Author Topic: Jabuticaba soil mixes used  (Read 2443 times)

Gulfcoastgardening

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Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« on: November 03, 2022, 08:42:09 AM »
I'm curious about experiences of others using different mixes for Jabuticaba, I have a number of them growing in ProMix HP right now, and they're doing fine but I was curious if there's other favorite mixes that people have. I was thinking about buying 27 or 55 cu.ft. of FoxFarm and trying it as a mix. I know some growers really like using peat exclusively (I worry about it mucking out with our humidity and rainfall).

Dan

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2022, 12:58:05 PM »
I like promix but the thing is so expensive.
Peat perlite is mid tier
I do peat perlite sand topsoil somtimes compost
Just to keep things ok
Also miracle grow potting soil works decent too but I make my own soil now

hammer524

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2022, 02:01:14 PM »
I use 2 parts Roots Organics 707 formula + 1 part peat moss.

K-Rimes

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2022, 02:10:51 PM »
I have had really good luck with FoxFarm Ocean Forest mixed with pumice / perlite / sand / peat in various amounts. Can't really go wrong in my opinion for jabos with this soil.

The most important part of using peat based mixes, in my experience, is to not up pot the plant too early otherwise it'll get waterlogged in the soil and have issues. I have made this mistake a lot in the earlier part of my planting career but getting a lot better and being patient now.

 

hammer524

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2022, 02:20:19 PM »
I have had really good luck with FoxFarm Ocean Forest mixed with pumice / perlite / sand / peat in various amounts. Can't really go wrong in my opinion for jabos with this soil.

The most important part of using peat based mixes, in my experience, is to not up pot the plant too early otherwise it'll get waterlogged in the soil and have issues. I have made this mistake a lot in the earlier part of my planting career but getting a lot better and being patient now.

This took me the past two summers to kinda figure out. I seemingly kept overwatering on really hot days

K-Rimes

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2022, 02:24:48 PM »
I have had really good luck with FoxFarm Ocean Forest mixed with pumice / perlite / sand / peat in various amounts. Can't really go wrong in my opinion for jabos with this soil.

The most important part of using peat based mixes, in my experience, is to not up pot the plant too early otherwise it'll get waterlogged in the soil and have issues. I have made this mistake a lot in the earlier part of my planting career but getting a lot better and being patient now.

This took me the past two summers to kinda figure out. I seemingly kept overwatering on really hot days

I try to only water when the pot is light now. It's just that easy. When the pot gets light in less than a day it's time to up pot.

tru

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2022, 03:33:15 PM »
I get 2 bags of compost, 4 bags of cheap potting soil, big bag of sphagnum moss, small bag of perlite, small bag of sand, and iron+calmag additive

mix the compost and soil first, add everything, and save perlite for last. Trust me if you put perlite in too early it becomes impossible to mix completely; makes ~100-120gal something like.

I use that as a base and then soil acidifier to target pH individually when potting for the first time, its a bit of work to mix it all but saves a ton of money in the long run
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pagnr

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2022, 04:42:26 PM »
The most important part of using peat based mixes, in my experience, is to not up pot the plant too early otherwise it'll get waterlogged.

Fully agree with that.
A container of pot mix without a plant loses water by drainage and evaporation.
Once planted, the plant pumps out water via transpiration.
As the plant grows bigger, it pumps out more water, so the media will dry out faster than with drainage and evaporation alone.
The way I see it, it is the size of the plant in the correct sized pot that as the issue, as much as the media.
Small plants often don't do well in big pots, as they can't pump out enough water to balance water logging.
This could vary seasonally, they might be ok in a hot period, but go backwards in winter.


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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2023, 05:05:55 PM »
I get 2 bags of compost, 4 bags of cheap potting soil, big bag of sphagnum moss, small bag of perlite, small bag of sand, and iron+calmag additive

mix the compost and soil first, add everything, and save perlite for last. Trust me if you put perlite in too early it becomes impossible to mix completely; makes ~100-120gal something like.

I use that as a base and then soil acidifier to target pH individually when potting for the first time, its a bit of work to mix it all but saves a ton of money in the long run

Hi tru

May I ask What is the product you use as iron+calmag additive? 

tru

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2023, 05:36:46 PM »
https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/FF310548-A6BD-4E35-A973-CE6DE9220FCC/search?ref_=ast_bln&terms=calcium%20magnesium I got the langbeinite and oyster shells

Recently though I tried osmocote plus and I've been really happy with the results, go only like 1/3 - 1/2 what the cap says because I gave some plants N toxicity following the directions (maybe because I'm indoors though, I'm sure established ones would take it). Less mixing and less expensive

also I tried using 4 compost bags and 2 soil bags instead and liked the results better, plus even cheaper
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onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2023, 07:08:03 PM »
https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/FF310548-A6BD-4E35-A973-CE6DE9220FCC/search?ref_=ast_bln&terms=calcium%20magnesium I got the langbeinite and oyster shells

Recently though I tried osmocote plus and I've been really happy with the results, go only like 1/3 - 1/2 what the cap says because I gave some plants N toxicity following the directions (maybe because I'm indoors though, I'm sure established ones would take it). Less mixing and less expensive

also I tried using 4 compost bags and 2 soil bags instead and liked the results better, plus even cheaper

Thank you.

onur

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« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 07:43:52 PM by onur »

Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2023, 07:32:47 PM »
Just got my first fruit 2 days ago. I used 40%peat potting mix, 40% pine bark, 10% vermicompost and 10% alfalfa meal.


onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2023, 07:37:09 PM »
Just got my first fruit 2 days ago. I used 40%peat potting mix, 40% pine bark, 10% vermicompost and 10% alfalfa meal.


Congrats! Are you located in Canada?

tru

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2023, 07:46:13 PM »
brown on the tips is from too much salt in your water most likely, or maybe sunburn

iron deficiency makes your plants bright yellow/white almost from chlorosis

Jabos seem not to like pH change at all in my experience so far, if you’ve added anything recently they may just be overreacting; would like someone that grows lots of jabos to weigh in on that though
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Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2023, 07:50:20 PM »
Just got my first fruit 2 days ago. I used 40%peat potting mix, 40% pine bark, 10% vermicompost and 10% alfalfa meal.


Congrats! Are you located in Canada?

Thanks Yeah, -30C this am
« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 09:20:35 PM by Tropicaltoba »

Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2023, 07:51:00 PM »
Also when do I eat it?

onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2023, 08:05:07 PM »
brown on the tips is from too much salt in your water most likely, or maybe sunburn

iron deficiency makes your plants bright yellow/white almost from chlorosis

Jabos seem not to like pH change at all in my experience so far, if you’ve added anything recently they may just be overreacting; would like someone that grows lots of jabos to weigh in on that though

Yes That is right. I don't know much about Jabos. Therefore, using Chelated FE also came to my mind. And I always use rain water and the water from the fish pond. They may need bigger pot and different soil mix.

 







kapps

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2023, 08:48:31 PM »
I use nearly 100% peat with a little perlite mixed in. I’ll fertilize with hollytone but I’ve also used some osmocote with good success.

onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2023, 09:28:22 PM »
Also when do I eat it?

I ate my scarlettes when they were red, heavy, chunky, juicy and big.  ;D  For black varieties, it should be totally black, I guess...
« Last Edit: January 25, 2023, 09:42:33 PM by onur »

onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2023, 09:32:38 PM »
I use nearly 100% peat with a little perlite mixed in. I’ll fertilize with hollytone but I’ve also used some osmocote with good success.

Peat is very acidic right? That's why they love it. Thanks.

W.

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2023, 09:48:13 PM »
All my jaboticabas are potted in Miracle Gro potting soil. I've had no nutrient deficiencies or root problems with any of them. Of course, I also regularly fertilize them with Espoma to prevent the former and up pot them incrementally to prevent the latter. I've occasionally had tip burn on a few jaboticabas, Plinia rivularis seemingly being the most sensitive, but that was when I was forced to use city water on them. Frankly, I've been surprised since I started growing jaboticabas over the past few years at just how easy they are to grow.

elouicious

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2023, 10:41:56 PM »
Fertilizer- Espoma Holly Tone
Soil- 1/3 peat 1/3 compost 1/3 inorganics like pumice, vermiculite, river rock and perlite


I put a layer of rocks on the bottom of the pot, then sit them in a saucer so that there can be some "groundwater" for the plants to reach- this practice is highly debated on this forum

Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2023, 10:50:06 PM »
Also when do I eat it?

