Author Topic: Why young Chempadak plants die  (Read 5395 times)

Satha

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 383
    • Sri Lanka
    • View Profile
Why young Chempadak plants die
« on: June 18, 2017, 10:25:43 PM »
Dear Members,

Can someone tell me as to why young chempadak plants die without any reasons.

I know that many members have experienced this before. Like to share their views and as to how it could be avoided.



Paraponera

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 295
    • USA
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2017, 10:49:27 PM »
Well, I almost lost one in my greenhouse and I am pretty sure it was just too moist and (possibly the wrong pH due to the incorrect potting mixture I was using) where I had it so I took it out and put it in my yard and as I suspected old leaves were lost and new growth and leaves are thriving. Seems to me that there was a nutrient not available due to damaged roots or incorrect pH at the temp inside the greenhouse or both. I have to admit I did not look up the specs for this species before I germinated it, but rather used that of Jackfruit/Marianas Breadfruit as a guide so I could have done better if I had prepared beforehand.

~ Paraponera
"Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better."

Albert Einstein

Ethan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1644
    • Central California Z9/9
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2017, 11:20:24 PM »
I find chempedak more difficult than most artocarpus I've tried growing. Supposedly they do well when grafted on jack.

Paraponera

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 295
    • USA
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2017, 09:03:11 AM »
Good to know! :)
"Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better."

Albert Einstein

Satha

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 383
    • Sri Lanka
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2017, 10:10:59 AM »
Agree. But for that we should have at least one single tree no?. No chempadak trees in Sri Lanka.

rgds

Gouralata

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 232
  • fruit trees for warm and wet tropical climate
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2017, 11:02:27 AM »
Here in Reunion Island we use to plant the seeds directly in the ground to avoid them died during our cool winter or during the transplantation.

Gouralata

Chandramohan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 783
    • India, Kerala, Wynad
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2017, 12:30:20 PM »
I bought 5 chempedak seeds, all of them sprouted and after putting out 4 leaves all of them died!! Does any one know for what reason??

luc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2448
    • Mexico , Puerto Vallarta , Jalisco . 20 degr. North
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2017, 01:47:48 PM »
I bought 5 chempedak seeds, all of them sprouted and after putting out 4 leaves all of them died!! Does any one know for what reason??

That's the million dollar question . Over the years I brought back hundreds of seeds . Only one made it .
Luc Vleeracker
Puerto Vallarta
Mexico , Pacific coast.
20 degrees north

buddyguygreen

  • Keeper of Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 978
  • Zone Creator
    • Citrus Ridge, FL,
    • View Profile
    • Knowledge of the Masters
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2017, 04:02:58 PM »
Ive planted hundreds of seeds and tried every type of soil and growing conditions, also tried with seeds from many sources and had good germination rates but only 1 grew to about 2 feet and eventually died. I will still persist.

Cheena on the other hand grows great and easy with little care.

Satha

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 383
    • Sri Lanka
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2017, 10:40:41 PM »
This is a million dollar question. Can the Asian members advise us. I too am a Asian but in Sri Lanka no chempadak. The only possible reason may be PH value. I hope to plant seeds next time in coco peat without soil. Coco peat seems to be acidic. All seeds will sprout but when they develop 2 to 4 leaves they dry  off and die.

Can anyone sell me few seeds for me to try with coco peat.


arvind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 292
    • Malaysia
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2017, 08:48:46 PM »
This is a million dollar question. Can the Asian members advise us. I too am a Asian but in Sri Lanka no chempadak. The only possible reason may be PH value. I hope to plant seeds next time in coco peat without soil. Coco peat seems to be acidic. All seeds will sprout but when they develop 2 to 4 leaves they dry  off and die.

Can anyone sell me few seeds for me to try with coco peat.

Maybe humidity seems to be the factor? Which part of sri lanka are you located? Chempedak grows in humid places with high rainfall like in southern part of your country or in colombo which have high rainfall.maybe it could be ph too and areas with high ph tends to be located in drier region

Finca La Isla

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1874
    • Costa Rica, Southern Caribbean coast
    • View Profile
    • finca la isla
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2017, 09:09:48 PM »
As noted, the seeds germinate easily but then have trouble making the transition to be supported by their own root system.  I too have limited success but there are some that make it in a medium high in coco fiber.  Also, maybe a light and acidic mix like that used for azaleas could work.
With our champedek production we do have some volunteers. That are growing nicely but none ever establish right under the tree.
Peter

Lory

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 626
    • Cebu-Philippines 10 N
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2017, 09:40:36 PM »
I add myself to the list of chempedak disappointed.
I lost my battle after managing to let my seedlings survive for some months then i surrendered.
I never understood what is the real reason of that sudden death.
The only one thing evident ot me is  the fact that seedlings root sysstem is poor and underdeveloped and it can't sustain the plant as the seeds resources are depleted.
I'ts weird and sad!
Lorenzo

Mike T

  • Zone 12a
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8728
  • Cairns,Nth Qld, Australia
    • Zone 12a
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2017, 07:54:30 AM »
I have mentioned the sudden death syndrome of chempadak a few times in past threads. It isn't climate related and some varieties are more prone to it than others. Two people can get seeds from one fruit and they might all die for one person and all live from another. They die when the are small and transitioning to food from the seed to be self sustainable.
I am pretty sure it is soil related and probably due to soil fungus impacting the roots during a short window where they are most vulnerable.If the get to a foot high they seem to grow past the vulnerability and are just the same as young jackfruit.

