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Messages - Galatians522

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Temperate Fruit Buy, Sell, & Trade / Re: Bronze scuppernog grape cuttings
« on: February 18, 2024, 11:39:20 AM »
Beautiful grapes there. They look just like Calusa grapes to me, but Calusa grapes look like a pink muscadine. I thought I had found a pink muscadine the first time I ever saw one. There is a lot of misinformation about Florida wild grapes and even some herbarium specimines are mislabeled in my opinion. Check the vine for the forked tendrils. That is the most reliable way. The other charicteristics are variable. I see some with rusty felt, some with white, and some with almost none. They can even hybridize with other bunch grapes where the habitats over lap. If you are absolutely certain that the vine has single tendrils then you have something very unique. If they fork I'm 98% certain that its a very nice specimine of Calusa grape.

Temperate Fruit Buy, Sell, & Trade / Re: Bronze scuppernog grape cuttings
« on: February 17, 2024, 09:14:57 PM »
If wild muscadine can pollinate the particular type I have then they might not be self fertile. I live in an area that is rural and wild muscadine are everywhere. I have heard 90% of wild vines are male but I'm unsure how true that might be. There are wild females around. Most of which have small purple black fruits. I have found a few with larger fruits but not quite as large as the ones I'm growing most often. I did find one with near marble sized fruits with distinctly pink skin. Fruit isn't large but ok flavor for a wild vine. However tastes are subjective and I'm one of those that can eat nearly anything and enjoy it to some extent. I like wild persimmon, muscadine, sand pears, etc and will eat them no problem at all. I eat the skins and seeds of muscadine no problem chewing the seeds not just swallowing them. I crunch through and enjoy Duncan white grapefruit seeds and all as bitter and numerous as the seeds can be. No qualms at all about that sort of stuff most wouldn't or couldn't do. It's a nutritional thing in my mind too I guess. The best phytonutrients and other bioactive compounds are highest in the parts most discard in many cases. That said I can acknowledge what would be considered a "good" fruit to those with much more picky tastes.

Yes, the wild Florida subspecies will pollinate muscadines if the blooms overlap. If my guess is right, the grape you found with pink skin is Vitis shuttleworthii "Calusa Grape." It has a lot of similarities with Muscadines, but is actually a bunch grape. Wild muscadines never come in pink (unless you have the first one)--that gene actually came from bunch grapes via a lot of crosses and back crosses. Calusa grapes ripen earlier, have felty leaves (especially on new growth), furrowed instead of smooth bark, and forked tendrils (muscadine tendrils are single). Calusa grape is also more graft compatible with bunch grapes--I have a bunch grape hybrid grafted on one right now.

Here is my list. Sri Kembangan Starfruit, Sri Chompoo Longan, Noble, Ison, Pam, and Supreme Muscadines, Black Pakistani Mulberry, Jujube, Blackberries, Sugarcane, Jabo, Pineapple, Papaya, and Mysore bananas. Wax Jambu and Jambolan probably deserves mention. They were very productive, but fruit was mediocre. I hear there are better varieties, though. Sounds like I need to invest in some top tier Sapodillas.

Temperate Fruit Buy, Sell, & Trade / Re: Bronze scuppernog grape cuttings
« on: February 17, 2024, 07:09:38 PM »
That is very interesting. Sounds like the bronze one you have is self fertile. Carlos is probably the most common self fertile bronze. Of the ones I am familiar with, the big one sounds like Pam. There are lots of possibilities for both, though. If your rock pile vine is self fertile there is a 99.999% chance that it is of cultivated origin. Only 2 self fertile muscadines have ever been found in the wild. All the other self fertile ones are decended from those two.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Zhpp Glo Mango
« on: February 17, 2024, 10:52:21 AM »
Now that seems pretty cool. I wish someone would chime in also.
If that one  ever gets released Galatians and I will be gardening after Dark🤣

 ;D my only question is whether we will start glowing when we eat the fruit?

Temperate Fruit Buy, Sell, & Trade / Re: Bronze scuppernog grape cuttings
« on: February 16, 2024, 09:47:37 PM »
Have you had good success rooting this one from hard wood cuttings like bunch grapes? I found simple layering to be way more reliable for the muscadines that I have tried to propagate.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: 2024 FL Mango Season
« on: February 15, 2024, 11:07:21 PM »
At 950 m, your altitude may be a factor. I've heard mangoes in Hawaii above 1200 ft start having issues flowering.

