Yangmei (Morella/Myrica rubra) thread

[Eggo]

Unfortunately you guys are correct.  Mine still had those plastic tape grafts on them and as unwrap them and inspected further they were all failed grafts.  So not really 3 males, just 3 seedlings hopefully one of them is a male.

[elouicious]

They are confirmed males IIRC

Presumably female seedlings do not need to be grafted and are grown out as true trees but who knows

[simon_grow]

So here's my guess about how to make male DongKui plants. You take a lot of seedlings, graft DongKui onto all of them, wait a while to see which ones took. The ones that took are female DongKui, the ones that failed are male DongKui. Then you recommend growers buy 6 male plants per 100 females so they'll have actual males.

Fang, that is a very plausible explanation.

On a side note, the hunt for male trees is no longer a limiting factor for our shared dream of fruiting Yangmei in our orchards. There are plenty of male and female trees out there and even if half of them don’t make it, there should still be hundreds of trees that will survive.

What I’ve experienced is that Yangmei is difficult to recover from bare rooting but once it recovers, it grows like a weed.

We should start focusing on gathering data about the different varieties, when they bloom, how long till fruit maturation, fruit size, fruit quality, etc…

I will post some new articles/videos or re post some of the articles I may have posted in another thread and discuss some important points regarding Yangmei.

Simon

[simon_grow]

My 3 males appears grafted.  All 3 appears to be pushing growth.

The nematodes issue is unfortunate and a headache to think about.  I began treatment on them.  I just hope I haven't contaminated my yard with root knot nematodes.

It’s good that you treated already, the sooner you treat, the better. After chemical treatment, let the chemicals wash out and then I highly recommend multiple inoculations with beneficial nematodes that attack RKN.

Simon

[simon_grow]

My guess is the named males are a mix of seedlings of named cultivars, and some of the male trees may have been grafted from proven males.

Rob and Nate,

That mss as he’s sense as well. The grafted males must be males that are proven to produce good pollen, perhaps it’s the male trees they use at the local orchards for their pollination.

Simon

[simon_grow]

Males are seedlings,

some of them have failed female grafts on them, This was confirmed by Bill for at least the first order

as for the cultivar, you eat the fruit, you plant the seed, it is either male of female of that cultivar

Based on the level of trees we were ordering I am betting these are grown as monocrops in various areas and intervariant pollination, while possible, is unlikely

Bloom times would likely align better with a male and female of each cultivar but I am not sure how long the bloom season is and whether or not this is really anything to be concerned about

If they are seedlings Dongkui for example, how do they know if it’s male or female? The rootstocks appear to be 2-3 years old and some of the literature says that it could take up to 10 years to fruit although some may bloom much earlier than that.

Whatever the male trees are, it will be very interesting to track their progress and document their bloom times.

Simon

[Jaboticaba45]

Everything has buds on it…I believe my factors of success is the timing (spring) with the parafilm with the greenhouse. I have them up on a table and sitting in buckets/trays so no wormies escape. What worries me is I potted them up and watered them…then I sat them down on the greenhouse floor and water (just a little) was probably dripping out. I don’t think they spread though?? Anyways I’m going to try to treat them. I heard you can send off a sample to the state ag department for testing ($25 per sample here) or you can take some soil you think has worms and plant melons in it…after three weeks there should be galls/no galls on the melon roots. My soil is heavy clay so the worms should have trouble anyway. I read that the hapla sp. of worms do better in cooler climates… whereas the others like warmer climates. (Ca and Fl)

[simon_grow]

Congratulations on your success! Feel free to post pictures on this thread.

One word of caution is that if you’re using parafilm or Buddytape to hold in the moisture, I remove the film as soon as I start seeing buds. I like to remove the film before they brake through because they form so many buds, it becomes extremely difficult to remove the film later on.

Simon

[simon_grow]

Here is a link that shows Morella rubra and it’s close relatives. Notice that M. adenophora and M. nana are more closely related than Cerifera. Out of the Morella Genus, rubra is said to produce the best there fruit but some of its close relatives may also produce some excellent quality fruit. There may be some good genetic material to work with if someone wanted to improve the eating qualities of Yangmei or if there was a need to improve disease or pest resistance.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Bayesian-phylogeny-and-divergence-time-estimation-of-Morella-Node1-and-node2-represent_fig10_282568640

Simon
 

[simon_grow]

This Australian article has lots of great information and data points from plants grown in China. Of special interest is the timeline of root growth, shoot growth, physiological/morphological flower bud differentiation, flowering and ripening times.

Most of the literature out there shows that Yangmei typically grow in acidic soils but so far my plants have been able to handle my hard city water and soils that are higher in pH.

https://www.agrifutures.com.au/wp-content/uploads/publications/05-081.pdf

Simon

[simon_grow]

Here is a rare Yangmei video with English subtitles.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NLLjHjiUM9E

Simon

[roblack]

This Australian article has lots of great information and data points from plants grown in China. Of special interest is the timeline of root growth, shoot growth, physiological/morphological flower bud differentiation, flowering and ripening times.

Most of the literature out there shows that Yangmei typically grow in acidic soils but so far my plants have been able to handle my hard city water and soils that are higher in pH.

https://www.agrifutures.com.au/wp-content/uploads/publications/05-081.pdf

Simon

So far, Biqi is growing nicely on high ph limestone with thin layer of soil.

