Author Topic: Garcinia ID  (Read 694 times)

Vegan Potato Man

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Garcinia ID
« on: September 10, 2022, 09:09:12 PM »
Aloha!

This fruit was sold as Garcinia Cowa but does not match pictures on google. I'm assuming it is garcinia but I could be wrong. Flavor is similar to apricot with small amount of astringency. Fruit size is a bit larger than a quarter.








Chandramohan

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2022, 06:09:01 AM »
Can you show a seed? It is definitely not G.cowa.

Vegan Potato Man

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2022, 11:58:24 AM »
Can you show a seed? It is definitely not G.cowa.

I will have to get a picture when its lighter here but the seed is similar in size to purple mangosteen, usually only one seed per fruit if that. The seed is covered in the yellow latex when you remove the fruit skin.

cassowary

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2022, 11:12:58 PM »
That reminds me of the "Buah badung" that Maryoto distributes.

It looks like a Garcinia sp. for sure.

Could be a really ripe Garcinia parvifolia "Kundong".

Why is the potato man hunting fruit?? :p

peace!
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Finca La Isla

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2022, 11:35:55 PM »
Parvafolia doesn’t have a seed like mangosteen. The seed is very thin, pliable.

cassowary

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2022, 12:15:14 AM »
Yes you are right, sowed 40 the other month.
But OP didn't clean the quarter section of the inside so I can't actually see the seed.

G. parvifolia is the closest  imo. Or Maryotos Buah badung, but that one have quite thin seeds too. But twice the size of G parv..

I have a Garcinia myself that I am unsure of ID, I am quite sure it's of American origin though, maybe you know Peter.

The bark of this one is not dark like G mangostana but brighter.
The closest I can get to this one is G. macrophylla but I would say the leaves are too small for a G. macrophylla.








peace
« Last Edit: September 16, 2022, 12:18:30 AM by cassowary »
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Finca La Isla

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2022, 11:36:34 AM »
I’ve got garcinias that need identification as well. Cassowary, my inclination is that that tree is not American.  The stem and flowers say Asian to me but there is so much diversity. 
Garcinias are amazing, there are so many and significant diversity within species.  What authority can we turn to for clarification.  With several highly commercial species you’d think this would be sorted out. .
Peter

Vegan Potato Man

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2022, 12:14:03 PM »





Here is the seed, with a thumb drive for scale. They are relatively plump and not what I would call flimsy. Some of the fruits have no seed or an aborted one though. It does look similar to Parvifolia but the skin is thinner and the sepal is more pronounced, looks like on parvifolia the sepal detaches completely when ripe?

Edit: thought I mentioned it but the seed itself is covered in latex and is very sticky once the pulp is removed, if that helps
« Last Edit: September 16, 2022, 01:32:10 PM by Vegan Potato Man »

Finca La Isla

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2022, 04:52:54 PM »
I found a red fruited garcinia in Malaysia that somewhat resembles parvafolia in presentation. But the seed is kind of wedge shaped. The pulp is generally sweet with a flavor that brings to mind apple. The foliage resembles parvafolia and forbessii.
Peter.

elouicious

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2022, 12:06:34 PM »
I’ve got garcinias that need identification as well. Cassowary, my inclination is that that tree is not American.  The stem and flowers say Asian to me but there is so much diversity. 
Garcinias are amazing, there are so many and significant diversity within species.  What authority can we turn to for clarification.  With several highly commercial species you’d think this would be sorted out. .
Peter

Taxonomy of plant based on morphology has many problems (i.e. the same flower structures developing in independent lines of evolution)

I am optimistic for a day when sequencing of plant genomes becomes affordable for the hobbyist, I think we will see some really surprising stuff that we thought was related is not and some things that we assumed were different are actually closely related.

