Author Topic: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?  (Read 2442 times)

agroventuresperu

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The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« on: February 15, 2023, 06:17:37 PM »
This was off the record, so I'm not sure I should be reporting it, but I remember about eight years ago talking with one of the senior researchers at the USDA lab near Ft. Pierce. I think his name was Randall Neidz. He was talking about how that disease was pretty much decimating the entire crop of oranges in Florida. He showed me some charts indicating the steady decline, and said the outlook was bleak. Basically he predicted an entire collapse of the Florida citrus industry. He said even if they were able to fast-track some sort of GMO citrus, which would still take a minimum of two years, the processing plants were built with a certain volume in mind, and the lack of volume during that interim period would supposedly cause everything to go bust.

Anyway, don't quote me on that. I'm just paraphrasing the guy.

So, what ever happened with that situation?


Galatians522

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2023, 08:03:41 PM »
Production has continued to drop overall. With the hurricane this year, California may produce more Valencias than Florida. The estimate for Florida Valencias was 10 million boxes and dropping last I saw and California was holding steady at 8.1 million boxes. The juice plants have started importing concentrate from Mexico to make up the shortage (at a fraction of the price of Florida juice). As a result, the juice price paid to growers has not followed the cost of production. The juice plants that remain have never made so much money.

manfromyard

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2023, 08:26:18 PM »
So far they're mixing Brazilian orange concentrate with the Florida Juice to make up the lost production.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-21/us-orange-juice-imports-from-brazil-surge-as-florida-suffers-setbacks

Galatians522

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2023, 10:28:06 PM »
Florida's Natural is the specific juice plant that is using Mexican Concentrate.

Millet

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2023, 11:39:57 AM »
They should change the name of their product to Mexican Natural.

Galatians522

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2023, 03:37:32 PM »
They should change the name of their product to Mexican Natural.

That thought did occur to me. Ha, ha!  :P

1rainman

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2023, 04:30:09 AM »
Greening takes a really long time to kill a tree. In the meantime you get edible but less sweet even sour fruit. They just mix the sour fruit with sweet juice from Brazil or Mexico. When the tree finally died they plant more. Now they have the nets and at least one variety more resistant then use pesticides. There's also a bunch of hybrids with poncirus etc that aren't approved yet but are disease resistant.

The acreage will continue to decline as property is sold for retirement homes or replanted with stuff like Florida peaches but I doubt it will die completely.

agroventuresperu

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2023, 06:20:24 PM »
Greening takes a really long time to kill a tree. In the meantime you get edible but less sweet even sour fruit. They just mix the sour fruit with sweet juice from Brazil or Mexico. When the tree finally died they plant more. Now they have the nets and at least one variety more resistant then use pesticides. There's also a bunch of hybrids with poncirus etc that aren't approved yet but are disease resistant.

The acreage will continue to decline as property is sold for retirement homes or replanted with stuff like Florida peaches but I doubt it will die completely.

I thought they were bulldozing the retirement homes and planting more oranges since the old folks were goaded into their government-sanctioned culling. At least that's what the alternative media would have you believe.

Some interesting responses here. I had heard of the Brazilian workaround, but didn't know about the Mexican option.

The reason I'm asking is because I was considering signing on as a company driver for a trucking company that hauls (mostly) orange juice in food grade tankers. Kind of curious what the outlook is like for that sort of work.

agroventuresperu

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2023, 06:23:04 PM »
I do know the company picks up juice concentrate loads at the ports. So they are not totally dependent on domestic production.

Galatians522

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2023, 11:06:16 PM »
People in America will be drinking OJ long after we are all dead and gone. At this point, it looks like the majority of that juice will enter our borders as concentrate from foreign sources and will be reconstituted and bottled here. They will need truckers to haul that juice and the concentrate that it is made from.

pagnr

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2023, 02:57:28 AM »
It has been going on for many years here in Australia, using Brazilian concentrate. The best part about it was the free 44 gal/200 litre drums from the factory near here.
Orange juice has that processed flavour.

agroventuresperu

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2023, 03:09:47 PM »
People in America will be drinking OJ long after we are all dead and gone. At this point, it looks like the majority of that juice will enter our borders as concentrate from foreign sources and will be reconstituted and bottled here. They will need truckers to haul that juice and the concentrate that it is made from.

You don't see people adopting the keto diet, carnivore diet and all the other low-carb, no-sugar diets cutting into the overall consumption? Also the folks that are health foodies that don't mind fruit and natural sugar realize that processed OJ is basically like sugar water, sterile and dead with no enzymes.

pagnr

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2023, 03:45:47 AM »
https://www.preventionaus.com.au/article/fruit-juice-now-has-less-health-stars-than-diet-cola-561006

Yes fruit juice, including Orange Juice, is health ranked lower than diet soft drinks here in Australia.
This cause quite an upset for Orange growers, who came out swinging. Not sure if it has affected sales too much ?
Water is probably the best choice, however it is also quite expensive out of the convenience store refrigerator $5 per litre ( cold) or $ 4.50 for 750 ml.

