Annona dioica

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Alex

thanks again for the vote of confidence!

I thought annona tomentosa and annona dioica are essentially the same?  I think the source that Miguel got his plants from uses the name annona tomentosa...but our plants are identical.

[kalan]

Hey Adam,
I got A. Dioica from you when I visited this past summer, as doing great until recently. Do you know if it is deciduous?  Lost a couple leaves and browned a few others when temps dropped into low 40s a few weeks back.

Hoping to see some green shoots soon.
Keith

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Hey Adam,
I got A. Dioica from you when I visited this past summer, as doing great until recently. Do you know if it is deciduous?  Lost a couple leaves and browned a few others when temps dropped into low 40s a few weeks back.

Hoping to see some green shoots soon.
Keith

keith

thanks for the update!

don't worry ...the trees shed their leaves this time of year, they can easily handle a freeze!

they'll leaf out nicely this spring!

good luck!

[FlyingFoxFruits]

confusing!

I noticed some of the plants that I thought were A. dioica, might be another species...

the foliage looks almost identical, and so far, so does the growth habit...but one has fuzzy leaves, the other has glabrous leaves when mature (slight fuzziness when foliage is emerging)

the plant I have labeled as A. dioica (fuzzy leaves) is actually flowering...now about 3 yr old...and 3ft tall.

hope we can get this mystery figured out...maybe A. tomentosa and A. dioica are separate species, not synonyms?

fuzzy leaved plant I have labeled as A. diocia


flower bud coming!


foliage showing fuzziness

mature foliage, rough and fuzzy texture


the other Annona sp., has glabrous leaves

[Sanddollarmoon]

A. tomentosa & dioica are in fact seperate species. How many can you say are for sure dioica? This species is gynodioecious, with a male to hermaphrodite ratio of about 2.5 to 1, so keep as many as you can!

[FlyingFoxFruits]

A. tomentosa & dioica are in fact seperate species. How many can you say are for sure dioica? This species is gynodioecious, with a male to hermaphrodite ratio of about 2.5 to 1, so keep as many as you can!

thanks for info...hopefully I have both species...and both are delicious.

i only have 2 of the fuzzy type, and 3 of the glabrous type...

maybe I will get lucky....

I distributed several of the fuzzy type, so if need be I can track down scions one day.

[Sanddollarmoon]

I would say the tomentose anón is A. tomentosa, could the glabrous be dioica? Sorry, I said there was a m:h ratio of 3:1, this is a mistake! It is closer to 2:1, or one in three. If glabrous turns out to be A. dioica you have a better chance that one is hermaphrodite.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

I would say the tomentose anón is A. tomentosa, could the glabrous be dioica? Sorry, I said there was a m:h ratio of 3:1, this is a mistake! It is closer to 2:1, or one in three. If glabrous turns out to be A. dioica you have a better chance that one is hermaphrodite.

i would have guessed the same thing, but pics online of A. tomentosa (Helton's website) and A. dioica (flickr?), both show the same leaf...with fuzzy texture.

I guess the glabrous type is not as common, whatever it is.  I've not seen it's likeness anywhere.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

A. tomentosa & dioica are in fact seperate species. How many can you say are for sure dioica? This species is gynodioecious, with a male to hermaphrodite ratio of about 2.5 to 1, so keep as many as you can!

see this quote?  I guess Helton says they're synonyms...but I'm not convinced.

Hello Adam

I believe this is the one that Helton calls Annona tomentosa- "Araticum de moita".

If you search on Helton web page you can see a picture of the fruit, and on his book "Colecionando frutas Vol.1" Helton talks about this species and even says there that the name Annona dioica is a synonymy for this species.

I also have one on my GH planted on the ground... this one is a bushy annona, not a tree... mine has 5 or 6 years now and no more than 1,5 meters... it flowered last year for the first time but no fruit yet... just one flower though... this year I don't see any flowers yet...


   

[davidgarcia899]

So wait? Is there a chance that the one plant you gave me wont produce fruit? Also idk why but mine just started to push out leaves

[Sanddollarmoon]

David, The possibility is certainly real, but surely among the many adam sent out there is a hermaphrodite.

Adam, the photos of A. dioica on Tropicos match the glabrous annona. Also, annona dioica & annona tomentosa are both the accepted names. One might argue that Helton had found Annona dioica var. mattogrossensis, which perhaps bore more similarities to Tomentosa. However, A. d. var. mattogrossensis merged with dioica because it's differences in leaf shape were not enough to mark it as a seperate variety.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

David, The possibility is certainly real, but surely among the many adam sent out there is a hermaphrodite.

Adam, the photos of A. dioica on Tropicos match the glabrous annona. Also, annona dioica & annona tomentosa are both the accepted names. One might argue that Helton had found Annona dioica var. mattogrossensis, which perhaps bore more similarities to Tomentosa. However, A. d. var. mattogrossensis merged with dioica because it's differences in leaf shape were not enough to mark it as a seperate variety.

photos on tropicos look just like my fuzzy leaved tree...im convinced that one is A dioica.

thanks for letting me know about their website.