I ate my scarlettes when they were red, heavy, chunky, juicy and big.  ;D  For black varieties, it should be totally black, I guess...
I was tempted to wait till it fell off the tree. Would it be spoiled by then?

tru

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2023, 10:57:58 PM »
I put a layer of rocks on the bottom of the pot, then sit them in a saucer so that there can be some "groundwater" for the plants to reach- this practice is highly debated on this forum

Wow what a cool concept! I see no reason why it wouldn't work as expected, what's the argument against it?
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CeeJey

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2023, 10:59:19 PM »
I just recently up-potted some of mine that were getting touchy in 1/3 peat, 1/3 compost, 1/3 pearlite with some lava sand thrown in and they've been significantly less touchy since. Also since I started adjusting the ph of the water lower to around a 6 (honestly I'm surprised that they were surviving at 8 ph water to the extent that they were).

I've been hesitant to go hard on Holly Tone after I got fertilizer burn with it once on a red (might have been a bad batch or something) but everybody else seems to get great results with it. But all of mine get foliar feed regularly and respond well to that.

Plinia rivularis and escalarte have been the most touchy for me, seedling reds and restinga the least so far.

elouicious

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2023, 11:30:42 PM »
I put a layer of rocks on the bottom of the pot, then sit them in a saucer so that there can be some "groundwater" for the plants to reach- this practice is highly debated on this forum

Wow what a cool concept! I see no reason why it wouldn't work as expected, what's the argument against it?

Some argue it promotes root rot, for other species it definitely can. I think most Plinia like to have their feet wet, I have seen Myrciaria dubia plants grow completely submerged in a river.

Basically some think it isnt worth the risk and some think it is the secret to success

elouicious

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #27 on: January 25, 2023, 11:31:47 PM »
I just recently up-potted some of mine that were getting touchy in 1/3 peat, 1/3 compost, 1/3 pearlite with some lava sand thrown in and they've been significantly less touchy since. Also since I started adjusting the ph of the water lower to around a 6 (honestly I'm surprised that they were surviving at 8 ph water to the extent that they were).

I've been hesitant to go hard on Holly Tone after I got fertilizer burn with it once on a red (might have been a bad batch or something) but everybody else seems to get great results with it. But all of mine get foliar feed regularly and respond well to that.

Plinia rivularis and escalarte have been the most touchy for me, seedling reds and restinga the least so far.

I use most fertilizers at 1/4 strength for the first application- with fertilizers a little goes a long way, and the punishment for going overboard is severe

The main benefit of the holly tone is the acidification of the soil- could also be that you swung the pH of the soil in the pot too quickly

onur

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #28 on: January 26, 2023, 02:54:02 AM »
Also when do I eat it?

I ate my scarlettes when they were red, heavy, chunky, juicy and big.  ;D  For black varieties, it should be totally black, I guess...
I was tempted to wait till it fell off the tree. Would it be spoiled by then?

I wouldn't wait! They may go bad.

RS

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2023, 07:24:05 AM »
Also when do I eat it?

I ate my scarlettes when they were red, heavy, chunky, juicy and big.  ;D  For black varieties, it should be totally black, I guess...
I was tempted to wait till it fell off the tree. Would it be spoiled by then?

I wouldn't wait! They may go bad.

What's the variety? If it's an astringent type (e.g. Sabara, Grimal, coronata, grandiflora) then you need to wait until it's deep color and slightly soft, otherwise it'll taste awful.

If it's a non-astringent variety (e.g. red jabo, trunciflora, phitrantha, anomaly) then should be fine to eat early.

Flying Fox Fruits had a youtube video about this that was really helpful to understand. I'd been harvesting Sabara too early and they were nasty. With Sabara, it needs to be almost black and have some give (not hard).

tru

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2023, 07:26:19 AM »
you harvest them when you can twist it off right?
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RS

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2023, 07:35:06 AM »
you harvest them when you can twist it off right?

You can twist them off too early if it's an astringent type and they haven't softened enough. At least with mine, they should be slightly soft before picking for best flavor. They'll also soften after picking but the flavor isn't as good in my opinion. Curious about others experiences...

Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #32 on: January 26, 2023, 09:18:05 AM »
Also when do I eat it?

I ate my scarlettes when they were red, heavy, chunky, juicy and big.  ;D  For black varieties, it should be totally black, I guess...


I was tempted to wait till it fell off the tree. Would it be spoiled by then?

I wouldn't wait! They may go bad.

What's the variety? If it's an astringent type (e.g. Sabara, Grimal, coronata, grandiflora) then you need to wait until it's deep color and slightly soft, otherwise it'll taste awful.

If it's a non-astringent variety (e.g. red jabo, trunciflora, phitrantha, anomaly) then should be fine to eat early.

Flying Fox Fruits had a youtube video about this that was really helpful to understand. I'd been harvesting Sabara too early and they were nasty. With Sabara, it needs to be almost black and have some give (not hard).

Thanks for the suggestions, It’s originally from pine island nursery as an unnamed cultivar, and it’s at least 7 years old (I’ve had it for 6 and I got if from someone else as a 2.5’ tree). I’m gonna pick it right now. Texting in real time, just a bit of give to the fruit and…. Delicious…. And I ate the skin too (nice funk and just I hint of astringency.




CeeJey

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #33 on: January 26, 2023, 09:25:21 AM »

I use most fertilizers at 1/4 strength for the first application- with fertilizers a little goes a long way, and the punishment for going overboard is severe

The main benefit of the holly tone is the acidification of the soil- could also be that you swung the pH of the soil in the pot too quickly

Gotcha. I've been very slowly re-adding it to some of the more acid-liking ones in the collection after letting them get settled in the new mix.

daisyguy

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #34 on: January 27, 2023, 04:16:12 PM »
I put a layer of rocks on the bottom of the pot, then sit them in a saucer so that there can be some "groundwater" for the plants to reach- this practice is highly debated on this forum

Wow what a cool concept! I see no reason why it wouldn't work as expected, what's the argument against it?

It raises your perched water table. See: https://lee.ces.ncsu.edu/2018/12/rocks-in-pots-drainage-or-perched-water-table-problems/

Tortuga

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2023, 10:19:10 AM »
I use native soil. They love my sandy loam. I only use organic and homemade compost. The fruits taste better and more nutritious when using organic!
« Last Edit: January 29, 2023, 10:25:18 AM by Tortuga »

elouicious

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2023, 11:15:18 AM »
I put a layer of rocks on the bottom of the pot, then sit them in a saucer so that there can be some "groundwater" for the plants to reach- this practice is highly debated on this forum

Wow what a cool concept! I see no reason why it wouldn't work as expected, what's the argument against it?

It raises your perched water table. See: https://lee.ces.ncsu.edu/2018/12/rocks-in-pots-drainage-or-perched-water-table-problems/

A little convoluted but this appears to be the main bit

Actually, a perched water table (where the water “perches” or gathers) forms at the container soil bottom where the drainage level is, even though it is open at the bottom. This saturated water level is called a water table. This happens in outdoor soil too, not just in our containers. The water table is the dividing line separating the unsaturated zone from the saturated zone. The soil is saturated because the pores are filled with water. The area above the water table is the unsaturated zone and is where the plant’s roots have space to grow well. If gravel is added to the bottom of the pot, the perched water table area of saturated soil without aeration is above that in the container, so even less room for the roots to grow and be healthy in. Root rot diseases can be the result of roots remaining in waterlogged soils.

I wonder if this is in the case of overwatering, and if fabric/terracotta pots might make a difference

Tropicaltoba

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Re: Jabuticaba soil mixes used
« Reply #37 on: January 29, 2023, 11:31:28 AM »
I use large (15-35 gallon) plastic pots and drill 4 large holes on the side at the bottoms. I then place large cedar bark chunks in the bottom 2” to stop the soil from falling out. I then place the pot in a 2” deep saucer. I find that pants that like water will suck up that 2” of water in the bottom within 4-6 hrs, if the water remains overnight I put a 1-2” lift under the pot.

Plants that hate standing water-  sugar apple, young citrus, longan

Plants that suck up standing water - jaboticaba, guavas (all types strawberry, pinapple aka feijoia) banana, passion fruit mature citrus

 

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