1rainman

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2023, 07:55:30 AM »
I feel healthy when eating oranges and orange juice. Mostly not from concentrate most concentrate is nasty. But the quality has gone down and price up so I don't drink as much. Grapefruit juice lemon and lime aid, it's all good. A little too much sugar though. The non red grapefruit juice is the only one with a good sugar level. Or homemade lemon aid not using much sugar.

cotter pin

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2023, 07:45:58 AM »
  We get our orange juice from Joshua Farms in Arcadia and it's not from concentrate and has been very good over the years, but I do taste a difference lately, I know the orange is not in season so I wonder if they source from a different source then themselves and wonder if it is from concentrate. Has anyone seen what happens to juice from concentrate? They basically boil the fruit down to a slurry of pulp, extract all the oxygen out of it, this includes all the nutrition, then store it in big vats for months on end, the slurry has no taste or smell, then when they make it into juice again they add perfume to make it taste like oranges again.

1rainman

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2023, 02:15:54 PM »
My main problem with concentrate juice is the disgusting tap water they rehydrate it with. There are some ok concentrated juices though most are garbage. Ocean spray is good. Their grapefruit juice is good and various cranberries. Not the best but decent. The store brand knock off oceansprays I can't even drink. It's disgusting like the tap water here.

A lot of concentrated juices here is straight tap water which comes out of the river here. But yeah I heard that too they add flavoring.

Like bottled coke is pretty good they use good Georgia water but local fountain coke is the local tap water and syrup. Doesn't taste the same. This tap water gives me headaches or I feel sluggish if I drink too much too. Also McDonald's I feel lethargic if I eat a lot of it due to preservatives I guess.

Galatians522

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2023, 09:32:30 PM »
  We get our orange juice from Joshua Farms in Arcadia and it's not from concentrate and has been very good over the years, but I do taste a difference lately, I know the orange is not in season so I wonder if they source from a different source then themselves and wonder if it is from concentrate. Has anyone seen what happens to juice from concentrate? They basically boil the fruit down to a slurry of pulp, extract all the oxygen out of it, this includes all the nutrition, then store it in big vats for months on end, the slurry has no taste or smell, then when they make it into juice again they add perfume to make it taste like oranges again.
They are picking Valencia oranges here in Highlands County now. They make excellent juice. Not from concentrate Valencia juice can be frozen for 4 months without much loss in quality. That is how most of the NFC juice companies got year round production. Valencias were picked until June and they used their stockpile of frozen juice until October when Hamlins started being harvested again. Perfume is not an ingredient in OJ concentrate to my knowledge. I am glad to hear that Joshua Creek is still selling NFC, Maxwells here in Avon Park does as well. They are our last local juice stand. There used to be one one every corner.

Aiptasia904

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2023, 09:02:43 AM »
They are picking Valencia oranges here in Highlands County now. They make excellent juice. Not from concentrate Valencia juice can be frozen for 4 months without much loss in quality. That is how most of the NFC juice companies got year round production. Valencias were picked until June and they used their stockpile of frozen juice until October when Hamlins started being harvested again. Perfume is not an ingredient in OJ concentrate to my knowledge. I am glad to hear that Joshua Creek is still selling NFC, Maxwells here in Avon Park does as well. They are our last local juice stand. There used to be one one every corner.

I used to pick valencia oranges in Placentia, CA, every day on my way to school in the morning. Our housing development was built on the hill of an abandoned valencia grove and the developers had the foresight to leave some of the old orange trees on the hillside. They are an incredibly good juicing orange. As far as citrus psyllid and Hunglongbing virus, our local citrus trees in my little town are all thriving and doing well. I have Owari satsuma, kumquat and pomelo flowering for the season and several neighbors have older trees that have never shown signs of citrus greening disease. I suspect the reason for that is we are right on the banks of the St. John's river and are surrounded by water oak and pin oak trees. I know that U.F. has been stuyding oak trees for a protein they produce that helps "awaken" the natural defenses of citrus trees to resist and recover from Hunglongbing. My citrus trees wind up with at least some oak leaves in their mulch all the time and I have a few open topped rain catches (blue barrels and an IBC tote) that often get oak leaves mixed in with the rain water making oak leaf tea. It's mainly what I water with because our tap water is literally liquid chalk with a super high pH that most of our acid loving trees don't like. Anyway, if you have citrus, consider adding some oak leaves to their mulch from time to time.

1rainman

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2023, 02:08:24 PM »
We have oak trees all over Florida. It doesn't seem to help.

jacksonLeo

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2023, 03:46:19 AM »
Citrus greening, also known as Huanglongbing (HLB), has been a significant issue for the citrus industry in Florida and other parts of the world. HLB is a bacterial disease that affects citrus trees, causing fruit to become misshapen and bitter and eventually killing the tree.

The citrus industry in Florida has been greatly affected by citrus greening in recent years. According to the Florida Department of Citrus, the state's orange production has declined by more than 70% since the disease was first detected in 2005. However, Florida still produces orange juice, although the amount has decreased significantly.