[Radoslav]

I read that in fact annona dioica aka annona tomentosa is normal annona plant with male and female stages of flower and that "legend" about dioecious behavior was spread by botanist, who described her first in his book.
Reginaldo Baião from Brasil wrote to me, that flowers of this species are rarely pollinated in nature, perhaps because of the  lack of pollinators. And this fact can support false image that there are male and female plants.
Annona tomentosa in the garden of Helton collaborator Jacob
http://www.bananasraras.org/tomentosaengl.htm
pictures of annona dioica in flicker
https://www.flickr.com/search/?text=annona%20DIoica&sort=relevance&q=annona%20dioica

[FlyingFoxFruits]

I read that in fact annona dioica aka annona tomentosa is normal annona plant with male and female stages of flower and that "legend" about dioecious behavior was spread by botanist, who described her first in his book.
Reginaldo Baião from Brasil wrote to me, that flowers of this species are rarely pollinated in nature, perhaps because of the  lack of pollinators. And this fact can support false image that there are male and female plants.
Annona tomentosa in the garden of Helton collaborator Jacob
http://www.bananasraras.org/tomentosaengl.htm
pictures of annona dioica of flicker
https://www.flickr.com/search?text=annona%20DIoica&sort=relevance

thanks for sharing this info and pics.

now I'm curious to find out what the one with glabrous leaves is...I don't think its A. dioica or A. tomentosa...but the seeds did originate from Brazil..I think they just came labeled as Annona sp.

[Sanddollarmoon]

On the gynodioecy of Annona dioica:
http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S0102-33062006000200015

[AlexRF]

It is known for Anona dioica and Annona tomentosa is different species. Both are pubescent.
If Annona is glabrous - This isn't A. dioica or A. tomentosa.
"Tomentosa" - botanical Latin, meaning covered with dense short curled or curved hairs.

Some Brazilian friends means that Adam's Annona - Annona dioica. And Miguel's Annona too.
And "Anona tomentosa" image from "BananasRaras" - also Annona dioica really. Mistaken identification.
Brazilian friends believe that Annona tomentosa looks like this (3 photos):
https://www.flickr.com/photos/mercadanteweb/10228731496/in/photostream/
leaves differ significantly. Annona tomentosa mainly habitat state Goias, Annona dioica - Minas Gerais, Sao Paulo.
Annona tomentosa fruit has yellow color when ripen. Annona dioica frut stay gray-green:

[Radoslav]

On the gynodioecy of Annona dioica:
http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S0102-33062006000200015

I am not an botanist, but is questionable, that presence of male and hermaphrodite flowers means that this plant is dioecious.
Dioecious means that male and female flowers are on separate plants. But presence of male and hermaphrodite flowers means nothing, especially when observed for example in one season.
For example citrus plants are not dioecious, but in some weather/temperature conditions they form only male flowers - observed by myself many times.

[Guanabanus]

Thank you, Alex, for the beautiful Flicker link.   The picture of the flower of Annona tomentosa makes it look as though it could be in a section with Annona senegalensis.

[Miguel.pt]

Here is my experience with this one:
flowers first:





and after some time spent doing hand-polination got 2 fruits:







but both fruits end up falling to the ground prematurely, and one of the fruits was totally seedless... even with a totally unripe look the scent of the fruits was amazing... and the taste was very good too.... here are the photos from the seedless fruit

 




Unfortunatly I regret to inform you all that my experience ended because my plant died... I suspect it was due to a flood I had on my GH during this last winter (CERRADO CURSE!!!!) even if it had already suported other floods... good luck for you all!

[FlyingFoxFruits]

MIguel,

thanks for sharing your experience!

did you have this planted in the ground??

if so, next time try container growing.

I'm wondering if a flood actually killed your plant?  These don't seem to be affected by the maldição do cerrado ...mine are not sensitive to pH at least....not sure about flooding though.

[Miguel.pt]

Hello Adam

Yes... it was planted in the ground inside the GH.

This "Maldição do Cerrado" is really a strange curse... the winter flood that I believe killed my A. tomentosa did not affected at all the other cerrado stuff I have there... so is dificult for me to understand when all you guys say that you don't water your Cerrado myrtaceae during winter...

All mine Eugenias klotzschianas and Campomanesias cambedesseana/adamantium spent several hours underwater in January 2014... and they even seem to have enjoyed it because they are flowering like crazy now... can you understand that?

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Hello Adam

Yes... it was planted in the ground inside the GH.

This "Maldição do Cerrado" is really a strange curse... the winter flood that I believe killed my A. tomentosa did not affected at all the other cerrado stuff I have there... so is dificult for me to understand when all you guys say that you don't water your Cerrado myrtaceae during winter...

All mine Eugenias klotzschianas and Campomanesias cambedesseana/adamantium spent several hours underwater in January 2014... and they even seem to have enjoyed it because they are flowering like crazy now... can you understand that?

Miguel

yes...i think the flooding is not as critical as the pH.

you must have nice acid pH.

I've had some cerrado plants that survived unusually wet winter conditions...but seems like even having neutral or slightly acid pH is not enough...they want full on acid pH...5.5 or lower I suppose.

[gunnar429]

What's the word on A. dioica?  Quality fruit???

[FlyingFoxFruits]

What's the word on A. dioica?  Quality fruit???

supposed to be quite decent...but my trees are not yet producing...I have 2 trees that should flower soon...they tried to flower earlier this year...but flowers fell off before they bloomed....my friend has a tree from the same batch that did actually bloom, but no fruit set so far.

[Guanabanus]

Supposedly the fruits are wonderful, but rarely encountered in the wild, even where the plants are common, due to the fruits hanging near or on the ground, where everything can have at them.   Apparently it has never been cultivated.