Author Topic: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?  (Read 2141 times)

containerman

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #25 on: February 05, 2021, 09:36:15 AM »
sc4001992,

So guess Sumo will be 1+, and Ponkan will be 1-?  Satsuma will be 3+?

I've had my Gold Nuggets in March but they are usually gone by then but I've tasted some of my friends who has a orchard in May and they were delicious. I've heard they hold well into as late as July.

Millet

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #26 on: February 05, 2021, 11:36:52 AM »
If the gage of which citrus taste the best, is determined by total wins in citrus taste contests, then it would be Xie Shan.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2021, 09:38:16 AM »
Millet, I hope so since I'm grafting a lot of Xie Shan so when I eat it and it tastes great I want plenty to share with family and friends. Still waiting for my first fruit, grafts are less than 1 yr old.

containerman

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2021, 11:20:11 AM »
If the gage of which citrus taste the best, is determined by total wins in citrus taste contests, then it would be Xie Shan.
I have also read that Okitsu has been a winner in the recent past have you read that too ?

This article was from 2014 below

https://www.fruitmentor.com/okitsu-wase-satsuma#:~:text=In%20a%20November%202014%20citrus,also%20noted%20its%20fragrant%20skin.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #29 on: February 07, 2021, 11:42:21 AM »
I hear/read a few different reviews, some people say it tastes good, others say its average.
I'm pretty sure I grafted/fruited both the Okitsu wase(VI-389) and Miyagawa(VI-612) but it was a while ago and if I liked the taste it would still be on my trees. I didn't find any of my old grafts of either so if I remember correctly, the fruits looked like the photos in citrus variety collection and it was bland, not much sweetness, similar to all those China Satsuma on their list so I got rid of the branches.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2021, 03:17:54 PM by sc4001992 »

containerman

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2021, 11:51:56 AM »
I hear/read a few different reviews, some people say it tastes good, others say its average.
I'm pretty sure I grafted/fruited both the Okitsu wase(389) and Miyagawa(612) but it was a while ago and if I liked the taste it would still be on my trees. I didn't find any of my old grafts of either so if I remember correctly, the fruits looked like the photos in citrus variety collection and it was bland, not much sweetness, similar to all those China Satsuma on their list so I got rid of the branches.

My okitsu's are really good tasting and I had everyone sample 5 different varieties of mandarins on Christman day and the okitsu won hands down.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #31 on: February 07, 2021, 03:26:11 PM »
Yes, I read that from your reviews. What was the other mandarin varieties that you tasted?
Your environment may be better than mine for the Okitsu. Next time I order more scions, I will need to try the Okitsu again.

I do notice that the taste of some satsumas get much better (sweeter) when you leave the fruit ripe on the tree longer, I may have been tasting mine to soon. My brother has many satsumas trees as well and he just leaves his fruit ripe on the tree. It stays ripe for  a few months and gets sweeter than mine. I don't care for the fruit when the flesh gets to soft even though it is sweeter.

containerman

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #32 on: February 07, 2021, 03:59:27 PM »
Yes, I read that from your reviews. What was the other mandarin varieties that you tasted?
Your environment may be better than mine for the Okitsu. Next time I order more scions, I will need to try the Okitsu again.

I do notice that the taste of some satsumas get much better (sweeter) when you leave the fruit ripe on the tree longer, I may have been tasting mine to soon. My brother has many satsumas trees as well and he just leaves his fruit ripe on the tree. It stays ripe for  a few months and gets sweeter than mine. I don't care for the fruit when the flesh gets to soft even though it is sweeter.
My okitsu's taste great at Thanksgiving and never last much past that time but I'm sure they would taste even better in December. I usually eat my Owari's around Christmas time. And yes they do get better over time as true with most mandarins.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #33 on: February 15, 2021, 06:51:35 PM »
I couldn't wait any longer to taste my last mandarins so I picked them on 2/14. Now I only have 2 sumo fruits left on the tree.