[nattyfroootz]

Here is a link that shows Morella rubra and it’s close relatives. Notice that M. adenophora and M. nana are more closely related than Cerifera. Out of the Morella Genus, rubra is said to produce the best there fruit but some of its close relatives may also produce some excellent quality fruit. There may be some good genetic material to work with if someone wanted to improve the eating qualities of Yangmei or if there was a need to improve disease or pest resistance.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Bayesian-phylogeny-and-divergence-time-estimation-of-Morella-Node1-and-node2-represent_fig10_282568640

Simon

I'm excited to work M. esculenta into my block and hopefully do some crosses

[simon_grow]

This Australian article has lots of great information and data points from plants grown in China. Of special interest is the timeline of root growth, shoot growth, physiological/morphological flower bud differentiation, flowering and ripening times.

Most of the literature out there shows that Yangmei typically grow in acidic soils but so far my plants have been able to handle my hard city water and soils that are higher in pH.

https://www.agrifutures.com.au/wp-content/uploads/publications/05-081.pdf

Simon

So far, Biqi is growing nicely on high ph limestone with thin layer of soil.

Rob, that’s great news. This is the kind of data that we need to keep track. If we can get specific soil pH values, that would be even better. This will be important when our trees start producing fruit. I want to compare yields and fruit quality between trees grown in different pH soils.

Rob, in your limestone soil, you may want to give occasional drenches of chelated iron and when it comes time to fruiting, you may want a bit of Boron in your fertilizer regimen.

Simon

[roblack]

Thanks Simon! I have those on hand and will experiment.

Have been meaning to have soil analyzed anyway. Will share results when finally get around to it.

[simon_grow]

Here is a link that shows Morella rubra and it’s close relatives. Notice that M. adenophora and M. nana are more closely related than Cerifera. Out of the Morella Genus, rubra is said to produce the best there fruit but some of its close relatives may also produce some excellent quality fruit. There may be some good genetic material to work with if someone wanted to improve the eating qualities of Yangmei or if there was a need to improve disease or pest resistance.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Bayesian-phylogeny-and-divergence-time-estimation-of-Morella-Node1-and-node2-represent_fig10_282568640

Simon

I'm excited to work M. esculenta into my block and hopefully do some crosses

Nate, you are a great resource and it will be awesome to see some Rubra hybrids. I’m betting some of the Yangmei varieties out there are already hybrids because M rubra is generally considered diocious but some varieties produce both male and female flowers so sometime ago, they may have been natural crosses with species like M faya that have been found, sometimes, to be monoecious.

Check out this link

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/277028420_Genetic_diversity_of_male_and_female_Chinese_bayberry_Myrica_rubra_populations_and_identification_of_sex-associated_markers/fulltext/582f439f08ae102f072f3331/Genetic-diversity-of-male-and-female-Chinese-bayberry-Myrica-rubra-populations-and-identification-of-sex-associated-markers.pdf?origin=publication_detail

Simon

[roblack]

Tested soil with bs ph meter.

Tried FF Ocean Forest for test. ph reading was 7.0. Online lists ph levels as 6.3 - 6.8

Soil in my yard is registering as 8.0 - 9.0, but I don't trust this meter much. 

Hard to say how much the roots have grown beyond the dirt filled holes. As they get into the limestone more, could see some issues. Will be interesting to see how other varieties fare as well. WuSu will be the next going in-ground.

[simon_grow]

Hey Rob,

The stick meters with the moisture/pH meters are not very accurate.

If your soil pH is truly 8-9, you may want to try grafting onto Cerifera and Californica sooner rather than later. At least your plants are looking great so far!

Simon

[pinkturtle]

My multi grafted and rooted cutting from Jan's ordered.  4 out 8 for grafted and 1 out 5 for cuttings.  Some of the cuttings still green.

[K-Rimes]

Glad to see some signs of life here. I’m being patient and not watering much or fertilizing. It’s taking awhile compared to others but I’m ok to be a little slow.

[pinkturtle]

Grafted 8 cuttings with March ordered with 2 CM rootstocks.  8 of them are swelling, a lot faster than the Jan's ordered.  Maybe warmer weather help.

[pinkturtle]

Only BC show grow for the March's ordered.

[simon_grow]

Pinkturtle, that’s great progress on your plants so far. Having these Yangmei grafted onto alternative rootstocks should prevent the RKN from spreading assuming the rootstocks are clean.

K-Rimes, that last one looks dead. Hopefully your other ones will pull through.

Simon

[K-Rimes]

It is dead up top, but green bark below on that last one. Hoping for good luck and it pulls through

[jtnguyen333]

So from the first buy of 2022

Late Growing..I made the mistake of putting it outside too early.  I  put it under shade outside with direct sun for 3 hours a day and the bud shriveled.  It is now back indoor.


Biqi..same mistake with late growing too much outside direct sun early.  Now it is under shade but outdoor.



Dong Kui Female is growing beautifully.  It is outdoor under shaded and also being shaded by a potted avocado plant. 



As for the second buy, only Dong Kui Male is showing bud growth and ready to leaf out.  The others .. the buds are swelling but no leaf so far.