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Messages - cgbills

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Mango not receiving full sun in winter
« on: June 30, 2024, 07:41:21 PM »
I have a spot in front of my house where I would like to place a big busy mango like a CAC to provide blockage of the view of the street. The only thing is this spot does not receive full sun all year long. In the winter, late fall, and early spring it does not get full sun, but still receives a few hrs a day during these times. Would this really effect growth since it is mainly during when the tree is dormant? When we talk about full sun, do we mean year round or just during the growing/fruiting season?

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I am looking for a CAC mango in or around Vero Beach.

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I am looking for Duncan, Pickering and Honey kiss scions for a grafting project. Looking to get 3-4 per. Located on FL treasure coast.

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CG, the grafting questions are above my pay grade since I am not an expert grafter. But I'll answer regarding the tree shape. The trouble with the "V" is the angle not the branching itself. Some day half of the entire fruit load for the tree plus all the weight of half the canopy will be pulling on each half of that "V". That is a lot of stress and tension. I've seen many lychee trees in our grove which had that shape break in half over the years and others have posted the same for mango. If the branch is at a wider angle (closer to 90 instead of 45), the weight pulls down instead of out (if you follow me) and its not typically an issue. Its possible that the tree will never get a high enough fruit load to cause that to happen, but its definitely a risk.

Ok so the main issue is how much load each of the first main branches is carrying, not so much how far down the trunk it is. With that then, is three main branches from the trunk considered enough to bear the weight of the tree and fruit? It probably depends on how much fruit we are talking about, but several of my trees’ first splits are into three main branches.

I guess I will go ahead and deal with these V shapes. I have these two and a young M4 in the back that need straightened out.

Also, on the question of grafting. I have seen a video from Dr. Campbell where top worked a tree. He did so by cutting it to a stump and grafting 3 scions directly to the stump just under the bark. Admittedly he said it was kind of a drastic form of grafting. Is this type of grafting less likely to take vs grafting further up into more green wood?

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This first question maybe a little unrelated to my first post, but I feel it is worth asking. Don’t we want to encourage more branching, and don’t you want several strong branches to make up the central structure of the tree? Are you saying there is an issue here because these V’s are low and technically are the trunk, forming a co-dominant union? If that is the case, How far above the ground is it ok to allow such a V shape and or branching? At what point does it stop being co-dominant and just becomes branching?

Regarding choosing a winner and pruning the loser side. How close to the trunk should I cut the losing side? Should I try to cut the losing side as close to the trunk as possible to make it easier to heal over? Also should I put anything on the spot to promote healing and ward off infection? Or will it scab over and heal on its own?

Regarding the head back pruning and grafting. Are you recommending that I prune everything and go up to the first branching or first green wood, whichever comes first, and graft there? The first branching points are about 1.5 and 2 feet up respectively. If I prune it below the first branching and graft there, what type of graft should I use? Also could I graft 2 or 3 scions that far up to star forming the branches of the tree? Finally should I wrap anything showing green below the graft to help keep the rootstock from kicking out new growth?

Thanks for the help

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Is it possible to cut a few inches under the V and graft to the trunk there? To be honest there is only one of the 4 trees I would be interested in letting grow to see what it does. The one V trunk tree is growing really well and I kind of want to see what it does. If the others are not grafted, could I just make the initial cut below the V/collateral growth, then graft on there? Would grafting too low be a problem?

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When we moved into our house in September, there were three unknown potted mango trees that were left and one unknown mango tree in the ground. Since we had the space and I did not want these potted mangos to die, I went ahead and put the three unknown mangos in the ground near the previously planted unknown mango. All of them have been doing pretty well and kicking out a lot of new growth. One in particular is doing VERY well with a very nice bushy structure and many terminal ends; however, I am debating top working these into varieties that I know and want. Here are my thoughts.