Do you know any varieties for high-altitude areas?

By the way, flowering isn't the issue. They have flowered every year since I've been here, but they usually set zero fruit. This year they produced a lot of fruit.

Sounds like you have an anthracnose problem or maybe some other disease issue.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: February fruit
« on: February 14, 2024, 06:31:35 PM »
Another benefit to jujube is that it will grow without irrigation. I have seen jujube trees in abandoned fruit orchards that are still productive when many other trees have declined. They are very attractive to deer, so you may want to protect them until they get tall enough to be above the browsing zone.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: February fruit
« on: February 13, 2024, 09:50:40 PM »
We had some nice Jujubes last week. Unfortunately, I didn't take pictures. The key is to pick them when they are yellow but not brown yet. They are about as sweet as a grocery store apple at that stage.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: 2024 FL Mango Season
« on: February 13, 2024, 06:23:34 PM »
Bombay Marc Anthony Buxton spice starting to bloom. Very excited and feel blessed started this journey 6 years ago with the only information I had to work with came from this forum. Used the shotgun approach planted many 7 and 15 gallon tree back when they were large. At the time i knew I was planting them too close but I knew I would eventually cull the herd. Dug those up traded and gave away. Finally got it fine tuned the way I want and now looks to be a bountiful season. My latest addition will be Pere Louis also called AKA mango Pal-Wee

Marc Anthony

Buxton spice
Also I have to give credit to Tropical acre Farms

The Marc Anthony you sent me is blooming now as well.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Grapefruit Tree Fungus
« on: February 11, 2024, 04:48:47 PM »
I'm not an expert on all citrus diseases, but the brown spots look like anthracnose to me.

Chayote and Yam (particularly Dioscora Rotundata which does not produce aerial bulbils) are two optiins to consider.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Transplanting mango seedling from ground.
« on: February 10, 2024, 02:30:09 PM »
Only move them when they are not actively growing. I killed one of my first mango grafts that way.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Avocado Bark Grafting
« on: February 10, 2024, 02:26:15 PM »
Yup, Sacadura has excellent videos on grafting. Did you notice your method #4, side graft with tongue failed in his video.

I prefer the side graft where you just cut the scion wood just like you do for cleft graft. I use this technique for most of my fruit tree when I do side grafts and it is very reliable and works great, you might want to try it. Doing a whip & tongue cut for the side graft should be fine but there is no need to do it and possibly cut yourself when making the tongue. He nevers uses a glove but he should so new grafters will not get in this bad habit.

I didn't watch the results, just the technique. Side graft has been my most successful technique so far. I will try your "side cleft" some time. That would also hold the scion while you wrap.

Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Thornless Blackberries
« on: February 10, 2024, 12:27:19 PM »
Wow! February is awfully early for them. Any idea what the variety is?

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Avocado Bark Grafting
« on: February 09, 2024, 11:24:12 PM »
This is the youtube clip that gave me the idea. He has way better pictures than my old phone can take. The side graft technique I have been using starts at 6:29.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Avocado Bark Grafting
« on: February 09, 2024, 05:55:06 PM »
Thanks for the great info Brad. I have been trying a new type of graft for mis-matched scion wood. Its the standard side graft with a tongue added (just like on a whip and tongue). It has been working really well for me. The tongue makes it much easier to wrap the side graft because it frees up both hands.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Seed grown cherimoya from Rincon Tropics
« on: February 08, 2024, 10:45:41 PM »
Thanks! Will do.

I wonder if putting the pot outside in late March would have the same effect as stripping leaves (low temps 30s-40s with possible freezing would cause defoliation?) Does cherimoya need chill hours? I did the same with potted feijoa in March and it was enough cold for blooms to form.

Also forgot to mention, there is a seedling sugar apple in the pot, when it gets a little bigger is it graft compatible on cherimoya?

Yes, I should be. A study I read said that Sugar Apples produce larger leaves and fruit when grafted on Cherimoya.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: 2024 FL Mango Season
« on: February 08, 2024, 10:39:12 PM »
Peach cobbler has tiny panicles starting here & there :)

That is what I would call snatching victory out of the jaws of defeat. Congrats!