Unfortunately for reasons that are probably to weedy for this board, plant genotyping and de novo genome assembly is much more difficult than animals

Finca La Isla

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2022, 08:18:56 AM »
Seems like something for competent botanists to work on. I used to hybridize anthuriums and the classification was a problem. Within some genuses you couldn’t get a cross to work but some Inter generic crosses did take. The university of Hawaii was working on that. For me this botanical work is something that institutions like universities should be working on. Garcinias should be interesting enough for them.
Peter

elouicious

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2022, 12:06:04 PM »
Seems like something for competent botanists to work on. I used to hybridize anthuriums and the classification was a problem. Within some genuses you couldn’t get a cross to work but some Inter generic crosses did take. The university of Hawaii was working on that. For me this botanical work is something that institutions like universities should be working on. Garcinias should be interesting enough for them.
Peter

I completely agree Peter,

IME getting the first plant genome, Arabadopsis, was a gigantic pain in the ass and most of the work with it has been in relation to how the genome differs from the ones we are more familiar with and Arabadopsis happens to be 2n which is what we are more familiar working with.

Now people are moving to staple crops (rice, wheat, etc.) for obvious reasons, but for many of the species we are discussing here a "de novo genome assembly" has not been done

I have acquired this machine https://nanoporetech.com/products/minion-comparison (just the MinION not the Mk1c) for playing around with trying to build some from fruit trees but I havent had the free time/energy to do it yet.

If I ever get around to it (or if someone was willing to fund these studies! looking at you government) I will make the info publicly available and post some links here

This kit is what I need to start-

https://www.qiagen.com/us/products/discovery-and-translational-research/dna-rna-purification/dna-purification/genomic-dna/dneasy-plant-pro-and-plant-kits/

I might buy it soon
« Last Edit: September 18, 2022, 12:13:01 PM by elouicious »

NateTheGreat

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2022, 01:46:04 PM »
Elouicious, if you haven't seen this, I bet you'd like it. Seems like he's doing what you're describing. https://geneticdistance.org/ He has an account on this forum I think.

elouicious

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2022, 02:26:43 PM »
very very cool resource Nate, that is awesome

Jaboticaba45

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2022, 02:54:13 PM »
Seems like something for competent botanists to work on. I used to hybridize anthuriums and the classification was a problem. Within some genuses you couldn’t get a cross to work but some Inter generic crosses did take. The university of Hawaii was working on that. For me this botanical work is something that institutions like universities should be working on. Garcinias should be interesting enough for them.
Peter

I completely agree Peter,

IME getting the first plant genome, Arabadopsis, was a gigantic pain in the ass and most of the work with it has been in relation to how the genome differs from the ones we are more familiar with and Arabadopsis happens to be 2n which is what we are more familiar working with.

Now people are moving to staple crops (rice, wheat, etc.) for obvious reasons, but for many of the species we are discussing here a "de novo genome assembly" has not been done

I have acquired this machine https://nanoporetech.com/products/minion-comparison (just the MinION not the Mk1c) for playing around with trying to build some from fruit trees but I havent had the free time/energy to do it yet.

If I ever get around to it (or if someone was willing to fund these studies! looking at you government) I will make the info publicly available and post some links here

This kit is what I need to start-

https://www.qiagen.com/us/products/discovery-and-translational-research/dna-rna-purification/dna-purification/genomic-dna/dneasy-plant-pro-and-plant-kits/

I might buy it soon
So cool you are getting into that stuff. I'd love for people to be able to use genetic sequencing to clear up garcinias and even plinias and others.
For sequencing, luckily you can send samples of to other places for cheap, but the expensive part would be preparing and pcr. I know some of the most advanced ones skip the pcr step for example the portable ones but again I don't have any money for this lol.

Would be cool to use this to tell the male/female for different trees like mamoncillo, garcinias, and yangmei. I know that Marta at reallygood plants does yangmei.

cassowary

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Re: Garcinia ID
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2022, 05:37:30 AM »
Peter, Could it been a hombromiana, microcarpa or a nitida you saw in malaysia?

Anyone have any suggestions for species for the images I submitted?
Sorry to hijack the thread P.M.

Best,
cassowary


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