First, I do not think two of these trees are grafted. As you can see from the pictures, two of the trees have growth tied off. I thought this could be growth from the root stock popping out, or maybe they are shoots from a poly embryonic seed they tried to stop. So do you think those tie offs are from grafting or from poly embryonic shoots? I know they were trying to do some work with trees and possibly selling as a nursery, so could they be root stock they were growing? Even if it is a graft, I do not know if it is the root stock or graft that “won” and which is growing

Second, the other two trees have a nice V structure, but I cannot tell if these are grafts either. These second two are the ones that are doing the best, but idk if they are grafted or from seed. Do you think these V shaped trees are double grafts or just grown from seed?

My main concern with just letting these 4 trees go is I will be waiting 7-10 year to get fruit if they are not grafted. It maybe cool to just let them go and see what I get, as I have several other trees; however, it would be a long time to let them grow, possibly fruit, then have to wait for new grafts to produce if the original fruit is bad. The whole thing ultimately is not a huge issue as I have several other trees, but I am trying to plan things out. The main corse of action I am leaning towards is grafting/top working the two trees that have the shoots tied off and let the other two V shaped bushy trees go. Thoughts?











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Just picked up a box. Nice guy and knowledgeable. Buy with confidence

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Tropical Fruit Buy, Sell & Trade / WTB mangos Treasure Coast, FL
« on: June 10, 2024, 08:09:51 AM »
Looking to buy various mango fruit varieties around Vero Beach, FL. I am wanting to try out various varieties to see what other mango varieties I would like to plant.

Thank you

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Any more mangos ready? I live near you and can swing by

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I looked and did not see some of the toothpick looking frass as you described. I did see some spots of what I would describe as grains of sand clumped in a few spots. This was very small however and I couldn’t tell is it was something that came out of the trunk from boring, or if it was sand that had clumped together from splash from the potting soil. The one the thing that is making me think it could be laurel wilt is the color or the leaves. They are rolling under on themselves and are turning a dark purplish green or bluish green, also there is limping of the new branches.

These symptoms sound different than verticillium wilt which describes yellowing of the leaves and burnt tips.


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Are there any fruit trees that are resistant or immune to the wilt? I found one thing for the university of California that said bananas are. Are there any other fruit trees I could put in that spot that would be resistant?

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If it is Verticillium wilt, can it spread to my other avocados? Since it is still young, would it be worth removing it and putting in a different tree? I was thinking about increasing watering, then if that doesn’t work replace the tree. I would hate for it to spread. It was planted from a 3 gal a few months ago, so I don’t have a tone of time invested.

It is odd though because just a month or two ago it was doing so well and was flush with a ton of growth. I haven’t really changed anything in terms of care

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The soil is sandy. When I water twice a week, I do it with a hose and give a deep soak. This is my only avocado that is doing it. New growth on the other trees aren’t rolling like that.

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Anyone have a Tommy Atkins mango?
« on: June 02, 2024, 12:30:50 PM »
I wanted to round out my mango collection with a few big producing, disease resistant, vigorous mango trees. The intent with these is reliable food production for the family. I already have Valencia Pride, Glenn, Keitt, NDM, O-15, Carrie, Coconut Cream, M4 and Sweet tart, but was looking for another tree like the VP that would be a big producer. I know everyone looks down on the Tommy Atkins, but I have heard that they are a lot better when grown at home and allowed to ripen properly. I was thinking about getting one to have a solid, no hassle producer. Thoughts? Also any other recommendations for big, disease resistant producers like VP and Tommy Atkins? I have also been thinking about CAC, Florigon, Bailey’s Marvel and maybe something like Maha Chanok (do these guys fit the bill?)