Citrus General Discussion / Re: 285yr old Lemon
« on: February 08, 2024, 08:03:48 PM »
After reading this I have decided to place citrus fruits having inscribed messages in all unused cabinet space. Sounds like a good investment. At $6.25 increase a year, a few bushels should give me some good money to spend in retirement.

Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Grafting pears
« on: February 08, 2024, 06:51:30 PM »
Thanks for the info! I am on the hunt for low chill varieties. I may have access to some but curious what you might have. Also looking for a variety of other low chill species including apples, prunus, Mulberry, persimmon, and Asian pear.

Where you are blight resistance should be the number one concern. I planted in Alabama: Shin Li, Dasui Li, Warren, and Potomac.

Of these Warren is the least vigorous and Potomac the most.

For Prunus I planted Florida Glo and Jefferson Green Gage, but I would also plant Inca Plum if available.

There should be no issues with any persimmon, but I'm partial to the pollination variant ones.

I didn't plant mulberries there, but I get plenty of them in SoCal. I will be planting them in WA when I get some, chill hours shouldn't be a consideration for these, but performance in wet weather should. I read somewhere in the Panhandle someone was getting fruit from Morus nigra by specially treating their tree, but I forget if it was by removing diseased leaves or by spraying. Most reports are that nigra is too difficult and instead efforts should be given towards alba and rubra types. My favorite by far of that group is the Frank's yellow, which appears synonymous with Aus green, White Shatoot, Sharahanpur Local, and others.

We got in excess of 600 Chill hours in AL, but I think you should be able to get the Asian pears to fruit, you may be able to get blooms out of Warren and Potomac, it's worth trying, scions are cheap and available online, I do have some spares if unable to locate.

Did you fruit Inca plum in Alabama? What did you use as a pollinator?

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: What time of year to plant trees 9B
« on: February 08, 2024, 06:48:31 PM »
You could purchase a 55gal plastic barrel for $5, a battery powered timer, some hose or plastic tubing, and a few fittings for $50 and for $55 per tree you could set up a gravity feed watering system that could water a tree for you for weeks even when you weren't there.

What a great idea. Where are you finding 55 gallon barrels for $5?

There is a guy selling them in Sebring for that price (at least that was the price last time I drove by). The sign is just north of Robbins Nursery on Hwy 27. "55 Gal Drums for sale $5 metal or plastic" is how it reads as I recall. I will have to check again the next time I am over that way for the sign and address.

No disease, just the weather. Mine look like that every year if we don't have a freeze. If we do have a freeze they have no leaves at all. If we have a hard freeze they get whacked to the ground. Just keep watering and fertilizing them. I have never seen a banana with fertilizer burn, by the way.  If you follow the UF recommendations it works up to like 4lb of fertilizer per mat by the time they bloom. So, if you can still see dirt you didn't over fertilize it (ok, that's a slight exaggeration, but you get the point).

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: What time of year to plant trees 9B
« on: February 07, 2024, 09:57:40 PM »
Here is another thought. My Dad used to say, "Plant a $5 tree in a $50 hole." There are no more $5 trees, but the principle applies. You could purchase a 55gal plastic barrel for $5, a battery powered timer, some hose or plastic tubing, and a few fittings for $50 and for $55 per tree you could set up a gravity feed watering system that could water a tree for you for weeks even when you weren't there. And, once that tree got established you could move the system to another tree and use it for years. Sounds like a good insurance policy for what could be an $85 tree in today's market.

If you keep it simple with just a timer on a gravity feed hose with no nozzel or emitter, the barrel could be filled with pond or ditch water hauled in a couple 5 gal buckets. That way you could plant what you wanted when you wanted and not be wasting money on replacement trees all the time. Also, you can keep the water you apply in your root zone by building a basin around the tree with dirt. It amazes me how many people plant trees these days without a basin.

Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: What time of year to plant trees 9B
« on: February 07, 2024, 06:26:38 PM »
Thanks Galatians. Your thoughts make sense about the "dog days of summer". I assume the dog days of summer cover July-August-early September?

Going forward I guess my plan would be to plant from present (February) to say June, then plant after mid-September. I could use the "dog days" to restock plants and stage them at my residence in Palm Beach County.

Yes, that is the period they cover. I would also be leary of planting when it is really dry. Most years that would include April and the beginning of May.

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