Mango topworking - what to do with all the new chutes?

[Cookie Monster]

Water sprouts do have a higher rate of take in my experience, especially if you graft them when they are red stage or still green. Then getting the buds to spring can be troublesome on veneered grafts to mature wood unless you head back the branch.

You can graft them even when they are in red stage. They look a little on the thin side, so you may have to wait for them to thicken up in order to match the thickness of your budwood. Eliminating some shoots will help direct energy to the ones that are left.

Sayyid - you probably could have bark grafted on that tree without cutting it back.  Those limbs are not that large.

I tried veneering on two of the horizontal branches, one seems to be taking.
I can go back to the failed branch and try bark grafting though instead of waiting for shoots. I'll let you know how it works out.

Since I'm not that experienced with grafting yet i figured i also try the water shoot method since it seems to have a high percentage of success.

[skhan]

Jeff will do,

The cut i made is just above waist height (maybe 6"-12").
This is in the front yard so I would like a tree that has a slightly higher canopy to walk under and keep an eye out for 2 legged bandits.
I would like to put 3 varieties on the tree, should i just graft the 3 to the water shoots and eventually get rid of the lower branches. ( i know this will require more pruning, I willing to maintain it though)
I think i'm going to go with Peach Cobbler, Dupuis and Lemon Zest.

As for the Lancetilla top working I really want Venus. If i can put another late or early season on it to that would be great but if not I'm happy with just Venus 

Thanks Rob and Alex for answering all of my annoying question on growth habits, vigor and whatnot.

[skhan]

Heres an updated pic after i removed all put three shoots.


Its in between an pencil and a sharpie in terms of thickness

I managed to find time to get some scions today, not the best timing i know. Any additional advice
Can i proceed and veneer to the shoot, or wait and store the scions? (whats the best way to store scions and for how long?)

[simon_grow]

The fresher the scions, the better your chance of success. Also, if you are new to grafting, you may want to put on 2-3 grafts of each variety for every one you want to take. I prefer to graft the same day I take the scions whenever possible.

Simon

[skhan]

The fresher the scions, the better your chance of success. Also, if you are new to grafting, you may want to put on 2-3 grafts of each variety for every one you want to take. I prefer to graft the same day I take the scions whenever possible.

Simon

Thanks Simon,
I'm still getting the hang of grafting so I guess to increase my chances i'll do it today.

I have 2 scions of LZ, Peach Cobbler, and Dupuis.
Only 3 shoots though, so i'll veneer or bark graft the rest.

[gunnar429]

The fresher the scions, the better your chance of success. Also, if you are new to grafting, you may want to put on 2-3 grafts of each variety for every one you want to take. I prefer to graft the same day I take the scions whenever possible.

Simon

Thanks Simon,
I'm still getting the hang of grafting so I guess to increase my chances i'll do it today.

I have 2 scions of LZ, Peach Cobbler, and Dupuis.
Only 3 shoots though, so i'll veneer or bark graft the rest.

As Jeff said previously, be careful when wrapping the grafts as the new growth can snap off rather easily.  I remember being happy last summer that it seemed like I finally got the hang of it only to realize that the mother tree and scion were grafted together...and in my hand, no longer connected to the tree 

[Cookie Monster]

That's perfect for grafting. And, timing is perfect. Veneer graft towards the base of those shoots and wrap with parafilm. In 2 weeks, you'll see some callous forming on the scion, and in 3 if it's still green, you can chop the top of the rootstock, leaving a leaf or two on the rootstock shoot.

Heres an updated pic after i removed all put three shoots.


Its in between an pencil and a sharpie in terms of thickness

I managed to find time to get some scions today, not the best timing i know. Any additional advice
Can i proceed and veneer to the shoot, or wait and store the scions? (whats the best way to store scions and for how long?)

[skhan]

Sorry for the crappy picture, we had to go out there in between the rain.


Buddy tape does not work that well when its wet.

[Cookie Monster]

Looks good. Let us know how it goes.

Sorry for the crappy picture, we had to go out there in between the rain.


Buddy tape does not work that well when its wet.

[skhan]

It still to early to know if the first grafts will take but at least here still green.