The last fruits I had hanging on the trees that are ripe are Sumo, Ponkan, Honey, Tango, Gold Nugget.
I did the fruit tasting today with my family again here's my taste rating, best tasting is #1, worst is #5

1) Sumo/Shiranui
2) Gold Nugget
3) Ponkan
4) Honey
5) Tango

Sumo really improve in taste since December and January testing. Now in Feb it seems to have the best taste as described of store bought fruits where it is very sweet tasting, different from other mandarin tastes that are just very sweet. Until I get fruits on my Xie Shan, Sumo seems to be the top one.
--------

To sum up the fruit tasting off my trees for the season, here's my favorite showing the best #1 and the others.
1) Sumo/Shiranui
2) Gold Nugget
3) Ponkan
4) Honey (CA)-many seeds



« Last Edit: February 20, 2021, 04:54:08 AM by sc4001992 »

brian

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #34 on: February 15, 2021, 08:17:20 PM »
I'm digging up my Tango tree and replacing it with the Shasta Gold mandarin I have in a container.  Tango is good, but this is better.

I am still on the fence about Sumo.  I'm going to give it another year and see.   My current crop was good but not amazing.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #35 on: February 15, 2021, 09:53:52 PM »
Yup, I will keep the Tango graft on the tree but it only tastes average.
I have a recently purchased (last year) Shasta Gold which is still in 5 gal that had 4 fruits and it tasted better than the 3yr old grafted Tango which fruits every year.

The Sumo/Shiranui graft in the photos is 3-1/2 yrs old now. It started fruiting by the second year (12 fruits) and the fruit does taste the best in mid-Feb even though it shows ripe colors by early December. In 2020 there were 14 fruits on the grafted branch. In fact the branch with fruits was too heavy and it started to crack in half so I had to repair it by putting a post to hold up the weight. If you look at my 2/15/21 photo, on the left is a 2inch diameter dead mulberry branch I used to prop it up, and to the left of the big funny looking fruit is a leather strap to hold the grafted branch from moving.



Malhar

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #36 on: February 16, 2021, 12:07:05 AM »
I recently found Shasta Gold and Sumo at local Sprouts. To my taste buds, Sumo was better than Shasta.  Sumo had a very balanced mix of sweetness and acidity and was quite flavorful.

brian

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #37 on: February 16, 2021, 11:29:31 AM »
Yeah, Sumo has such a good reputation I want to give it a while before I decide it isn't fantastic.  Could just be a bad crop due to conditions.

Same with Xie Shan.  The Xie Shan fruit I've grown so far weren't amazing, but the tree hasn't been super healthy either.  I am going to give it a few years and see.

My tango was extremely healthy and fruitful, and it was just what I expected, but I was blown away by the very first Shasta Gold crop I had

EricSC

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #38 on: February 16, 2021, 08:19:16 PM »
brian,

Tango was mentioned as similar as Gold Nugget.  Can you give it a description such as:
size, sweetness, flavor, tangy, zing, easy to peel, seeds, cell toughness, more?

brian

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #39 on: February 16, 2021, 09:33:59 PM »
Tango is one of the common mandarins sold as "cuties" or "halo" and grocery stores across the country.  It is very slightly pumpkin shaped and less round than the spherical "clementine" type that is also sold under this name.  As far as mandarins go, I don't think Gold Nugget is all that similar to Tango at all.  I've had some good Gold Nuggets from grocery stores, and some good ones from my tree, but overall they tend to be too puffy and over-sweet/not-sour-enough in my experience.

Tango is usually totally seedless, thin skinned, easy peel, sweet with a bit of sour and tasty.  It is a great variety!  But shasta gold is simply better in my opinion :)

Shasta gold has more cell toughness (flesh firmness), which I like.  The rind is a bit thicker but easier to peel in my limited experience (I only got one Shasta crop so far and it was small).   Mix of sour and sweet.   I don't like pure sweet.

My Gold Nugget has always been a weak one.  I think it is just my tree and not the variety in general so I don't want to comment as some kind of authority
« Last Edit: February 16, 2021, 09:39:38 PM by brian »

EricSC

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #40 on: February 16, 2021, 11:22:11 PM »
brian,

With my limited experience with gold nugget, I am with your descriptions. 

2020, I had a little more than100 gold nugget fruits, picked from March through end of May.  It is very clear that the sweetness increases with time without other deteriorations.   As you mentioned, it has a clear sweet taste and is not-sour-enough.  It does not have the "ziiiiiii" feeling but a good percent of people like it.