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / What is wrong with my brogdon avocado?
« on: June 02, 2024, 12:16:23 PM »
Trying to figure out what is going on with my brogdon avocado. I put it in the ground several months ago from a 3 gallon. It did well at first showing abundant new growth. It was one of the best that I put in the ground. Now almost all that new growth is drooping and curling. The leaves do not seem dry, spotted or crunch, just droopy and curling. I water twice a week and have been fertilizing once a month with 6-4-6 mango and avocado fertilizer. I haven’t changed anything of my care since I first planted. My one thought is with the increased sun, that maybe effecting it. Another thought was maybe over watering. Any input is appreciated






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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Mango panicle with leaves and flowers?
« on: May 07, 2024, 02:00:39 PM »
I have a larger grafted Nam Doc Mai I planted. Since hasn’t even been in the ground a year, I am pruning panicles as recommended (leaving a little of the panicle so a new one doesn’t start). However the tree kicked out several long, thick panicles that developed flowers and leaves out of the same spot. Is this long, thick, pink panicle actually going to turn into a branch? I went ahead and trim this panicle with leaves and flowers, but should I not have? Do mangos sometimes kick out a mix of flowers and leaves on what will be permanent branches? I had another equally long and thick panicle with only flowers

Please note on the picture, some of the flowers were cut off. You can see the nubs right above the leaves



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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Victoria Avocado variety
« on: March 28, 2024, 10:19:19 PM »
Thank you so much for the info. It is always fascinating to hear the story of how different varieties came about. Would you say it is a vigorous grower or more on the dwarf side? How does it compare in size and growth to other varieties? Trying to think about where I would put the tree. Thanks again for the help

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Victoria Avocado variety
« on: March 28, 2024, 02:07:39 PM »
Does anyone know anything about Victoria Avocado trees or have any experience with them? My local nursery has some, but I cannot seem to find any info on them

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We all know that it is important to prune mango and avocado flowers/small fruit the first few years to allow the roots to establish themselves. My question is, what other of the big tropical fruits should you do the same. For example, you do not hear people talking about not letting starfruit bear fruit the first couple years. Should you apply the same principle of mangos and avocados to things like sapodilla, sapote, starfruit, mamey, jackfruit, lychee, etc.

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Banana variety tastes
« on: March 27, 2024, 08:34:30 AM »
We are looking at doing a bed/area of banana trees. My wife was thinking of just doing cavendish bananas, but I was thinking we should grow some things we don’t get in the store. So first question is what are some of your favorite banana varieties based on taste? Size isn’t a big issue but probably would like to stay around the 6-7 foot range. Second question is does anyone know a good place to try several different varieties that is semi close to the treasure coast? I think if we could taste a few different varieties, then maybe we would want more than the cavendish.

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Maria vs Maria Black Avocado
« on: March 27, 2024, 08:21:49 AM »
It is a small 3 gallon, so it is the usual lime green. There really isn’t any new growth on it yet

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Maria vs Maria Black Avocado
« on: March 25, 2024, 12:25:09 PM »
https://everglades.farm/products/maria-avocado-tree-grafted-from-florida

That is the link that I found that says Maria and vigorous growth

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Maria vs Maria Black Avocado
« on: March 25, 2024, 09:16:27 AM »
I was at my local garden store and they had some 3 gallon avocado trees labeled “Maria”. Not “Maria B”, but just “Maria”. I went ahead and pick one up assuming it was a Maria Black that I have heard a lot about; however, after getting it home and looking more into it, it seems there may actually be just a Maria avocado that is different from Maria Black. Everglades trees lists a Maria avocado that show as a vigorous grower, vs what I know of a Maria Black being a dwarf. I have space for it either way, so it’s going in the ground. I just want to know if there is actually a Maria and if that is what I got. I may go back and ask the place I purchased it and ask where they got the shipment of trees from

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In my planting of mango and avocado, I have planted different varieties to span the season and have fruit more of the year. I have been looking into sapodilla and see the same thing can be done with them. Can anyone recommend 3 or so tree varieties that will of set each other and allow for more fruit throughout the year? Space really isn’t an issue, just concerned about productivity and spacing out the fruiting seasons.

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