Finca La Isla

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1874
    • Costa Rica, Southern Caribbean coast
    • View Profile
    • finca la isla
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2017, 09:46:00 AM »
Besides soil balance another thought comes to mind.  There could be an advantage in having some soil microorganism present in the growing medium.  A common palm called 'cocos plumosa' in the trade can have difficult germination, then it was determined that sterile soil was the culprit...
Someone mentioned Cheena seedlings always growing well.  I am grafting both jak and champedek on to champajak seedlings.  The seeds are larger than jak seeds which I like for quicker more robust development and are even more compatible for champedek which isn't easy to establish from seed.
Peter

arvind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 292
    • Malaysia
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2017, 09:25:32 PM »
I have mentioned the sudden death syndrome of chempadak a few times in past threads. It isn't climate related and some varieties are more prone to it than others. Two people can get seeds from one fruit and they might all die for one person and all live from another. They die when the are small and transitioning to food from the seed to be self sustainable.
I am pretty sure it is soil related and probably due to soil fungus impacting the roots during a short window where they are most vulnerable.If the get to a foot high they seem to grow past the vulnerability and are just the same as young jackfruit.

Wow that is interesting and valuable info there.One of my favourite fruit too and love it when it is deep fried as snack

DaveT

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 22
    • Australia,QLD
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2017, 04:51:57 AM »
I also have had a few losses but I am on pretty clayey soil. So I elevated my plants 300 millimeters and kept them shaded until a meter or so high. They are just so feeble when they are young compared to jackfruit. Once past that juvenile stage they grow well, though still waiting for mine to fruit. They are not as precocious as the jack.

Future

  • The Future
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2017
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2017, 12:32:56 PM »
All mine, courtesy of Mike T, died.

Siyu98

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 57
    • Italy, Zone 8
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2017, 02:08:36 PM »
Same for me! I have planted some seeds and, after sprouting, the stem started to dry out.
Humidity wasn't low.

Future

  • The Future
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2017
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2017, 02:13:20 PM »
I live in a high humidity location too.  100% humidity isn't unheard of here.

greenman62

  • CharlesitaveNB
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1277
    • [url=https://vgruk.com/]vgr uk[/url]
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2017, 05:54:01 PM »
I bought 5 chempedak seeds, all of them sprouted and after putting out 4 leaves all of them died!! Does any one know for what reason??

ive seen people with larger seeds like mango and jackfruit
get all excited when a seedling pops up
and it looks so healthy for the fist couple of days or even weeks.

large seeds store a lot of energy
they want the small plant to get off on a good footing

after a few days it starts to need its own energy when the seed runs out.
there is a fast-growing seedling that needs a lot of energy.

certain plants are more dependant on mycorrhizal fungi, than others
i am wondering if its not a certain fungi which is needed. ??

or if maybe, at least in *some* of these cases
the soil is just to "sterile".
if no chemical fertilizers are used, the plant needs NPK+ from somewhere. ??


Lory

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 626
    • Cebu-Philippines 10 N
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #21 on: June 23, 2017, 10:56:59 PM »
Plenty of useful hints here, thanks everybody  :)
Lorenzo

Ethan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1644
    • Central California Z9/9
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2017, 02:06:58 AM »
I was looking back at a 'Australian Tropical Fruit R&D Update' and it shows chempedak being 6-10 times more susceptible.

Tolerance of different Artocarpus species to
Phytophthora palmivora

SPECIES AND SOURCE LESION LENGTH
(cm)

Champedak (Abuyog) 31.90 a
Jackfruit (Abuyog) 2.58 cd
Camansi (Foodtech, VSU) 4.70 b
Marang (Abuyog) 0.00 e
Tipolo (Brgy. Gabas) 2.17 d
Tugop (San Jorge, Samar) 3.87 bc

Side note, they list an A.heterophyllus crossed with A.Rigidus, might be interesting to track down?
« Last Edit: June 24, 2017, 02:09:04 AM by Ethan »

FrankDrebinOfFruits

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
    • Kauai, HI 12A
    • View Profile
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2017, 03:03:47 PM »
I had a really good chempadak from a festival and managed to save one seed. When the tree was 2.5 feet tall I topped it to promote branching. The cut got infected and the tree never overcame. It took a couple months and then later died.

I blame myself for early pruning. Now I am super hesitant to prune my jackfruit.

fruitlovers

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15883
  • www.fruitlovers.com
    • USA, Big Island, East Hawaii, Zone 13a
    • View Profile
    • Fruit Lover's Nursery
Re: Why young Chempadak plants die
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2017, 12:55:49 AM »
Had similar problems here with chempadek. Some would die off, and the ones that survived looked chlorotic for a while. They would grow out of that once they get a few feet high. Last summer i had a tree that pumped out massive amounts of fruit on the first fruiting.  See photo at http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21383.msg261264#msg261264 Another 2 trees, same size, about 8 feet, didn't make a single fruit. In any case, it's a delicious fruit worth persevering the difficulties it puts you through. I think that Peter's suggestion of having soil microrganisms in the medium is a good one. At very least use compost or earth worm casings in the medium. Also as Mike points out, some cultivars seem more troublesome than others, so just keep trying...persevere.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2017, 01:53:00 AM by fruitlovers »
Oscar

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk