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Messages - Lumi-Ukko

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1
The two G.Mexicana saplings I got shipped from Raul both perished (a slow die back until they succumbed). Not sure what I did wrong with them as the other Garcinia species I spurced from Raul and elsewhere are doing ok to very well. I'll try to get some more from Raul and try again. I hate failing lol

2
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Lychee in hot equatorial climate
« on: November 28, 2024, 12:43:44 PM »
Agreed on Lychee. I have two trees and it's a constant battle keeping them happy here in Merida Yucatan. They've never flowered at all, so I look at them as ornamentals with the hope of one day seeing a fruit.

For reference, we get down on rare occasions to 14c at night on the coldest nights, but they are one or two occasions a year. Most often, our night temperature in January is about 17-18c and  daytime high of 29-30c. May, our hottest month can have nights in the low 30s celsius and as high as 45c in the day. Just too extreme for lychee. Pulasan and Longan trees are still young but seem to be much happier with our climate.

3
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: CHELATED IRON
« on: November 28, 2024, 12:37:57 PM »
I have high pH limestone soil and groundwater (we use a well) here in Merida Yucatan, and suffer a lot from iron uptake issues particularly with container trees. I give a soil soak periodically with iron chelate solution and a little Epsom salts which seems to work well. However, prevention is better and I like to mulch with a lot of compost and use sulphur for acidic loving plants.

4
FYI,
kwai muk scientific name is now artocarpus parvus.

I may have some seeds available in a week or so, and if I'm on break I can send you some.

Excellent! Let me know if so! I'm definitely interested and the timing would be perfect for me (I shuttle between California and Yucatan, Mexico and have a trip planned early December).

Thanks also for the heads up on the name change. sometimes hard to track all these name changes!

5
Do you happen to have seeds available?  Shipping to California (Santa Monica)?

6
I bought some from Fruit Lover's recently https://fruitlovers.com/product/kwai-muk/

They are listed as "Available on backorder". It took quite a while before my order shipped, but they did eventually get to me.

Thank you. Any luck with germination?  I got a batch from an Etsy seller a while back but had zero success with the 8 seeds, and they rotted even though I gave them a dilute hydrogen peroxide rinse. First Artocarpus I have had zero success with.

7
Haven't seen any recent postings for this species.

I am wishing to purchase Kwai Muk seeds or trees in USA or Mexico.

If sold in USA, seeds only preferred.
If sold in Mexico, seeds or trees/saplings.

Please DM if you have any to offer.  Many thanks in advance,
Peter

8
I find that young plants are sporadic at setting fruit until well established. But, I do find sunshine hours are most important. If my plants don't get enough sun, they flower less and abort more flowers. I never cross pollinate with other plants when hand pollinating, and the pollen from the male part to the female ovule on the same flower is usually successful. At a guess I would say sun hours or lack of phosphorus or potassium is the issue (most likely phosphorus). I'm no expert and just try to give good balanced organic fertilizer every few weeks which seems to do the trick.

9
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Beetles eating my Black Sapote
« on: October 26, 2024, 01:27:22 AM »
Do they happen to be small black flea beetles? I have so many of those on my Black Sapotes. They got over and infested my Fig too, but I got on top of that with the last resort of using imidacloprid; something I only used after trying all organic controls I could find.

10
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: September 27, 2024, 09:47:38 PM »
I will update my tree's status in 4 weeks when I return from a trip. When I left, it was pushing out new growth, larger leaves and much healthier looking leaves. Still a ways to go to see if it bounces back properly but early indications are good.

11
Definitely hard to define unique as we use other flavours to define new tastes. Clearly avocado is a good pick for truly unique.

I guess describing fruit is like describing art, we all have our own tastes and opinions. I find chupa chupa very unique. Like a bit mango, a bit condensed milk and plain ice cream. Salak also feels familiar (pineapple tones) but then there's something so much more complex that I can't quit describe. Similarly to canistel is hard to define. I suppose this is a common pattern and might even differ from tree to tree.

12
Not sure what extreme dwarf means but some thoughts.

Perhaps not a tropical fruit, per se, but finger limes (limon caviar in Spanish) can be kept compact and in <10 gal containers. I had one when I lived in SoCal that fruited well in a 7 gal container as long as I irrigated it well and fed it appropriately.

Also, pineapples can be kept in containers and will fruit if they are happy. Doesn't need to be a big plant to do so, but the fruit might be smaller (but no less delicious- in fact the best pineapples I've had came from pots in the yard).

13
That's a great list and a post that should be pinned. In my case, I have a couple of very particular trees which would likely prefer a bit more clay content to the soil. These trees will one day go in ground but for now they will be up-potted.

My topsoil is terrible, so I have to really make all potting soil from individual ingredients.I can cover most variations of soil with what I have or can buy, but the clay-loam is hard for me to replicate without a clay-like medium.

14
Figured I would throw this question in this thread, keeps the forum tidier and information concise.

I am hunting for a good clay or clay substitute for adding to potting medium for certain fruit trees that tend to like this kind of soil.  Unfortunately here in Yucatan, we don't get the multitudes of options that can be found in the USA. For example, Turface is something I just can't seem to get and even finding a store that sells surface medium for baseball fields seems a bust.

I've been mulling options to add to my soil to replicate the clay nutrient rich soils:

1) Adding Fine food grade diatomaceous earth.  However, this is technically more like a silica, though may have better water retention than regular courser silica.

2) Plain, natural Kitty litter clay with no additives. Not sure if I can find it but stand a chance.  If distributed evenly within the soil it could replicate what I need.

3) Potassium clay. Not quite the same as regular clay, and I worry about the nutrient level of this as I tend to control nutrient levels through compost, fish and algae fertilizer, bone meal, etc depending on needs.  Also, it might not provide what I really need in texture.  Here's an example:
https://articulo.mercadolibre.com.mx/MLM-1491319873-arcilla-potasica-organica-10-kgs-_JM#position%3D29%26search_layout%3Dgrid%26type%3Ditem%26tracking_id%3Ddb37c6bf-2ac9-49f3-914e-8197ddafbf77

4) Any other options? Open to any and all ideas.

Thanks,
Peter

15
I have a lot of young trees down here yet to fruit, so this list might look different in a few months or years. But for now, and in my climate in no particular order:

Jackfruit
Mamey
Mango
Mulberry
Papaya

All of these grow really well in our poor basic alkaline soil,.produce tasty fruit, and require little work compared to other more demanding species.

16
For southern CA, the 5 bullet proof trees you can put in the ground and they produce loads of fruit with minimal effort:
1. Guava
2. Loquat
3. White sapote
4. Citrus
5. Avocado

There are better tasting fruit IMO that require more effort, but the 5 I mentioned above are set it and forget trees with the best ROI.

A good list, I would definitely agree with loquat, citrus, and avocado.

I'd definitely also argue for Feijoa/Pineapple Guava. When I lived in SoCal, I had a tree that set copious amounts of fruit and I never ever fertilized it, never had any pests (save the squirrels who loved the fruit), and I could let the soil dry out without any damage.  Perfect tree suggestion for anyone without a green thumb.  And depending on location of SoCal, Passiflora Edulis, again grew rapidly and fruit profusely with hardly any input except some help pollinating when there was a marine layer, which could make the pollen a bit sticky.

17
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: My guava refuses to bloom . . . .
« on: September 06, 2024, 11:04:37 AM »
Same problem with my guava. Grows like crazy, nice green leaves, no blooms yet. Is about 10ft tall and went in ground 2+ years ago, maybe 3 years tops at about 3 feet high. Have trimmed it back twice to 6 feet.

My feeling is that it doesn't get enough sun hours as it is somewhat shaded by at different times of day by a huge ceiba, a large lime tree, and some bamboo too. I'd estimate it gets 3-4hrs complete sunlight this time of year, and a somewhat more in winter and spring. Unfortunately, it can't be moved, so it will just have to remain as an ornamental unless it changes its mind on flowers.

18
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 26, 2024, 01:29:20 PM »
So I took the plunge Saturday and repotted the miracle fruit.  When I pulled it from its 15 gal pot, the soil was so compacted and dense, it was clear to see why it had been struggling.  I washed off most of the soild from the rootball, leaving a little of the sandy/loamy bit that was attached when I bought it.

Repotted in the same size pot (clean one) with a mix made using everyone's suggestions. I went for:

48% sphagnum peat moss
45% perlite
5% pine bark chips small to medium sized
2% pumice.
Added some gypsum, mycorrhizae, and a little soil acidifier into the mix.

Watered it in with some weak pH Down and diluted fish emulsion. Topdressed with some holly-tone and a decent layer of thicker pine bark chips.

Moved it in to a fairly shady spot to minimize transplant shock; the sun here is hella strong, so it will get max of 1hr full sun in the mid-late afternoon.  Will keep measuring the pH level and adjust the acidity accordingly as well as throwing on some used coffee grounds from time to time.  Hopefully we get more rainfall as it has been strangely dry here for peak rainy season. I really don't like giving the acid loving plants our crappy alkali groundwater from the well as it just becomes a daily struggle.

Looking forward to see how it responds now. Can tell the container is much lighter now.

Now onto the next project of fixing my Jaboticaba which is also struggling for some reason...

19
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 23, 2024, 11:51:02 AM »
I'm not a big fan of starting a new topic for every question when I think adding it to an existing thread helps consolidate useful information. However, the last thread I could find labelled for Miracle Fruit advice turned into a bit of a snipefest. Even the forum code suggested I open a new thread instead of replying to the older one. So anyhow, here goes...

I have a metre or so tall Miracle Fruit tree in a roughly 15 gallon pot that I planted around a year ago. for the best part of time it did well, and when it started to look a bit iffy, I managed to perk it up with some acidifying fertilizer and got a decent berry harvest for the second time. However, it soon started to look sick again, which I initially put down to our crazy record-breaking hot dry season this past spring. However, two solid months into rainy season and it still isn't looking great.

Some background. I potted it with a mix of perlite, local topsoil, compost, and peat moss.  Our local soil is very alkaline and tends to clay up when wet.  The well water that is used to irrigate it during drier spells is also very alkaline. I've been religiously giving coffee grounds, sulfur, and measuring the pH to get it into optimal range, plus occasional weak compost tea and foliar sprays, so I am thinking I have other issues.

So what next?  In my opinion I think that the soil has sludged up, or salt/saline conditions are taking over.  I drilled lots of big holes to the pot to help drainage, but I think the roots are just too wet still.  Sadly I think I will need to pull it from it's pot and try to repot it with a cleaner mixture.

My questions are:

1) Am I even on the right track with my thoughts?  Can I try something else before going defcon 1?  I'll try to add a photo of the tree/leaves tomorrow
2) I heard that Miracle Fruit get upset very easy when the roots are disturbed. How would I go about cleaning up any sludgy mess should I find it?
3) Related to #2, is there any suggested substrate mix which will avoid using my local crappy topsoil?  I have most ingredients one could need, so it would be about putting these into an applicable mixture.
4) Am I crazy even trying? She's an already decent sized tree and don't want to give up on it.

Thank you in advance of any replies.

I have two very large miracle fruit trees (one short leaf and one long leaf) for 6 years in 20 gallon containers  and I believe within the last year I finally got them extra happy. I made my own soil mixture. I used 50% Canadian sphagnum peat moss/50% perlite or pumice. I top dress every 6 months with Dr Earth Acid Lovers fertilizer- I have been adding pine needles and pine bark to the top 4 inches of soil. I will also add soil acidifier and coffee grounds to the top dressing recipe.

When the tips of the leaves are brown, it usually signifies they didn’t receive enough water or the soil is not acidic enough. This happened to the both of my plants about 16 months ago. They don’t like soaking wet soil but they also don’t like the soil to dry out, ever. I use rain water only, I mix that water with pH down to bring the ph to about 4-4.5 ph. I will also add Mycorrhiza and fish emulsion every other watering, they real seem to thrive and respond really well to extra stuff I add to the waterings. They are slow growers- but one of my plants grew and easy 3.5ft in the last year. The brown leaf tips from last year are almost gone (the plants periodically drops leaves) and the new growth is super healthy with shiny leaves. Once a year, I use a soil ph Meter to make sure the ph is within optimal range.

Both of my trees live under my screened in porch, west facing.  They are shaded all day except when they receive direct sunlight from about 3-6pm. The more shade, the better. They really can’t tolerate direct sun for long periods.

I highly recommend that you repot with the proper soil mixture, it shouldnt hurt it and give it regular waterings. I water about every 5-7 days in winter and every 3-5 days in the summer. I started watering more frequently this summer and they responded well and I have been rewarded with hundreds of berries in the last 4- 6 months. Miracle fruit is a perfect container plant, best of luck with it.

Hi Darcizzle, thank you for the detailed response. With yours and others suggestions, I am going ot try and brave the soil change. I have one question left, to how much can I worry about washing away any congealed soil from the rootball before adding to it's new soil? I have a feeling there's some poor soil conditions around the root zone and probably should take care of that at the same time.

20
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 14, 2024, 12:22:33 PM »
I have killed my fair share of miracle berry. I am currently trying an experiment with 5% sulphuric acid and it they seem to be loving it. I am going to go against the grain and test out soils that are not as heavy in peat. Peat eventually turns to sludge which I feel is the death for miracle berries. I think I might test out more non organic soils. I have heard Decomposed granite is slightly acidic. I might try that. It will be an interesting experiment.

Let us know in this thread how you get along. I'll post an update when I get round to re-potting my tree and the ratios I used. We can track the progress of the trees.

I may dial back the peat moss a little and ramp up the fine pine bark, which, all things being equal should satisfy keeping the roots more aerated but with similar acidity.

21
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Mangosteen seeds germination help
« on: August 13, 2024, 03:25:21 PM »
I managed to pick up a bag of purple mangosteens (Garcinia mangostana) from a street seller in Chiapas and kept the seeds after devouring the fruit.  After two weeks I have 6 of the 12 seeds I collected showing some sprouting.  Pretty happy that I may get some companion plants to my two foot high Mangosteen.

However, I am curious if anyone has a suggestion for type of soil to add the germinating seeds to? Or should I just bung each of them in some HP Pro Mix with a little added worm humus and perlite?

22
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 13, 2024, 01:58:42 PM »
I have 3 miracle berry trees (1 small leaf and the other two have larger leaves). The smaller leaf plant went yellow leaf on me and it's been like this for 2 years. I did everything I could - repotted it with fresh peat, watered it exclusively with rain water and ascorbic acid powder...nothing helped. The larger leaf plants are as green and health as can be. I think the smaller leaf ones are just weaker in general. It did give me a heck of a crop 2 years ago before going all sickly.

Hi Sir Graftalot (great name btw), I am actually unsure which variety I have, but going by photos I have seen of the trees of many others, I would guess a small leaf variety. So perhaps it is a weaker tree, though I would think not helped by our volatile climatic swings and my inexperience with this type of tree. I'm not prepared to give up on it yet, as at a metre + tall, she isn't a cheap thing to replace like for like in size.

23
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 13, 2024, 01:53:24 PM »
Can you take a close up pic of your potted soil and the leaves of your plant?

1/3. I would have said it's a pH issue if it was only the coir/peat you we're using to adjust but I also use sulfur for mine and that should be more than enough. When I bought mine, it was looking rough. Brown leaf tips we're the primary symptom. This persisted regardless of changes to pH when I added sulfur pellets. Repotting to new soil that I mixed myself was the first thing that started turning things around for my plant. I found that the 15 gal pot it came in was filled about 1/3 full (and was instructed not to fill it more because it didn't like too much soil). But the real problem was that the soil it DID have, was pure, condensed sludgy silt that could not drain well if the pot had 50 holes in it. For soil, I mix peat moss, perlite, and a combination of soil amendments that are primarily a combo of coir/composted forest products, bark fines manure/worm casings. But err on the side of light and not heavy so, like, 50-60% Peat, 10-20% perlite, and the rest (30-40% max) denser organics that break down over time. My #1 problem before anything else was to check if the soil was sludgy and to correct that.