Heres the Lancetilla shoot in the back.
Its already pushing a second flush and the first are stlll semi-red. Is this normal
Also some of the shoot don't look too healthy


Maybe next week a few shoot should be ready...I hope

[skhan]

Update to the VP topworking project


LZ is pushing and i just checked today and it seems like over night the Dupuis pushed too

[Cookie Monster]

Good work. As soon as the grafts start pushing new growth, you can cut the rootstock shoots back. You will need to tip the newly grafted shoots at roughly every 18 inches of growth (usually 2 growths); otherwise, you'll end up with leggy and vigorous growth.

Update to the VP topworking project


LZ is pushing and i just checked today and it seems like over night the Dupuis pushed too

[skhan]

Good work. As soon as the grafts start pushing new growth, you can cut the rootstock shoots back. You will need to tip the newly grafted shoots at roughly every 18 inches of growth (usually 2 growths); otherwise, you'll end up with leggy and vigorous growth.

Update to the VP topworking project


LZ is pushing and i just checked today and it seems like over night the Dupuis pushed too

Jeff, thanks for tutoring me through the whole thing. Im not out the woods yet though.
Whens a good time to cut back the nursing/shade branches?

I cut back the vertical section a little bit higher than waster height because i wanted to have clearance for the cars as its right next to the drive way)
Definitely will be tipping.

In other news, I'm slowly converting my front yard Keitt to Cac, anyone have a suggestion of a variety i can pair with it?
Its in the front yard so anything but red will do, I was thinking Pineapple Pleasure

[Guanabanus]

I have never tried the grafting onto tender red water shoots of mango that Jeff describes here--- I'm intrigued!

[skhan]

Here it is after 3 weeks.

I'll cut off the remain part of the branch Dupuis is grafted to
Peach cobbler poked through the buddy tape.
The Lemon Zest has a nice red flush

[skhan]

Heres a update.
Sorry for the bad picture. I'll post another one soon


All of the grafts are pushing another flush so its looking good.

[simon_grow]

Great job, it's going to be a nice cocktail mango tree.

Simon

[DurianLover]

Update to the VP topworking project

I think it's too crowded, three varieties with different growth habits on a single stem.  Besides surrounding branches are VP and they have not been changed. I have to guess VP will envelope and basically burry the centre portion alive with its vigor. Those three in the middle will likely struggle for sunlight and space.

[skhan]

A better picture taking this morning
Finally decided the time was right to remove all the nursing branches

[bsbullie]

I would have kept the other limbs on as a shade protector for a while longer.  Those new grafts are gonna have to withstand some hot blazing sun which is not the greatest for them.

Also,  as stated above, you should have put a single variety, each on its own scaffold branch (with more than three b e anches, you could have put say one variety on two of the scaffold branches which would have increased the yield and filled out the tree better) instead of all three on the same.  Live and learn for the future.

[Guanabanus]

Also the leaves on those branches were keeping the roots well fed.

[skhan]

Update to the VP topworking project

I think it's too crowded, three varieties with different growth habits on a single stem.  Besides surrounding branches are VP and they have not been changed. I have to guess VP will envelope and basically burry the centre portion alive with its vigor. Those three in the middle will likely struggle for sunlight and space.

I agree, normally that would be the case but i consulted the local experts to find tree with similar growth habits and vigor.
Peach Cobbler, Lemon Zest and Dupuis all have high vigor and a upright growth habit. (Also since this is in my front yard I wanted all the fruits to be green or yellow)

I left on the surrounding branches as nursing branches and to provide shade for the grafts. The new picture posted a few minutes ago shows all but one removed. I left one on for a bit long as a guard so I don't bump into the new grafts by accident

@simon
Thanks, first time trying. Jeff's method works great.

[bsbullie]

Also the leaves on those branches were keeping the roots well fed.

Yup, forgot to mention the obvious.

[skhan]

I would have kept the other limbs on as a shade protector for a while longer.  Those new grafts are gonna have to withstand some hot blazing sun which is not the greatest for them.

Also,  as stated above, you should have put a single variety, each on its own scaffold branch (with more than three b e anches, you could have put say one variety on two of the scaffold branches which would have increased the yield and filled out the tree better) instead of all three on the same.  Live and learn for the future.

I assumed that topping the trunk and grafting using Jeff's method would just make 3 new scaffold branch for the future. I wanted to raise the canopy up a bit too. Always next time i guess Live and learn indeed...
I guess my impatiences got the better of me 

[skhan]

Also the leaves on those branches were keeping the roots well fed.

Great point...
I should've of stuck to my guns and continued to slowly remove them.

On the bright side, at least i made remove for some of the new zills