Author Topic: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer  (Read 2627 times)

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2021, 02:36:01 PM »
No. This is a sugar apple (annona squamosa) x custard apple ( annona reticulata) and custard apple( .reticulata) x sugar apple (a. squamosa)….. no annona cherimola
« Last Edit: September 14, 2021, 02:37:43 PM by JF »

Acetogenin

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2021, 07:20:26 PM »
Still an atemoya
No need for redundant names

kh0110

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2021, 08:27:18 PM »
Saramuyo is basically what is known here as Sugarlata, a cross between Sugar Apple and Annona Reticulata aka Custard Apple.

Cherimoya has nothing to do here, so not Atemoya which is a cross between Sugar Apple (Annona Squamosa) and Cherimoya (Annona Cherimola).


Thera

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2021, 09:39:05 PM »
No it’s not an Atemoya you have no idea what yr talking about.

BestDay

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2021, 11:11:38 PM »
Thanks for clearing that up.  All these annona get scrambled up in my head.

Bill

sytanta

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #30 on: September 14, 2021, 11:33:32 PM »
I believe this is a hybrid of SA & CA. The fruit skin looks much bolder than any sugar apples. Frank do you have some pics of its leaves?

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2021, 12:18:51 PM »










This is in the rescue saramuyo station

sytanta

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #32 on: September 15, 2021, 12:31:39 PM »
Thanks Frank, in the 2nd pic, leaves sure look like a hybrid of A. squamosa and A. reticulata but more of the A. reticulata while the fruit is almost of A. squamosa, very interesting!

achetadomestica

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #33 on: September 15, 2021, 12:33:12 PM »
Those pictures are incredible. That tree is HUGE!
I know you have explained this before So there are sugar
apples, custard apples, and crosses growing in the same vicinity?
How big is the area? Is it private land and was this all someone's project
or all naturally occurring? How long have these trees been crossing?

This is a picture of the sugarlata fruit that Painter created. It is a seedling
from his fruit. The texture looks similar to your fruit in the first pictures?







JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #34 on: September 15, 2021, 02:54:02 PM »
Mayans have been selecting saramuyos for eons like the Inkas with cherimoyas. Unfortunately saramoyos ,like canistel and many other native fruits, has loss it’s status but they are trying to make a comeback with the government saramuyo rescue project.

BestDay

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2021, 04:25:38 PM »
Is the Yucatán Titán Rojo, a sugar apple?  Or is that also a Saramuyo?

Thanks,
Bill

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #36 on: September 15, 2021, 06:17:52 PM »
Is the Yucatán Titán Rojo, a sugar apple?  Or is that also a Saramuyo?

Thanks,
Bill

Yucatán Titán Rojo Is a saramuyo but I have red and green sugar apple also




Acetogenin

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2021, 06:49:50 PM »
No it’s not an Atemoya you have no idea what yr talking about.

Fine then sugarlata if genetics are half sugar apple half reticulata….prior poster said it was part cherimoya but apparently other saying it is not.  For what it’s worth it does look like a sugarlata.  Still no need to make duplicate names.  There are already too many duplicate annoying names in annona world like “custard apple”.  Soon the annona world might end up like the garcinia nomenclature

Guanabanus

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #38 on: September 15, 2021, 07:58:33 PM »
When I visited Yucatan several times decades ago, small regular sugar-apples were called Saramuyo in Merida.  Go a few towns down the road, and names will be used differently.  It it has been popularized now to call just big-fruited varieties that there, or here in the USA, fine.

The big special fruits were then called "injerto."  Though this word should mean "graft", the conversations seemed to be about hybrids.
These looked similar to what is being called Giant Yucatan, and similar names here on the forum.  We used one that we called "M-1" in breeding trials.
We were always up front about not knowing its classification: strange sugar-apple, other species, hybrid, or ancestral form.

Har

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #39 on: September 15, 2021, 09:28:29 PM »
When I visited Yucatan several times decades ago, small regular sugar-apples were called Saramuyo in Merida.  Go a few towns down the road, and names will be used differently.  It it has been popularized now to call just big-fruited varieties that there, or here in the USA, fine.

The big special fruits were then called "injerto."  Though this word should mean "graft", the conversations seemed to be about hybrids.
These looked similar to what is being called Giant Yucatan, and similar names here on the forum.  We used one that we called "M-1" in breeding trials.
We were always up front about not knowing its classification: strange sugar-apple, other species, hybrid, or ancestral form.

The hybrid here are called saramoyos and INIFAP has a large selection of top tier saramuyos in the rescue station which are commercially propagated all over the Yucatán peninsula. The smaller fruits which are easily recognize as sugar apples are called anonas or chirimoya. Here is a pix of a sugar apple tree and you can contrast the leaves with the pix above  in the field station.



« Last Edit: September 15, 2021, 11:46:31 PM by JF »

Mvule101

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #40 on: September 15, 2021, 11:47:42 PM »
Next month I am travelling to Mazatlan on the west coast of Mexico. Am I likely to find Sarumoyo or similar Annona available there?

Thanks

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #41 on: September 16, 2021, 11:58:27 AM »
You are not going to find many or any. Yucatán produce the most something like 500 tons that’s commercially. There few backyard trees over the city and the rural area in the Yucatan o
Península  but nothing like nances, mangos, caimito, sapotes etc ..maybe Raul or someone else  that lives in the west coast can chime in

Mvule101

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2021, 09:27:59 AM »
You are not going to find many or any. Yucatán produce the most something like 500 tons that’s commercially. There few backyard trees over the city and the rural area in the Yucatan o
Península  but nothing like nances, mangos, caimito, sapotes etc ..maybe Raul or someone else  that lives in the west coast can chime in

Ok Thanks

Dmaxx69

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #43 on: September 18, 2021, 11:43:31 AM »
Put me down for some saramoyo seeds please! That is if you are bringing them back to USA first, im still scarred from my ilama seeds getting confiscated a couple weeks ago. Mahalo

Gogu

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #44 on: September 19, 2021, 11:26:37 PM »
does CA stand for custard apple?

Guanabanus

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #45 on: September 20, 2021, 12:36:35 PM »
Yes, as in Annona reticulata (bullock's heart).
Har

JoeP450

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #46 on: September 25, 2021, 02:38:11 PM »
Hey Frank,

Just wanted to update you on the progress of the saramuyo seeds from a while back:

Dorado Yellow


Piste Red



Really looking forward to the fruit now as you rate them so high!

-Joe

JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #47 on: September 26, 2021, 02:46:03 PM »
Hi Joe
Dorado and Piste are CA x SA hybrids

Mikey

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #48 on: September 29, 2021, 11:32:26 PM »
Pictures below are seeds from JF, the foliage is that of a custard apple or biriba but the flowers are that of a sugar apple or Atemoya.




JF

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Re: Saramuyos; cherimoya killer
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2021, 11:04:17 AM »
Yes , Yucatán hybrids play tricks on yr mind. The leaves look like a smooth skin reticulata but the fruits are bumpy and large like an atemoya and vice versus.

 

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