To combat citrus greening, researchers and growers are working together to find solutions, including developing disease-resistant varieties of citrus trees and implementing strict disease management practices. While the situation remains challenging, there is hope that the industry will be able to overcome citrus greening and continue to provide consumers with high-quality citrus products.

agroventuresperu

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2023, 05:09:01 PM »
They are picking Valencia oranges here in Highlands County now. They make excellent juice. Not from concentrate Valencia juice can be frozen for 4 months without much loss in quality. That is how most of the NFC juice companies got year round production. Valencias were picked until June and they used their stockpile of frozen juice until October when Hamlins started being harvested again. Perfume is not an ingredient in OJ concentrate to my knowledge. I am glad to hear that Joshua Creek is still selling NFC, Maxwells here in Avon Park does as well. They are our last local juice stand. There used to be one one every corner.

I used to pick valencia oranges in Placentia, CA, every day on my way to school in the morning. Our housing development was built on the hill of an abandoned valencia grove and the developers had the foresight to leave some of the old orange trees on the hillside. They are an incredibly good juicing orange. As far as citrus psyllid and Hunglongbing virus, our local citrus trees in my little town are all thriving and doing well. I have Owari satsuma, kumquat and pomelo flowering for the season and several neighbors have older trees that have never shown signs of citrus greening disease. I suspect the reason for that is we are right on the banks of the St. John's river and are surrounded by water oak and pin oak trees. I know that U.F. has been stuyding oak trees for a protein they produce that helps "awaken" the natural defenses of citrus trees to resist and recover from Hunglongbing. My citrus trees wind up with at least some oak leaves in their mulch all the time and I have a few open topped rain catches (blue barrels and an IBC tote) that often get oak leaves mixed in with the rain water making oak leaf tea. It's mainly what I water with because our tap water is literally liquid chalk with a super high pH that most of our acid loving trees don't like. Anyway, if you have citrus, consider adding some oak leaves to their mulch from time to time.

I wish I could have a few tanker plane payloads of your water dumped on my land.

Calusa

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2023, 07:52:30 AM »
FYI, I saw on the local news last night that the citrus output for Florida this year is the lowest in 100 years. Of course hurricane Ian caused some of the problem but the trend is less and less fruit each decade.

1rainman

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2023, 12:42:13 PM »
Used to be oranges and citrus everywhere. Impossible to find now. That's why I'm interested in things like the desert lime x meyer with high hlb tolerance.

manfromyard

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #23 on: May 24, 2023, 08:12:09 PM »
Citrus greening, also known as Huanglongbing (HLB), has been a significant issue for the citrus industry in Florida and other parts of the world. HLB is a bacterial disease that affects citrus trees, causing fruit to become misshapen and bitter and eventually killing the tree.

The citrus industry in Florida has been greatly affected by citrus greening in recent years. According to the Florida Department of Citrus, the state's orange production has declined by more than 70% since the disease was first detected in 2005. However, Florida still produces orange juice, although the amount has decreased significantly.

To combat citrus greening, researchers and growers are working together to find solutions, including developing disease-resistant varieties of citrus trees and implementing strict disease management practices. While the situation remains challenging, there is hope that the industry will be able to overcome citrus greening and continue to provide consumers with high-quality citrus products.

How do these bots get to register?

cassowary

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Re: The Situation on Citrus Greening? Does Florida Still Produce OJ?
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2023, 08:17:03 PM »

I thought they were bulldozing the retirement homes and planting more oranges since the old folks were goaded into their government-sanctioned culling. At least that's what the alternative media would have you believe.


I thought so too..

Regarding low Carb diets, It's still a very small percentage of the population and it's a short term diet. A "carnivore diet" leads to scurvy if followed properly so you could anticipate increased consumption eventually for those recovering from that fad diet.

Here in Au the OJ from the Big green shed tastes like they juiced the whole fruit with the peel and all! Can't stand it, good to clean the pruning saw with though since there so much orange oil in it.
Having atleast 400ml of fresh home squezze every day. Most of the time it's manadrin based as the OJ In the green shed are to sour. Not enough from the farm yet.

The problem with the netting of citrus is that it reduces photosynthesis and brix levels in sap. Have a look a T Dykstra's work from dykstra labs. it's on a Podcast by AEA John Kempf.
It's expensive to keep replanting tree's and especially if your running intensive populations. Well nurseries atleast make more money short term.
http://dykstralabs.com/

Galatians, that oak leaf tea seams quite close to Rudolf Steiner's Oak bark preparation or BD 505. It's very high in calcium. But obviously not the same as Ca Carbonate from a rock.
https://patriciadamery.com/biodynamic-preparation-505-oak-bark/

Interesting that the OJ plants are making big money now... If the processing industry can make more money when the local farmers are declining it seams likely they would take action towards that happening, they have profit motives. And also now an excuse to say we have to import OJ.

Huanglongbing, China? Seams like there's some bad stuff coming in from China lately... Or maybe I am just to cynical..

Peace

 
« Last Edit: June 04, 2023, 08:35:50 PM by cassowary »
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