 10, 2023, 10:11:41 PM »

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Cocktail Trees
« on: October 07, 2023, 12:17:49 PM »
Kevin...what NZ varieties do you have on the Feijoa?  My NZ varieties surpass others in size and flavor.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Persian Mulberry Fruits - in SoCal
« on: August 03, 2023, 05:31:17 PM »
Maybe someone knows differently, but it was my understanding that for full flavor and good production M. nigra needs to be in the ground.  My M nigra "Kaester" has an extensive root system (on fruitless mulberry rootstock, tho) and seems to really like water.  Here roots are constrained by drippers in pure sand.

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