On the other side, we do notice that there is a good % of population who really enjoy the sour taste.  Clearly these two group of peoples will have different preferences and descriptions.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2021, 10:44:18 PM by EricSC »

mbmango

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #41 on: February 17, 2021, 07:17:55 PM »
I like Gold Nugget at our location since we don't get a lot of heat, but it can still get sweet enough for us.  Kishus similarly also work well for us.  I'm curious how Shiranui will taste when I eventually fruit it, but probably another 2 years.  I've tried Honey mandarin which comes out bland, and Cara Cara and Moro are way more tart than what I can buy. 

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #42 on: February 24, 2021, 05:10:47 AM »
mbmango, you must not have tasted the real Honey (CA) mandarin, VI-133. I think there are three types that were at one time called honey mandarin/tangerine so it could get confusing. I grow all three types. You can get the details of the varieties from the CCPP budwood website.

1.Honey mandarin, VI-133
2.Murcott mandarin (FL Honey), VI-147
3.W. Murcott Afourer, VI-462

If the fruit you tasted was not small with many seeds, then it sounds like you ate the W. Murcott Afourer, VI-462. This fruit is medium size, skin is bright orange, peels easy and flesh is juicy but taste is bland. Of the three, this is the one I like the least. The other two are very good, I rank it as shown, they are sweet & tart. I keep a graft of the VI-462 just to have the variety for comparison of tastes. My tree has been in ground for over 7yrs and the taste of this fruit has not changed.

You will like the taste of Shiranui fruit, it should have fruits in 2 years, but the excellent taste may not show up until year 3. At least for me that is how its been. Now my tree has very good tasting fruits so I ended up grafting a lot more Shiranui on my trees. Also, don't pick the ripe fruit until Feb to get the best taste.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2021, 05:16:09 AM by sc4001992 »

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #43 on: September 28, 2021, 03:43:25 PM »
Here's my taste test update as of 9-26-21:

1a) Orri (Israel)- sweetest of them all
1b) Sumo/Shiranui - sweet and little tart
2) Xie Shan -still did not taste a fully ripe one, only green/yellow so far
3) Gold Nugget
4) Ponkan
5) Honey mandarin (VI-133)
6) Tango

Still did not get to taste the Yosemite Gold which I hear is also excellent, maybe next year, Johnny where would you rate the taste?

EricSC, thanks for the heads up on the Orri, I saw them last weekend at the market so got a dozen to eat, very good, consistent flavor.
When you planted some of the seeds from Orri, were they kinda on the small side? I did find some small seeds in a few fruits from the dozen fruits I ate.

Lovetoplant, here's an update on your question, "which is the sweetest", the answer now is Orri.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2021, 03:51:49 PM by sc4001992 »

EricSC

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #44 on: September 28, 2021, 06:56:55 PM »


Out of 6 very thin seeds I found from 10 Orri fruits, I got two very thin and weak baby plants .  They eventually dried out in the hot summer.   One web article mentioned FL has the plants for sale from a nursery but no one in CA yet.   
Here's my taste test update as of 9-26-21:

1a) Orri (Israel)- sweetest of them all
1b) Sumo/Shiranui - sweet and little tart
2) Xie Shan -still did not taste a fully ripe one, only green/yellow so far
3) Gold Nugget
4) Ponkan
5) Honey mandarin (VI-133)
6) Tango

Still did not get to taste the Yosemite Gold which I hear is also excellent, maybe next year, Johnny where would you rate the taste?

EricSC, thanks for the heads up on the Orri, I saw them last weekend at the market so got a dozen to eat, very good, consistent flavor.
When you planted some of the seeds from Orri, were they kinda on the small side? I did find some small seeds in a few fruits from the dozen fruits I ate.

Lovetoplant, here's an update on your question, "which is the sweetest", the answer now is Orri.

sc4001992

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Re: Best Satsuma variety for Southern California?
« Reply #45 on: September 28, 2021, 08:18:25 PM »
Ok, thanks for the info, I will try to grow my seeds out and if they survive will update later next year. My sumo seedling trees did very well, got 3 of them, one is 4 ft tall now.

 

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