2. Not in my experience. I had to wash off the almost silt-like sludge from the pot it came in which I was so adamant in removing that i just washed the entire root system off under my tap and planted into better soil. Seemed to appreciate the change without any shock. Started putting out new growth almost immediately.

4. If the problem persists even after improving soil drainage, then it's likely a humidity issue. Trickier to solve but doable if you want to go crazy and build your own greenhouse enclosure.

Hope this helps!

Hi Aristolochia,

Thank you for your well thought out response!  Some of what you say does tally with what I initially wrote. As you requested, below my musings here are some images. The soil even near the roots on the surface does look "cloying" so I reckon a soil overhaul will be needed. Some other ramblings:

I do have peat, perlite, some decently composted leaf litter, coconut coir, composted chicken manure, and fine pine bark available, so will follow your advice and mix up a similar ratio to you.  Additionally, at present, we are consistently over the 70% humidity range 24hrs a day and will be for the next 2 to 3 months, so I am not too worried about that for now. Lastly, I'll try not to worry about the shock of cleaning off the roots from any silty sludge. At this point, I don't think I can make things much more worse, other than death of the pant, which it is slowly on it's way to anyhow if I don't change things.

Photos:










24
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Miracle Fruit Advice Requested
« on: August 13, 2024, 01:25:43 AM »
I'm not a big fan of starting a new topic for every question when I think adding it to an existing thread helps consolidate useful information. However, the last thread I could find labelled for Miracle Fruit advice turned into a bit of a snipefest. Even the forum code suggested I open a new thread instead of replying to the older one. So anyhow, here goes...

I have a metre or so tall Miracle Fruit tree in a roughly 15 gallon pot that I planted around a year ago. for the best part of time it did well, and when it started to look a bit iffy, I managed to perk it up with some acidifying fertilizer and got a decent berry harvest for the second time. However, it soon started to look sick again, which I initially put down to our crazy record-breaking hot dry season this past spring. However, two solid months into rainy season and it still isn't looking great.

Some background. I potted it with a mix of perlite, local topsoil, compost, and peat moss.  Our local soil is very alkaline and tends to clay up when wet.  The well water that is used to irrigate it during drier spells is also very alkaline. I've been religiously giving coffee grounds, sulfur, and measuring the pH to get it into optimal range, plus occasional weak compost tea and foliar sprays, so I am thinking I have other issues.

So what next?  In my opinion I think that the soil has sludged up, or salt/saline conditions are taking over.  I drilled lots of big holes to the pot to help drainage, but I think the roots are just too wet still.  Sadly I think I will need to pull it from it's pot and try to repot it with a cleaner mixture.

My questions are:

1) Am I even on the right track with my thoughts?  Can I try something else before going defcon 1?  I'll try to add a photo of the tree/leaves tomorrow
2) I heard that Miracle Fruit get upset very easy when the roots are disturbed. How would I go about cleaning up any sludgy mess should I find it?
3) Related to #2, is there any suggested substrate mix which will avoid using my local crappy topsoil?  I have most ingredients one could need, so it would be about putting these into an applicable mixture.
4) Am I crazy even trying? She's an already decent sized tree and don't want to give up on it.

Thank you in advance of any replies.

25
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Medjool Dates
« on: August 07, 2024, 09:37:34 PM »
Have several Medjool seedlings growing well here in Yucatan as an experiment. Long way to go with them but seems they'll likely never ripen properly due to the summer humidity. We do have long very hot dry seasons in spring, and remain warm to extremely hot all year. Can't imagine me getting too far with them as we are also prone to flooding. Just a fun little project for me for now.

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